Official 4BR Tier List V3 - Competitive Insight & Analysis

[Zerp]

You are joking right? How could ZeRo lose? He wipes the floor with Nairo.

No, he's not joking, that actually happened, I think ZeRo's just nervous.

 

[Ziodyne 21]

Man.. anyone think its possible all the pressure was finally getting to him . Even in the his video he posted about about why Civil War is so important he sounded kind of nervous and uncertain. Saying that it would be the most difficult competition he will be in yet and it would be the most important event yet in the entire history of Smash 4

 

[Fenny]

He just...lost to the strangest people...

 

[Bowserboy3]

In a way, it's kind of a good thing to all upcoming competitors that ZeRo lost this early.

By that I mean, it shows that these top players aren't all superhuman; they do indeed suffer the same things that a lot of us do (nerves) from time to time.

Fantastic job to that ZSS player though. I can't bear to imagine his heart rate during the last stock!

Sad for ZeRo personally though. Isn't this his lowest placement, ever? Like, even across all games?

 

[ARGHETH]

In a way, it's kind of a good thing to all upcoming competitors that ZeRo lost this early.

By that I mean, it shows that these top players aren't all superhuman; they do indeed suffer the same things that a lot of us do (nerves) from time to time.

Fantastic job to that ZSS player though. I can't bear to imagine his (this is me just assuming, correct me if "she" is more appropriate) heart rate during the last stock!

Sad for ZeRo personally though. Isn't this his lowest placement, ever? Like, even across all games?

Yup.
(Him and Ally are actually tied now)

 

[NotLiquid]

Honestly I'd say ZeRo was playing regularly and just fine until Game 4/5 when it was clear he was shook, neither him or Luhtie were committing to much.

Also: a notable thing about Luhtie's playstyle I felt was that compared to the likes of Nairo and several top ZSS players, Luhtie didn't go for grabs. ZeRo has a habit of exploiting ZSS players by punishing whiffed grabs but Luhtie spent most of the game going for aerials and safer tilts whenever it felt like other players would go for a grab. It felt like ZeRo was waiting for Luhtie to commit to something he rarely did, something ZeRo caught onto after Game 3 from the looks of it. But by Game 5 I think both of them were already too scared to get caught in a kill setup since Luhtie was way too good with those edge guards and Diddy's kill confirms are way too safe.

Imagine that, Luhtie was probably scared out of his mind, but the best player in the world was probably even more scared of him.

 

[Bowserboy3]

I never saw this set actually.

Was it on a different stream then?

Probably super premature asking, but is it uploaded or anything yet?

I'd assume if not, it will be one of the first to get uploaded due to the nature of the upset though.

 

[ARGHETH]

I never saw this set actually.

Was it on a different stream then?

Probably super premature asking, but is it uploaded or anything yet?

I'd assume if not, it will be one of the first to get uploaded due to the nature of the upset.

It was on the secondary stream, ESAsmash.

 

[YerTheBestAROUND]

Another notable upset: Ally loses to Locus 3-1 sending him to losers.

 

[TDK]

Maybe I'm biased because I got a lot of mileage out of challenging Locus's Focus Attack landings with Link's ridiculous multihits, but Ally had way too much respect for them.

That leads me to another point: How does Mario challenge Focus Attacks?

 

[ARGHETH]

Maybe I'm biased because I got a lot of mileage out of challenging Locus's Focus Attack landings with Link's ridiculous multihits, but Ally had way too much respect for them.

That leads me to another point: How does Mario challenge Focus Attacks?

Isn't Dair a nice multihit?

 

[Diamond Octobot]

You can't always be ready to DAir. On the other hand, F.L.U.D.D. & Cape are nice anwsers. Not absolute, but they work nonetheless.

...Actually scratch that these 3 moves are ok answers

 

[|RK|]

Maybe I'm biased because I got a lot of mileage out of challenging Locus's Focus Attack landings with Link's ridiculous multihits, but Ally had way too much respect for them.

That leads me to another point: How does Mario challenge Focus Attacks?

Why challenge them?

 

[|RK|]

whoops... delet

 

[TDK]

Why challenge them?

From personal experience, I got a lot of mileage from challenging them. Pretty much every time I hit Locus into the air, he'd try to Focus back to the ground, which in-turn got him hit. I still lost because he's just better, but by punishing his Focus Attacks with good multihits I kept it closer than I would have expected.

 

[Das Koopa]

Link in Top 32 at the most stacked tournament ever

 

[TDK]

Link in Top 32 at the most stacked tournament ever

 

[Das Koopa]

Called it. HIKARU beat VoiD 3-1. His Fox (which looked crisp btw) but still.

Japan has such a grasp on Top 32 that if Aba beats Elegant for top 32 then Japan is confirmed for Top 8 lmao

 

[Peppermint1201]

Link in Top 32 at the most stacked tournament ever

oh Radical Larry, why didn't we listen?

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Regarding T I'd like to point out that it's his set win against NAKAT that got him into top 32.

Just mentioning it because I've been arguing against the notion that Fox mops the floor with Link for quite a while now. At this point I feel fairly confident in saying that it's an even matchup and given that T has beaten both Shogun's and NAKAT's Fox the burden of proof isn't even on me in that case. If you still think Fox wins it you better argue your points well.

 

[L9999]

oh Radical Larry, why didn't we listen?

T wasn't around back then.

 

[MistressRemilia]

Link in Top 32 at the most stacked tournament ever

And yet the best wins of T so far are Nakat & Meteor. ( at CW )
Quite a fortunate bracket, wouldn't you say

Edit: K9 too, who apparently went Diddy, over Sheik, for some reason.

 

[TDK]

And yet the best wins of T so far are Nakat & Meteor. ( at CW )
Quite a fortunate bracket, wouldn't you say

And K9 in a 35-65 at best matchup gets no recognition?

 

[Rizen]

oh Radical Larry, why didn't we listen?

Because he said a lot of stuff that's still outrageous like 'Link beats Sheik +2'.

 

[TDK]

2GGC: Civil War top 32

Winners:
Earth vs Captain Zack
Mr. R vs Nietono
Locus vs Kirihara
Dabuz vs Shuton
T vs Tsu-
HIKARU vs Abadango
Nairo vs Ranai
Komorikiri vs Fatality

Losers:
Larry Lurr vs Mr. E
9B vs FOW
Ally vs ESAM
Zinoto vs Salem
Ac vs Trela
ANTi vs Samsora
Tweek vs Marss
Shope vs Falln

33rd:
Zenyou
ImHip
MVD
Vinnie
Xzax
Kameme
Mr. Con Con
Luhtie
Javi
6WX
Lycan
Kome
NAKAT
Nicko
VoiD
Elegant

49th:
Charliedaking
Aarvark
Tyroy
8BitMan
WaDi
Mew2King
Eon
ZeRo
Konga
SS
DSS
Shaky
Dath
Day
S1
Meteor

 

[Flux0r]

I have a strange feeling Captain Zack might be able to win this.

The stuff he did in that set against Kameme... I've never seen anything like that before.

Might be crazy for saying this, what does everyone think?

It may help with ZeRo out of the picture as well.

 

[ShadowGuy1]

2GGC: Civil War top 32

Winners:
Earth vs Captain Zack
Mr. R vs Nietono
Locus vs Kirihara
Dabuz vs Shuton
T vs Tsu-
HIKARU vs Abadango
Nairo vs Ranai
Komorikiri vs Fatality

Losers:
Larry Lurr vs Mr. E
9B vs FOW
Ally vs ESAM
Zinoto vs Salem
Ac vs Trela
ANTi vs Samsora
Tweek vs Marss
Shope vs Falln

33rd:
Zenyou
ImHip
MVD
Vinnie
Xzax
Kameme
Mr. Con Con
Luhtie
Javi
6WX
Lycan
Kome
NAKAT
Nicko
VoiD
Elegant

49th:
Charliedaking
Aarvark
Tyroy
8BitMan
WaDi
Mew2King
Eon
ZeRo
Konga
SS
DSS
Shaky
Dath
Day
S1
Meteor

Meteor did not use Ryu vs MKLeo. He beat him with Sonic. People just assume he uses Ryu because of MKLeos Ryu weakness. Also for VoiD, add Fox because it did take a game from Hikaru.

 

[TheGoodGuava]

Maybe Link will finally get the breakout tournament hes been craving for so long

 

[Lord Dio]

I really want to see Zack vs Tsu in WFs now...the fight with Salem was amazing at Frostbite, and I want o see how Tsu plays against such an aggro bayo.....
Granted, if Tsu meets Fatality in QFs....it's all over for Tsu, and then Fatality will get bodied by Zack........
Despite having to face a sheik if he beats earth and a good probability of having to face a rosalina if he wins the sheik fight, things look good for zack imo.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

Sheesh this game gets crazy at times.

"Yeah we have top and high tiers, but really anybody all the way down to the top half of low tier can place top 32 in a super stacked tournament. Including the one so stacked Zero failed to make top 32."

Certainly explains why tier lists can be seemingly all over the place.

 

[Envoy of Chaos]

I'm just happy I see Ness success three Nesses in 49 and then FOW still in at the most stacked Smash 4 tournament ever is wonderful.

 

[TDK]

Corrin, Ike, Bowser, Wario, Yoshi and Lucas kind of flopped this tournament, being unable to top 64. Corrin and Bowser might show up as secondaries for Earth/ESAM and Nairo respectively, but what on earth happened to the other four?

 

[TheGoodGuava]

Corrin, Ike, Bowser, Wario, Yoshi and Lucas kind of flopped this tournament, being unable to top 64. Corrin and Bowser might show up as secondaries for Earth/ESAM and Nairo respectively, but what on earth happened to the other four?

Esam also has a Yoshi that we might actually see

 

[Envoy of Chaos]

Corrin, Ike, Bowser, Wario, Yoshi and Lucas kind of flopped this tournament, being unable to top 64. Corrin and Bowser might show up as secondaries for Earth/ESAM and Nairo respectively, but what on earth happened to the other four?

Well Wario was literally just Gluttony and I don't know if the other Lucas mains went but Taiheta didn't so that's not helping his results here. Can't comment on the other two characters

 

[Nidtendofreak]

Corrin, Ike, Bowser, Wario, Yoshi and Lucas kind of flopped this tournament, being unable to top 64. Corrin and Bowser might show up as secondaries for Earth/ESAM and Nairo respectively, but what on earth happened to the other four?

Only two Ike mains (and Lycan who will occasionally use Ike but I don't think he did this tournament). In Ryo's case I think he ran into match up inexperience x2: Kome and then Shaky. No clue about SM.

Did Ryuga show up for Corrin? Because if so that's a pretty major blowout. I know Cosmos didn't. Xion beat Wrath but that was about it for them. But the overall lack of Corrin results outside of "maybe Earth" is just furthering my belief that Corrin is mid tier and not high tier. If his MU spread was as good as claimed, he'd have at least one sure fire rep in the top 65. Time to put that thinking away and accept he ain't so great. Because quite frankly even if Ryuga didn't show up I'm pretty sure Corrin had more reps there than all of those characters you mentioned. Possibly combined.

Wario ran into "giant sword character issue" aka Shulk.

Marth took a beating as well considering how many of his reps showed up and how few made top 32.

Bowser... FinalBoss lost to a Ganondorf. Don't know anything beyond that.

 

[Lord Dio]

There's only one person in top 32 who plays marth, and they've gone lucina for the vast majority of the tournament.......Marth had his good days at ZeRo saga and G4, the dlc had their bad day at Frostbite, now it's time for marth and I guess top players in general to have a bad day.

 

[ARGHETH]

Only two Ike mains (and Lycan who will occasionally use Ike but I don't think he did this tournament). In Ryo's case I think he ran into match up inexperience x2: Kome and then Shaky. No clue about SM.

Did Ryuga show up for Corrin? Because if so that's a pretty major blowout. I know Cosmos didn't. Xion beat Wrath but that was about it for them. But the overall lack of Corrin results outside of "maybe Earth" is just furthering my belief that Corrin is mid tier and not high tier. If his MU spread was as good as claimed, he'd have at least one sure fire rep in the top 65. Time to put that thinking away and accept he ain't so great. Because quite frankly even if Ryuga didn't show up I'm pretty sure Corrin had more reps there than all of those characters you mentioned. Possibly combined.

Wario ran into "giant sword character issue" aka Shulk.

Marth took a beating as well considering how many of his reps showed up and how few made top 32.

Bowser... FinalBoss lost to a Ganondorf. Don't know anything beyond that.

Ryuga didn't show up.
Literally none of his high level reps did. Ryuga, Frozen, and Cosmos didn't attend, while Ryo apparently went all Ike (even against a Ness, oddly enough).

 

[Nidtendofreak]

Ryuga didn't show up.
Literally none of his high level reps did. Ryuga, Frozen, and Cosmos didn't attend, while Ryo apparently went all Ike (even against a Ness, oddly enough).

Well that would certainly add to the "why Corrin did nothing" comment, though my point about Corrin still having more overall rep than those other characters combined most likely still stands.

But yeah: 0 top level Corrins (unless Earth counts then its 1), 1 top level Ike + 1 higher level Ike, 1 confirmed Bowser, 1 top level Wario, unknown number for Yoshi and Lucas.

 

[TDK]

Snoop got 65th, so that's something for Yoshi.

Lucas has like no rep at supermajors unless Taiheita shows up though, so there's that.

 

[The-Technique]

So we've got 8 Japanese players in top 32 winners side (including a Link and DK!) in an American major no less. People still think they are inconsistent?