What Would Get You Guys Interested in Project M?

[-LzR-]

Yeah but that doesn't mean DKs fair makes any sense.

 

[Tlock]

I think that if when Brawl was released it was P:M demo 2.6, this thread would not exist, the smash community would not be split two or three ways, and Brawl (P:M) would have combated Street Fighter for the most entrants at EVO. I'm pretty sure every person that was playing melee competitively back in 2008 played brawl for a week or two when it came out but shortly switched back to melee because brawl was well, brawl. But if it would have been like PM with all the melee top and high tiers left the same, and had a cast of 35 tournament viable characters among the numerous other features in PM no one would be playing melee anymore.

I could only imagine what the PM metagame would be like if it had 5 years of development from the ENTIRE smash community.

 

[-LzR-]

It would have actually killed the game because the sequel would have been a lame copy of Melee.

 

[Divinokage]

It would have actually killed the game because the sequel would have been a lame copy of Melee.

What?? If anything, the game would've been more widely accepted.

 

[The_NZA]

What?? If anything, the game would've been more widely accepted.

I liked your original reply better. The edit took away the tasty punch.

 

[-LzR-]

What?? If anything, the game would've been more widely accepted.

All it would have done was just make Melee obsolete and that's it. There would have never been 3 Smashes, just 64 and Melee and it's clone sequel.

 

[Divinokage]

All it would have done was just make Melee obsolete and that's it. There would have never been 3 Smashes, just 64 and Melee and it's clone sequel.

Ya a sequel where everyone plays, there wouldn't be any separation at all. It took us to do it with our own hands to make an old game grow like crazy, I'm sure if P:M was made officially and made super well.. it would've carried itself to success.

 

[Double Helix]

In response to the Falco's dair from Melee, I never said that Melee was super fair, but I can also bet that there was no goal to balance Melee. It wasn't exactly meant to become what we have made it. In any case, if PM had been Brawl, there would be no way that the Melee community would have grown how it has. Plus it is true; there would be very little separation in the community. There would be no [outdated] Melee vs. Brawl discussion that ended in far too much hate. 64 would still be kinda off on its own still unfortunately. The game is hype, but it isn't really big enough IMO.

 

[The_NZA]

In response to the Falco's dair from Melee, I never said that Melee was super fair, but I can also bet that there was no goal to balance Melee.

I don't really see the relevance to this and your original claim of saying "DK's fair is too strong" in PM. If Melee is the bar, then why does it matter what the developer's intentions are? You seem to love it and you believe PM is inferior because it doesn't follow the conventions of melee on having fairly balance moves (amongst the viable cast).

Edit: Correct me if I'm mischaracterizing your position.

 

[Double Helix]

Honestly, regardless of how well made Project M is, I will most likely not play it. My only goal is to provide constructive criticism. I like what Project M is trying to do. It is trying to bring together the Melee and Brawl community. I honestly don't know how well it is working. I enjoy both games. Melee happens to be my competitive game of choice is all.

But what my main argument happened to be was the fact that not all moves have to be good. It is neat if they all happen to be, but I like that Smash Bros. keeps the flavor of each character I guess. When I think of DK, I think of a slow, lumbering fellow that packs a punch. Correct me if I am wrong, but the fair comes out quickly for DK. Seems wrong. I understand that Project M is trying to better balance the cast, and they are doing a good job working toward it. I like their goal, but I probably won't play the game that much. I will, however, play 2.6 next week (since I will be done with the summer semester) so that I can provide better, and probably more constructive, criticism.

I want this game to do well. I hope this game brings the community together. I hate that it took a Brawl hack to do it. Sorry if I have been misinformed or if I am misinterpreting the goal.

 

[TreK]

It is trying to bring together the Melee and Brawl community.

Nope, it doesn't. We now see Melee/PM events that don't include Brawl.

 

[Divinokage]

Nope, it doesn't. We now see Melee/PM events that don't include Brawl.

Have you considered that a lot of Brawl players are playing P:M now? Cmon.. think a little.

 

[The_NZA]

It's cool man, and I love that you are so committed to giving criticism that you will play the game. I don't think fair on DK is fast...especially when you consider most moves that you were moderate speed have been made faster (to resemble a better balance) and most moves that you consider slow are now viable speed/moderate speed.

Dk's fair is still, IMO a move on the slower side of PM moves. I actually think DK is one of the better done characters, because his new roll dash attack makes him feel lumbering but, at times, gorilla fast, like a bull who see's red. I think that's the way DK is meant to be. Bowser, by contrast is super slow and very fortress like. DDD is slow but when he's in the air, he can fall like a rock making him a king of aerial control and gimpage.

Also, I don't think the goal of PM is to bring together the Brawl and Melee communities, so much as it is to create a better new smash game worthy of being called Melee's successor (take that as you will). Part of that goal is about making new aggressive options, taking the best tech from Melee AND Brawl and creating amazing unique fighting styles for characters that haven't been realized well in the smash franchise. For instance, I don't think there's ever been a character in the smash universe like Ivysaur.

 

[TreK]

Have you considered that a lot of Brawl players are playing P:M now? Cmon.. think a little.

Fair enough.
How many of these Brawl players play their Brawl main in PM ? Salem plays Zelda, M2K plays his Melee chars, Ally plays CF, Zinoto plays Mario. The only ones I've seen stick to their Brawl mains are Reflex and P-1.
And how many Melee players stuck to their Melee mains ? Basically every top player.
This game was not designed for Brawl players in mind. Now, it's normal they didn't want Brawl's campy characters, but the point is still valid, this game was not designed to help reduce the split between the two communities.

I know I may sound like a controversial troll saying this, trust me this is not the case, I have a lot of respect for the team behind PM. But tbh, if there are people you want to thank for trying to bridge the gaps between the two communities, it's those Brawl players who put work in PM even though they're clearly not the target audience.

 

[Double Helix]

Dude I love the concept of Ivysaur. Reminds me of Rachel Alucard from Blazblue (in terms of being a trap character and the fact that I can't play either worth anything). But as I said, I will have to play the new version before I can give any really great criticisms it seems. Otherwise they are just conjecture and we can't have that.

I think the first people to thank are the PMBR for trying to make the game as enjoyable for those who want to play it as they can. Melee and Brawl have flaws, and they are working on a game that is trying to take the best of both games without either community having a strict advantage, though if I had to guess, Melee players would have the advantage (silly button presses =P). It is good that Brawl and Melee players are giving it a shot though.

 

[ItalianStallion]

I have seen both Brawl players and players who never played smash before do really well when it comes to learning the tech and enjoying the game of PM. In fact, I wouldn't say Melee players have the advantage because they are the ones more likely to notice the small differences and have those differences effect their game (The small differences between Peach in PM and Peach in Melee caused a Melee vet to not use her in PM). Newcomers to the tech just practice and accept it for what it is and end up doing really well.

 

[Divinokage]

Fair enough.
How many of these Brawl players play their Brawl main in PM ? Salem plays Zelda, M2K plays his Melee chars, Ally plays CF, Zinoto plays Mario. The only ones I've seen stick to their Brawl mains are Reflex and P-1.
And how many Melee players stuck to their Melee mains ? Basically every top player.
This game was not designed for Brawl players in mind. Now, it's normal they didn't want Brawl's campy characters, but the point is still valid, this game was not designed to help reduce the split between the two communities.

I know I may sound like a controversial troll saying this, trust me this is not the case, I have a lot of respect for the team behind PM. But tbh, if there are people you want to thank for trying to bridge the gaps between the two communities, it's those Brawl players who put work in PM even though they're clearly not the target audience.

Well perhaps they want to try something new, no? Why would you want to keep playing your main when you play a different game? (Unless you don't feel like learning a new character, like me)

 

[TreK]

Well perhaps they want to try something new, no? Why would you want to keep playing your main when you play a different game? (Unless you don't feel like learning a new character, like me)

If you don't feel like learning a new character and you're a Brawl player, you simply don't play PM. Because your main as you know it is not in PM. Every Brawl player who's playing PM is a Brawl player who's trying something new.

My point is that PM doesn't try to cater to the Brawl community. Simple as that.

 

[ItalianStallion]

My point is that PM doesn't try to cater to the Brawl community. Simple as that.

Fair enough, but in a way, it is catering to them in some sense. It's not like the PMBR decided to take out the technical things from Brawl, or drastically change character specific mechanics (Squirtle's PM design was heavily influenced from Brawl Squirtle). The main reason why they changed things up was to balance the cast. The way I see it, a lot of Brawl players love PM because their main is now viable. If you were a Ganon player in Brawl, should you really be complaining that he isn't like his Brawl form in PM? And a lot of the good Brawl characters like Snake, Diddy, MetaKnight, etc., are heavily inspired from their Brawl iterations.

 

[Zone]

I'm late to this conversation, But the main reason myself and a few other people down here are very "meh" about it. is because it still doesn't feel fluid like melee does, I don't care if you tell me the frame data matches, my hands react to what my eyes see, and something feels off. Also I hate the C-stick, even though I can live with a few minor things like this but when they all keep adding up it starts to take a toll.

I also realize I'm having problems with sonic/bowser in my area scene against players who I 3-4stock in Melee, and they are going 100% even with me. I don't keep up with how the balancing goes but are these ******** OP or something? someone tell me like really lol.

I can't react to anything sonic does I feel as though I have to just throw out high priority moves when I think he's gonna come at me with his one of 10 ball moves.

My friends try to tell me "treat sonic like you do when you fight falcon, how falcon just runs around hits and runs" Except it's not the same, Falcon's footsie range is still shorter than sonics when it comes to going in and out of his reach, and being able ot react to an action to punish.



I also feel like there are too many gimmicks, and I understand it's sort of in beta, and updates happen to try and balance. But I hope once they decide on the final product they never patch it again. I am sick of all these fighting games constantly patching their games. It's one of the reason I love smash, we are one of the few communities who really get a chance to push our game to the limit before making major changes. I mean think about how ignorant we were about jiggs and peach before Mango/Hbox/armada?




What would get me into it, is just the feel matches melee, there is huge sliding while you shield, no lightshielding. It's just not melee, while I do find it intriguing enough to support and play it. I'm just not hyped, I don't practice that hard for it because I'd still rather play melee.

I'm not trying to be some kind of Project M hater, I'm just stating my honest opinions so far. Albeit I know a few things I say may come from ignorance, but I'm just putting my information out there.

 

[Double Helix]

The reason it is getting so many patches is because not all the characters are even in the game. The game is unfinished. I can safely assume that there will not be patches after the game is finished. I hope Smash4 takes a bit from what PM is doing though XD

 

[Zone]

The reason it is getting so many patches is because not all the characters are even in the game. The game is unfinished. I can safely assume that there will not be patches after the game is finished. I hope Smash4 takes a bit from what PM is doing though XD

I know I mentioned I understand it's being "developed" and we're basically play testing it.

So no worries there, I just wanted to say what I hoped for the future.

I like it overall, But I blame my scene for getting me to play it by telling me it's "Melee" then when I say something I don't like they instantly tell me "Well dude... it's not melee it's project M"

I enter all the tournaments for it here, and I support it.


My rant is actually aimed at other FG's like Injustice and stuff that constantly get patched and it becomes a cry babies wish list. I just don't want to see project M take the same path once it's finalized.

 

[The_NZA]

The reason it is getting so many patches is because not all the characters are even in the game. The game is unfinished. I can safely assume that there will not be patches after the game is finished. I hope Smash4 takes a bit from what PM is doing though XD

Every other fighting game likes getting their game patched annually. That's what people looked forward to the most with ultimate marvel v. capcom. I think infrequent patching is AMAZING in games. Nothing drastic--just messing with some frame, number, or hitbox data to even the rough edges on an annual basis.

 

[The_NZA]

I know I mentioned I understand it's being "developed" and we're basically play testing it.

So no worries there, I just wanted to say what I hoped for the future.

I like it overall, But I blame my scene for getting me to play it by telling me it's "Melee" then when I say something I don't like they instantly tell me "Well dude... it's not melee it's project M"

I enter all the tournaments for it here, and I support it.


My rant is actually aimed at other FG's like Injustice and stuff that constantly get patched and it becomes a cry babies wish list. I just don't want to see project M take the same path once it's finalized.

Hey Zone,

You should definitely try 2.6. I've been saying it a lot, but I think it gets the mobility much more right.

 

[ItalianStallion]

Also Sonic in 2.6, while still being a really good character, is no longer broken like he was in 2.5b. Bowser just take some time to get used to. He's obviously very good (Which you can say about practically the whole cast now), but he's not game breaking.

 

[TreK]

Fair enough, but in a way, it is catering to them in some sense. It's not like the PMBR decided to take out the technical things from Brawl, or drastically change character specific mechanics (Squirtle's PM design was heavily influenced from Brawl Squirtle). The main reason why they changed things up was to balance the cast. The way I see it, a lot of Brawl players love PM because their main is now viable. If you were a Ganon player in Brawl, should you really be complaining that he isn't like his Brawl form in PM? And a lot of the good Brawl characters like Snake, Diddy, MetaKnight, etc., are heavily inspired from their Brawl iterations.

Yup, they did take a few things from Brawl in terms of ATs, and it adds quite nicely on Melee's repertoire.
As for characters... I beg to differ, I really do.
Low tier heroes play their character because they love it outside of Smash, so most of them are happy with their revamp, that's true. But look at higher tiered Brawl newcomers. They may be a lot of fun, but they play nothing like their Brawl self. Lucario is of course the prime example, but even the ones you said didn't change are a completely different character. PM's Diddy doesn't even get to use his bananas more than once or twice per game, and his banana game is simply not as rewarding, deep or effective as it is in Brawl in case he does manage to pull them both out and not get killed in the process. Snake is not heavyweight anymore, his whole Brawl playstyle revolves around the assumption than when you're fighting Snake in Brawl, you're NEVER in the lead. Wario has been popularized by Glutonny's tire combos, aong other things, and his bike is gone. MK is actually closer to his Brawl self from what I've seen, and that's a good thing. It shows that they've realized that things like this alienated half of their potential audience.

 

[ItalianStallion]

Yup, they did take a few things from Brawl in terms of ATs, and it adds quite nicely on Melee's repertoire.
As for characters... I beg to differ, I really do.
Low tier heroes play their character because they love it outside of Smash, so most of them are happy with their revamp, that's true. But look at higher tiered Brawl newcomers. They may be a lot of fun, but they play nothing like their Brawl self. Lucario is of course the prime example, but even the ones you said didn't change are a completely different character. PM's Diddy doesn't even get to use his bananas more than once or twice per game, and his banana game is simply not as rewarding, deep or effective as it is in Brawl in case he does manage to pull them both out and not get killed in the process. Snake is not heavyweight anymore, his whole Brawl playstyle revolves around the assumption than when you're fighting Snake in Brawl, you're NEVER in the lead. Wario has been popularized by Glutonny's tire combos, aong other things, and his bike is gone. MK is actually closer to his Brawl self from what I've seen, and that's a good thing. It shows that they've realized that things like this alienated half of their potential audience.

I don't see why Diddy can't use his bananas. I use them just fine in PM and they seem to really compliment his gameplay. He can still have two out at a time, can still do aerial glide toss with them, and along with that now can wavedash over them to pick them up. If anything, the wavedash thing alone is worth losing some of the ridiculous qualities the banana had in Brawl.
If Snake's main strategy in Brawl was that he was really heavy, then I'm glad they made the character more interesting in PM.
The bike just didn't really fit into the Melee play-style. The game's goal was to make Brawl more like Melee.
I mean, I'm no Brawl hater, but a lot of the top tier characters of Brawl relied on a lot of broken movesets to make them top tier. Snake's double grenades with dacus u-smash. Diddy's banana traps. MetaKnight's everything. If they were to keep more loyal to the Brawl top tiers than they already did, PM wouldn't be as interesting as it is now.

 

[TreK]

Alright, if you don't believe me, here's some video evidence :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=On4DtgNJ8h4 (1st match)
Damage caused by bananas+followups : 82 (15% of the total damage dealt by Diddy)
Amount of tosses : 19

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z6or0iVvxbU (1st match)
Damage cause by bananas+followups : 161 (28% of the total damage dealt by Diddy )
Amount of tosses : 51

So no, PM's Diddy has nothing to do with Brawl's, not even his banana game.

As for the other part of your post, please refer to my previous answer : "They may be a lot of fun, but they play nothing like their Brawl self". You may like it better in PM, but your opinion is not shared by players who main these characters in Brawl.

 

[ItalianStallion]

Alright, if you don't believe me, here's some video evidence :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=On4DtgNJ8h4 (1st match)
Damage caused by bananas+followups : 82 (15% of the total damage dealt by Diddy)
Amount of tosses : 19

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z6or0iVvxbU (1st match)
Damage cause by bananas+followups : 161 (28% of the total damage dealt by Diddy )
Amount of tosses : 51

So no, PM's Diddy has nothing to do with Brawl's, not even his banana game.

As for the other part of your post, please refer to my previous answer : "They may be a lot of fun, but they play nothing like their Brawl self". You may like it better in PM, but your opinion is not shared by players who main these characters in Brawl.

Couple things:

First off, I am very impressed you took the time to count out and do the math for the banana use comparisons.
However, I still have problems with the points you are making. You keep on claiming that the Brawl vets play nothing like their old self. That is very extreme. Every Brawl character is going to play differently due to the Melee engine. Along with that, they are going to play differently because the PMBR gave them new tools to work with so they don't have to do the same stuff over and over again. However, that does not mean that the PMBR didn't stay faithful to the characters as they were in Brawl. PM Diddy's banana game is still really potent. You seem to think it isn't because it isn't used as much as Brawl Diddy but that's because PM Diddy has a bunch of new stuff that works as well. Did Brawl players expect a 1:1 port of their mains to a game that was designed solely to make their game more like it's predecessor? The fact that the PMBR kept the characters as close to their Brawl iterations as they did shows that they are thinking of the Brawl community. It seems weird to say that Brawl players feel alienated by it.

Also, as a side note, that Brawl match you linked had the commentators complaining about the bananas about twenty seconds into the match.

 

[GaretHax]

I'm honestly not sure what you really want here Teneban... PM was created because alot of people were not satisfied with Brawl. Why would it emulate Brawl? They kept advanced techniques from Brawl and I honestly think they tried pretty damn hard to keep at least a few parallels in character playstyles, but the game and engine is NOT Brawl. Brawl has a ton of frametraps, chaingrabs, and other inescapable strats/techs saturating its' meta and dominating high-level play. Once you switch to a more Melee-esque engine they are no longer reliable, or in most cases even present anymore, so I fail to see how it is so surprising to find Brawl characters playing drastically different in a drastically different game. Tbh alot of Brawl characters and strategies/Meta's just don't fit or wouldn't work in a Melee environment. Personally I think they have improved the feel and "canonness" just about everyone who has been redesigned. But to each their own, you have every right to feel differently, however I really do believe that the removal of Brawl physics alone would cause characters to appear radically different regardless of actual design or intentions.

 

[The_NZA]

Couple things:

First off, I am very impressed you took the time to count out and do the math for the banana use comparisons.
However, I still have problems with the points you are making. You keep on claiming that the Brawl vets play nothing like their old self. That is very extreme. Every Brawl character is going to play differently due to the Melee engine. Along with that, they are going to play differently because the PMBR gave them new tools to work with so they don't have to do the same stuff over and over again. However, that does not mean that the PMBR didn't stay faithful to the characters as they were in Brawl. PM Diddy's banana game is still really potent. You seem to think it isn't because it isn't used as much as Brawl Diddy but that's because PM Diddy has a bunch of new stuff that works as well. Did Brawl players expect a 1:1 port of their mains to a game that was designed solely to make their game more like it's predecessor? The fact that the PMBR kept the characters as close to their Brawl iterations as they did shows that they are thinking of the Brawl community. It seems weird to say that Brawl players feel alienated by it.

Also, as a side note, that Brawl match you linked had the commentators complaining about the bananas about twenty seconds into the match.

Kind of in the same vein of the last thing you mentioned, Brawl is a game where characters entire play strategies centralize on singular moves (even moreso than Falco dair in Melee). That is because the defensive playstyle of Brawl, the inability to combo, and the focus on spacing/lack of mobility that truly prevents a character from "getting in" overpowers/overvalues certain types of moves. Namely: Projectiles (spamming), and disjointed hitboxes (usually larger DJ hitboxes). I'm sort of glad PM understood its engine wasn't Brawl and actively decided to do MORE with the other tools of Brawl characters rather than make them centralized on a couple gimmicks.

WIth that said, of course every Brawl character will use their individual projectiles much more in Brawl than PM––because that is what works in their respective games. However, that doesn't mean Diddy doesn't still rely on a "bananna trap" gameplay with quick movement to punish it in PM (which I would say is his gameplay in both games).

 

[TreK]

I counter an argument that said PM Brawl vets played just like their Brawl selves, and three guys jump at me like 'wtf would you want them to be like in Brawl ?!'

Ahh, Internet.

The short version is that I don't. The game's name is Project Melee for a reason, it's meant for Melee enthusiasts and it does a good job at catering to them (even though this thread's existence shows that there's still progress to make in that regard). As long as it doesn't get renamed into Project OneUnit, don't take my remarks as complaints.
These remarks were meant to show Double Helix, Divinokage and Italian Stallion that despite what they seem to think, PM doesn't try to cater to the whole Smash community or try to heal the community's split. Or that if it does, it actually does a bad job at it.

 

[The_NZA]

I counter an argument that said PM Brawl vets played just like their Brawl selves, and three guys jump at me like 'wtf would you want them to be like in Brawl ?!'

Ahh, Internet.

The short version is that I don't. The game's name is Project Melee for a reason, it's meant for Melee enthusiasts and it does a good job at catering to them (even though this thread's existence shows that there's still progress to make in that regard). As long as it doesn't get renamed into Project OneUnit, don't take my remarks as complaints.
These remarks were meant to show Double Helix, Divinokage and Italian Stallion that despite what they seem to think, PM doesn't try to cater to the whole Smash community or try to heal the community's split. Or that if it does, it actually does a bad job at it.

Relax, man. No one is jumping down your throat. We are refuting some of your arguments. I agree that they designed PM to be more like Melee and less like Brawl but that doesn't mean the Brawl newcomers aren't heavily inspired or a translation of their Brawl play style into a Melee space. In my post, I concluded that you analyzing the amount of times bananna's were thrown or percentage given by nanners between both games was an unfair way of judging whether a "brawl playstyle" was effectively translated to PM. Diddy's trap and punish game is still a central part of his PM character design. That's not a personal attack––that's a refutation of your point.

 

[Shawn101589]

I think that if there is a side effect of Project M helping to blend the communities together, it is a coincidence (though a happy one). Project M was created to "improve" brawl to be more like Melee, with its own twists. It was not created to appeal to Brawl players who enjoy Brawl over Melee.

That being said, while I completely disagree that it having difference from Melee are an inherently bad thing, I think that getting upset at the "It isn't Melee" argument isn't really justified. Everyone has their own reasons, and the fact of the matter is, it isn't Melee.

I like Project M because it's a fresh experience with more content than Melee and I'm willing to settle for 90% Melee (in terms of feel) for the extra stuff, and there is a LOT of extra stuff. And I'll say that if Brawl came out and was 90% Melee with all the Brawl content, there are few people who would not have switched to Brawl because "it feels weird". Melee diehards (see: people who wouldn't even settle for 99.9% Melee) exist because of how disappointing Brawl was. Brawl being taboo in certain circles is a big issue with the acceptance of Project M in my opinion.

 

[Zone]

I agree with NZA and GaretHax,

Funny thing is, atleast in my area. It seems to take half our melee players, and half our brawl players interests, and make up a combined community atleast in this region. There are people in Project M that I never play against in Melee, and a large number of them because they are of a brawl background. I know my personal experience does not count for the entire community. But I think it brings in more brawl players than you think.

so whether or not it caters to them doesn't matter too much considering it is ment to make brawl into melee. I just think some people are excited for a fresh experience, and it captures brawl audience, and some melee audience cuz the feel is close enough. alienates half the brawl guys because it's "not brawl" like someone said earlier, but it also alienates some melee players too, who don't like it's "Feel"

but my man up there told me to try the new one, I don't think I have yet actually so Ill do that eventually this weekend.

 

[The_NZA]

Am i your man up there? yay.

 

[Double Helix]

Still haven't played 2.6, but the reason I didn't like its "feel" is not because it isn't Melee. I play a lot of games that aren't Melee. I didn't like the feel of 2.5 and before because it didn't feel smooth like a finished product should. In my experience, the Melee physics or techs seemed forced, which is a little hard to explain, but I guess I will try. When I would wavedash in PM (again, prior to 2.6), even if it was a perfect wavedash, it wouldn't feel like it fit in the physics engine. I think that is the simplest way for me to put it right now.

I still think PM is a great thing to work on, and I would like to help where I can. I will not enter tournaments for it. I probably won't even play it much for fun. I enjoy Melee and Brawl, and I am looking forward to what Smash4 has to bring. I honestly don't know why I don't want to play PM that much, but oh well; Maybe I will change my mind.

 

[Zone]

I wasn't trying to put you in the same boat as my scene double helix, I'm just stating my opinion, and what some of my personal melee friends think. Wasn't Trying to speak for everyone.

 

[Double Helix]

I wasn't trying to put you in the same boat as my scene double helix, I'm just stating my opinion, and what some of my personal melee friends think. Wasn't Trying to speak for everyone.

I was making a bunch of general statements. I think you had made it clear that you weren't speaking for everyone, but thanks for responding.

 

[The_NZA]

I was making a bunch of general statements. I think you had made it clear that you weren't speaking for everyone, but thanks for responding.

I hope you play 2.6, really enjoy yourself, and keep playing it. I have a feeling you will really like it.