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Brawlplusery Codeset / Competitive Play Discussion
- Thread starter Sukai
- Start date
stingers
Smash Obsessed
Rion, talk about that kind of discussion in here:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=232823
Almas is gonna be mad tomorrow @.@
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=232823
Almas is gonna be mad tomorrow @.@
Magus420
Smash Master
It already is fast and has a purpose.
8 frames.
TK Wolf
Smash Ace
I found a bug, but I'm not sure if it's with this version, or with a texture pack I downloaded. (http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=237712)
When I win and hold X (mapped to shield) after I win to select my winning pose, the wii freezes. This happened with Lucario, Charizard, Peach. I haven't tested with other characters.
When I win and hold X (mapped to shield) after I win to select my winning pose, the wii freezes. This happened with Lucario, Charizard, Peach. I haven't tested with other characters.
Revven
FrankerZ
It's the same as if you are holding a direction. Just don't press anything when a match ends.
TK Wolf
Smash Ace
Oh, I see. Thanks for letting me know about that. I didn't notice it in the first post, and I couldn't get this to happen when I hold Y (jump) instead of X.
So is this one of those bugs that'll be sticking around for a long time? Or hopefully there's a fix around the corner? ^^;
So is this one of those bugs that'll be sticking around for a long time? Or hopefully there's a fix around the corner? ^^;
cookieM0Nster
Smash Champion
It will eventally be fixed, but, as we have a lack of coders, this will stay for some time. I am sure that it will be fixed by the final release. So, just wait, and it will eventually be fixed.
TK Wolf
Smash Ace
Sounds good. ^^
Starscream
Smash Ace
To the guys getting freezes, are they right as the match ends as it goes "GAME!" or at the victory screen?
I'm getting freezes at random at the victory screen after I hit start twice to go back to the CSS even when I deliberately don't hold a direction or any other button. I'm just using the official codeset + tumble codes, lower hitstun and camera codes.
I'm getting freezes at random at the victory screen after I hit start twice to go back to the CSS even when I deliberately don't hold a direction or any other button. I'm just using the official codeset + tumble codes, lower hitstun and camera codes.
Revven
FrankerZ
Try taking off the tumble codes (I know that they might not have anything to do with it, but, it's two foreign codes to the set). Honestly, you guys make the freezes happen quite too often, it's annoying, stop it already! ;_;
(FYI: If the tumble codes doesn't fix it, it's likely AGAIN the CSS but tbh, you're the second person who's had it happen... YOU GUYS ARE 2FAST STOPPIT!)
leafgreen386
Dirty camper
...stop being dumb. I told you about this a long time ago, so you should know how to respond to stuff like this by now. It's a very very frequent freeze, and it's probably a result of the CSS code. Anytime you enter the CSS, if you're pressing buttons too quickly, it will cause a freeze. This means when you're entering vs mode, when you're exiting a match, or when you're entering training mode. To avoid the freeze, take your time when navigating into vs mode or training mode - don't just hastily press buttons like you would in melee or vbrawl to get there as fast as possible, since this is only gonna end up delaying you more. On the results screen, wait for the winning player's victory taunt to play before pressing start to go back to the CSS (I usually wait to hear the victory taunt begin, and then slowly press start, pause a moment, press start, pause a moment, press start, allowing each new screen to load before pressing start again). It requires you to use slow deliberate button presses when navigating into the CSS, but as long as you do that, you should be fine.
Boo Mansion
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- Jun 20, 2006
- Messages
- 83
I'm not sure if this has been asked yet, but will this ever be fixed? It seems to happen to me quite often, even when I do wait. I apologize if this has already been asked. It's probably not a priority at the moment, but hopefully it can be fixed before the final.
I'm using v4.1 as well.
Revven
FrankerZ
PK hasn't ported the CSS yet.
CloneHat
Smash Champion
What it leads into is totally up to DI, and sometimes it doesn't lead into anything. It's just not totally useless now.
SymphonicSage12
Smash Master
- Joined
- Feb 6, 2009
- Messages
- 3,299
yeah, you really CAN tech toon link's down smash. O_O and after some practice it's fairly easy to do so. although by the time you finish teching, toon link could just hit you again. :<
CloneHat
Smash Champion
SymphonicSage12
Smash Master
- Joined
- Feb 6, 2009
- Messages
- 3,299
well still, couldn't the toon link just techchase then? :<
CloneHat
Smash Champion
Does he have enough time to catch the opponent at the end of their roll? Unless TL's dsmash was sped up, I don't think so. I'll test it out sometime.
SymphonicSage12
Smash Master
- Joined
- Feb 6, 2009
- Messages
- 3,299
O.K, thanks for enlightening me. XD
Skip2MaLoo
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Oct 31, 2008
- Messages
- 1,293
see, I can be serious about brawl+ from time to time. lol, it really isn't hard to tech his dsmash. instead of saying "tech chase, etc", a smash attack shouldn't set up for a tech chase. a smash attack should be a gtfa from me move.
SymphonicSage12
Smash Master
- Joined
- Feb 6, 2009
- Messages
- 3,299
So, shouldn't you get to work about tweaking his dsmash then? ^_^
jay kay.
jay kay.
leafgreen386
Dirty camper
Well... sorta. There is no rule that a smash can only serve one or two functions (killing and keep away). Some smashes can be used as combo starters, and when sonic had the usmash spike, it was a great techchase starter. Roy (while not an official character at this point) will have two smashes that are capable of setting up techchases. Just because a smash operates differently from the norm doesn't mean that it's a bad thing. Unique attributes of characters is what makes the game interesting.
However, when a move doesn't work right, there is a problem. A move designed for the first hit to hit into the second hit shouldn't be techable between the two hits. Especially when the character doesn't even have the time to attempt a techchase.
SymphonicSage12
Smash Master
- Joined
- Feb 6, 2009
- Messages
- 3,299
Which is exactly why there is an issue with toon link's down smash. It isn't supposed to be techable, so it needs to be reworked so you can't tech it. How to do that? I have no idea.
SymphonicSage12
Smash Master
- Joined
- Feb 6, 2009
- Messages
- 3,299
Arcrandom, post that on the ...area where they talk about brawl+ stages here (sorry I haven't gone there on smashboards; i usually use allisbrawl for stage discussion.)
trojanpooh
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Oct 23, 2007
- Messages
- 1,183
I personally think that the code that turns new pork into wifi waiting room should be adjusted so it changes Mario Bros instead. I enjoy new pork from time to time, and I'm pretty sure we can agree that Mario Bros is just bad. Either that, or use a Custom Stage Select Screen and Custom Random Stage and include all the stages and more.
I have never seen it not lead into something. And some characters have useless moves. It doesn't make the character bad. ZSS's uthrow and fsmash are useless. She's still an incredible character. If Falco's shine is useless, he still has one of the best projectile games, and he still has a slew of high damage, finishable combos. He doesn't need a useful shine because he is a good, balanced character without it. Making him better unnecessarily just facilitates power creep.
SymphonicSage12
Smash Master
- Joined
- Feb 6, 2009
- Messages
- 3,299
You've probably already heard this problem before, but the game, for me, always freezes on the sidescrolling stages (Mushroomy Kingdom and Big Blue). I don't really play on these stages, so it doesn't matter that much, but I'm curious as to know why this happens.
Kaitou Ace
Smash Apprentice
Falco without his new shine was just decent. He basically laser spammed until he could find an opportunity to utilt. His only real other option was DC dtilt but that was a bit too risky and Falco ideally needs to have a good amount of distance between the opponent and himself. With his new shine, he now has one more combo starter at a longer distance which keeps him a bit safer and mixes up his game a.k.a creating DEPTH. Depth is good for any character, even the most campy, annoying ones.
The truth of it is, many of the things that characters did to succeed in vBrawl just don't work in B+. Falco losing his lul chaingrab was really huge as that created an easy 40% or even stock advantage for him. Now, he has to rack up damage in a way that puts him in a lot of risk considering he's a FFer and quite comboable. His shine is not a big deal.
there u go:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=225642
@almas: u should probably also edit the op title in order to avoid confusion
Sukai
Smash Champion
Falco is a deadly, combo/gimp/edgeguarding machine, his only balancing feature was his crap recovery.
His shine didn't add depth, it's a flat out buff, it made it easier for him to **** you.
Depth shouldn't make a character noticeably better, it should potentially make them better.
Being able to DI Firebird is depth, it gives the player ability to maneuver better.
Melee Falcon's moonwalk is depth.
Illusion cancelling is depth.
Dancing Blade stall is depth.
Depth is more sensibly found in movement than it is in attacks.
Adding to knuxrouge's post, now he just spams until he can find an opportunity to Shine. And this does not add depth. It just makes him unnecessarily better.
Let me put it into perspective. For any character that can't out camp Falco (90% of the cast or more), lasers force them to either approach or turtle until Falco approaches, but in order for them to approach or turtle effectively, they need to do it safely. That means they can't get comboed while trying to start a combo themselves. And to do that, they need to be able to outrange Falco's combo starters.
So what did we do? We made Falco's longest ranged physical attack a combo starter. This move outranges just about every physical attack in the game, and reflects projectiles to boot. Most characters who get outcamped by Falco barely have the tools to deal with his lasers. What makes you think they have to tools to deal with his Shine? His Shine is in every way better than his utilt for starting combos now, so you've effectively replaced utilt, which has a high risk/high reward balance associated with it, and replaced it with the Shine, which has low risk/high reward balance. This being always his best option, it has effectively reduced his depth. Where before he had to practice some creativity with some match-ups, now he can just keep doing the same thing with most of the characters in the cast.
If this were for a character who was bad, ie. Bowser, I would applaud your ingenuity, but Falco already has a beast combo game that most players I've seen haven't really tapped yet, and which is complemented well by his top-notch zoning game. Given that he's already got so many good options, making him even better is not necessary, especially if it makes him less deep.
metaXzero
Smash Champion
Falco's new shine doesn't break him. It's not even a guaranteed combo starter (seriously, who thinks this?). The trade off for the new shine is suppossed to be a % decrease in lasers, however that's currently not a good enough trade-off (lasers still wreck characters).
If you want to take away from Falco, take that U-tilt speed-up (THAT'S more like a straight-up buff).
If you want to take away from Falco, take that U-tilt speed-up (THAT'S more like a straight-up buff).
Shell
Flute-Fox Only
- Joined
- Feb 7, 2007
- Messages
- 2,042
Right now, the shine is of comparable risk with less reward than the u-tilt, which is fast and has nearly non-existant cooldown, yet a better setup KB / angle.
Also, depending on how you DI the shine, you can de-fang it to a certain extent, limiting its setup power. I don't see how you can say that it is always his best option. I don't use it too often, and if you do, it's not too hard to predict it, spotdodge, and punish.
Watch this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WgHokAWO_hs
I consider Thunderhorse a really solid Falco+ player. How many times did he spam the reflector? Once. And popo, the one who actually had all the damage and would've been killed by the usmash, was able to DI away from it and avoid the followup altogether.
The problem isn't with the shine, it's with laser camping. How many times did you see Thunderhorse laser camp and then Phantasm past the ICs? At least 8, maybe 10 or more times. This is more of a real problem.
In a WBR test set we are also playing with moving Falco's Phantasm hitbox behind him (ala Melee), making him more attackable out of it with good timing. If it works properly, it will limit his ability to laser camp and phantasm past you to continue, as well as making his phantasm easier to edgeguard.
There has also been some minor talk of a type of PS reflecting, which would limit all forms of spam. This hasn't been agreed upon or even coded, so we shall see.
Also, depending on how you DI the shine, you can de-fang it to a certain extent, limiting its setup power. I don't see how you can say that it is always his best option. I don't use it too often, and if you do, it's not too hard to predict it, spotdodge, and punish.
Watch this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WgHokAWO_hs
I consider Thunderhorse a really solid Falco+ player. How many times did he spam the reflector? Once. And popo, the one who actually had all the damage and would've been killed by the usmash, was able to DI away from it and avoid the followup altogether.
The problem isn't with the shine, it's with laser camping. How many times did you see Thunderhorse laser camp and then Phantasm past the ICs? At least 8, maybe 10 or more times. This is more of a real problem.
In a WBR test set we are also playing with moving Falco's Phantasm hitbox behind him (ala Melee), making him more attackable out of it with good timing. If it works properly, it will limit his ability to laser camp and phantasm past you to continue, as well as making his phantasm easier to edgeguard.
There has also been some minor talk of a type of PS reflecting, which would limit all forms of spam. This hasn't been agreed upon or even coded, so we shall see.
metaXzero
Smash Champion
^Some projectiles can't be edited currently. Think Falco's is one of them.