Zelda's Personal Matchup Thread

[Fuujin]

I personally feel ROB is even. My reasoning, his shield is bad. I'll elaborate more on this.

....Just out of curiosity, where do you feel Zelda belongs on the tier list?

 

[Fluttershy]

Star Fox is up early

other than going on him

I personally feel ROB is even. My reasoning, his shield is bad. I'll elaborate more on this.

you can still elaborate since I'm ending ROB early

also Fuujin to answer your question
:samusbrawl:


They are in two different categories of commands you put samusbrawl instead of samus2

 

[GodAtHand]

ROB's tough. I beat two of them KTAR but it wasn't easy. I feel that he definitely has an advantage in this matchup. It's no Snake or Meta but it's no cake walk that's for sure.

He ***** Zelda once he gets in her in the air. He out camps her on the ground. And he ever-so-slightly outranges her close up. Zelda needs to get kills and hold on to the damn gyro and fast...

 

[JigglyZelda003]

Fox is up and im first? yay me!

I think Its 60:40 Fox. to me Fox is like the mid Tier Falco. he still camps and can run circles around Zelda, but he doesnt have grab shenanigans or shut her down w/ Jab BS. he also can kill her early, but Zelda can kill him around similar percents.

getting close(at least dash grab distance) and trying to predict if Fox is going to try and get away or run through you and act accordingly is basically what you have to do. Fox has fast attacks, but no unusually big hitboxs so Zelda can out reach him. Dtilt and Jab can stop Fox's approaches and Usmash if your timings good. the matchup isn't so bad if you can stay close and take as little laser damage as you can.

Edit: im so mad that i know this matchup, but can't explain it very well at all :C

 

[M@v]

Riot, doesn't everyone **** zelda once she's in the air? :3.

At least zelda has a projectile + reflector vs rob.

As for fox, watch out for gimps and din's isnt too good since he can shine it. It just blows up and doesn't hurt him when he has shine out.

 

[GodAtHand]

Unfortunately rob's lasers go through Din's even while it's exploding and a good rob won't be trying to hit Zelda with the gyro all the time, he will be positioning it directly in front of her so she will have a harder time approaching. And anytime she tries to pick it up she'll get a laser in the face...

Not that Din's is useless in this matchup. It's great when he is offstage, but you can't really camp with it here...

 

[KuroganeHammer]

ROB: 55:45 ROB

ROB needs to land on the stage to refuel. He can't just up b again off the ledge.

Punish that shiz.

Fox, use down b and ftilt.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

yeah for fox I don't even know why you would consider playing the matchup without shiek. It goes from 40:60 to 60:40 or something like that if you switch to shiek from Zelda.

That having been said, Zelda's defensive game ***** aggro foxes.... but when on earth do you see aggro foxes who aren't scrubs?

 

[JigglyZelda003]

i play the matchup as Zelda all the time lol, but thats probably because my sheik sucks.

Zelda purist(sp?) also should know that you don't NEED Sheik to beat Fox.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

i play the matchup as Zelda all the time lol, but thats probably because my sheik sucks.

Zelda purist(sp?) also should know that you don't NEED Sheik to beat Fox.

True. It just helps . . . a lot.

 

[Alacion]

If you SDI towards Sheik, Fox can supposedly escape the F-tilt lock. :x

But yeah, Love Jump's going to be a big help when you get hit by Fox's DSmash. I'd say the matchup is 60:40 Fox, or worse. I find it hard to play defensive when Fox can easily shine Din's and is constantly shooting lasers at you.

 

[JigglyZelda003]

True. It just helps . . . a lot.

not if you can't ftilt right lol

If you SDI towards Sheik, Fox can supposedly escape the F-tilt lock. :x

But yeah, Love Jump's going to be a big help when you get hit by Fox's DSmash. I'd say the matchup is 60:40 Fox, or worse. I find it hard to play defensive when Fox can easily shine Din's and is constantly shooting lasers at you.

Sheik can easily turn around and keep Fox locked.

 

[Fuujin]

-2 for Rob

-3 for Fox.
Hes like, she 3rd fastest character in the game against the 3rd slowest character in the game...
Camp all day.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

-2 for Rob

-3 for Fox.
Hes like, she 3rd fastest character in the game against the 3rd slowest character in the game...
Camp all day.

I thought she was the 2nd slowest . . .

 

[mountain_tiger]

yeah for fox I don't even know why you would consider playing the matchup without shiek. It goes from 40:60 to 60:40 or something like that if you switch to shiek from Zelda.

By that logic, no one should ever use Zelda against anyone.

 

[AlanHaTe]

I've never played a good/competent, not even a decent Fox, so nothing from me ._.

sorry

 

[Fuujin]

I thought she was the 2nd slowest . . .

I count her as faster than Deded because of her airspeed.
On the ground she's tied with him though.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

By that logic, no one should ever use Zelda against anyone.

I'm just saying, this is one of the matchups most affected positively simply by pressing Down+B

 

[JigglyZelda003]

-2 for Rob

-3 for Fox.
Hes like, she 3rd fastest character in the game against the 3rd slowest character in the game...
Camp all day.

she gets camped all the time though, nothing new.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Fox is probably -2 for Zelderp. I don't think it's the same difficulty as Falco.

Saving grace is that she kills him fast for some reason.

Edit:

OR

You can just ftilt lock him to death with Sheik.

It's the reason it's a +4 matchup.

ftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftiltftilt... Up-smash.

 

[PMC66]

I personally feel ROB is even. My reasoning, his shield is bad. I'll elaborate more on this.

Kyle, you gonna be at Apex? I'd like to play ya if possible!

I would have thought Zelda would beat R.O.B because her Naryru's love can reflect laser and gryo at long distances. You have way better kill options against rob as Zelda, R.O.B is very bad at killing and alot of Zelda's moves have disjointed hitboxes meaning you could if you know how out prioritise R.O.B. Also U-tilt would kill him super early and his DI is just as Bad as Zelda's meaning he dies very easily in general. space F-smash would beat his F-air which lets face it is his only good aproach option. His F-tilt is good but Zelda's is better.

i'd say it was 55-45 Zelda's favor Rob can do damage off stage but then so can you and if you do manage to sweet spot either F-air or B-air he's going to die at the 120%s if he's at the end of the stage or off stage. you don't aproach rob to some degree because his projectiles take charge time and are easily shielded. not only that you can reflect them back at him quite easily. If he drops Gyro you can glide toss it back and at low percents get a free smash out of it. Basically ban frigate and you should kick his *** really... oh and D-tilt lock him Rob is a big hit box so you should rack up a nasty amount of damage on him if your at pointblank range.

 

[Mocha]

Rob's f-tilt is really good against Zelda actually, and no Zelda's f-tilt isn't better than his (unless you're talking about killing potential). Rob's f-tilt can shut down a lot of Zelda's ground game and is an annoying shield poke as well as his d-tilt.

 

[Fluttershy]

Kirby is up

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

haven't played against Kirby in a while, but last time I remember the matchup feeling fairly reasonable considering how much better Kirby is on the tier list than Zelda.

It felt like I had the advantage, which probably means it's actually something like 55:45 Kirby's advantage.... I don't really know where it should be, though I wouldn't be surprised if it were 50:50 (crosses fingers) . . . but I suppose I also wouldn't be surprised if it were 60:40 so..... I guess I'll say 55:45 kirby's advantage . . . for now at least. I may recant this later.

 

[Fuujin]

Kirby
I wouldn't be surprised if it were 50:50

Side-eyeing you so hard right now.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Kirby's definitely 60:40.

Zelda can't even punish badly spaced up b's. :C

Mind you, that might just be me.

 

[Mocha]

Is it just me or does Kirby seem difficult to upsmash sometimes? Unless you pop him up from down tilt or something. I think his crouch can duck under Zelda's upsmash too lol

A vid of me vs Kirby awhile back, not sure if this helps give a little insight to the MU or not. The MU doesn't seem that atrocious. Oh and Kirby's f-smash goes through Din's.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PxyyvCdYzI0&list=PL40F04DE62939407E&index=10

Mocha vs Ghost.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

Side-eyeing you so hard right now.

Oh I knew you would. It makes it so much more fun to be mindlessly optimistic.

 

[mountain_tiger]

Is it just me or does Kirby seem difficult to upsmash sometimes? Unless you pop him up from down tilt or something. I think his crouch can duck under Zelda's upsmash too lol

A vid of me vs Kirby awhile back, not sure if this helps give a little insight to the MU or not. The MU doesn't seem that atrocious. Oh and Kirby's f-smash goes through Din's.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PxyyvCdYzI0&list=PL40F04DE62939407E&index=10

Mocha vs Ghost.

4:21 - worst DI ever?

But I'm going to say 40:60 because Kirby's Bair is incredibly annoying both on-stage and off-stage (but especially off-stage).

 

[AlanHaTe]

kirby's rolls are annoying I read once they're very good, but I really can't say if it's true or not...

I think the most annoying thing about him is grab range it's just ********!!! so I would recommend to have super good or perfect spacing to avoid getting easily grabbed.

be carefull with Bair and Dair off stage... and watch out if he's like doing nothing off stage near the edge, they normally do that for kirbycides (fell in one recently I forgot )

Still never played a decent/good kirby or a real kirby main, so I can't think of many other useful things...

maybe -1 or -2 for us I really don't know, we can kill him early, but it's hard at some point

 

[AlMoStLeGeNdArY]

Is it just me or does Kirby seem difficult to upsmash sometimes? Unless you pop him up from down tilt or something. I think his crouch can duck under Zelda's upsmash too lol

A vid of me vs Kirby awhile back, not sure if this helps give a little insight to the MU or not. The MU doesn't seem that atrocious. Oh and Kirby's f-smash goes through Din's.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PxyyvCdYzI0&list=PL40F04DE62939407E&index=10

Mocha vs Ghost.

you really shouldn't try to usmash some of the shorter characters kirby/pikachu/ness/olimar and I do believe that they can crouch it also. I think there was a list of characters that could duck Zelda's usmash floating somewhere but I can't really recall.

Nice match though Mocha.

 

[JigglyZelda003]

kirby's rolls are annoying I read once they're very good, but I really can't say if it's true or not...

I think the most annoying thing about him is grab range it's just ********!!! so I would recommend to have super good or perfect spacing to avoid getting easily grabbed.

Its no rollycario, but its a good one.

i haven't fought a Kirby main in a long time, but i felt like i was at a disadvantage. like a -2 maybe.

 

[Alacion]

-2. So hard to land attacks on and Up smash doesn't hit Kirby when he's on the floor. Gimps Zelda pretty well.

@Vid: Poker Face and Lava Reef Zone together? That's a new one, lol.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

My reasoning for ROB.....http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BQOpCz0cDxs&feature=channel_video_title

As far as Fox, it's a -2 for us. I often play my teams partner Trump who is a great Fox and his tools are just so much better than ours. It's not worse though because our Dtilt is so good against him. We can also stuff his recovery if we guess right. It's just a big, awful game of tag when Fox wants it to be. Do not like.... but we can certainly win this.

EDIT: And for Kirby, I am willing to say -1 because we can wall him pretty well. I feel if we try to play run away from Kirby, it'll work. After playing this countless hours with DC when I was home, and playing chu when he still played. I think we do solidly. I'm honestly in between -1/-2

Fuujin: To answer a question you asked a while ago about where I think Zelda belongs on the tier list, I think she belongs near the top of low. I honestly think we can get there, especially now since the rep has picked up. We have solid tools as a character and if we can learn to play against camps effectively, we can easily make top of low. Just playing with patience.

2xEDIT: I was skimming through the ratios that I missed......Yoshi is 0, Pit is -1/-2, and Peach is a -2. Just making sure I have something down lol.

 

[Fuujin]

Zelda belongs near the top of low. I honestly think we can get there.

Spoiler

 

[Mocha]

4:21 - worst DI ever?

But I'm going to say 40:60 because Kirby's Bair is incredibly annoying both on-stage and off-stage (but especially off-stage).

Lol I don't think he was expecting me to kill him with f-tilt. Not to mention, f-tilt is a weird move to DI. And yeah Kirby's Bair is annoying. i would almost go as far as to say his down air off stage can be pretty annoying too, because the semi-spiking can gimp us x_x

kirby's rolls are annoying I read once they're very good, but I really can't say if it's true or not...

I think the most annoying thing about him is grab range it's just ********!!! so I would recommend to have super good or perfect spacing to avoid getting easily grabbed.

Yep, like my opponent rolling behind me + following up with grab right after. Kirby's grab range in general seems pretty good, cause Kirby chars in this game and their grabs are incredible.

I find that one of the better moves to space against his grab is f-smash but i'm sure he can do a buffered dash grab. Thing is, when Kirby shields something like Zelda's upsmash, it's a free easy grab for him. Her f-smash doesn't have as much cooldown as upsmash, and it seems to have a nice shield push back so she doesn't get grabbed all the time.

you really shouldn't try to usmash some of the shorter characters kirby/pikachu/ness/olimar and I do believe that they can crouch it also. I think there was a list of characters that could duck Zelda's usmash floating somewhere but I can't really recall.

Nice match though Mocha.

Yes, i noticed this too xD I think a better use of upsmash against shorter chars from now on would be to punish their landings, or from a down tilt follow-up at higher percents. Mhm it's true Kirby can duck under Zelda's upsmash, as well as the other chars with really good crouches, like Snake. I believe they can even duck under her up tilt, but it may be dependent on where the arc of Zelda's hand finishes.

And thanks! Don't mind my occasional weird choice of moves for certain situations guys. Like me using f-tilt. I like to see what her different moves can do to different scenarios - what works, what doesn't, etc

-2. So hard to land attacks on and Up smash doesn't hit Kirby when he's on the floor. Gimps Zelda pretty well.

@Vid: Poker Face and Lava Reef Zone together? That's a new one, lol.

Lol I think this was something from OC Remix but I could be wrong. I don't have this song though, someone recorded it for me :3

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Fuujin's gifs are lagging my computer. gtfo plz.

Or put them in spoilers.

Either one.

Kirby is dumb.

He can bait really well by jumping above us and staying out of u-smash range, and we have too options:

up-smash and get punished by bair
up air and get punished by anything

It is a sad matchup.

 

[Fluttershy]

Toon link is up

 

[Fuujin]

Fuujin's gifs are lagging my computer. gtfo plz.

-3 for TL.
He's a pain in the ***.
Zelda's like the perfect match up for him.
She's slow as balls, floaty, tall, can't approach, her reflector sucks too much to reflect anything and she's light.
It's really hard for her to approach him, even harder than usual, she just gets hit too much.
I played (MJG though he was pretty high iirc) and it was like by the time I got near I had already eaten a large amount of damage.
Yeah he's light but when you can't safely get near him you won't really be able to do much.

 

[JigglyZelda003]

im in agreement with Fuu on Toonie.