Walgreens Mafia - DRAW game - The mod ****ed up pretty bad...=/

[Asdioh]

uh... because the answer is obvious? -_- miller naturally falls under more suspicion, meaning it's easier for scum to push a mislynch onto him. plus, informed millers tend to not be PRs from what i've seen. both of those help avoid the NK.

Exactly. Scum like to kill power roles, and they would probably dismiss a miller as "not a power role." Have any of you ever seen a miller PR?
Kantrip, what do you think of this reasoning?

http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=13601002&postcount=676 - kantrip crumbing in advance.

his reason? "I decided to crumb this time so that this doesn't look like back-dooring."

so i'd like to know why he thinks my decision to crumb was so scummy

hahaha

If T-Block is town he literally picked the path of most resistance to avoid getting nk'ed. He put himself immediately in the spotlight and immediately opened himself upon to skepticism and criticism which might not result in his nk but could absolutely result in his lynch.

Good thing I'm here! I have a history of trying to deter from what I think will be a "too-easy mislynch," especially on Day 1, and this is one of those times.




also since July said she can't see it, that's because it's in the disco room. i'll quote it here:

Spoiler

You would lynch Red Ryu, then? If you're town, though, you should know that he's town and naturally want to lynch T-Block, should you not?

Your answer confuses me, though, because if you are scum you would not advocate a lynch on Red Ryu because it would condemn you as scum.

This can only mean one thing: You are actually scummates with T-Block. Since you know T-Block's scum flip would clear Red Ryu, this would in turn also clear you by default.

The reason you would advocate Red Ryu's lynch over T-block's is that you would be saving your scumbuddy, and you KNOW that Red Ryu would flip town, which would "clear" you.

This is why you were instantly suspicious of my role, because you knew what I claimed could not be true, as you are scum and Red Ryu is town.

Also, I never thought Red Ryu was your scumbuddy. I wanted reactions, and I actually crumbed it this time:

Good, now that that's out of the way I can ask Red Ryu what he thinks about my case on his scummate. Answer when you feel like it, no rush there. Maybe we can get a response from other players as well? But that's probably wishful thinking on my part. I would like to see a response from at least T-Block, Tery, John, and Red Ryu, though. That's it for now.

I was just using the Red Ryu scummate thing to get reads. I decided to crumb this time so that this doesn't look like back-dooring.



So basically guys, John and T-Block are the scumteam.

Vote: T-Block

^ leaving this in here because screw you, T-block, I put effort into coloring those letters

 

[Kantrip]

Exactly. Scum like to kill power roles, and they would probably dismiss a miller as "not a power role." Have any of you ever seen a miller PR?
Kantrip, what do you think of this reasoning?

It's completely sound, and one of the townie options I EXPECTED him to claim. I came to this conclusion very early, and I baited him to contradict it when I told him that claiming vanilla was anti-town. What does he do? He says there are more to his powers and that he is only claiming miller STATUS. To say later that "no I was claiming to have no powers because when do you ever see miller PRs" is a contradiction to this. There was literally NO REASON for him to deny that he was claiming to have no abilities.

 

[T-block]

the fundamental reason is the same: so it doesn't look like a total jump out a backdoor. why does it matter that it was someone else's gambit?

two things, kantrip:
a) by the time i revealed my reasoning, even if you had pulled a gambit, it would have had little effectiveness. the fact that you said it could be used at Night would have brought up the question "why would you use it during the Day instead of at Night". there was also so much pressure on me that the question "why wouldn't you use it on T-block instead" would have also come up

b) i was about to be lynched for it. i'm going to prioritize defending myself in that situation

 

[T-block]

It's completely sound, and one of the townie options I EXPECTED him to claim. I came to this conclusion very early, and I baited him to contradict it when I told him that claiming vanilla was anti-town. What does he do? He says there are more to his powers and that he is only claiming miller STATUS. To say later that "no I was claiming to have no powers because when do you ever see miller PRs" is a contradiction to this. There was literally NO REASON for him to deny that he was claiming to have no abilities.

why are you being such a dense ****

quote where i said there was more to my powers

quote where i said i was claiming to have no powers

i neither confirmed nor denied other abilities, because that's exactly what i would have done if i were actually a miller. why give scum more information when all i wanted out there was my miller status?

 

[Kantrip]

Pick one? What are you even saying? It would be so incredibly stupid to just "pick one" and close my mind of other possiblities. I have two, maybe three possibilites, right now each is as likely as the rest, so no, I'm not gonna pick one.

Stop being dense. There is a thing when you scumhunt called "making people take a hard stance".

Take a hard stance, or we are both dying toNight. I don't need you playing tough guy who doesn't comply with town's requests. You will give me an answer.

There is no penalties for being wrong. I don't care if there's not much data. I'm asking you to WEIGH both possibilities you mentioned, and CHOOSE which one you think is more likely.

This will mark the second time you have denied a request from me. I will not allow a third.

 

[Kantrip]

the fundamental reason is the same: so it doesn't look like a total jump out a backdoor. why does it matter that it was someone else's gambit?

Because it is much more meticulous for you to do what you did. You were obviously worried about being called out, or else you wouldn't have crumbed. That was my reasoning for crumbing in the quote you showed: I was worried about being called out. Were you worried about being called out? If so, why?

two things, kantrip:
a) by the time i revealed my reasoning, even if you had pulled a gambit, it would have had little effectiveness. the fact that you said it could be used at Night would have brought up the question "why would you use it during the Day instead of at Night". there was also so much pressure on me that the question "why wouldn't you use it on T-block instead" would have also come up

First part of this I can see I guess, but "it wouldn't have been very effective as a gambit at that point" is not something that holds on its own. The second point, "why wouldn't you use it on T-block instead" is not valid and I will not accept it.

b) i was about to be lynched for it. i'm going to prioritize defending myself in that situation

You weren't going to get quicklynched Day 1. Don't be silly.

 

[Asdioh]

It's completely sound, and one of the townie options I EXPECTED him to claim. I came to this conclusion very early, and I baited him to contradict it when I told him that claiming vanilla was anti-town. What does he do? He says there are more to his powers and that he is only claiming miller STATUS. To say later that "no I was claiming to have no powers because when do you ever see miller PRs" is a contradiction to this. There was literally NO REASON for him to deny that he was claiming to have no abilities.

So you figured he was a PR, and wanted to bait him to confirm your suspicions?

._.

However, I now see the contradiction you're talking about. In the very first few posts of the game, he claims miller and then after your single post of pressure, he says "I just claimed miller status, not role" which hints at maybe being more, which goes against the "trying to not get NKed" bit.

My head. And now I have a few ninja posts to read.

 

[Kantrip]

So you figured he was a PR, and wanted to bait him to confirm your suspicions?

._.

However, I now see the contradiction you're talking about. In the very first few posts of the game, he claims miller and then after your single post of pressure, he says "I just claimed miller status, not role" which hints at maybe being more, which goes against the "trying to not get NKed" bit.

My head. And now I have a few ninja posts to read.

You're really slow today, aren't you

That's not even the thought-inducing part of it all. But yes, that is the contradiction I am talking about. And no, the bait was more about the fact that claiming miller means claiming miller as a role. He even added flavor that only touched on miller status and no abilities. The bait was to see if his intent matched up as what I was reading it as.

See: It didn't.

 

[T-block]

Because it is much more meticulous for you to do what you did. You were obviously worried about being called out, or else you wouldn't have crumbed. That was my reasoning for crumbing in the quote you showed: I was worried about being called out. Were you worried about being called out? If so, why?

yes i took a precaution against being called out

look at what's happening now - even with the crumb people are still questioning my intentions. why are you asking stupid questions with obvious answers?

First part of this I can see I guess, but "it wouldn't have been very effective as a gambit at that point" is not something that holds on its own. The second point, "why wouldn't you use it on T-block instead" is not valid and I will not accept it.

why won't you accept it? if i were the target of such a gambit, those are certainly two questions i would ask.

You weren't going to get quicklynched Day 1. Don't be silly.

i already explained that even if i held on the reward would hardly be worth it. in light of that, l-1 was enough for me.

 

[T-block]

So you figured he was a PR, and wanted to bait him to confirm your suspicions?

._.

However, I now see the contradiction you're talking about. In the very first few posts of the game, he claims miller and then after your single post of pressure, he says "I just claimed miller status, not role" which hints at maybe being more, which goes against the "trying to not get NKed" bit.

My head. And now I have a few ninja posts to read.

asdioh, if i actually were a miller with no abilities, i would have done exactly the same thing. it's there to add credibility to the claim, not to hint at being more than just a miller.

You're really slow today, aren't you

That's not even the thought-inducing part of it all. But yes, that is the contradiction I am talking about. And no, the bait was more about the fact that claiming miller means claiming miller as a role. He even added flavor that only touched on miller status and no abilities. The bait was to see if his intent matched up as what I was reading it as.

See: It didn't.

you are ****ing stupid

 

[Kantrip]

yes i took a precaution against being called out

look at what's happening now - even with the crumb people are still questioning my intentions. why are you asking stupid questions with obvious answers?

It's not "even with the crumb". For me, the crumb adds to it. You were being very careful and you had a lot of back-doors that I don't honestly see you setting up as town. If you disagree I'm sorry, but this has roots in a meta environment where I don't see you being so meticulous as town.

Sorry about the questions thing. It's something I do, is that I ask obvious questions as they lead me on a tangent, and I always feel like getting people to answer a string of simple questions with obvious answers will focus everything and guide it along so that when they have an interjection they have it at one point along the chain, instead of trying to discredit the entire argument on one point, which scum often tries to do.

why won't you accept it? if i were the target of such a gambit, those are certainly two questions i would ask.

Yeah, and they are GOOD QUESTIONS. The asking of those questions would help town. This is why I'm not accepting it as reason for you high-tailing out of there.

i already explained that even if i held on the reward would hardly be worth it. in light of that, l-1 was enough for me.

And I already explained that the reward would still be greater than zero, and if you really felt the need to use all of your smoke traps and escape mechanisms, then that just means you were paranoid about new suspicion on you, and you never really cared about town gaining.

 

[Asdioh]

Screw this. I hate how Kantrip plays this game.

I'm sorry T-block. I'm sorry Sokr. I'm sorry other people.

I am a Kirby and I'm in this store to eat it, but I had second thoughts.

I have a one-shot Kirbicide ability, and I want people to tell me who they think I should use it on. I was thinking Kantrip.

The game will be better with the two of us gone, I think. Any other suggestions?




(going to bed, g'night)

 

[Asdioh]

i'm just kidding btw kantrip :hug:

but really g'night

 

[T-block]

It's not "even with the crumb". For me, the crumb adds to it. You were being very careful and you had a lot of back-doors that I don't honestly see you setting up as town. If you disagree I'm sorry, but this has roots in a meta environment where I don't see you being so meticulous as town.

-_______________________________________________________-

Yeah, and they are GOOD QUESTIONS. The asking of those questions would help town. This is why I'm not accepting it as reason for you high-tailing out of there.

yes, but they mean the gambit would have been hella weak. that's the point.

And I already explained that the reward would still be greater than zero, and if you really felt the need to use all of your smoke traps and escape mechanisms, then that just means you were paranoid about new suspicion on you, and you never really cared about town gaining.

and then kantrip revolutionized the logic world with his new argument:

if p, then q
p
therefore r

 

[Kantrip]

I'd call this a TvT debate so we could move on and start finding the other scummies, but you're not making it a TvT debate at all.

When the majority of your responses to posts become abrasive mockeries and satires of your opposition's points, I find it hard to believe your mind is in a townie place.

Why don't we not make the game centre around this. Could you find me a scumpick besides lurkers or Sokr please, T-block? I don't need it right away, and I'll leave the thread for a bit and I won't even post, but I'd like to see you actively finding a scum suspect. Please.

 

[T-block]

moving kantrip to scum

his reasoning is appalling

 

[T-block]

I'd call this a TvT debate so we could move on and start finding the other scummies, but you're not making it a TvT debate at all.

When the majority of your responses to posts become abrasive mockeries and satires of your opposition's points, I find it hard to believe your mind is in a townie place.

Why don't we not make the game centre around this. Could you find me a scumpick besides lurkers or Sokr please, T-block? I don't need it right away, and I'll leave the thread for a bit and I won't even post, but I'd like to see you actively finding a scum suspect. Please.

when your posts are so bad i can't even respond to them, i feel justified in mocking you

i gave my thoughts on the whole damn playerlist already

you are my scumpick after sokr/rajam

 

[Kantrip]

I didn't say "give your thoughts on the playerlist".

That post was grimy by the way, and your reads were central to how each player reacted to you. Your read on me and Gorf stemmed off our scumreads on you, and your read on Asdioh was based on his townread on you.

This isn't about that post, though. I'm asking you to move away from our discussion and do something else in your next posts, and you choose instead to continue to call my posts bad and me scum. I don't care.

 

[T-block]

no they didn't

i'm done with this. i am getting far too worked up over this game. sorry about the insults.

you have my reads. look into kantrip on my flip and see how shoddy a lot of his reasoning is.

side note: if you are actually were lying about your role and you let me get lynched like this i am literally never playing with you again

gl town

 

[Kantrip]

You're not even getting lynched yet. Don't give up T-block, if you ignore me and don't feed me anything to respond to I won't respond!! You're not lynched yet! I want to see you dig out of this rut, not AtE out of it!

If you're going to be okay with your inevitable lynch and you don't like me/think I am scum, I could always use my role on you?

 

[Jim Morrison]

Just too much pointing at T-block, lots of what has already been said I agree with. If you feel the need for me to compile everything I agree with and justify my vote, just ask so!

Unvote
Vote: T-blcok

If you are town, I will not weep.

@mod: Requesting votecount

 

[Sokr]

how about you read instead of asking a question just so you can be seen asking a question

It was rhetorical.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Haven't read up everything yet but from what I've skimmed through I'm willing to buy T-Blocks "explanation". I knew something was fishy about his claim so it's good he finally admitted it was a lie.

Vote Sokr

More later.

 

[Sokr]

I think TB vs Kantrip is SvS. ill explain later as I'm on my phone and hate typing.

 

[Rajam]

Just re-read all the initial issue of the two millers. Ignoring T-block and RR, the most scummy player in that interchange is deffinitely Asdioh, who didn't bring any original question... he was just asking easy-to-ask stuff which doesn't lead anywhere really

FoS: Asdioh

Is T-Block just a Worker? As in, the rest of it is just from his description? I was assuming the whole thing was his role name.

Also wouldn't double miller result in a guaranteed mislynch? From a mod perspective, I've seen people lynch a cop on the premace there weren't two cops in a set-up when that happened to actually be the case. In addition to this, I have trouble seeing how a double miller could work in a twelve man.

@RR (and @Gheb too please answer this): What do you think of the probabilities of the next setup configurations for this game:

2 mafia
2 millers
8 town

or

2 mafia
1 indy
2 millers
7 town

?

Hahaha if you think you were helpful to town in SMRPG you severely need to be disillusioned.

How would disconnecting from you gain me town points? What is your "point" that supposedly stands?

Because unconsciously, is more likely to label people with more disconnections as town

My point that stand is that my accusation isn't just a discussion starter or something I'd easily drop later, or non-serious because your post was the very first in the game. Going again to that, you begin all serious by immediatly claiming miller, then on the second paragraph you just throw that dumb policy lynch with a weak base as "I don't remember him being useful" (you know in SMRPG I was very useful D2, clearing and working with several players - Raz/BarDulL, TinMan, Krys, Pierce - and reducing the pool lynch significantly). As I see it, that second paragraph was a total filler considering your 1st paragraph was all serious, and with the intention to create a quick disconnection (which would enhance your miller claim's credibility) to gain the town points.

Jim Morrison is still scummy after Asdioh. Just saying things that everyone knows and can deduce on their own; nothing new

Kantrip is my strongest town read atm

Regarding T-block again, it doesn't fit me that he didn't react voting RR when RR cclaimed him, instead he left his vote on me when I had to yet make my first post. T-block said later his vote is always on the person who he wants dead the most, so, and due to the lack of responses from T-block against RR at the very beginning, I'll have to assume T-block tried to avoid the issue as much as possible

The whole issue of two millers is unlikely imo and I think we should lynch one of them toDay. I have already a point against T-block meanwhile I don't have anything really against RR; also, you may call it OMGUS but T-block having me and Kantrip as top-priority lynch candidates is another point against him

unvote
vote: T-block

All the other players are null.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

How much have you even read up? Your post doesn't give me the impression you're up to the most recent happenings 0_0

 

[Jim Morrison]

Oh my god I can't let T-block get lynched because of this ****** above me. My heart could not bear it.

Unvote

 

[Jim Morrison]

(That is not at Gheb <3)

 

[~ Gheb ~]

LOOOOOOOOooL

[gathering points @Sokr atm]

 

[~ Gheb ~]

p7 - 8 have me thinking that T-Block is town and Sokr scum btw.

Would also like to know about Ryu's status. Still on that Miller claim? Where are you?

 

[Jim Morrison]

What posts are those? We are on different PPP.

 

[Rockin]

Day 1​

Rajam (2) - T-block, Asdioh

T-block (4) - Red Ryu, Gorf , July , Rajam

July (1) - Kantrip

Sokr (1) - Gheb

Not Voting - Mentosman, AsianAussie, Jim Morrison , Sokr

With 12 players, it takes 7 to lynch. Deadline is in Jan. 28th

NOTES

- Due to the blackout yesterday, the deadline has been moved to Jan. 28th

- There is no need to ask me to tally up vote counts. I do tally ups practically every day at least once. When deadline is near, I will try my best to be more frequent.

 

[Jim Morrison]

This feels like an 8-man game, instead of a 12-man game.

Red Ruy, Mentos and Aussie, you haven't said a thing in ages and Rajam is just being plain dumb and playing this game while lagging behind 100 posts or so.

Gheb, can you sell me on Sokr playing a newb-scum game?

 

[~ Gheb ~]

If we're gonna lynch somebody, there's no point for Kantrip to use his ability. The only time he would use it now is if he desperately believes he needs to kill someone that isn't being lynched, or if we can't reach a majority vote.

Why?

Townie Points? Claiming this is basically getting him out of the pressure that was on him and saying "Hey! I can be useful to town!"

AA, why do you think Kantrip is town?

Kantrip, I don't believe it. It seems very likely of you to pull of a gambit.

It could be either scummy or town, depending on the intent. The way you came out with suggesting to bomb Rajam, who was already a lynch pick, you could have been watching for who jumped behind you on that idea. You could also be hoping to get which people are more desperate to not die and somehow get something out of that (power roles maybe, as scum).

Pick one? What are you even saying? It would be so incredibly stupid to just "pick one" and close my mind of other possiblities. I have two, maybe three possibilites, right now each is as likely as the rest, so no, I'm not gonna pick one.

As for T-Block's unclaim: did I post that post about me thinking he was setting himself up with a backdoor with the joker crumbs and all that? Anyways, this just looks extremely scummy to me. T-Block, please give a more solid verification of why you did this.

Someone asked about me not really posting my thoughts on Rajam. This is because everyone else already said the relevant stuff and anything I said wouldn't spark conversation or provide insights and would only lead to people saying "oh, he's sheeping!"

T-Block's talk of surviving the NK sounds very survivalistic to me. Indy, huh?

I mean like the whole point of all of these posts is basically to discredit whatever stuff Kantrip and T have been saying / doing, right? You've drawn the most negative conclusions possible in every single one of these posts with no attempt to actually give some CONSTRUCTIVE input at all. That's why there's NO WAY other than T-Block being indy to justify his lie ... And that's why you imply so hard that discredit Kantrip's claim. And that's why you draw the conclusion that the interaction is S vs S ...

...seriously?

Two dubious claims - one admittedly fake - attracts inexperienced scum from miles away. You fell for both traps, congrats.

how about you read instead of asking a question just so you can be seen asking a question

Agreed, Sokr has been all about giving off impressions how people should look at him being wary of things and questioning things. But the substance behind it has clear anti-town implications.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Guus, I just quoted all the important posts in regards to Sokr. T-Block's posts are scattered between them.

 

[Jim Morrison]

You have my sword

Sokr

 

[Jim Morrison]

EBWOP: Vote: Sokr

 

[Sokr]

I can definitely see Kantrip as the kind of person who would attack his scum partner if they aren't playing that well. It put's Kantrip in a good light and separates him from someone who'd flip scum. That said, I think TB at first couldn't believe Kantrip was going after him so he started getting really defensive. Then you can see in his play where he starts to back off Kantrip, even sheeping him. This is probably around the time TB asked Kantrip what the hell he was doing and Kantrip told him.

 

[Kantrip]

I think TB vs Kantrip is SvS. ill explain later as I'm on my phone and hate typing.

I'm not the right person and I won't be able to explain it well, but after this game I want you to talk to someone experience about TvT, SvT, and SvS interactions.

 

[Kantrip]

Sokr I don't even know what you're saying in your last post.

Do you still think I'm scum?