Ask a Qusestion. Get an Answer.

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

@Wake: That's quiet a bit of involvement in trying to get a SHDL down pat. Hope it works out for you.

@Calvo: Constant mental reinforcement tends to work for some people. By this I mean telling yourself throughout the match to "slow down". Retreat at times where you think you might be advancing all the time. Focus more on I need to space these safe options.
^Things similar to this.

 

[Calvonta "Calvo" parker]

How do you practice in general like, with ? Do you have to know all the frame data of him to really test yourself? Or is maining requires knowing what other chars do i.e: their frame data?

 

[1PokeMastr]

You don't really need to know his frame Data, but, knowing frame data DOES help you with Punishes, as in, if we Fsmash and hit a shield. The opponent can Shield Drop and Do and Attack that hits on Frame 20 or faster, they don't even need to PS the Fsmash.

Though, I practice/ train with Falco in training mode. I just run through doing all his aerials, fast falling them and buffering everything, haha.

He is a very technically demanding character in my opinion.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

Yea, frame data analysis and other things like that are simply good for knowing the limitations of the game. If you watch others or play enough yourself, you'll eventually understand more what is or not possible to accomplish regularly.

I think that was actually an issue with Brawl at first. Too many people were new at the game and thought stuff like SDI was too hard. For example, the whole idea of SDI or ASDI G&W's Bair probably seemed difficult, but 3 years later and with practice, its not all that hard. People just lacked the ability to reliably execute things.

Anyway, you just practice on your own by doing your own sort of maintenance. Practice SHDL to SHL repeatedly. BPG chaingrab on characters. Grab release -> Dacus MK. General flow of attacks. Get on stage with lasers. Throw yourself into a smartbomb and practice stick mashing to get out for SDI. Random stuff like that.

In matches, you should try practicing new things you cannot try on your own such as SDI Falco's CG spike. Or simply tryout out different approaches to match-ups or play-styles.

 

[Mr. game and watch]

What's the point of RAR?

And is it ever a good idea to do grounded lasers?

And finaly I'm trash on CGing to Dair spiking. Does the spacing and timing differ from character to character?

 

[1PokeMastr]

What's the point of RAR?

And is it ever a good idea to do grounded lasers?

And finaly I'm trash on CGing to Dair spiking. Does the spacing and timing differ from character to character?

Rar is a nice way to hit with a Bair or Other Aerial while facing the opposite direction you're travelling. I know Falco won't Shot Hop Fair.. ever.. Unless you're me. Anyway, I already it.

If your opponent sits back and Power Shields all the lasers from your SHDL. Just fire grounded ones to see if they can Power Sheild them all, it't what I do, and when they can't, it's free damage, other than attempting to laser lock, Grounded Lasers don't have much use.

As for the CG -> Spike.
All you have to do is Buffer a Dash and Dair, the timing is the same on all Characters.

 

[Mr. game and watch]

Is there any recent Wario MU discussions? Or lucario?

 

[1PokeMastr]

Sorry about this, but, we're still on D3 ? They should be started soon, but, I do know both of those Mu's a bit, and I can tell you what I know ( In Pm so we don't take up space on the boards ) Just leave me a Pm if you'd like to.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

There is also the attempt at a laser lock or slightly extra damage. Dthrow -> Jab -> Grounded Lasers.

 

[1PokeMastr]

"If your opponent sits back and Power Shields all the lasers from your SHDL. Just fire grounded ones to see if they can Power Sheild them all, it't what I do, and when they can't, it's free damage, other than attempting to laser lock, Grounded Lasers don't have much use."

 

[Mr. game and watch]

I've done CG>max%>Fthrow>dash attack> lasers, or SHDL.

Got wario from 0 to like, 65.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

Throwing out a specific case. Calm down Poke.

 

[Mr. game and watch]

Y'all don't even have Avis.

Get outsa here

 

[Jet300]

How do you do Falco's DACUS?

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

Y'all don't even have Avis.

Get outsa here

Ha! I have one now.

How do you do Falco's DACUS?

You need to cancel a dash attack into an Usmash within 2-3 frames after starting the dash attack. And that's about 1/30th-1/20th of a second to give you an idea of the speed needed.

You can start your dash attack with whatever button you have assigned to attack, or pushing the c-stick down. After you have done that, you need to move the control stick up and press the attack button (or grab button works too) or simply push up on the c-stick for the Usmash. However, you make your inputs, the time delay between them has to be 2-3 frames or very, very fast.

 

[1PokeMastr]

I like to be specific.

Also, If I don't have an Avi.
I wont get one.
If I have one.
I won't change it.

 

[Jet300]

Thanks Xeylode.

 

[Bloodcross]

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315221

 

[Blondie.]

I hate to ask it on here, but can one of you guys please critique my vids on the critique thread. I'm playin the same guy again tomorrow and would really appreciate some advice. Thanks!

 

[Mr. game and watch]

My SHDL doesn't hit wario while he's standing. But every once in awhile one hits him...

 

[1PokeMastr]

The perfect SHDL should hit Kirby while standing.
Silent laser fires at ground laser height.

 

[Mr. game and watch]

Ahhhh, ok, I'll work on that.
I was lead to believe you just SH double tap B and hit X to buffer the jump... But, that's too fast I suppose.

 

[1PokeMastr]

You don't have to buffer the Jump, well, I don't, I buffer the lasers.
Just make the jump input and as soon as you do, make the laser input.
Wait a few frames, make the next.

 

[teluoborg]

Yes do that and fire both laser so high that it won't hit a standing Marth.
But the right thing about what poke said is that you shouldn't buffer a jump after a SHDL because if the opponent manages to dodge the lasers you're stuck in a horrible position.

 

[Calvonta "Calvo" parker]

Well, i'm having trouble with the MU and every time I play my friend @ the beginning of the match it starts out well and then I lose a stock, and and slowly another, unable to hit I get 3 stocked. And the DDD MU i'm having the same prob I cant seem to hit him (well I can but Puma, (DDD main) always shields or shield grabs it.). I try to camp it out but it dosent work.

 

[-Cross-]

What are some good tactics with b-reverse laser? I've noticed that it's a good frame trap on characters trying to get back on the stage from the ledge. Example, jump away from the ledge to avoid any attack options from the ledge, then b-reverse laser can gimp their second jump, or if they do any other option you can react and punish b/c of nearly no landing lag. It also seems to be a good spacing tool when camping, but I don't see to many falco's using it. I'm new to Falco, but it seems that b-reverse lasers have a lot of utility, even though the tech isn't used that much. Am I wrong in thinking this?

 

[Zwei Striker]

The problem with b-reversal is that, if you mess it up, you do phantasm and die. That's the reason I don't use it, at least.

 

[-Cross-]

Then, practice more? I have trouble believing that's the real reason. imo b-reversal is easier than bdacus, and tons of Falco's try and perfect bdacus. I would argue that b-reversal has enough utility to be practiced to the level most Falcos can bdacus.

But this is all besides the point. My real question is (regardless of technical difficulty) how useful are b-reversal lasers? I also feel like I highlighted some good tactics, and I'm hoping others may tell me some more.

 

[1PokeMastr]

Well. Be Reversal is just pivoting the Direction you fire which.. is Just B then Side.
Wave bouncing is what can get you killed, you can wave bounce left or right.
A use for Wave Bouncing is.. approach, wave Bounce a laser, and you'll be out of their grab range, and get a nice free punish.

As for against D3, Fire Lasers, and Lasers and Lasers.
If he shields them ? Keep Firing.
If he walks up and shields them ? Run up Shield Grab him, or do an empty jump to bait something, or fake a phantasm, or just dash forwards, then dash back. Most people will shield when you dash towards them, expecting a hit, then you can just dash back and work your way from there.

For Sonic.. Honestly, the easiest way for me, is just.. camp.. run away, camp, Repeat.

 

[Zwei Striker]

Oh, damn, I confused B-reversal with Wavebouncing, my bad.

 

[-Cross-]

Still no answer to my original question :/

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

B Reversal lasers aren't something you learn to do for specific options. It's to have the ability to SHDL or SHSL a direction without having to pivot.

 

[-Cross-]

You're referring to turnaround lasers which is not what I'm talking about. lol this thread.

 

[teluoborg]

No one uses b reversal lasers. The frame window for the input is 3 frames iirc, the punishment for failing an input is ridiculously high and the benefits from it are ridiculously low (mix up your landings and... that's it ?).
If you want topractice something with precise timing train your phantasm canceling.

 

[Calvonta "Calvo" parker]

Hey guys, thanks for ignoreing my plea

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

@Calvo: I guess a problem you have with DDD is that he is sitting in shield the whole time? And any attempt to hit him from shielding gets you grabbed or Bair out of shield or spotdodge -> whatever?

For one, you can space around his shielding with Ftilt (has to be very exact) or wreck his shielding with AAA. Other methods are simply trying to mix it up and be tricky and abuse there habits in shield. Say for example you just sit there out of range of a grab and DDD is shielding. He cannot do anything unless you try to attack him or get very close. So, you can try walking up to him, then spotdodge or roll attempting to solicit a grab. Or even walk up to him and then dash away. Also, simply grabbing is another thing you can mix-up if all you ever do is attack his shield.

Try to pay attention to how DDD keeps reacting in shield, then try to mix-up how you go about handling that. Regarding Sonic, sorry, not much help I can give there, its a match-up I do not play a whole lot.

Edit: Dah, I hate smash jargon at times. Particularly how often things can used interchangeably.

 

[teluoborg]

No Xeylode, what you call B reversal is turnaround B and what you call Wavebounce is B reversal.
Wavebounce is a combination of both : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NoidQzpEpl0#t=40s

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

Jargon is irritating. Anyway, I guess I'll agree with Cross on this one. While its risky if one should mess up (as you mentioned teluoberg), it does add an aspect of aerial mobility to Falco's game-play which might throw one off or safe you in an awkward situation.

Besides, too many people are complaining about technical consistency and this is not that difficult to execute. Worth at least trying out more often before saying else against it.

 

[-Cross-]

I could see people complaining about wavebouncing lasers, but b-reversing lasers? Come on :/. From the looks of it, I guess people don't really know specific tactics using b-reverse lasers, but I'll provide an example of one. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qcs2juWBG8&t=0m31s

Gluttony is able to avoid any immediate retaliation from the MK by jumping away, then return immediately to the same spot to punish even if the MK dodges the initial laser. If the laser lands, he also gets a free hit. I'm sure there are case specific counters, but in general, b-reverse lasers seem to be too good of an option in this situation. I hope you all can understand why I think not employing b-reverse lasers because of potentially sd'ing with phantasm (something that can be solved with practice) is bs considering the advantage it can give you in certain situations, and if anybody has other uses PLEASE POST.

 

[1PokeMastr]

Just thought I'd point this out.. Metaknight could have Up B'd there, but, anyway. Using them to get out and get in is nice, and what Gluttony did there, really isn't hard, it's just Direction + Direction + B.

Though, I should encourage Falco's to learn to play without Lasers and Chain Grabs.
It has a lot more uses than your think. And it's loads of fun, haha.

It also allows for, if lasers aren't doing anything against your opponent, not using them may help.
And not chain grabbing, more mix ups and follow ups, haha.