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Ask a quick question, get a quick answer (The Marth FAQ's)
- Thread starter Pierce7d
- Start date
andyisjudo
Smash Cadet
- Joined
- Jan 30, 2010
- Messages
- 71
It would take so much time if I read all of the pages if my question has came up already lol So I mind as well ask. I've been searching for a video on the stutter step with Marth and I couldn't find it. Maybe can someone link me to one or just explain it please. I need to reteach myself that lol
rahsosprout
Smash Apprentice
tap control stick forward>tap control stick back>tap c-stick forward
infiniteV115
Smash Hero
I like fthrow --> running shff nair --> fsmash, though the fsmash won't be tippered.
During Mike's set with Rain @ Genesis 2 (and against another MK during the crew battle) I noticed he decided to fthrow --> tippered fsmash, so it's probably guaranteed. It did 24%, which is pretty good.
fthrow --> running shff nair --> fsmash does more than 24 iirc, but I don't think it's guaranteed. It seems like it's likely to hit as long as they aren't spamming SL.
PS: Yes, these have to be done at 0%.
rahsosprout
Smash Apprentice
The fthrow>fsmash is a guaranteed follow-up and works from 0-3% on almost all of the cast. You can still get in a couple dthrow>fsmash at later % but it's not guaranteed and means your opponent is not DIing correctly. at higher %, grab release>dair spike is my favorite thing to do against MKs 
Jeos
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- May 3, 2009
- Messages
- 224
I like the fthrow>fthrow>double SH nair (or one nair and fair).
if you know the opponent you can do some nice reads and punish accordingly.
also fthrow to tipper fsmash is possible but has to be very well timed, too soon it won't tipper, too late and be punished.
for sttuter step fsmash:
start a dash, do a foxtrot and during the time you're foxtrotting, you can cancel into a fsmash in both directions or dashing to both directions (initial frames), is all up to you.
question: what the **** is a DAC grab? D: or a boost grab...
if you know the opponent you can do some nice reads and punish accordingly.
also fthrow to tipper fsmash is possible but has to be very well timed, too soon it won't tipper, too late and be punished.
for sttuter step fsmash:
start a dash, do a foxtrot and during the time you're foxtrotting, you can cancel into a fsmash in both directions or dashing to both directions (initial frames), is all up to you.
question: what the **** is a DAC grab? D: or a boost grab...
Reizilla
The Old Lapras and the Sea
- Joined
- Mar 20, 2008
- Messages
- 13,676
I will do fthrow > nair > jab > db/grab/fsmash, if they don't know how to get out of fthrow > nair. If they do, or if I'm at kill percents, I will just fthrow > fsmash.
DAC is dash attack cancel. Just hit down on the C stick and then grab, kinda like you're doing a DACUS.
DAC is dash attack cancel. Just hit down on the C stick and then grab, kinda like you're doing a DACUS.
Akashi
Smash Lord
You can GR Ike/DK too, but they have to struggle. Both can only be fair'd, iirc. I should really post a video of all of Marth's CGs/GRs... maybe someday
edit:
edit:
Also spike and fairV said:
ScareMl
Smash Journeyman
i had a question. What's the CF vs Marth MU ratio. I thought it was a large advantage for Marth, but then i watched Ally beating Leon with CF at ngamers and now...im not so sure. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=33IILAuhnSc&feature=relmfu
PEACE7
Smash Champion
^ WTF I had never seen those lol thanks for the link
ScareMl
Smash Journeyman
no problem ally made that MU look even. What is it in reality? is it still like 80-20 or something for marth? lol
infiniteV115
Smash Hero
Hi guys. I need a little help making a decision. Any serious input is appreciated.
I'm a ZSS main. She's my favourite character in the game and there's no way anybody else will ever become my main.
Now that that's said, I'm having trouble choosing who my secondary should be. I know I don't HAVE to have a secondary, but it helps. Right now, I'm stuck between Marth and Pika (no particular reason other than they're the most fun out of the rest of the cast, and they're not complete garbage), and they both do well (Pika especially) against Falco (ZSS' worst matchup, really annoying), so having either as a secondary will benefit me greatly in that aspect. I'd like to hear what other reasons you guys may have as to why I should choose Marth over Pika.
And I'd like to hear reasons such as MU coverage, CPing/being CPed to certain stages, pocket characters, how it affects my playstyle, etc. Please no spam.
P.S I'm fairly new to the competitive scene, after like 2 weeks I'll have been to 4 tournaments (in my entire life) so any other input (such as how much practice to put into mains/secondaries) is welcome.
I'm a ZSS main. She's my favourite character in the game and there's no way anybody else will ever become my main.
Now that that's said, I'm having trouble choosing who my secondary should be. I know I don't HAVE to have a secondary, but it helps. Right now, I'm stuck between Marth and Pika (no particular reason other than they're the most fun out of the rest of the cast, and they're not complete garbage), and they both do well (Pika especially) against Falco (ZSS' worst matchup, really annoying), so having either as a secondary will benefit me greatly in that aspect. I'd like to hear what other reasons you guys may have as to why I should choose Marth over Pika.
And I'd like to hear reasons such as MU coverage, CPing/being CPed to certain stages, pocket characters, how it affects my playstyle, etc. Please no spam.
P.S I'm fairly new to the competitive scene, after like 2 weeks I'll have been to 4 tournaments (in my entire life) so any other input (such as how much practice to put into mains/secondaries) is welcome.
basvhout
Smash Apprentice
Started the game playing tap jump off, still do so. But I read something wich might help alot if you have it ON. so I play marth i guess on is really helpfull for OOS options and thats needed for marth?
Akashi
Smash Lord
you can buffer anything oos with tap jump off as you can on. For dolphin slash, I have x set to special, so i can roll jump (y) to special immediately. Obviously you don't need special controls, but it helps me.
rahsosprout
Smash Apprentice
I thought for DS OoS with tap jump off you have to shield drop first before doing DS as opposed to with it on where you can do it during multi-hit moves cuz of invincibility frames.
ScareMl
Smash Journeyman
Kirby MU
anybody have tips on the marth v kirby MU?
anybody have tips on the marth v kirby MU?
Zano
Smash Master
stay grounded, don't try to fight him in the air.
That's all I know, lol
That's all I know, lol
ScareMl
Smash Journeyman
the pika MU isn't that bad. you have more range with your aerials, and you can sdi out of his d-smash. counter his side-b recovery and space your fairs and nairs. also, at 0% you can do f-throw>f-throw>d-throw>f-smash.
as for the IC's, i don't have much exp. with them, but you need to space or else if you get grabbed, your dead. try to separate nana and popo, and idk if it's just me, but i noticed it's better instead of going after nana when they're separated, just charge a smash and wait for nana to run into it cuz she can't dodge or DI.
somebody correct me if i messed up on any of these points but i hoped that helped a little
as for the IC's, i don't have much exp. with them, but you need to space or else if you get grabbed, your dead. try to separate nana and popo, and idk if it's just me, but i noticed it's better instead of going after nana when they're separated, just charge a smash and wait for nana to run into it cuz she can't dodge or DI.
somebody correct me if i messed up on any of these points but i hoped that helped a little
Kuro~
Nitoryu Kuro
When marth does a grounded up-b and hits the ground does he still have to land again to get rid of lag or does that landing from freefall count? Was watching some vids and it confused me a bit.
Also i read in a thread that marth can tipper upair mk via GR. The timing is somewhat similar to dair the person said. Can someone elaborate a bit?
Also i read in a thread that marth can tipper upair mk via GR. The timing is somewhat similar to dair the person said. Can someone elaborate a bit?
If he does a grounded DS he doesn't suffer RCO lag. I'm not entirely sure about the GR > uair but if it's similar to the timing of a dair then I'd just dair unless you're in the middle of the stage and uair would kill.
@ VICTR
What I've noticed most good Marth's do vs diddy is they just read his banana tosses and punish his follow ups. That's a really condensed statement but that should give you a start.
@ tubby
I don't have much wolf exp and I need to learn that MU as well so maybe Shaya could help with that. Against ROB you're gonna have to approach with the best spacing you can. His ftilt outranges your aerials but it has cooldown. I would stay just outside his ftilt range and test the waters with him. See if he commits to things and if he knows his spacing well. Space with nair not fair. His nair/bair/dair can be countered on reaction as long as you haven't commited to anything. Always pay attention to if he has a gyro charged or in hand. If he doesn't then know the spacing for a quick gyro so you know when to expect it. His dtilt is a pain. If he does it on your shield then DS oos. If he misses in front of you then dash > DB. If it connects DI up since it's a free followup and you don't want to be offstage vs ROB since he can gimp you well. If he does get you offstage and he goes for a fair the DS early. Juggles and ledgetraps are really good vs ROB. On the ledge all his options are telegraphed and in the air all he can do is AD, dair, and falling nair. Jump to bait the AD. If he doesn't then counter his nair/dair on reaction. He has trouble killing so his main method to kill you is getting you offstage. Always DI up. Don't get directly above him so you avoid usmash. If he's holding a gyro he's already shot then look for glidetoss > fsmash to get you offstage. Nair and bair are your best kill moves. If he upb's he can't AD until he lands or grabs the ledge so that's your chance to edgeguard him. Walk don't run (vs any character). Don't be afraid to throw out shield breaker as a mixup.
That's all I have hope it helps.
@ VICTR
What I've noticed most good Marth's do vs diddy is they just read his banana tosses and punish his follow ups. That's a really condensed statement but that should give you a start.
@ tubby
I don't have much wolf exp and I need to learn that MU as well so maybe Shaya could help with that. Against ROB you're gonna have to approach with the best spacing you can. His ftilt outranges your aerials but it has cooldown. I would stay just outside his ftilt range and test the waters with him. See if he commits to things and if he knows his spacing well. Space with nair not fair. His nair/bair/dair can be countered on reaction as long as you haven't commited to anything. Always pay attention to if he has a gyro charged or in hand. If he doesn't then know the spacing for a quick gyro so you know when to expect it. His dtilt is a pain. If he does it on your shield then DS oos. If he misses in front of you then dash > DB. If it connects DI up since it's a free followup and you don't want to be offstage vs ROB since he can gimp you well. If he does get you offstage and he goes for a fair the DS early. Juggles and ledgetraps are really good vs ROB. On the ledge all his options are telegraphed and in the air all he can do is AD, dair, and falling nair. Jump to bait the AD. If he doesn't then counter his nair/dair on reaction. He has trouble killing so his main method to kill you is getting you offstage. Always DI up. Don't get directly above him so you avoid usmash. If he's holding a gyro he's already shot then look for glidetoss > fsmash to get you offstage. Nair and bair are your best kill moves. If he upb's he can't AD until he lands or grabs the ledge so that's your chance to edgeguard him. Walk don't run (vs any character). Don't be afraid to throw out shield breaker as a mixup.
That's all I have hope it helps.
Roy's ouR boy
Smash Rookie
I've been wondering for a couple of months now...
How does Mike do that weird DB1 trick where he just gets some weird momentum?
Ive seen him do it so many times. I haven't seen any other Marth players do it yet.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-NyvpsniLbA
He does it at 1:44
and again at 2:55
How does Mike do that weird DB1 trick where he just gets some weird momentum?
Ive seen him do it so many times. I haven't seen any other Marth players do it yet.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-NyvpsniLbA
He does it at 1:44
and again at 2:55
he does a breversed opposing direction db1.
So hes going towards the ledge > this way
he dbs < this way, and b reverses it back towards >.
So hes going towards the ledge > this way
he dbs < this way, and b reverses it back towards >.
remember that swords out disjoint body parts (fair/bair/smashes/jabs) and that his out of shield options are quite bad.
You have to respect his shield in terms of range and lag though, he can cover all laggy options on his shield with shield drop fsmash (this is pretty important, not many characters can punish marth with a kill move when they fully spaced fsmash tipper their shield)
jab is very strong. His landing options aren't that strong due to marth's sword outdisjointing his shine
it kinda plays out like the ditto because of wolf's good range and similar aerial ability. Marth with very strong spacing (with subsequent reads) is very hard for wolf to do much with, but its very stressful play.
You have to respect his shield in terms of range and lag though, he can cover all laggy options on his shield with shield drop fsmash (this is pretty important, not many characters can punish marth with a kill move when they fully spaced fsmash tipper their shield)
jab is very strong. His landing options aren't that strong due to marth's sword outdisjointing his shine
it kinda plays out like the ditto because of wolf's good range and similar aerial ability. Marth with very strong spacing (with subsequent reads) is very hard for wolf to do much with, but its very stressful play.
Kuro~
Nitoryu Kuro
Well,ya that's why i'm looking into it. There were many a time when i grabbed someone in the middle where a tipper upair prolly would of killed them.If he does a grounded DS he doesn't suffer RCO lag. I'm not entirely sure about the GR > uair but if it's similar to the timing of a dair then I'd just dair unless you're in the middle of the stage and uair would kill.
@ VICTR
What I've noticed most good Marth's do vs diddy is they just read his banana tosses and punish his follow ups. That's a really condensed statement but that should give you a start.
@ tubby
I don't have much wolf exp and I need to learn that MU as well so maybe Shaya could help with that. Against ROB you're gonna have to approach with the best spacing you can. His ftilt outranges your aerials but it has cooldown. I would stay just outside his ftilt range and test the waters with him. See if he commits to things and if he knows his spacing well. Space with nair not fair. His nair/bair/dair can be countered on reaction as long as you haven't commited to anything. Always pay attention to if he has a gyro charged or in hand. If he doesn't then know the spacing for a quick gyro so you know when to expect it. His dtilt is a pain. If he does it on your shield then DS oos. If he misses in front of you then dash > DB. If it connects DI up since it's a free followup and you don't want to be offstage vs ROB since he can gimp you well. If he does get you offstage and he goes for a fair the DS early. Juggles and ledgetraps are really good vs ROB. On the ledge all his options are telegraphed and in the air all he can do is AD, dair, and falling nair. Jump to bait the AD. If he doesn't then counter his nair/dair on reaction. He has trouble killing so his main method to kill you is getting you offstage. Always DI up. Don't get directly above him so you avoid usmash. If he's holding a gyro he's already shot then look for glidetoss > fsmash to get you offstage. Nair and bair are your best kill moves. If he upb's he can't AD until he lands or grabs the ledge so that's your chance to edgeguard him. Walk don't run (vs any character). Don't be afraid to throw out shield breaker as a mixup.
That's all I have hope it helps.
ScareMl
Smash Journeyman
Shaya, i need help with the kirby MU. You got any tips on that?
Yeah.. jumpings bad against kirby because his bair absolutely ***** us trying to do any 'laggy movements' from the ground.
Jab and hard reads of his landings, rar bairs is very strong.
By hard reads of his landings, if you power shield a falling bair, you're gonna get some **** on him.
But if he fast falls into a roll, grab, utilt, spot dodge, crouch, and other stuff you gotta pick the right moves to take advantage.
Fortunately dancing blade is quite good here, but rolls, spot dodges, and utilts can beat it, as well as a dash away reverse fsmash (**** stings).
WALK ONLY. THERE IS NO REASON TO EVER DASH IN THE MATCH UP, THE SPEED OF KIRBYS ROLLS AND HIS RANGE ABSOLUTELY ANNIHILATE MARTH'S TERRIBLE DASH TO SHIELD LENGTH. Kirby's grab range is pretty monstrous. Don't get grabbed, it can mean half of your stock each time.
Use retreating aerials as a means of "trying to reset your spacing", but don't get read (i.e. dash to power shielding your rising aerial... it means an fsmash angled upwards or a grab).
Walking and trying to jab when he fast falls his bair. Just get used to the timing of his landing, if he isn't going to bair you should be able to tell, and from there you just need to not have him **** your spacing with a well timed roll / shield\dash grab.
If he's keeping "high" and stalling with jumps, just rar bair him.
Jab and hard reads of his landings, rar bairs is very strong.
By hard reads of his landings, if you power shield a falling bair, you're gonna get some **** on him.
But if he fast falls into a roll, grab, utilt, spot dodge, crouch, and other stuff you gotta pick the right moves to take advantage.
Fortunately dancing blade is quite good here, but rolls, spot dodges, and utilts can beat it, as well as a dash away reverse fsmash (**** stings).
WALK ONLY. THERE IS NO REASON TO EVER DASH IN THE MATCH UP, THE SPEED OF KIRBYS ROLLS AND HIS RANGE ABSOLUTELY ANNIHILATE MARTH'S TERRIBLE DASH TO SHIELD LENGTH. Kirby's grab range is pretty monstrous. Don't get grabbed, it can mean half of your stock each time.
Use retreating aerials as a means of "trying to reset your spacing", but don't get read (i.e. dash to power shielding your rising aerial... it means an fsmash angled upwards or a grab).
Walking and trying to jab when he fast falls his bair. Just get used to the timing of his landing, if he isn't going to bair you should be able to tell, and from there you just need to not have him **** your spacing with a well timed roll / shield\dash grab.
If he's keeping "high" and stalling with jumps, just rar bair him.
Roy's ouR boy
Smash Rookie
Thanks Shaya. I will try to implement that into my game.
light-zion
Smash Cadet
I neeed help. How do i stutter step??????????????? does anyone have a video that shows what it looks like cuz i never seen it before? plz help me