Ask a Qusestion. Get an Answer.

[1PokeMastr]

High Level Falco play is just knowing Match ups, not having large noticeable patterns, ability to mind game, and ability to make reads.

2 - I just sit in training mode and practice all the techs and make sure I can do them fluently ( I'm in the same situation as you ).

3 - There's no guaranteed way to laser lock, but around +50% D-Throw -> Jab is a great way to set it up if they miss the tech.

F-Tilt is around 60 - 70%, if they miss the Tech you can laser lock.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

To add onto that, the get-up attack from the ledge puts people into state where they might hit the ground and be laserlocked. The only guaranteed form of laser lock set-up that comes to mind is hitting someone in shield off a platform. Some characters cannot tech at all when they fall off, so a laserlock is guaranteed. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ic0pWtsVTEo

Try to keep your friends interested in playing and try to improve there competitive play attitudes. Many times people lack putting in the time to learn or do not like the rules of standard competitive play. No items and only 1v1 3 stocks only gets boring to some people pretty quickly. Just try to make it as fun as possible for them. Eventually you both can learn from each other.

 

[SombreroJon]

@pokemastr

Thanks for the answers. Reading these forums it seems like everyone else is an area that has competitive smash, it's good to know I'm not the only one.

@Xeylode

Hm didn't know that about the ledge or platform setups. Looks like I'm going to have to get some sexy Bair to Laser lock combos on BF tomorrow.

And yeah I know what you're saying. I'm trying to keep them interested. The only 2 other guys that are p good enjoy the game and love playing each other but they don't like playing me.... too annoyed with losing to falco and/or being chaingrabbed so much. They play enough where they should be getting more competitive but idk, I would guess they just aren't naturally "good". I want to teach them and help them out to get better but I always feel like a doucher if I win then tell them what they can improve on.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

You could probably start mixing up how you do things. Instead of always chaingrab everyime you could, you might dthrow -> gatling combo, dthrow -> dash attack -> jab -> grab -> dthrow. Explore the character a bit more than some of the same things you have always been doing.

If you phantasm and laser a ton, try doing it less and figuring out other things you might try in its stead. You will learn more about the character and the other people might not get annoyed as much playing against a falco.

 

[SombreroJon]

I have been - that's the worst part lol.

I've p much stopped chaingrabbing, moved on to getting my f-tilt and u-tilt better. I've learned that u-tilt is actually very very good OoS in a lot of situations because it comes out so quickly. For example a fox I always play liked to SH Dair and a shield to up tilt wrecks him every time. Is a nice surprise kill too if they're up at 180 and you can't land anything.

OK well since this is a question thread I might as well ask another one...

What things should I practice to improve my laser game? I'd say it's my weakest part which is a shame on falco. My mind knows when to SHL and when to SHDL but against faster characters it usually puts me in a bad spot more often than a good one. I guess I need to get better at the backflip laser.

 

[Calvonta "Calvo" parker]

How to pratice wall/celing techs? I don't want to be stage spike gimped and get salty 'cause idk how.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

@SombreJon: I guess you are lasering in place? Yea, learning to retreat and perform a turnaround laser can help. But so can doing an empty short hop. Without committing to lasering at times, you can see if the other character is rushing up to you. If they are, you can perform an aerial to stop them, 2nd jump out of the way, or airdodge.

@Calvo: Pick up Snake and C4 yourself into the side of a stage or underneath one and try teching. You can buffer techs (press the shield button before reaching the wall). Plus, if you hold up on the up control stick or hold one of the jump buttons when you tech a wall, you will automatically jump. There are different timings depending upon your distance and speed from the wall/ceiling.

Other than that, the rest is practice when it actually happens in a match. Being stuck in firebird below the stage is probably a prime situation for when you might think people will hit you into the stage.

 

[1PokeMastr]

@Calvo: Pick up Snake and C4 yourself into the side of a stage or underneath one and try teching. You can buffer techs (press the shield button before reaching the wall). Plus, if you hold up on the up control stick or hold one of the jump buttons when you tech a wall, you will automatically jump. There are different timings depending upon your distance and speed from the wall/ceiling.
.

That Snake tech is really easy to be honest.
Another way would be to drop a bumper off a ledge -> walk off stage and have it bump you into it, tech it, recover into it and tech it again then repeat.

Another way is to drop a bomb omb and Bair it, then tech it on the side of the stage.

These are really helpful, but, you need to keep up with practicing it, My muscle memory can't seem to keep it in there.

 

[Host Change]

How to pratice wall/celing techs? I don't want to be stage spike gimped and get salty 'cause idk how.

I have a good way. Go into training mode and throw the bumper items and try to tech them. I had the same problem but that's what I've been doing for the past 2 weeks and it's helped a lot.

Also, are you trying to input the tech too late? When I started practicing, I found that I was usually hitting it too late rather than too early, and now I've gotten pretty good at techs.

 

[BleachigoZX]

When does Grab Armor activate?

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

Grab armor is only active for the single frame a person gets grabbed.

Falco catches someone on frame 6, but also would get hit on frame 6, grab armor is active. If he catches someone with his grab on frame 6, but gets hit on frame 7, no grab armor.

 

[Oninova]

Can someone tell me easiest, most simple button input for charging bdacus? I have it currently set so L is attack, and all I really need to do is press and hold L on the second Up C-stick, but since the double up c-stick already requires such fast input, having to press L as well just throws me off.

 

[-Cross-]

Work on bdacus until it becomes very fluent and easy for you. I remember when trying to buffer bdacus out of spotdodge, I would slam on my c-stick to try and get two inputs out quickly enough, needless to say, the excessive movement makes it difficult to input anything after it. But once I got enough practice that I didn't need to slam the c-stick and felt comfortable with the timing to just quickly flick it twice, it's all a matter of holding the attack button quickly enough. The thing with the trigger is that your input doesn't register until you press it down all the way, so that slight delay may be just enough to screw your timing. So you either press the L button faster or you can use the z-button which doesn't have the same problem as the trigger buttons. First though, master bdacus, then worry about charging.

 

[Blondie.]

Two questions:

How are you supposed to juggle?

From what I hear, falco is supposed to be a very good juggler. I know he has the uair to dair frame trap and stuff, but when I try to use it, I always get punished. I'll hit them in the air with a phantasm or something, and then they'll just throw out a dair or bair and punish my air chase. How are you supposed to mix up the juggling game to make it more effective?

Also, how are you supposed to land?

If you watch the matches I just posted in the critique thread, when I was playing sonic, I got landing camped A TON!!! I would get punished almost no matter what I tried, whether it be air dodge, bair, dair, or phantasm. How am I supposed to recover from something like an uthrow for sonic, or anyone for that matter?

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

Well, I think is a key component of keeping your advantage after an attack is maintaining the proper position between you and your opponent. A position that will minimize your risk of counter attack or giving up a good spot, yet puts them in a bad position where you can punish some or all of their options.

Say your on battlefield and you just hit them up into the air above the platforms. If you chase them really high above the platforms, you risk them air dodging past you. If that happens, you're in the air with them having just landed on platform. That's a bad spot to be in and the situation has quickly turn around. A risk for jumping out to meet them that far out, but can yield good results if you were right.

But if you instead stayed below the platforms, they cannot attack you, and instead you can try to attack them as they land on the platforms. Falco can full hop up to the top platform and hit someone with Nair/Bair/Uair/Dair. He can cover the lower platforms much the same way only using a short hop instead. In this position, you attack them through the platforms as they land (catching landing lag if your timing is good), but not easily hit from below.

There too many scenarios in this game to really detail what position you should take, but that's what I feel you need in order to "juggle" someone well.

As for getting down... Its something similar about choosing the right position to be in that has the least risk. Using Battlefield again as an example. Falco has just taken a strong hit offstage towards the upper blastzone and you need to get back to the stage. What can you do? Well, you could land on the upper platform and hope the character cannot get up to the location before the lag is over. You might go for the lower platform hoping that they might not react quickly enough. You can keep dropping and risk going on stage or going for the ledge. You might also try dropping through the platform once you get near above it to feint like you were going to land on the ledge.

Do a quick calculation on what your opponent's motions are and what their previous habits have been and pick an option you think will give you the best result.

 

[Orion*]

High Level Falco play is just knowing Match ups, not having large noticeable patterns, ability to mind game, and ability to make reads.

sounds like most characters for most fighting games

 

[1PokeMastr]

sounds like most characters for most fighting games

Exactly

 

[SombreroJon]

What should I/we look or listen for when trying to BDACUS out of D-Throw? In training at half speed it looks/feels like the buffer window comes out at the beginning of his third laser, but when I moved it 2/3 speed I couldn't even buffer a dash attack anywhere around that time. WTF.

 

[1PokeMastr]

Practice buffering a Dash attack out of his last laser in normal speed.
Then move on to BDacus.

 

[SombreroJon]

^^ of course.

I was just starting to question if I was even in the right buffer frame. Last laser correct?

 

[1PokeMastr]

Indeed, it is.
It's what I use to buffer things for D-Throw follow ups.

 

[-Cross-]

What should I/we look or listen for when trying to BDACUS out of D-Throw? In training at half speed it looks/feels like the buffer window comes out at the beginning of his third laser, but when I moved it 2/3 speed I couldn't even buffer a dash attack anywhere around that time. WTF.

Only use the slower speeds in training mode to learn when the move ends. I usually go 1/4 speed and zoom in on my character, then do the action I want to know the last ten frames up and hold shield. The moment the shield comes up, I know that is the last frame of that particular action. Then, you can ballpark estimate what the last 10 frames are.

Now go to real time and input commands in the 10 frame window you determined. I like to do dash forward+up on c-stick, because when it comes out as a dash attack, it means that you have buffered it correctly. If it comes out as dash u-smash, it means you didn't buffer the c-stick command quickly enough. Tip: C-stick never functions properly in speeds less than 1x in training mode, for me at least.

 

[SombreroJon]

Yeah that's exactly what I was doing to figure out when the buffering window was. Problem was I went to 2/3 speed to make sure once more that I was in the right time frame and my C-Stick was terrible only at that speed for some reason.

I haven't gotten the BDACUS out of D-throw quite down yet but I have a pretty good idea of when it comes out now at least. Protip: use any speed but 2/3'rds.

 

[Blondie.]

Does anyone have a .pac file for the falco hitbubbles? It would be awesome to be able to really see all the hitboxes when fighting to get better at spacing.

 

[1PokeMastr]

I had that Exact same idea.
However.. I could not find the .pac file.

If someone has it.
PLEASE link it to us.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

I'll ask around for one I know if they have it, if not I don't think it would be much trouble to make one.

 

[I Dair You]

lol I tried getting the Falco hitbubbles like a yr ago. But apparently, the original pac file got deleted and no one on these boards has the know-how to make one :/

 

[-Cross-]

Here is a video of his hitbubbles:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4j1k-I_bo6A&feature=BFa&list=PL12D8A5623ABC2599&lf=mh_lolz

Unfortunately, there is no super detailed thread of his hitbubbles that other characters have. But Smash lab has a project of showing the hitbubbles of every single character. I believe it's in the gameplay section of competitive brawl discussion. There are only 5.5 characters done, but if it is completed, Falco will eventually have his own hitbubble thread. imo, the most important thing is frame data for Falco. The frame data for Falco is pretty pitiful if you compare it to the more detailed ones around here. No knock on 4GOD or anything, but his frame data findings are old and slightly incorrect. If anybody knows someone is willing to do something like this: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=301721&
Please ask them

 

[4GOD (JJV)]

Here is a video of his hitbubbles:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4j1k-I_bo6A&feature=BFa&list=PL12D8A5623ABC2599&lf=mh_lolz

Unfortunately, there is no super detailed thread of his hitbubbles that other characters have. But Smash lab has a project of showing the hitbubbles of every single character. I believe it's in the gameplay section of competitive brawl discussion. There are only 5.5 characters done, but if it is completed, Falco will eventually have his own hitbubble thread. imo, the most important thing is frame data for Falco. The frame data for Falco is pretty pitiful if you compare it to the more detailed ones around here. No knock on 4GOD or anything, but his frame data findings are old and slightly incorrect. If anybody knows someone is willing to do something like this: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=301721&
Please ask them

I didn't know I had frame data findings!! Cool!

 

[-Cross-]

Oh wait... It's 3GOD not 4GOD. lolwut?

Oh and we do have a frame data thread, but it's not cool looking QQ: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=308016 for those who want to know, and question: Why isn't this stickied?

 

[Naridax]

I have noticed that SLS often simply runs up to his opponent and shields. Is this actually a safe approach option?

Also, is jab cancel to grab safe? My brothers often retaliate with jab after I jab them.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

Running up and shielding is not a horrible idea, but neither is it always the greatest thing to do. Shielding allows you to do certain things while preventing you from doing other things. It just depends.

Every jab cancel Falco has can be punished in some way. Some characters can punish Falco while others cannot. That doesn't mean you shouldn't stop using it, but rather change up how you keep using it. Instead of jab -> grab, try jab -> shield or jab -> shield grab. Depending on the character and the timing, you can get a power shield and you'll get the grab.

 

[Naridax]

Okay, thanks.

Is cancelling the first or second jab recommended? I have seen both used. I think using the second jab might be more common though.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

I feel jab1 is better simply because it gives your opponent less time to react and it does get a better frame advantage over the first one. However, there are uses for using Jab2 over only using the first one. Jab1 -> grab/ftilt can go through a spotdodge entirely. Jab2 allows you to wait it out. Jab 1 -> jab2 also gets more damage and getting jabbed twice can mess mroe people up.

Use both.

 

[Naridax]

Okay, thanks, so would you recommend playing with tap jump on or off?

And I do not see Falco players use pivot grab outside of chain grab. Is pivot grab a bad option? I see Marth players pass shielding opponents and pivot grab quite often. Falco does not dash very fast, but I would think that boost pivot grab would make up for that.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

Turning it off removes the possibility you might accidentally jump when you never intended too. I think having tap jump ON makes OoS Usmash much easier. Your call in the end.

The pivot grabs aren't a bad idea. Its just that whenever you might consider using it, there probably is another option available that is equally as good that you could have used.

 

[SombreroJon]

What is the best/easiest/most consistent way to get a full DACUS? The only way I know to do it is dash -> down C -> Up + Z. How fast must those inputs be? Are there other ways to DACUS? I read that changing Z to attack helps... I did and I guess it makes a difference.

Also - what do you guys feel is the best button setup for falco? I personally have R set to jump (SH lasers + IAP are easier), Z set to attack for reasons above, and Y set to grab because it was the most "natural" feeling grab button besides Z. I also have tap jump on, although I've heard that it's considered a bad thing to have it on.

 

[-Cross-]

What is the best/easiest/most consistent way to get a full DACUS? The only way I know to do it is dash -> down C -> Up + Z. How fast must those inputs be? Are there other ways to DACUS? I read that changing Z to attack helps... I did and I guess it makes a difference.

Also - what do you guys feel is the best button setup for falco? I personally have R set to jump (SH lasers + IAP are easier), Z set to attack for reasons above, and Y set to grab because it was the most "natural" feeling grab button besides Z. I also have tap jump on, although I've heard that it's considered a bad thing to have it on.

Ah yes, button mapping. Personally, I use R (attack) and that's it. I claw which is where you have your index finger over the Y button, so I don't need to change my buttons to be able to simultaneously jump while doing something (ie. IAP). Tap jump on has its advantages. The two biggest advantages are easier jump cancel u-smash/upB OoS and being able to meteor cancel asap. With tap jump on, you can spam up on the control stick when you get spiked and there will be no input penalty, but if you use a button to jump, you will not be able to jump again until a certain number of frames have passed. It's personal preference.

Also for Full DACUS, you need to get the attack button/u-smash input to register asap after the dash attack input. The faster the u-smash registers, the longer your dacus would be. This is why Falco's bdacus travels very far. Keep in mind though, this is not always the case: as you can see, Snake and Sheik go nowhere with their bdacus even though their normal DACUS travels very far.

 

[1PokeMastr]

Um.. those first two what you call a BDACUS are Hyphen Smashes.

Sheik's "Normal" Dacus, is actually a buffered input, which results in that incredibly far Dacus.

Snake's.. I have no idea, just C-Stick Up -> C-Stick down = His Dacus.

But, yeah, those first two AREN'T a Dacus.. they're hyphen smashes.
Just Dash -> Usmash.

Edit: It's just Cancelling your Fox trot dash animation into a Usmash.

 

[-Cross-]

Ummm lol? Did you even watch the vid? Innocentroads puts a banana in front of both characters and both characters pick it up which means its not a hyphen smash but a dacus. bdacus means you are doing dacus by buffering it out of a move, so technically it's just a dacus that sheik's do and not a bdacus.

Also it's c-stick down then up for dacus. And distance on dacus is character dependent and different characters have different timing. People tend to think that the faster you do the inputs the farther you'll go, but people forget that everybody can dacus but only certain characters gain a lot of distance. IR showed that this is the case with Sheik and Snake. Although their dacus travels far, their bdacus covers almost no ground