FrostyFrosty
Smash Rookie
yup... truth be told
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Why do the majority of people here want a Melee 2.0?
- Thread starter LavisFiend
- Start date
red stone
Smash Ace
wavedashing and l-canceling were 60% of melee for me. taking that away is changing the game to something else in my eyes
LavisFiend
Smash Lord
ERROR:
Not enough hands-on time to make such a broad assumption about an unreleased game.
Try again.
LouisStevens722
Smash Rookie
- Joined
- Sep 26, 2007
- Messages
- 16
Brawl is gonna be the core of what Melee was supposed to be .Melee was not supposed to have Wave-dashing or L-cancel, if you can't enjoy the game without all the advanced tech that have been made up by players too bad for you.
FrostyFrosty
Smash Rookie
Wave-dashing and L-canceling was what made Melee + more fun. Why would they take out what made the game MORE fun.
red stone
Smash Ace
whatever, back to my guilty gear. at least one game series out there understands depth and their community actually wants a high skill ceiling instead of casual only experience
You know whats going to be hilarious. Whe brawl comes out, is great, and all of these people who are whining end up playing it, finding new techniques, and loving it. Seriously, someone should record all of the people saying the game is ruined, and then their accounts should be squelched when the games comes out so they aren't allowed to talk about it, since they were so sure they would hate it.
red stone
Smash Ace
if somehow brawl is deeper than melee and requires better dexterity, call me up
LavisFiend
Smash Lord
Because they can, simple as that.
NickRiddle
#negativeNick
-.- L-canceling was in SSB, and is in SSBM...It's not a glitch...I love how people lump Wavedashing and L-canceling together. Wavedashing isn't needed...Hell, I go to tournaments but I don't wavedash. Those whining about WDing not being in are stupid. Those cheering about WDing not being in are stupid too.
Red_Maniac
Smash Lord
- Joined
- May 30, 2006
- Messages
- 1,377
- NNID
- SeeJayC
The reason why people are complaining is because we're SOOO used to playing with Melee. We've been playing it for SIX years, and some people just aren't open to change yet.
I'm sure that'll change in six years.
>_>
I'm sure that'll change in six years.
>_>
Kryptonite X
Smash Cadet
- Joined
- Mar 26, 2006
- Messages
- 42
Except that melee is a far more popular series than guilty gear as far as game sales go. Why? Because of the intuitive simple controls.
Guilty Gear appeals to hardcore fanbase. Brawl will appeal to everyone. Huge difference.
If you expect the devs to cater to the lowest common denominator, go cry yourself to sleep while the rest of us enjoy a great game.
Salaad
Smash Ace
Having Adv. Techs to me made the game way more deep, and I know brawl will be tons of fun. Before Adv. Techs. it was all about dashattacking and randomly charging up smashes. Sometimes change is good though.
LavisFiend
Smash Lord
Never once did I call L-canceling a glitch.
Mamush
Smash Cadet
If wavedashing and L canceling are not in Brawl then shouldn't that tell you what Sakurai thinks of it being in Melee? The man who made the game?!?
LavisFiend
Smash Lord
Well seeing as how countless videos already have certain characters aerial moves already at a speed that is relative to an l-canceled move, common sense implies that L-canceling is done automatic...
So it is not a glitch.
Witchking_of_Angmar
Smash Lord
I'll quote it again, simply because M2K represents alot of other pros that do care about WD and L cancelling being gone;
Mindgames and tech skill go hand in hand because more tech skill and harder tech skill allows for more exploitation of missed L-cancels or other things. All these things that people complain about because they are too hard, and that a pro is defined by his mindgames is so ridiculous. If the tech skill is f*ucking easy, then mindgames will be limited also, and the whole depth of the game will suffer. Mindgames and tech skill should exist in a constant balance, and right now, the tech skill in brawl is far too little.
The tech skill in Melee wasn't particularly impressive in the beginning, either. Mew2king johns like a john.
Witchking_of_Angmar
Smash Lord
Yes, but we already know that the tech skill from Melee end-> Brawl beginning has decreased, and that's a bad thing.
Scar
#HarveyDent
I am going to speak for all of us "Pros." Here is the deal.
We care that WD/L-cancelling/everything may be gone because we worked at this game. It is not an easy game to get good at, and it requires time. All of us "pros" worked, some harder than others, and now we are better than all of you scrubs.
We really don't have a problem with you. You guys are cool, and in fact necessary to feed our egos and make us elite in a sense. I personally can enjoy a 4 player melee every once in a while, and hell, at some point we have said, "Let's turn items on!"
Our problem is when you say things like "**** melee" or "wavedashing is a glitch" or "you guys aren't good without those things." This is just all of you scrubs trying to explain to yourselves why it doesn't matter that I can 4-stock you on a bad day. You're not even really talking to us, because if you were you would know that we have been there and overcome it.
If you guys had shut up and stopped whining and actually worked at the game, you probably would have gotten good at it.
I respect your decision, o scrub, to have a life and only get marginally better. Just don't whine about it, and understand that you have accepted to forever be unsuited for a competitive environment.
Enjoy your game, and I will enjoy mine. Don't cheapen my efforts/successes as a tournament-level player. My response will forever be that you are lazy, whiny, jealous, scrubby, stupid, and bad at Smash. These are all insulting, so don't provoke that response.
Shai Hulud
Smash Lord
Scar you are my hero.
takieddine
Smash Master
That's it People like you piss me off...
You've never tried to learn advanced techs, you never have to if you play against your 5 friends in FFA items hyrule matches. You can't tell people what to hope for in brawl, peopel just want 2 different games.
Advanced techs are ADVANCED, not forced, so if you have to you can stay a n00b all your life. You're not being forced with it down the throat.
We think these techs should still be in because we're the ones playing the game, we dedicate more time. you play it casually. you can still play it casually without using advanced techs, but guess what taking them out makes for a shallow game in tournament play.
You've never tried to learn advanced techs, you never have to if you play against your 5 friends in FFA items hyrule matches. You can't tell people what to hope for in brawl, peopel just want 2 different games.
Advanced techs are ADVANCED, not forced, so if you have to you can stay a n00b all your life. You're not being forced with it down the throat.
We think these techs should still be in because we're the ones playing the game, we dedicate more time. you play it casually. you can still play it casually without using advanced techs, but guess what taking them out makes for a shallow game in tournament play.
Witchking_of_Angmar
Smash Lord
Scar said everything. /topic. Scar, you are officially awesome.
Digital Angel
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Sep 20, 2007
- Messages
- 304
Wow, dude you need some mass help and I don't mean in SSB.
People want this to be Melee 2.0 because they've wasted 6 years of their life playing competitive Melee and don't want to start all over.
Case closed.
As a casual Smasher, the removal of wavedashing and other techs doesn't really affect me - but it does affect the pros, who dedicated a significant part of their time to learning the intricacies of the Melee engine. It's like working on a project for six years, and having it scrapped because they wanted something slightly different.
But we have to remember that Brawl's a new game, and that there no doubt exists new flaws in the engine that will create new advanced techs. I will safely say that wavedashing will return in some form, just not as the same method in Melee.
But we have to remember that Brawl's a new game, and that there no doubt exists new flaws in the engine that will create new advanced techs. I will safely say that wavedashing will return in some form, just not as the same method in Melee.
GOTM
Smash Champion
umm....yeah owned a little bit?? i think thats an understatement
Red Exodus
Smash Master
I don't know about the other competitive players but I don't get a flying **** about what you call a 'life'. Where do you get off trying to constitute what a life is, how they should use it and who needs help?
People like you need to learn that everyone lives their life differently and no matter how weird it is they have a right to do as they please as long as it doesn't break any laws.
NES n00b
Smash Master
Stop making sense. He is just following societies definition of life which in turn, makes him cool.
Scar
#HarveyDent
I was hoping someone would do that for me, thanks. The worst part is that they're saying these things on SWF. Nothing not smash means anything here. Don't try to flame gamers on a gamer forum.
Also, "mass help" doesn't mean anything to me save help with either a religious ceremony or the force by which gravity pulls on matter. That post was made of such fail.
I understand that the pros are upset because all the work they put into melee may be lost to some extent, but i just hope they don't ruin this game by not allowing it to have a competative scene.
what i mean is that the pros wont play the brawl tournaments in protest, this could ruin the competative scene of smash alot>
what i mean is that the pros wont play the brawl tournaments in protest, this could ruin the competative scene of smash alot>
LavisFiend
Smash Lord
and it all comes full circle...
Full ****ing circle!
You are complaining...over work lost? I got you Scar, I know where you are coming from...
However...
Thinking that Sakurai should cater to your "feelings" and "work" is borderline ********, because the world does not revolve around one person, especially in the videogame business.
That's what this all about, complaining about your work going unnoticed and made null and void. You can try to make any counter argument you want to, it makes no difference. YOU are whining friend, not me. I was asking a question.
Here's a real world fact: People don't give a **** about what you do, or how long it took you do it. You are indispensible, just like those who do work hard at something. It is a harsh truth, but it translates beautifully in real life. Best seen at the work place...
The fact remains that the tourney attendees are about as small as a decimal to the overall number of smash customers, and thinking the tourney scene will just up and die without you is so full of bull****.
The game will die, my friend, if it ends up flopping on a global scale. If you fail to upstand your status as, "pro," you will sweeped away by the new breed of "pro," in the form of people who rely on mindgames over techs. It is not fabrication, it is full blown fact.
Popular games make tourneys possible, not just popular people. In my mind, Brawl will be even more popular than Melee with the full range roster of recognized faces and even more skills to implement in the game.
MY view on your kind will never change, (and by kind I mean pros whose ego's are so inflated they could go on a hot balloon ride around the world, twice.)
I have no beef with those pros who don't give a crap what happens, because THOSE are the pros that will still REMAIN pros when Brawl comes out, as they don't rely that heavily on advanced techs.
I am a scrub, because I don't follow the game extensively enough to just wavedash every godforsaken thing?
....ok, that's fine, I really don't care anymore, in fact, I love the show scrubs...
but I would much rather be a scrub, than a child who can't handle the reality of things and realize they matter as much as dirt to water.
The sooner you realize how unimportant you are, the better.
Sorry for the harsh post, but **** it, it is time for truth.
Get over your work being lost, and if you care so much, find other techs....
Till then?
Owned.
I say let the purists who can't live without wavedashing and such stay with melee.
I'll personally ditch WD'ing and move to Brawl, means I can spend more time perfecting my reaction time and knowledge of situations rather than practiciing irritating fiddly glitches. (Yes, wavedashing is a glitch, to quote the dictionary 'a defect or malfunction in a machine or plan.' it's not intentional. It's a flaw in the physics engine that wasn't discovered early enough for it to be changed afaik)
Try and look foward to the positive things about Brawl:
It feels similair to 64, hits have more "impact"
New characters
New items
New ways to play
Online so you'll always have people to play against
Story mode
Everything melee had (bar the glitches)
So you can continue to whine and rant and scream about how floaty it is and how you can't slide around, my answer is, go try and wavedash in real life to put yourself out of misery.
Edit: LavisFiend. QFMFT.
I'll personally ditch WD'ing and move to Brawl, means I can spend more time perfecting my reaction time and knowledge of situations rather than practiciing irritating fiddly glitches. (Yes, wavedashing is a glitch, to quote the dictionary 'a defect or malfunction in a machine or plan.' it's not intentional. It's a flaw in the physics engine that wasn't discovered early enough for it to be changed afaik)
Try and look foward to the positive things about Brawl:
It feels similair to 64, hits have more "impact"
New characters
New items
New ways to play
Online so you'll always have people to play against
Story mode
Everything melee had (bar the glitches)
So you can continue to whine and rant and scream about how floaty it is and how you can't slide around, my answer is, go try and wavedash in real life to put yourself out of misery.
Edit: LavisFiend. QFMFT.
The WIN is strong with this one...
I'd just like to make an observation.
A forum is for people speaking, expressing themselves and debating different topics openly yes?
If other people want to say (in the appropriate thread of course) that they are quite distraught over have no wavedashing or in general just want brawl to be similar to melee then who the **** are you to judge?
If you had a valid point i'd be respectful to you but you dont. You've simply made a statement and assumed everyone would bend over for you. A real discussion includes taking in peoples points, and making your own - not trying to persuade/hate them for not agreeing with you.
A forum is for people speaking, expressing themselves and debating different topics openly yes?
If other people want to say (in the appropriate thread of course) that they are quite distraught over have no wavedashing or in general just want brawl to be similar to melee then who the **** are you to judge?
If you had a valid point i'd be respectful to you but you dont. You've simply made a statement and assumed everyone would bend over for you. A real discussion includes taking in peoples points, and making your own - not trying to persuade/hate them for not agreeing with you.
lol, Fox user
Scar
#HarveyDent
Point by point:
1. I never complained. So the bulk of your post is irrelevant off the bat. All I did was say that people who say "advanced techs are glitches" and think they are good at Smash without advanced techs are all wrong. Not only are they wrong, but they are annoying to everyone who actually got better at the game. So re-read this a few times. No complaining here.
2. First I'd like to nit-pick: quote you, "You are indispensible." First of all, misspelled, it should be "indispensable," and second, that means that I am the most important thing ever, to be contrasted with your next point of how unimportant I am. Next time use a dictionary.
Second, again I'm going to say "Did you even READ what I wrote?" Where at all did I say anything about Brawl??? I only said that perhaps we who worked at Melee are a bit upset that everything we worked for is now more/less worthless. I think that's understandable, don't you?
3. I am one of those pros that you don't have any beef with. I really don't care that wavedashing won't be back, in fact I refuse to talk about Brawl at all because who knows what the game will be like? You just didn't read what I had to say and had a hissy fit.
4. Even if you did have an awesome ownage of a post, the minute you self-proclaim ownage it immediately turns to fail. Next time don't give yourself props.
IN SUMMARY: You really didn't get my message. I wasn't even talking about Brawl. All I want to say is that the people who are good at Melee are that way because we tried real hard. I think that everyone who will remain scrubs at Melee shouldn't tell us we are cheaters. That is all. If you tell us we cheat, we will tell you that you are awful.
So stop telling us that we cheat, or that we rely on tech instead of mindgames, or that we take the fun out of the game, or whatever other Johns you can come up with!
NES n00b
Smash Master
Scar wins beyond belief.
Aside from everything else that could be wrong with this post... Lets look at this:
Deep Voice was a single individual who confided in a single reporter which lead into a massive investigation. The results of said action lead to the resignation of a president. All because one person testified to it, amazing what one person can do, huh? If he's credible stfu.
Another thing, stop *itching about *itching.
Sorry, I know its an early post but I couldn't help it.
Lets try approaching this from a historical angle:
Deep Voice was a single individual who confided in a single reporter which lead into a massive investigation. The results of said action lead to the resignation of a president. All because one person testified to it, amazing what one person can do, huh? If he's credible stfu.
Another thing, stop *itching about *itching.
Sorry, I know its an early post but I couldn't help it.