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I don't think that's a complete answer. If you wait for a second jab that never comes you lose, there is no indicator that will tell you whether or not sheik will jab again. Sounds like a good way to make jab->grab safe for the sheik player since you are waiting to react to a possible second jab. It works fine if you call it every time though, but that's not a strategy.
I f**k with you heavily.
You're right that it isn't a complete answer. But it's something that works against jab pressure on shield after fair and it's important to recognize shieldgrab as an option against Sheik (and characters that aren't Fox/Falco; the same concept applies to any character that tries to shield pressure with jab like Falcon/sometimes Peach). Of course shieldgrabbing the jab can be beaten by a large number of mixups (most good Sheiks probably won't even opt to fair->jab your shield anyway; they'd probably prefer to fair->short hop or fair->dash away/fox trot away or something) but it's incredibly important to make Sheik wary of it.
Can you give us a link to the set?
Read, non-tipper...
I don't even think you need to CC it lol it's so laggy and bad a low percent. And the best set up I can think of is off tech chases. The way I see it, if jiggs can metagame a move with like 5 seconds of lag and only hits a small area for 1 frame we can metagame a tipper dsmash.
Well I'll tell you it is much easier to chase a tech with tipper dmash than it is tipper fsmash. Mango/Scorp got a lot of those when he went Marth. Dsmash is just about interchangeable with grabbing after a tech read. It's just much more laggy if you miss or don't use it correctly.
The cool part is that you recognize what they could do. See, back in the day, people didn't know what they could do, but they went to manipulate people instead to do what they wanted them to do. Now we swung too far the other way, and know more options but don't try to act on them.How would you suggest going about getting better at this? I seem to get stuck a lot at the "throwing them up then wrecking them" part. There just seem like there are so many variables... when/if they fastfall, when/if they airdodge, if they'll come down with an aerial and when and which kind, if they'll go for a platform or ledgecancel... I find it frustrating to just get u-throw->u-air->nothing because I swing too early, or just get hit because I wait too long baiting things out. Might just be scrub problems though.
With regards to the last part of this,I feel like the soft reverse hit on top of fair is underutilized too, it's really cool for manipulating people onto/off of platforms or off stage, and has a nice amount of hitstun that links well into another fair or u-air.
This made me laugh. Hahaha... yeah.
Can you expand on point 1 a bit? Whenever I get faired, Sheik usually does some jab/tilt witchcraft and all of the sudden I've been grabbed or tic-grabbed, or they'll jab once or twice and call a roll/wd/jump/whatever.
I feel more comfortable with points two and three. My mixups are alright, and my proudest moment in tournament so far was 0-170-deathing a Sheik who's a much better player than I am by u-air u-air u-air u-airing off the top of FDMarth's movement and juggle games really are a blessing against Sheik.
Thanks for the post and congratulations on your victory!
Considering Marth can have trouble killing in that range(not sure what matchup you tested this on though,) that's pretty cool!
You're completely overlooking the fact that it kills off the top and comes out like twice as fast. Not only is killing off the top going to be more useful vs. characters like Peach and Samus who are heavy and floaty, but if the opponent is DIing upwards for an fsmash then a dsmash will kill even earlier because they aren't DIing left or right.
Tipper down smash (hits frame 5) is way faster than tipper forward smash (hits frame 10 or later), especially for low hits (forward smash takes a couple extra frames to swing down). This makes a lot of things possible to do on reaction, whereas for forward smash you'd have to guess.
Dude, m2k just pulled it out and let it sat there and PP tried to get in for a while before giving up and standing there for like half a minute. This happened a few times.
You should probably think twice about giving Sakurai the capability to patch Melee.
Would you cry if you had beaten M2k?
Welp...on to the next. Time to figure out the Yellow rat in the Party hat. (love you Axe, but you're too broken vs marth <3)
