Which character takes the most mental skill to play?

[Limeee]

snake: all his moves are epic mindgames
IC's: extreme concentraition and paintence (did i spell that right) to do chaingrabs
Wario: watch the opponent bait and punish

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

OOOOO, even with good DI, Link will not come back against a character who can fly unless the player behind the flying character says "lolinkrecovery *taunt*"

Link has projectiles to throw at the opponent, a bomb explosion to aid him, and a high priority aerial spin attack. Plus, all good Link players have broken DI. THIS IS FACT. But even with all that, his recovery is just not good whatsoever.

As true as this post is, good DI>>>>Any recovery moves.

 

[Matador]

As true as this post is, good DI>>>>Any recovery moves.

Quoted for emphasis.

 

[Veggi]

I think people have different ideas of what skill they are thinking about. For example, to play as the Ice Climbers, if you don't master the chaingrabs, chances are you are not going to do well. However they take a different type of skill than say... Poke'mon Trainer. He requires a lot of tactical skill and deciding how to perform in each matchup and how to manage each Poke'mon, decision making and stuff. Sonic has a lot of tools he can use for mind games and requires some quick thinking in order to punish what he needs to.

Mario is a tool box character, same with Link, who has to pick through a whole lot of tools to decide which is best for "x" situation, they both have a whole ton of options to choose from in different situations, however the options they have just arn't as effective as Metaknight. Marth and Donkey Kong are kind of similar in the way that as player who is already very skilled at the game could pick them up and start doing well. However, if a bad player picked up Marth or Donkey Kong, he would probably be ***** even harder than before he picked up Marth or DK despite being fairly good characters. Marth requires great spacing to bring out how good of a character he is, while DK is a good character who can just be exploited to no end if the player doesn't know how to work with his weaknesses so they can play well with DK. The mistake people are making with Marth is that he requires a lot of skill to play, but the same skill is used for other characters. The difference is that Marth magnifies skill and gets punished harder for having a lack of skill.

Other people are saying that the lower a character is on the tier list, the more skill they take to play. It looks like it's being confused with a learning curve. At normal levels of play, Diddy Kong won't be doing well if the player doesn't know how to manage his bananas, while I wouldn't be suprised if someone like Shiek went even with that player even if they were at the same level of skill. However, once the Diddy Kong learns how to rake in the benefits of the bananas, he will probably be doing better than the Shiek player. After that the Shiek player would have to have a good amount more skill to beat the Diddy player.

 

[SpongeBathBill]

Other people are saying that the lower a character is on the tier list, the more skill they take to play. It looks like it's being confused with a learning curve. At normal levels of play, Diddy Kong won't be doing well if the player doesn't know how to manage his bananas, while I wouldn't be suprised if someone like Shiek went even with that player even if they were at the same level of skill. However, once the Diddy Kong learns how to rake in the benefits of the bananas, he will probably be doing better than the Shiek player. After that the Shiek player would have to have a good amount more skill to beat the Diddy player.

This is the point I've been trying to make for like 6 pages, but phrased 10,000 times better

 

[saviorslegacy]

Has anyone said MK yet?

 

[dre_89_]

With the Snake and Marth debates, let me say this.

1. Both take time to master, as do most characters.

2. However some characters are easier to just pick-up-and play than others. For example if you go into a match having never used Snake before, you're most likely going to get your but handed to you. But if you use Marth, you'll do alot better because he's fast and has good range, he's a simple character to understand. Ok it takes time to be pro with him, but in a noob or semi-pro match it's not hard to just exploit your priority, range and speed advantage with a relatively strong disjointed hitbox.

I'd say Ivysaur has a steep learning curve. He has awkward movement and aerials, and it takes practice to master KOs with vine whip and to edgeguard with the tether

 

[dre_89_]

But naturally people just mention their main because they've made progress with them more than other characters so they feel as if they have large mental aspect.

 

[TheREALShadowChaos]

Sonic for mindgames obviously, and technical skill I don't really know. Maybe IC or Sheik.

Snake gets better with some stage control which requires though (He doesn't need it to be good though).

 

[Overclassed]

Ganon.

10Ganons.

 

[Iri5hL3gaCY]

snake has the weaponry that takes a lot mental skill to perfect

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Meta Knight, because you'd have to be an idiot to use anyone else.

 

[highfive]

I'd say Dedede since he has slow moves so positioning yourself at the right time is critical and trying to evade quicker enemies.

 

[NinjaLAW1234]

^^^^^^
shield grab
lol at reflex

 

[rehab]

Wry some more Reflex

 

[Overclassed]

Hey.

Idoits.

It's still Ganon.

O:

 

[Nitrix]

Other people are saying that the lower a character is on the tier list, the more skill they take to play. It looks like it's being confused with a learning curve. At normal levels of play, Diddy Kong won't be doing well if the player doesn't know how to manage his bananas, while I wouldn't be suprised if someone like Shiek went even with that player even if they were at the same level of skill. However, once the Diddy Kong learns how to rake in the benefits of the bananas, he will probably be doing better than the Shiek player. After that the Shiek player would have to have a good amount more skill to beat the Diddy player.

At the same time though, this isn't who takes the most mental skill to play and win with, this is who takes the most mental skill to function. Although Diddy would win and Sheik would have to work hard, Diddy requires much more mental thought to function as a character. Thus, Diddy and Wario and Snake are all contenders for most mental skill required to function.

Hey.

Idoits.

It's still Ganon.

O:

Just because Ganon is bad does not mean he requires the most mental skill to play. Stop making useless posts.

 

[exdia_16]

i say meta knight, Mario, Luigi, and Captain falcon AKA one day will arise out of nowhere just wait.

 

[PhantomX]

If we're talking about MENTAL skill, anyone that has trap setups or relies on bait and punish takes the most... these are characters like Snake, Diddy, Wario, ICs, Ganondorf, etc. You make actions in order to force your opponents into situations where it's EASIER FOR YOU TO PREDICT THEM, and then do damage/kill accordingly.

Snake, while super easy to use to beat scrubs, is immensely difficult to play at higher levels, especially if you don't just resort to extreme camping.

I can attest to the fact that Wario takes little to no technical skill however, as if he did, I would probably be unable to play him as I do XD

 

[Matador]

Techskill probably goes to the characters that actually need some degree of practice, such as ICs and Diddy.

For mindgames, it's hard to say since every character needs it. It's more of a player-specific thing. I supposed it'd fall between Ganon and CF since they require the most thinking to overcome their faults and be played at a professional level. Again, if you see a great player like Ally taking matches off other pros with CF, it's probably not CF that makes this happen, but Ally's ability to mindgame his opponents to make up for CF's shortcomings.

The character who requires the most mindgames to play (and by this, I assume you mean "to win as") would be the character lowest on the tier list because he/she does not have much going for them, thus, one has to constantly out-think one's opponent.

Why don't you think these two responses are correct PX?

 

[PhantomX]

B/c they're not entirely true. Mindgames are necessary throughout the tier list. Just b/c one character has more options for a given situation doesn't mean you don't need to mindgame your opponent a lesser amount than a lower tiered character. Hell, tricking my opponent pays off IMMENSELY more as Ganondorf for me than it does as Wario (fart excluded), b/c of how hard they can punish relative to each other. Diddy's reads on opponents do damage, but when that 18 percent damage is only a 1/10 of the total damage they need to do to score a kill, it doesn't amount to much (whereas, again, Ganon can score 30%, which is 1/3 of what he needs to get someone to kill range).

Mental Skill encompasses a lot more than just mindgames, such as leniency in punishing and baiting, knowledge of all your opponents' options when you trap them, etc. Lower tiered characters can't really do all of these, b/c of the fact that they are bad.

 

[CRASHiC]

Guys, I found out I made a player quit. o.o
I feel proud, but ashamed at the same time.
Oh! The conflicting life of a King DDD main.

Thus, DDD, because of the guilt of making so many character nonviable.

 

[Raimundo]

Thus, DDD, because of the guilt of making so many character nonviable.

It's not our fault. They just don't need to get grabbed.

 

[Matador]

B/c they're not entirely true. Mindgames are necessary throughout the tier list. Just b/c one character has more options for a given situation doesn't mean you don't need to mindgame your opponent a lesser amount than a lower tiered character. Hell, tricking my opponent pays off IMMENSELY more as Ganondorf for me than it does as Wario (fart excluded), b/c of how hard they can punish relative to each other. Diddy's reads on opponents do damage, but when that 18 percent damage is only a 1/10 of the total damage they need to do to score a kill, it doesn't amount to much (whereas, again, Ganon can score 30%, which is 1/3 of what he needs to get someone to kill range).

Mental Skill encompasses a lot more than just mindgames, such as leniency in punishing and baiting, knowledge of all your opponents' options when you trap them, etc. Lower tiered characters can't really do all of these, b/c of the fact that they are bad.

When the OP described "mental skill", he included ability to overcome bad matchups. Nobody on the tier list has worse matchups than the bottom characters.

I think that's the most important idea when thinking about this question, since characters like Olimar don't take a ton of techskill but aren't better than characters like Diddy and Snake who take require a ton. When you're at the bottom of the tier list, you're forced to constantly and totally out-think your opponent to win a given match.

 

[sasook]

^I can attest to that last sentence.

 

[smashkng]

Snake's attacks do amazing damge, especially ftilt and the up tilt is an amazing finisher. Skill is not required to make him a good character compared to bananaless Diddy or not very good skilled Sonic but if Snake requires high skill to be in tourneys, why are there so many people who clears to master the very high learning curve things?