Wyvern
Smash Journeyman
The main problem I have with wavedashing is that, with the way things are now in Melee, I feel that it hurts the balance of the game. I mean, how could it not? The game designers didn't consider it when they designed the characters, and it doesn't even affect all characters evenly.
For example, let's look at Bowser vs. Fox. (Obviously, there's a heck of a lot more than a bad wavedash keeping Bowser out of the major leagues, but just bear with me for a minute here.) By taking advantage of wavedashing, Fox can open up whole new avenues for mindgames, controlling his spacing, etc. Bowser is denied this privelage. As a result of this, even if Bowser and Fox had been balanced against one another to begin with, Fox now simply has greater base potential than Bowser due to the unforseen factor of the wavedash.
Obviously, the designers are going to try to improve the balance of the cast for Brawl. But how are they going to do it with wavedashing in mind? They can't very well ignore it again, now that they know what it means. So what are their options?
Well, they could fully embrace wavedashing as a part of the game, and give each fighter custom wavedash mechanics. Bowser could be given a much longer wavedash, and now he can be sliding around with the best of 'em. His moveset would be rebalanced a little with this new ability in mind (as would Fox's, for that matter), and everyone would live happily ever after, right?
But it's nowhere near that simple. I think Jumanji said it the best:
Alternately, they could leave wavedashing mechanics the way they are now and just balance around it. To compensate for his inability to preform wavedash-related feats, Bowser could be buffed in other ways, getting more speed and power, and Fox could stay more or less the same. But this is barely better than the first option. Now, in a battle between casual players who know nothing about the wavedash (whether you like it or not, this is the primary audience these games have in mind), Bowser is the overpowered one. And why should Fox have to work twice as hard as Bowser to fight at the same level? Even if Bowser becomes a tournament-viable character, I can imagine the social stigmas developing: elitist long-time smashers saying how Bowser is a noob character and people only play him because they don't want to work at improving themselves with advanced techniques with the "real" characters.
The easiest thing from a pure balance perspective is to take out wavedashing entirely, but I think the downsides to this have been covered quite extensively in this thread already.
So it's not just as simple as "should we leave wavedashing in or take it out". The developers need to grapple between pleasing both the casual players and the dedicated competitive smashers, all while sticking to a unified design philosophy. It's a difficult thing to manage.
And as for me? Well, a month or two ago, I probably would have told you that they should just take out wavedashing and be done with it. But I've come to understand the issue a little better now, so here's what I think: My prediction is that they'll leave wavedashing in the game, but they'll try to reduce its emphasis as much as possible. The new faster dodges are a good example of this. They don't singularly replace the wavedash, but they're still much better for spacing than the old rolls, and characters with poor wavedashes especially will get a lot of benefit out of them. And remember those animations everyone was analyzing back on page 28? I submit to you that Mario and Wario aren't wavedashing, but are simply hitting the ground and running. What if they just took out the stun associated with the landing frames and let you keep moving as soon as you hit the ground? That would make real wavelanding not seem so out of place, wouldn't it?
True wavedashing might still be a factor in tournament play even with changes like these, but it would greatly diminish the rift between casual and competitive play. Competitive players will be better at things everyone is familiar with, rather than prying completely new and secret techniques out of the game against the designers' intentions. It seems like it would be a good compromise between the two sides.
For example, let's look at Bowser vs. Fox. (Obviously, there's a heck of a lot more than a bad wavedash keeping Bowser out of the major leagues, but just bear with me for a minute here.) By taking advantage of wavedashing, Fox can open up whole new avenues for mindgames, controlling his spacing, etc. Bowser is denied this privelage. As a result of this, even if Bowser and Fox had been balanced against one another to begin with, Fox now simply has greater base potential than Bowser due to the unforseen factor of the wavedash.
Obviously, the designers are going to try to improve the balance of the cast for Brawl. But how are they going to do it with wavedashing in mind? They can't very well ignore it again, now that they know what it means. So what are their options?
Well, they could fully embrace wavedashing as a part of the game, and give each fighter custom wavedash mechanics. Bowser could be given a much longer wavedash, and now he can be sliding around with the best of 'em. His moveset would be rebalanced a little with this new ability in mind (as would Fox's, for that matter), and everyone would live happily ever after, right?
But it's nowhere near that simple. I think Jumanji said it the best:
Wavedashing simply does not fit the design philosophy of Super Smash Bros, and they would be contradicting themselves by focusing on it like this. They can't very well just keep it hidden now that they've made it a fundamental game mechanic, but are they supposed to now put wavedashing in all the instruction manuals? What'll happen when the casual crowd sees it and can't understand why they've suddenly tried to make the game so complicated? And what if a lot of characters were to be designed such that they need to wavedash a lot to play properly at any level? They would risk alienating their primary audience. It's just not going to happen.
Alternately, they could leave wavedashing mechanics the way they are now and just balance around it. To compensate for his inability to preform wavedash-related feats, Bowser could be buffed in other ways, getting more speed and power, and Fox could stay more or less the same. But this is barely better than the first option. Now, in a battle between casual players who know nothing about the wavedash (whether you like it or not, this is the primary audience these games have in mind), Bowser is the overpowered one. And why should Fox have to work twice as hard as Bowser to fight at the same level? Even if Bowser becomes a tournament-viable character, I can imagine the social stigmas developing: elitist long-time smashers saying how Bowser is a noob character and people only play him because they don't want to work at improving themselves with advanced techniques with the "real" characters.
The easiest thing from a pure balance perspective is to take out wavedashing entirely, but I think the downsides to this have been covered quite extensively in this thread already.
So it's not just as simple as "should we leave wavedashing in or take it out". The developers need to grapple between pleasing both the casual players and the dedicated competitive smashers, all while sticking to a unified design philosophy. It's a difficult thing to manage.
And as for me? Well, a month or two ago, I probably would have told you that they should just take out wavedashing and be done with it. But I've come to understand the issue a little better now, so here's what I think: My prediction is that they'll leave wavedashing in the game, but they'll try to reduce its emphasis as much as possible. The new faster dodges are a good example of this. They don't singularly replace the wavedash, but they're still much better for spacing than the old rolls, and characters with poor wavedashes especially will get a lot of benefit out of them. And remember those animations everyone was analyzing back on page 28? I submit to you that Mario and Wario aren't wavedashing, but are simply hitting the ground and running. What if they just took out the stun associated with the landing frames and let you keep moving as soon as you hit the ground? That would make real wavelanding not seem so out of place, wouldn't it?
True wavedashing might still be a factor in tournament play even with changes like these, but it would greatly diminish the rift between casual and competitive play. Competitive players will be better at things everyone is familiar with, rather than prying completely new and secret techniques out of the game against the designers' intentions. It seems like it would be a good compromise between the two sides.
). In the future, please do not tell me and other people what would be more fun for us in such an authoritative tone. Thanks