Social Banjo-Kazooie Social Thread - Project Dream Come True!

[Banjoisawesome2020]

Anyone here on the Rayman speculation thread? I have an idea for Rayman's moveset I want to explain on there!

 

[ivanlerma]

Anyone here on the Rayman speculation thread? I have an idea for Rayman's moveset I want to explain on there!

i'd been looking into rayman time to time again.

 

[Banjoisawesome2020]

i'd been looking into rayman time to time again.

Can you link me to it?

 

[TAnimal]

Can you link me to it?

Twitter - https://mobile.twitter.com/RayForSmash/with_replies
Rayman Smashboard - https://smashboards.com/threads/rayman-revolution-spirit-of-dreams.446447/page-63

 

[RetrogamerMax]

I don't know if I ask you guys this question before or after Banjo & Kazooie got in, but I'll ask again. Now that the bear and bird duo are in Smash, who is the next Rare rep y'all want to see? For me it's Krystal.

 

[ivanlerma]

I don't know if I ask you guys this question before or after Banjo & Kazooie got in, but I'll ask again. Now that the bear and bird duo are in Smash, who is the next Rare rep y'all want to see? For me it's Krystal.

i'd say conker, since he is another one of rare's famous properties.

 

[TheZoologist]

I don't know if I ask you guys this question before or after Banjo & Kazooie got in, but I'll ask again. Now that the bear and bird duo are in Smash, who is the next Rare rep y'all want to see? For me it's Krystal.

Krystal, definitely. Been one of my favorite go-to choices for a first-party rep and even out the Star Fox roster pretty well. Think she'd be a cool female character with a unique moveset thanks to her using a staff as her main weapon with elemental attacks.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I don't know if I ask you guys this question before or after Banjo & Kazooie got in, but I'll ask again. Now that the bear and bird duo are in Smash, who is the next Rare rep y'all want to see? For me it's Krystal.

Besides the squirrel, I'd be down with Rash of the Battletoads. If only to get him in a game that's not influenced by 2010s animation in a bad way.

By the way, I found a funny:

Spoiler

There was a problem fetching the tweet

 

[Sponge]

I don't know if I ask you guys this question before or after Banjo & Kazooie got in, but I'll ask again. Now that the bear and bird duo are in Smash, who is the next Rare rep y'all want to see? For me it's Krystal.

Just Dixie, really. I wouldn't mind Fulgore or Conker, but they have zero presence in Japan outside of Conker appearing in DKR and Live and Reloaded releasing there. I doubt Sakurai or Nintendo would add western characters that barely anyone in Japan knows.

 

[Banjoisawesome2020]

Just Dixie, really. I wouldn't mind Fulgore or Conker, but they have zero presence in Japan outside of Conker appearing in DKR and Live and Reloaded releasing there. I doubt Sakurai or Nintendo would add western characters that barely anyone in Japan knows.

Rare's iteration of James Bond, yes THAT James Bond, was considered along Banjo for Smash 64. Look up DYKG's video on Smash Bros. Characters to see!

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

For what it's worth, there isn't a rule that disqualifies any game character that's been in Westside and in Japan at least once because of lack of awareness.

 

[BravadoMan_13]

I don't know if I ask you guys this question before or after Banjo & Kazooie got in, but I'll ask again. Now that the bear and bird duo are in Smash, who is the next Rare rep y'all want to see? For me it's Krystal.

Dixie is the next one in line. She is a missing piece to the roster and is one of the bigger characters not in Smash yet. Gruntilda, Mumbo, Funky, Cranky, and Conker would be the remaining Rare cast to be in Smash for me.

 

[ChunkySlugger72]

I don't know if I ask you guys this question before or after Banjo & Kazooie got in, but I'll ask again. Now that the bear and bird duo are in Smash, who is the next Rare rep y'all want to see? For me it's Krystal.

It's likely going to be Dixie Kong whether as an original fighter, echoe or semi-clone, Big advantage that Dixie has over other remaining Rare characters is that Nintendo owns the Donkey Kong franchise, It's a big IP and they can use Diddy Kong as a base/foundation.

Wouldn't mind Krystal, But Star Fox isn't a main priority for Nintendo and unfortunately they don't know what direction to take the franchise and if Star Fox Zero is any indication it's that Nintendo doesn't view her as a vital part of the series where as Dixie Kong plays a bigger role for the Donkey Kong franchise even though DK and Diddy Kong are the main stars.

Conker, Rash/Battletoads, Fulgore or Joanna Dark are all great choices, But none of them have the huge following and audience of Banjo-Kazooie to push them into Smash.

I personally don't see us getting another Rare rep, Banjo-Kazooie was the biggest name of the bunch and can't see them going for a lesser name as an encore.

If we are going to get another Microsoft rep, My money is on Master Chief.

 

[Banjoisawesome2020]

Somebody who anyalized why the Smash Community may be the most toxic one ever.

Also...that Waluigi picture...*Shivers*

Good night. Bed time.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

The Minecraft costume cameo is so miniscule, I'm not 100% sure if that's enough for Master Chief to qualify, seeing as you only dress up as him.

Let's remember though; whether a Rare character is recognisable or not doesn't matter so much for selection, it's rather if they can provide fun and interesting gameplay to use.

 

[ChunkySlugger72]

The Minecraft costume cameo is so miniscule, I'm not 100% sure if that's enough for Master Chief to qualify, seeing as you only dress up as him.

Let's remember though; whether a Rare character is recognisable or not doesn't matter so much for selection, it's rather if they can provide fun and interesting gameplay to use.

I personally think Master Chief is still fair game, Sure Banjo-Kazooie got in because of fan demand and large part of that had to do with the franchise's origins on the N64 and Rare's previous ties with Nintendo, But at the end of the day Banjo-Kazooie and Master Chief are 1st party characters under Microsoft's Xbox brand, Is he likely ? Probably not, But if Nintendo and Microsoft want to top Banjo-Kazooie and do the historicaly unthinkable and impossible then they would do so by adding in Master Chief.

While Sakurai did mention gameplay as the most important factor when deciding characters, It still doesn't change the fact that all 3rd Party characters added into Super Smash Bros are either icons or significant enough, Not to mention Sakurai bias plays a factor too.

Bayonetta probably has the weakest star power from the 3rd party bunch, But she pretty much got in because Nintendo was collaborating with Sega/Platinum for exclusive titles in the series and is getting the 2nd party treatment.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

It's likely going to be Dixie Kong whether as an original fighter, echoe or semi-clone, Big advantage that Dixie has over other remaining Rare characters is that Nintendo owns the Donkey Kong franchise, It's a big IP and they can use Diddy Kong as a base/foundation.

Wouldn't mind Krystal, But Star Fox isn't a main priority for Nintendo and unfortunately they don't know what direction to take the franchise and if Star Fox Zero is any indication it's that Nintendo doesn't view her as a vital part of the series where as Dixie Kong plays a bigger role for the Donkey Kong franchise even though DK and Diddy Kong are the main stars.

Conker, Rash/Battletoads, Fulgore or Joanna Dark are all great choices, But none of them have the huge following and audience of Banjo-Kazooie to push them into Smash.

I personally don't see us getting another Rare rep, Banjo-Kazooie was the biggest name of the bunch and can't see them going for a lesser name as an encore.

If we are going to get another Microsoft rep, My money is on Master Chief.

Give it time especially after a Rare Replay Switch port comes out and more people will want those characters in Smash especially Conker. I asked the folks over at the N64 sub-Reddit awhile back who they wanted to see next now that Banjo & Kazooie are in and a HUGE majority said Conker. A lot of N64 fans will be hungry for Conker in Smash very soon.

 

[TheCJBrine]

The Minecraft costume cameo is so miniscule, I'm not 100% sure if that's enough for Master Chief to qualify, seeing as you only dress up as him.

Let's remember though; whether a Rare character is recognisable or not doesn't matter so much for selection, it's rather if they can provide fun and interesting gameplay to use.

To be fair, Minecraft skins are treated as the characters in Minecraft form and not just cosplay options (well, aside from the player still having their own username).

 

[RetrogamerMax]

To be fair, Minecraft skins are treated as the characters in Minecraft form and not just cosplay options (well, aside from the player still having their own username).

Has any character skins ever come with special weapons or items related to the character in any of the Minecraft games? I'm curious because if not, I would probably say that skins are cosplays.

 

[TheCJBrine]

Has any character skins ever come with special weapons or items related to the character in any of the Minecraft games? I'm curious because if not, I would probably say that skins are cosplays.

They don’t ever come with items; they don’t do that kind of thing, aside from letting content creators make addons with new stuff to play with on their store in Bedrock Edition. However, some skins do come with a new world and resource pack, and some skins change the character model (i.e. R2-D2 being smaller and actually shaped like himself, and Yoda being even smaller).

Although, I guess they’re not exactly treated as the characters actually being there with you in the game, though they don’t seem to be treated as just costumes either, aside from those skins in the store that actually are some person wearing something; idk how to explain it. Maybe it is kind of like cosplay, but not like the Miis? Maybe like you’re choosing what character to play as, even if you keep your username? I dunno. I don’t really know if Master Chief’s skin would be enough to count for Smash, but tbh I don’t think he needs a previous Nintendo appearance before getting in Smash anyway.

If we’re talking more Microsoft characters, though, I personally only care about Steve, Alex, the Creeper and Conker after Banjo and Kazooie. I don’t know if Cuphead counts? I don’t think he’s actually owned by them...

 

[CosmicQuark]

They don’t ever come with items; they don’t do that kind of thing, aside from letting content creators make addons with new stuff to play with on their store in Bedrock Edition. However, some skins do come with a new world and resource pack, and some skins change the character model (i.e. R2-D2 being smaller and actually shaped like himself, and Yoda being even smaller).

Although, I guess they’re not exactly treated as the characters actually being there with you in the game, though they don’t seem to be treated as just costumes either, aside from those skins in the store that actually are some person wearing something; idk how to explain it. Maybe it is kind of like cosplay, but not like the Miis? Maybe like you’re choosing what character to play as, even if you keep your username? I dunno. I don’t really know if Master Chief’s skin would be enough to count for Smash, but tbh I don’t think he needs a previous Nintendo appearance before getting in Smash anyway.

If we’re talking more Microsoft characters, though, I personally only care about Steve, Alex, the Creeper and Conker after Banjo and Kazooie. I don’t know if Cuphead counts? I don’t think he’s actually owned by them...

I know some people like RogersBase are going hard on wanting Cuphead in. Microsoft didn't make the game, but funded it, I believe. I think copyright wise it would be attributed to the studio that made the game, not Microsoft, and would be an indie game. Whereas Mojang was sold to Xbox Studios and would probably be attributed to Microsoft. I was surprised Rare wasn't in the copyright along with Microsoft, unlike Atlus. It really could go either way as we don't know the full backroom deal type details.

My guess is Minecraft would be much more likely than Cuphead, and I don't see Cuphead being in as it would be treated as an indie game. At that point, Travis or Sans (if he were not a costume) would make more sense from an ownership standpoint.

Regardless of Microsoft's further involvement in Smash, I'm still so happy Banjo & Kazooie made it in. Every time I play them, I feel like they're back home. That feeling has yet to wear off.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

I know some people like RogersBase are going hard on wanting Cuphead in. Microsoft didn't make the game, but funded it, I believe. I think copyright wise it would be attributed to the studio that made the game, not Microsoft, and would be an indie game. Whereas Mojang was sold to Xbox Studios and would probably be attributed to Microsoft. I was surprised Rare wasn't in the copyright along with Microsoft, unlike Atlus. It really could go either way as we don't know the full backroom deal type details.

My guess is Minecraft would be much more likely than Cuphead, and I don't see Cuphead being in as it would be treated as an indie game. At that point, Travis or Sans (if he were not a costume) would make more sense from an ownership standpoint.

Regardless of Microsoft's further involvement in Smash, I'm still so happy Banjo & Kazooie made it in. Every time I play them, I feel like they're back home. That feeling has yet to wear off.

I don't know the complete details surrounding the copyright around Cuphead, but I'm guessing it's a 2nd party franchise to Microsoft from the way you're describing it.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I'm so sick and tired of the "indies can't join" fan rule...

The actual thing with Cuphead is, he's only had one game so far. So far there aren't many characters getting in after only appearing in one game, and Sak had made a big deal of characters needing "history" to get in (which apparently amounts to "more than one game).

By that metric, Gunvolt would be barred from getting in even though his series has three games to its name now? That's ridiculous. If Sak doesn't care about the console wars, I don't see why he'd be any more concerned about whether a character's made independently or not. They're all video game characters.

 

[ChunkySlugger72]

I'm so sick and tired of the "indies can't join" fan rule...

The actual thing with Cuphead is, he's only had one game so far. So far there aren't many characters getting in after only appearing in one game, and Sak had made a big deal of characters needing "history" to get in (which apparently amounts to "more than one game).

By that metric, Gunvolt would be barred from getting in even though his series has three games to its name now? That's ridiculous. If Sak doesn't care about the console wars, I don't see why he'd be any more concerned about whether a character's made independently or not. They're all video game characters.

The way I see it and I would imagine most people who bring that specific rule up (I am somewhat guilty of it too to a certain extent as well) is that many Smash fans would rather see longtime "Icons" or "Significant names" that have been household names in the video game industry than the new or recent hot indie game that some gamers are talking about, (Untitled Goose Game anyone? Just joking, But you get the idea)

Super Smash Bros is the biggest video game crossover ever and essentially for the most part the "Video Game Hall of Fame" and many fans (Including myself) believe that a video game character should meet a certain criteria to make it in the roster, While many of video games biggest icons are already in, There are still some pretty big names out there like Crash Bandicoot, Spyro the Dragon (Not before Crash), Rayman, Heihachi, Doom Slayer ( I'm still kind of iffy on him) etc, Hell since we already got Microsoft on board why not go nuts and add Master Chief?

Me personally would rather have some of the remaining bigger names make it in first before they even decide to add indies, I know Sakurai has said that gameplay and moveset potential is the most important when deciding a character, But it doesn't change the fact that the majority of the 3rd party characters he chose to add are video game icons or at the very least significant names and this is purely speculation, But based on the only indie content he has provided so far has been minor such as assist trophy's, costumes or spirits has lead me to think that even he might believe indies are not at that "Level" yet, If he didn't then we should have gotten a fighter probably by now.

Like I mentioned before when you have the biggest crossover in video game history it just makes more sense to go for the bigger or biggest names in the industry (That are legally obtainable). Characters/Franchises that are much more marketable or mainstream and are better of investing expensive resources in such as CGI Trailers for example.

I wanna see something historicaly crazy or insane happen that breaks the internet, turn heads and make people and gamers take notice like Crash Bandicoot or Master Chief, Your not really going to get that with your average indie character.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

I'm so sick and tired of the "indies can't join" fan rule...

The actual thing with Cuphead is, he's only had one game so far. So far there aren't many characters getting in after only appearing in one game, and Sak had made a big deal of characters needing "history" to get in (which apparently amounts to "more than one game).

By that metric, Gunvolt would be barred from getting in even though his series has three games to its name now? That's ridiculous. If Sak doesn't care about the console wars, I don't see why he'd be any more concerned about whether a character's made independently or not. They're all video game characters.

I agree, I am tired of hearing that Indies can't join too. They got a freaking Assist Trophy and Mii costume so no other honor left besides a playable character slot. And let me remind this to you all that believe Indies are not ready yet: Nintendo gave away the Zelda license to a Indie developer to create Cadence of Hyrule. I would have said before hand that Nintendo giving away the license to one of their biggest franchises to a Indie developer would be more of a pipedream and unrealistic than a playable Indie character in Smash Bros. That right there says it all that Indies are more than ready to get a playable character slot in Smash.

 

[TheCJBrine]

I think indie characters are fine. I’d like it if Sans was actually playable with Papyrus alongside him as a duo (not like Ice Climbers), even if the Mii costume is still cool.

When it comes to “criteria,” it’s really just a bunch of dumb fan rules ranging from more-reasonable ideas to flat-out stupid and sometimes hypocritical crap from people whom bash you because “this character may fit my criteria but I don’t like them so I have to make up reasons against them because whatever I say is the truth and will definitely happen and no one else can be happy getting their favorite characters because I unreasonably loathe those said fictional videogame characters!”

 

[RetrogamerMax]

I think indie characters are fine. I’d like it if Sans was actually playable with Papyrus alongside him as a duo (not like Ice Climbers), even if the Mii costume is still cool.

When it comes to “criteria,” it’s really just a bunch of dumb fan rules ranging from more-reasonable ideas to flat-out stupid and sometimes hypocritical crap from people whom bash you because “this character may fit my criteria but I don’t like them so I have to make up reasons against them because whatever I say is the truth and will definitely happen and no one else can be happy getting their favorite characters because I unreasonably loathe those said fictional videogame characters!”

Like Sakurai said: "It's more important that a character is fun to play not just being recognizable." I completely agree with him. A indie character like Shantae isn't really iconic to the public eye and nether to some people in the Indie community. But she would have insane moveset potential being a half genie that can transform into a bunch of different animals, attacking her opponents with her hair, performing spells like a fireball or spikeballs to surround her for protection. She would be a blast to play with in Smash, but a lot of people only seem to care if it's somebody SUPER DUPER iconic and popular.

 

[ChunkySlugger72]

Like Sakurai said: "It's more important that a character is fun to play not just being recognizable." I completely agree with him. A indie character like Shantae isn't really iconic to the public eye and nether to some people in the Indie community. But she would have insane moveset potential being a half genie that can transform into a bunch of different animals, attacking her opponents with her hair, performing spells like a fireball or spikeballs to surround her for protection. She would be a blast to play with in Smash, but a lot of popular only seem to care if it's somebody SUPER DUPER iconic and popular.

Just playing devil's advocate here, Like I mentioned before While Sakurai has stated that a character's moveset is more important than their status, It doesn't change the fact that all the 3rd party characters he's added are video game icons or at least significant enough.

It kind of seems like some people think that a character can't be iconic and have moveset potential at the same time.

Any character has moveset potential if you think hard enough, Some are just more easier to implement and already thought out than others like Banjo-Kazooie for example.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Just playing devil's advocate here, Like I mentioned before While Sakurai has stated that a character's moveset is more important than their status, It doesn't change the fact that all the 3rd party characters he's added are video game icons or at least significant enough.

It kind of seems like some people think that a character can't be iconic and have moveset potential at the same time.

Any character has moveset potential if you think hard enough, Some are just more easier to implement and already thought out than others like Banjo-Kazooie for example.

People can say what they want about Joker/Persona and Bayonetta, they ain't iconic whatsoever not even their franchises. Both popular? Yes. But iconic? Not really.

 

[3BitSaurus]

I'm so sick and tired of the "indies can't join" fan rule...

The actual thing with Cuphead is, he's only had one game so far. So far there aren't many characters getting in after only appearing in one game, and Sak had made a big deal of characters needing "history" to get in (which apparently amounts to "more than one game).

By that metric, Gunvolt would be barred from getting in even though his series has three games to its name now? That's ridiculous. If Sak doesn't care about the console wars, I don't see why he'd be any more concerned about whether a character's made independently or not. They're all video game characters.

To me, it's less that "indies can't join" and more like "if Shovel Knight, Shantae and Undertale couldn't join, then the chances for other indies aren't the highest right now".

The first two are banking on an AT/Spirit promotion (which may or may not be them, since there are several other choices for that) and the latter really seems like the deal between Sakurai and Toby really was just for a costume and the remix, but nothing else.

There's only two indies that stand a chance right now imo - Quote and Reimu - and even then, they have to go against some really heavy hitters to get in. I suppose you could make the argument that Minecraft used to be indie if Steve gets in, but that's kinda stretching it.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

I think at this point in the game if a Indie character get's a slot in Ultimate it's going to be Reimu due to how big her franchise is in Japan. I'm not saying it's going to happen, but all bets I would say should be on Reimu right now if any Indie character.

 

[ChunkySlugger72]

People can say what they want about Joker/Persona and Bayonetta, they ain't iconic whatsoever not even their franchises. Both popular? Yes. But iconic? Not really.

Don't know much about either franchise, But I have heard that Persona is a spinoff from another franchise that's called Shin Megami Tensei that apparently has been around since the NES or SNES era, Don't know how big it is in Japan, But if it's anything like Persona than it must be pretty popular over there and we all know that Japan takes priority most of the time when it comes to characters, Can't forget that Sakurai is a big fan of Persona too as it influenced the main menu in Super Smash Bros Ultimate and the character face screen wipes when they perform their final smashes.

As for Bayonetta I always have viewed her with the weakest star power of the 3rd party bunch (Her 1st game wasn't exactly the biggest seller or most well known, Hell it came out on the PS3/Xbox 360 before it even came to the Wii U years later) and more of an advertisement/tie in during Wii U as she came around the same time her sequel was coming out if I'm not mistaken and since Nintendo was collaborating with Sega/Platinum Games for exclusive titles in the series for Nintendo platforms (Let's not forget she has a 3rd game coming) and kind of took the series in as a 2nd party franchise/character (Somewhat similarly like how Rare and Banjo-Kazooie were back in the N64 era) , So I assume it was only natural for Nintendo to promote her in Smash.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

As far as indies go, Gunvolt seems to have a big shot. Two main series games, one spin-off, two crossovers (with one of the series involved being a much ridiculed property), yet he seems to be mostly ignored. If that's not enough, Inti Creates also have a legacy franchise with Jason Frudnick's Master Blaster.

But yeah, Steve is a bit of a strange beast, seeing as Minecraft stopped being indie to the point that Mojang's former owner is no longer allowed there for reasons that don't need to be discussed.

At the end of the day, only Sakurai knows which indie character is worthy. For all we know, it could be someone we never thought could stand a chance. Until then we're just at an impasse.

 

[Banjoisawesome2020]

I personally think Master Chief is still fair game, Sure Banjo-Kazooie got in because of fan demand and large part of that had to do with the franchise's origins on the N64 and Rare's previous ties with Nintendo, But at the end of the day Banjo-Kazooie and Master Chief are 1st party characters under Microsoft's Xbox brand, Is he likely ? Probably not, But if Nintendo and Microsoft want to top Banjo-Kazooie and do the historicaly unthinkable and impossible then they would do so by adding in Master Chief.

While Sakurai did mention gameplay as the most important factor when deciding characters, It still doesn't change the fact that all 3rd Party characters added into Super Smash Bros are either icons or significant enough, Not to mention Sakurai bias plays a factor too.

Bayonetta probably has the weakest star power from the 3rd party bunch, But she pretty much got in because Nintendo was collaborating with Sega/Platinum for exclusive titles in the series and is getting the 2nd party treatment.

Shantae deserves next. She's been around much longer than Ga...ahem, Bayonetta. But Banjo was the ONLY thing I was excited for in 2019, since Game Freak hurt my trust till yesterday with the Expansion Passes.

 

[ChunkySlugger72]

Shantae deserves next. She's been around much longer than Ga...ahem, Bayonetta. But Banjo was the ONLY thing I was excited for in 2019, since Game Freak hurt my trust till yesterday with the Expansion Passes.

I feel like Bayonetta got in Smash because of Nintendo's partnership with Platinum Games and publishing the franchises games as exclusives (Let's not forget she's got a 3rd game coming) so I guess she kind of gets a pass because she's almost practically a 2nd party character, I would argue that even though she hasn't been around as long as Shantae she still is considered as a bigger deal and has more selling power considering Nintendo has been backing the series lately, I mean there is a reason Nintendo teased the 3rd game at the video game awards a couple of years ago.

I'm probably gonna get some hate from some people here, But I'm going to say it like it is, While I can see why some fans want Shantae in Smash (I'm sure their fun games and seem to have an appealing art style and gameplay make sense for Smash) If you were to ask me I believe her "Status' doesn't really warrant a roster spot for Super Smash Bros at the very least not before when there are much bigger fish left to fry.

I have said it countless time before and while some people don't want to hear it, Icon and significant status has gotta mean something, I mean there's a reason we have some of the biggest characters in gaming guest starring in this biggest video game crossover regardless of their moveset potential.

 

[Cookies N Milk]

I don't know if I ask you guys this question before or after Banjo & Kazooie got in, but I'll ask again. Now that the bear and bird duo are in Smash, who is the next Rare rep y'all want to see? For me it's Krystal.

Conker Conker Conker Conker

 

[CosmicQuark]

I've been watching a Banjo-Tooie blind Let's Play of guys who know Banjo & Kazooie from Smash, and it's given credence to my earlier claim how Mario Odyssey, while probably not directly inspired by, had elements that could be traced to Banjo-Kazooie. I've noticed multiple times they compare elements from Tooie to Odyssey--namely the transformations, weird aerial tricks of solo Banjo, as well as level specific currency. Just an interesting note. Also it's amazing when they get excited seeing a move from Smash, such as Grenade Eggs, and were so happy to poop them out. And they noticed as well how Pack Whack would have been an interesting move choice!

I don't know the complete details surrounding the copyright around Cuphead, but I'm guessing it's a 2nd party franchise to Microsoft from the way you're describing it.

They would be a 2nd party franchise in my opinion, just like Rare was to Nintendo in the N64 days--not owned by them, but originally exclusive to them. That being said, I don't think Nintendo would talk to Microsoft about the rights, but the studio themselves, since the studio isn't owned by Microsoft. Hence, why I think legally they would be considered an indie franchise, rather than a Microsoft property.

I'm so sick and tired of the "indies can't join" fan rule...

The actual thing with Cuphead is, he's only had one game so far. So far there aren't many characters getting in after only appearing in one game, and Sak had made a big deal of characters needing "history" to get in (which apparently amounts to "more than one game).

By that metric, Gunvolt would be barred from getting in even though his series has three games to its name now? That's ridiculous. If Sak doesn't care about the console wars, I don't see why he'd be any more concerned about whether a character's made independently or not. They're all video game characters.

While probably not directed at me, I want to clarify that I didn't say indies couldn't get in, only that I would think, given the logic above, that Cuphead would be considered an indie franchise, rather than a Microsoft property, and should be judged as an indie title. I then gave examples of indie titles that I felt were more likely than Cuphead--Travis Touchdown and Undertale (prior to being a Mii costume, which I consider to be a legitimate, but not perfect, indicator of disconfirmation). I think indies being disconfirmed outright is ridiculous--though, I also think they're far less likely to get attention compared to the big studios. But eventually I think we'll see indie characters as full characters. San's mii costumes, as well as references to Shantae, show that Nintendo/Sakurai are looking more at indie companies this time around.

 

[Cookies N Milk]

I don’t think Dixie Kong or Krystal qualify as a rare character. They are from franchises owned by Nintendo, which means they don’t have to ask Microsoft for another character. They are unlikely for ultimate because they are from franchises that are represented and Krystal is already an assist trophy. Conker would be a far more interesting choice for a fighter then both mainly because he would bring in more additions to the game that no other fighter has.

 

[ChunkySlugger72]

I don’t think Dixie Kong or Krystal qualify as a rare character. They are from franchises owned by Nintendo, which means they don’t have to ask Microsoft for another character. They are unlikely for ultimate because they are from franchises that are represented and Krystal is already an assist trophy. Conker would be a far more interesting choice for a fighter then both mainly because he would bring in more additions to the game that no other fighter has.

I'm pretty sure everyone knows that while Rare creations they are legally Nintendo characters just like DK and Diddy Kong where as Banjo-Kazooie and Conker are Microsoft/Rare, They are all Rare characters regardless of Nintendo or Microsoft ownership. Donkey Kong is kind of a hybrid of Nintendo/Rareware seeing how Rare just redesigned him.

Conker, Rash (Battletoads), Fulgore (Killer Instinct) and Joanna Dark (Perfect Dark) would all be great choices for Smash, But I just don't any of them happening anytime soon as much as it sucks to say. In the grand scheme they are all Rare characters regardless of Nintendo or Microsoft creation
It's a shame because had Nintendo did buy Rare when they had the chance then we likely would have gotten some if of not all the major Rareware characters.

 

[Cookies N Milk]

I'm pretty sure everyone knows that while Rare creations they are legally Nintendo characters just like DK and Diddy Kong where as Banjo-Kazooie and Conker are Microsoft/Rare.

Conker, Rash (Battletoads), Fulgore (Killer Instinct) and Joanna Dark (Perfect Dark) would all be great choices for Smash, But I just don't any of them happening anytime soon as much as it sucks to say.

It's a shame because had Nintendo did buy Rare when they had the chance then we likely would have gotten some if of not all the major Rareware characters.

Phil said in an interview at Banjo’s reveal that he is willing to let other rare characters in, as in characters that are owned by Microsoft. Rare was such an important part of Nintendo’s history, why wouldn’t you let another one in? The only logical choice is Conker, which is the 2nd face of rare when it comes it fans. I’m pretty sure rare considers Conker the 1st face of their company. He had the most screen time in the Xbox commercial, he is in front of everybody in the rare replay art, he appeared in project spark and a VR game and left Banjo in the dust. I think he has a nonexistent chance of being fighter 5, but I think he has a good chance of getting in after the fighters pass.