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Revelation; people enjoyed using full screen needles, dthrow 50/50; uair upb + nair downb, dash attack to ladder, wt2 to uair. Why? Because it was easy to do. With kill setups mostly gone (except for diddy and some mid tiers eg dk bowser), most kills have to be earnt.
The only problem I have with this statement is how over centralized the meta could become. I'm going to ignore Brawl on account of MK, but look at Melee. I dislike it as Fox outclasses all characters on the roster. I am truly afraid of Sheik becoming the new Fox. I am aware however that meta's will always be centralized but Sheik (in my opinion) is not a healthy center. We have great characters who I rarely see any gameplay as (i.e. Pac-man, R.O.B, and DDD). I had high hopes for this game after coming from Brawl where we had Snake as a high level character who was also a heavy and did quite well.
How is Sheik anywhere near as centralizing as melee Fox? Sheik isn't decisively the best character right now (no one is), and even then, Sheik's tools aren't oppressive to the point where they define the meta, not since 1.1.5.
Are we talking about the same game? Another poster already told you to basically ignore the tier list on the front page of the thread. That tier list was made based on the meta of version 1.1.3 -- 3 patches ago. The game has been turned upside down since then. Sheik is not a threat to the meta and neither an overtuned character, just a character who has a finely-tuned tool set.
See what I meant about Charizard?this game has quite a few viable heavies tbh, id consider ryu,(if cloud is considered a heavy, insert here) lucario, megaman, ike, dk, wario, falcon, yoshi and rob viable, with samus, bowser and link being borderline:/ out of all the heavies that leaves only b.jr. dedede and ganondorf as unviable in my books, and even they are getting results. of course this depends heavily on your definition of viable, but if we compare this to previous iterations of smash its looking really rosy for heavies.
also sheik is by no means overcentralizing and neither does she outclass the rest of the roster, in fact its debatable whether shes even the best character at this point with diddy, rosa and cloud all having some degree of claim to being the best. definitely a long shot from melee fox, where even an infinite into death off of a grab doesnt make a character better than him
Bayonetta was just his pocket/secondary for a little bit. He's mained DDD since launch and dropped Bayonetta about 2-3 weeks ago.
Is m night shyamalan running the balance patches now? (M ....marth?... it all makes sense)Plot twist: Marth is actually a better character than Corrin.
It's not that big of a stretch. Marth's been doing well in tournaments lately and his last buffs made him into a legitimately good character.
oh no its not too much a stretch, definitely now when i think who is better ike or marth? I personally can't tell. A month or so ago would have been a resounding Ike.
I think they just want deep characters with a lot of options. Only A handful of characters are like that right now. But, as long as the game devs don't nerf the already very developed characters and buff those that need it to be actually strong and fun and then leave the game alone to develop on its own, I think the game will be fine on that area.
Considering Corrin is grossly overrated, having the Peach/Greninja syndrome of "but potential!" but even worse than those two, that's not surprising at all.Plot twist: Marth is actually a better character than Corrin.
Lucina is definitely below Ike
I'm not convinced that Lucina is on Marth's level. I feel like the gap between them has actually widened since launch, though she's definitely not a "bad" character anymore. I don't think Ike is better than Corrin either. He's solid, but his matchup spread against the high tiers isn't as good.
Also note that that particular part of the tier list is very closely packed together. Lucina is somewhere in mid tier but that's a pretty big group and doesn't say much for how close she is to Marth in terms of ranking.
That was ZeRo, lmao. Dude needs to learn how to keep his hype in check.
...What?
side b on BF dreamland or even platforms is pretty good as mobility.
Who are those "several high tiers" that people claim Corrin is good against? I would imagine she's about even with Cloud, Mewtwo and Rosalina - which is already pretty good, mind you - but that's all that seams feasible to me.
But there are only a handful of characters that are used as secondary and these are pretty good characters:
,so it begs the question if have good matchups against high tier characters to be used as an counterpick and doesn't loose hard to any character then how can she be any lower that high tier, i dont see mid tiers used as counterpick secondaries, there should be something good that the character does if she is used as a effective secondary.Corrin doesn't lot of wins under her belt, but she's placed well in stacked tournaments. Earth got 4th at Sumaboto 8 going all Corrin, Ryuga's 2nd placing at Landlocked is still a thing, and ESAM busting out Corrin at Pound shows her value as a counterpick character.
Pit has rep in Japan though. Corrin and Zard I don't think have any really notable solo players...
No need to spoon feed it to me, I get it.
Every other player you play in bracket doesn't main or secondary Sheik.
Draquaza would be the main one right now for Zard.
Explain it to me. Ike seems like a ridiculously solid character too, but his matchups against the top tier isn't as good...?
This is an understandable statement, but it has a large flaw in its logic. Corrin unlike Greninja or Peach has a really undeveloped meta and player base. Comparing a character that just came out the beginning of this year, to characters that came out at the beginning of the game is a little unfair. The fact that she has the regional results she does while also having a budding player base, and meta speaks volumes ( while face much more complete character meta's). Also she is placed around falcon in high tier on most lists because they both perform at regional lvl amazingly, but also have too few major lvl results. Falcon we know because high lvl counter play, Corrin because we are not sure of her yet under current results. Regardless she should not be placed outside the "gate keeper" falcon tier up or down (from there she could go up or down with time).
tbh I remember reading about Pugwest (one of the best Marth mains atm) admitting that he thinks Lucina MIGHT be better than Marth
Ness is another one. Not a common high tier, but still a high tier currently. And being a good option against Cloud and Mewtwo is pretty major like you said. Don't know about Ryu, I ain't going to pretend I'm good at figuring out who does and doesn't work well against him, lol.Who are those "several high tiers" that people claim Corrin is good against? I would imagine she's about even with Cloud, Mewtwo and Rosalina - which is already pretty good, mind you - but that's all that seams feasible to me.
PK Gaming
Ike's top tier spread outside of Diddy/Sheik (Maybe Fox as well, though that MU is more volatile to the extreme than anything. Both characters can kill each other within about 30 seconds of the match starting) is all within the 45-55 to 55-45 range, with Sonic being an arguable 6-4. Its not amazing to be sure, takes a lot of effort, but its something that's workable for placing well at majors. Hence MLG and GOML results. Those Diddy/Sheik issues hurt for sure, but being able to take on Cloud, ZSS, Sonic, Rosalina all fairly comfortably is fairly large as well.
Hero_2_All
Corrin's regional results are not at a high tier level. They fit perfectly into the mid tier range of "one or two regions have a good one they have to deal with". You also can't get tossed into high tier based on theory. You need results to back it up. Corrin doesn't have it, and he's not building any steam.
