[WA] Perth Smash Thread

[Jupz]

trav is right. a theory is the highest order of belief in science. a theory cant be proved only disproved. take the theory of gravity. to prove it you would have to go to EVERY single spot in the universe and test if gravity applied. if at just one particular point in the universe you dropped something at and it didnt obey the theory then the whole thing is disproved.

ive learnt too much about it to be foolish enough to believe their not right.

 

[Hobobloke]

Yeah Mic the LHC is trying to gain understanding about the universe's origins by basically slamming atoms into each other at high speeds, it aims to answer questions such as

Is the Higgs mechanism for generating elementary particle masses in the Standard Model indeed realised in nature? If so, how many Higgs bosons are there, and what are their masses?
Are electromagnetism, the strong nuclear force and the weak nuclear force just different manifestations of a single unified force, as predicted by various Grand Unification Theories?
Why is gravity so many orders of magnitude weaker than the other three fundamental forces? See also Hierarchy problem.
Is Supersymmetry realised in nature, implying that the known Standard Model particles have supersymmetric partners?
Are there additional sources of quark flavour violation beyond those already predicted within the Standard Model?
Why are there apparent violations of the symmetry between matter and antimatter? See also CP-violation.
What is the nature of dark matter and dark energy?
Are there extra dimensions, as predicted by various models inspired by string theory, and can we detect them?

Also zomg someone finally called me Trav instead of LB.

 

[Vlade]

^ haha, Andre (Muzga) finds it awkward to call me Vlade, but he also finds it awkward to call me alister

For future reference, feel free to call me either one since I know Alister is kind of an unusual name

 

[Bsrk_]

Heard about the Atom Collider not working properly_ That really bugged me seeing the results were meant to take about 7 months and its well overdue because of technical difficulties_ Either way it'll be interesting to see the final results whether we get sucked into a manmade black hole or not_

You really dig this science stuff dont you Trav_ So what happens once we prove how exsistence was created_? Do we play god with our knowledge or do scientists just claim bagging rights_

 

[Hobobloke]

Yeah I'm pretty into science . The LHC should be up and running by the end of this year and when we do prove how it started we either ficus on other questions or do what you said play god whilst bragging.

Also who prefers their real names to their smashboard ones and who doesn't so i know.

 

[Marteh]

Well I try to call people by names on the forums on here but if you don't like it I can understand Trav.

My name there's no diff with Marteh/Marty so meh.

As for that **** machine, their still insisting on risking life to prove the creation of the worth, should they be heroes or locked up?

 

[Hobobloke]

come on man theres no risk, the doomsday prophecys were showed to be rubbish. Also it's not like I dislike LB its just more casual being called Travis besides Lord seems obnoxious

 

[Muzga]

There is significantly more evidence for creation than there is for evolution and random explosions that just so happen to set EVERYTHING PERFECTLY.

btw im no longer looking for matches online since i gotta head out to uni!

The idea of evolution works based off of the idea that life adapts to its surroundings. As long as there is a circumstance somehow, somewhere that it is possible for life to exist, then it can exist and adapt to change. Evolutionists theorise that people weren't created as they are, fully formed. Through use of carbon dating there is evidence that dinosaurs existed long before humans did. Carbon dating can prove that there were creatures similar to humans that died out, Neanderthals, Cro magnons and the like.

The human body is inherently flawed. There are problems in the human body that shouldnt exist. We eat and breathe from the same hole, that makes it possible to choke. Men have nipples, And the appendix which the last time i checked was completely useless is an organ which makes no sense to me. Why such a useless organ would be created is beyond me. But some people will debate that im trying to apply human logic to something that isnt human.

But inherently both arguments are flawed anyway, I would have to strongly disagree if you were to suggest that there is insufficient evidence of evolution.

I acknowledge that both are flawed. that figuring out the answer is beyond me, and then i subsequently stop thinking about it because to me its pointless to formulate an opinion on something that is impossible for me to grasp completely

 

[skillskillfiretruck]

I'm coming to the tourney. bro is dropping me off.

 

[Mic_128]

Yeah Mic the LHC is trying to gain understanding about the universe's origins by basically slamming atoms into each other at high speeds, it aims to answer questions such as:

Are there additional sources of quark flavour violation beyond those already predicted within the Standard Model?

Chocolate, Strawberry and the rumoured Spearmint flavours.

Also who prefers their real names to their smashboard ones and who doesn't so i know.

Well my real life nickname is Mic, and my Smashboards name is Mic, so whichever's fine

Should do nametags or something, I'm horrible at remembering names to faces.

The human body is inherently flawed. There are problems in the human body that shouldnt exist. We eat and breathe from the same hole, that makes it possible to choke. Men have nipples, And the appendix which the last time i checked was completely useless is an organ which makes no sense to me. Why such a useless organ would be created is beyond me.

Don't forget putting a recreational zone attached to a waste management facility.

 

[Hobobloke]

I've also heard they uncovered a new "banana" quark flavour. And Mic just remember I'm the one with blonde hair a black shirt and thongs (oh and playing bowser is a dead giveaway).

 

[skillskillfiretruck]

Sparta

I'm the black one who wears Ecko.

 

[Vlade]

Don't forget putting a recreational zone attached to a waste management facility.

It took me a little while before I could figure that one out ^_^

Nice one though.

 

[Jupz]

I like to call Vlade Vlade because Vlade is an awesome screename. I like to be called Jupz but i dont mind if im called Jason. As a King Dededee main I just refuse to call a bowser main "lord" Lol im jk

Anyway yeah science is really cool. We've learnt about all the 4 forces too ^_^ I've done some research on the collider, its cool

Mic!!! I'm the one that was there at the end. I think you were second last to leave after me and my friend? I said goodbye to you Cmon mic u gotta remember me im ur numa #1 fan

 

[Muzga]

I like to call Vlade Vlade because Vlade is an awesome screename. I like to be called Jupz but i dont mind if im called Jason. As a King Dededee main I just refuse to call a bowser main "lord" Lol im jk

Anyway yeah science is really cool. We've learnt about all the 4 forces too ^_^ I've done some research on the collider, its cool

Mic!!! I'm the one that was there at the end. I think you were second last to leave after me and my friend? I said goodbye to you Cmon mic u gotta remember me im ur numa #1 fan

**** off...
Seriously...
I'm mics number one fan!

Oh and mic-- Find me a waste management facility created by god, then we can talk

 

[Jupz]

Ok im mics number 2 fan!!!

 

[Hobobloke]

Nobody wants to be my #1 fan....

On the sunject of physics i have a test on nuclear physics tomorrow =/

 

[Corpsecreate]

Please tell me you aren't serious.

Very Serious.

Carbon dating takes 1 factor into account and 1 factor only. The Half-life of Carbon 14. Not too long ago Police found a bone or a skull of some kind (cant remember which) and they brought it to scientists for carbon dating. The scientists returned with an age of something like 500-700 years old. Not long afterwards, the bones were found to belong to a person who died only a few years ago. Carbon dating is subject to many things.

The theory (yes its a theory, not proof as they would like you to believe in schools) of evolution revolves around the fact that each organism adapts to environment over a long period of time in an attempt to better cope with that environment. The problem with this is that there are some animals where if evolution were true, they would have been extinct in 1 generation. For example, chickens when they are hatched from an egg. I cant exactly remember the specifics but basically when a chicken is in an egg, they are surrounded by fluid and because of this fluid they are unable to breath and instead they die. The only reason they dont die is because the eggs themselves create a mini air-pocket that the chicken can breathe through up until the time it can break through the egg themselves. By the theory of evolution, the only way that airpocket would exist is if the chicken's eggs evolved over a long period of time and enabled that air pocket feature. Unfortunately, its impossible for that to happen because no chickens would exist before the airpocket was around because they would all die at birth.

There are many other examples of this using many other animals. Things like regulating blood pressure for giraffes long neck, the tongue of a woodpecker, the nesting system of some birds and something to do with a beever

 

[Richard7]

Don't forget putting a recreational zone attached to a waste management facility.

Did you get that from a movie? Man of the Year? Or is that a well known joke?

EDIT:Oh and I suppose it doesn't really matter since the tournament's soon, but the thread name needs changing, "May 23thstrd" must be the left overs from the fake dates that were on. If you made it like this on purpose, just ignore this.

EDIT:On the subject of posts, I'm number 7004! Woot lol.

 

[Hobobloke]

Carbon dating whilst sometimes may be inaccurate majority of the time it works quite well, sure you can bring up one instance where they misdated something but what about all the times when they date things correctly.

Also evolution does not solely rely on carbon dating, thats merely to find out the age of fossils etc even if we don't know the age of a fossilised creature we still know it existed a long time ago and if it has human like features it can be concluded that they have been in our family at one point but evolved to adapt and the others died out.

With your chicken example is it not plausible that a previous ancestor of chicken developed ths airpocket to aid the chick even though it might not have been completely vital but helped nontheless and then this trait was passed down into the chicken we know (and eat mmm) today.

I also find it rather amusing that science must have everything 100% proven whilst religion can just say "because God said so" do you have any proof for Intelligent Design? Also do you take Genesis literally? If not what is your stance on how we came to be?

EDIT:He made it like that on purpose Ric because he kept getting thate dates wrong etc.

 

[Mic_128]

Not sure where I heard it before, but I didn't come up with it.

Find me a waste management facility created by god, then we can talk

Please don't make me show you my wang

 

[Corpsecreate]

Science doesnt have to be 100% correct. The problem is when something that hasnt been 100% proven is considered to be 100% correct. If something is only considered a theory then dont go ahead and say that the age of this bone is EXACTLY 5920 years without a doubt no questions asked. Like schools teach evolution as though it is fact even though nobody KNOWS (or ever will know) for sure whether or not evolution is true or not. So why teach something as though its fact when evolution is only a theory? Thats the problem.

3 numbers that need to be known in carbon dating btw:

N0 = number of radiocarbon atoms at t = 0, i.e. the origin of the disintegration time,
N = number of radiocarbon atoms remaining after radioactive decay during the time t,
λ = radiocarbon decay or disintegration constant.

You must know exactly how much carbon was left at the moment the organism stopped living.

You must know exactly how much remains (which would be subject to the accuracy of whatever machines are used to measure this value) after a certain amount of time.

You must know the precise decay time of the element (which is impossible to know).

Tiny variations in any or all of these values will drastically effect the answer you receive.

 

[Marteh]

Corpse you know you brought up a point that I've always wondered. Why do schools teach you about evolution, atoms, etc. When it's not 100% proven, it's just weird.

As for who's who only people I can remember is
Andre
Mic
Elton
Travis
Vlade (Dont know your name haha)
Yeah I think thats it.
Still Im easy to find, tall, long hair, bad teeth ^_^

 

[Muzga]

The most commonly accepted theory among objective scientists seems to be evolution. That doesnt affect whether the argument holds any water, but that is most likely why it is taught as fact as opposed to a theory, imagine teaching creationism in public schools. A lot of people wouldnt be impressed because of the religious overtones. It's harmless to teach people that way,

Couldnt the chick eat its way out samuel?

 

[Hobobloke]

in science a theory does not mean a hypothesis but rather it can't be tested in a lab environment for example noone questions the theory of relativity.

Theory is not meant in the sense that we use it in common everyday language.

He first demonstrated the accuracy of radiocarbon dating by accurately measuring the age of wood from an ancient Egyptian royal barge whose age was known from historical documents

This at least shows that they are more often than not quite accurate. We also know the rate of decay, I believe the half-life of carbon-14 is 5730 years or someone around there (please correct me if I'm wrong) I also dont think we need to know (think I'm not an expert in the field ) that we don't need to know the original amount of carbon-12 and carbon-14 as we compare the proportion.

Anyways we aren't debating the reliability of carbon dating but rather how humans came to be, what is your side of the arguement? Intelligent Design as its told in the bible?

 

[Corpsecreate]

Couldnt the chick eat its way out samuel?

I dont think so Recall that I said I did not remember the specifics of the chicken example and its possible that I detailed it wrong.

Take a look at the things that 'just so happened to work perfectly' and it makes me instantly reject evolution. If you dont know what I mean by that ill detail afew.

1. You ALWAYS see the same side of the moon every night no matter where you are on Earth. The chances of this happening by luck is lower than the chance of winning the lotto 500x in a row.

2. MANY living creatures and plants grow and are proportioned by a mathematical ratio known as Phi (not sure about the spelling here) or otherwise known as the Golden Ratio. For example, the ratio of your height compared to your head to your belly button (or is it feet to your belly button) is 1.618 (this is the value of Phi). The ratio of your arm to the length of your hand to your elbow is 1.618. The ratio of lengths involving the way tree leaves are distrubted involves 1.618.

3. Instantaneous compounding otherwise known as exponential growth and decay involves the number e ( 2.7182818284590452353602874713... ) which is present in quite a few different places.

4. If the earth was something like 2-3 KM closer to the sun, life would not exist. Also, if the radius of the earth was 10km less (it is 6350ish km) we would be too close to the Earth's core to survive.

 

[Muzga]

Also, regarding your post about the chicken egg-airhole thing
If youre suggesting the chicken was created that way, thats fine. It's a system that functions well
But what about the appendix? Last time i checked it was completely useless for anything but bursting. Humans are in their design flawed. That begs the question, Why do we have an organ which is not necesarry? If we were created would we have useless body parts that dont have any useful function?

 

[Corpsecreate]

I can ask you the same question regarding evolution. Why evolve a body part over millions of years that is useless? As far as I know, the Appendix isnt actually useless at all.

The appendix, they say, acts like a "good bacteria factory" that "cultivates and preserves" good bacteria nutrition to help keep your body healthy. There is much more bacteria (or germs) inside your body than cells. Most of this bacteria that resides inside your body is needed to help you digest, absorb, and eliminate your food. These friendly microbes also provide your skin with a protective barrier.

Also, just because you cant live without something that doesnt make it useless. You can live with 1 eye!

 

[Hobobloke]

You have yet to put forward any evidence supporting your claim, sure our planet and things on it are extremely unique and alot of thing seem extremely improbable but that in no way supports the existence of a deity or Intelligent Design.

EDITerhaps the appendix was necessary fo our ancestors but wan't very efficient and we evolved to cope without it?

EDIT2:Further research into the topic reveals i was on the right track

One potential ancestral purpose put forth by Charles Darwin was that the appendix was used for digesting leaves as primates. Over time, we have eaten fewer vegetables and have evolved, over thousands of years to consume meats, hence this organ may have evolved to be smaller to make room for our stomach. It may be a vestigial organ of ancient humans that has degraded down to nearly nothing over the course of evolution. Evidence can be seen in herbivorous animals such as the Koala. The cecum of the koala is very long, enabling it to host bacteria specific for cellulose breakdown. Human ancestors may have also relied upon this system and lived on a diet rich in foliage. As people began to eat more easily digested foods, they became less reliant on cellulose-rich plants for energy. The cecum became less necessary for digestion and mutations that previously had been deleterious were no longer selected against. These alleles became more frequent and the cecum continued to shrink. After thousands of years, the once-necessary cecum has degraded to what we see today, with the appendix. Evolutionary theorists have suggested that natural selection selects for larger appendices because smaller and thinner appendices would be more susceptible to inflammation and disease.

 

[Corpsecreate]

0.0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001% chance of something happening by luck vs creator in control of events.

The support seems pretty clear to me Lets not forget the many accurate predictions that have been stated in the bible.

I'm going to bed now.

 

[Hobobloke]

link to sources from this statistic please(and there is no such thing as luck just chance).

The bible also states the earth is 6,000 years old and that children should be stoned for being rude amongst many other things. I wouldn't exactly call it a reliable source either.

 

[Mic_128]

0.0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001% chance of something happening by luck vs creator in control of events.

Does that mean God chooses who wins at the casinos?

 

[Hobobloke]

It would explain why I never win anything

 

[Marteh]

Dammit Trav I had the same idea, then I scrolled down to see your post.

Still I doubt that, wouldn't that basically be controlling everyones life, thus near impossible for one being?

 

[Hobobloke]

God contradicts himself in that sense, theists claim bad things happen because we have free will but if God is omnipotent and omniscient then he would know what we're goign to do before we do it thus only giving us the illusion of free will.

 

[Richard7]

Hey ummm Mic, is having a massive discussion like this in this thread allowed? I thought this would be considered spam or something. I havn't actually read the smash board rules because I thought most of them would be fairly obvious.

 

[Hobobloke]

Ric brings up a good point I don't think this is allowed, I'm sorry for derailing the thread considering I started it, if anyone wnats to continue this lets take it to PM's

 

[Bsrk_]

It doesn't bother me as i actually enjoy a good debate_ As far as im aware, this is the Perth Smash thread which relates to preth discussions only_ In my opinion, this is a discussion between the Perth smash community on a topic willingly discussed between them_ If there are any major disputes i would think that they should be forwarded to Mic, who then in turn would end the discussion_

Well apart from the fact im still laughing at Mics 'recreational facility next to waste management' post, I find this topic to have created a massive influx of discussion within this thread between the community_ I find it a good thing for everyone to be able to communicate about various topics rather then be stuck on the topic of Brawl, as we are already inside a large Smash forum site_

As for my stance on the topic_ Im fairly uncaring both ways_ I was brought up into religion and also taught science and can see relevant flaws in both arguments_ Religion gives hope to people in trouble_ Science gives cures to to benefit society_ Religion causes wars_ Science gives those wars firepower and destructive force to fuel those religious ideals_ Religions answer to creation is based upon the belief of one sole diety as the creator and force behind our creation (along with suggestions to our destruction) without any relevant explanation as to why or how_ Science aims to explain creation through a 'logical' viewpoint by examing and theorizing on possibilities for how and why things work and how we were created_

Either way, there is no real way to find out how earths species were created at the present time without passing into death_ One man creating everything sounds unrealistic but so does atoms smashing into each other causing a large explosion which creates life_ But funnily enough they both sound similar to a degree_ One large 'creator' or 'creation' which justifies our current exsistence_ We do evolve, this is true_ But what is our purpose_? As stated before, we are the earths biggest disease because we destroy, change and abuse its advantages_ We have destroyed species, environments and ultimately ourselves through our 'evolution' and through our creations comes more destruction_ But are we in 'gods hands' or merely our own_

Ultimately we need to accept that we exist and humanity spends too much time bickering over the whys and hows rather than the now_ I exist because i was created, but i dont care as to why i exist because those answers wont come in our time_ When they do, who knows_ But to what effect will this discovery have_? What happens if science proves religion wrong_? What happens to those peoples lives who commited themselves so heavily towards a belief that has carried them through their existense_? And what happens if religion is right_? Do scientists hang up their lab coats and kneel to praise a higher diety_? Do we give up on trying to justify our existense and create our future_?

Either way both have their pros and cons_ But ultimately they need each other and exist for their own purposes_ I am an athiest and i will believe the answers when the time comes to prove them right, dead or alive_

 

[Corpsecreate]

You truly are the master of underscores :D

 

[Hobobloke]

I think we can all agree on that.

EDIT:AAAGGGHHH! It looks like I won't be able to bring my Wii, SD card or anything! I was really looking forward to getting the wii hacked and trying out Brawl+ I don't even know if I'll be able to get my hands on a controller!