Videos for critique

[Zero]

Because of people commentint on older videos, I've edited them in here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MisjVCtgLvU (vs. Marth) OLD
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TBXY-K9nQ78 (vs. Marth) OLD
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mjpVJFXsr-c (vs. DK) OLD
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_YWVywT3wGc (vs. DK) OLD
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdXggy04H9g (vs. Tcranter [PKMN]) OLD
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZnaPRf8H368 (Zerodesu vs. Shaya [Marth])
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fd9NLXNDDA0 (vs. Tedeth [Wolf])

Problems

- overaggressive
- not defensive enough
- blindly rushing in
- bad spacing
- ???

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

1. You don't really overuse side-b, based on what I watched (first match and first half of the second match). You did really nail usmash into the ground for the first half of match 1 though. It's a good attack but it quickly becomes predictable so try to use it sparingly. Up+B works well.

2. On that note, you can use Uair as an alternative to Usmash if your air game is good, which yours... is not. Oftentimes when you come back to the stage after landing, it is normal for beginning players to be very predictable in their landing approaches. In your case, you tend to zero in on your opponent and fail or
lose the air dodge chicken game, getting juggled. In contrast, your opponent often wins those air dodge games meaning you can't combo effectively. You need to work on making your air game less predictable which can be hard with ZSS. My recommendation is to focus on missing your first Uair attack. This lures your opponent into a false sense of security and often they won't see the second one coming.

3. Adding to point 2, you don't use enough Bair or Fair and your attacks become stale. As an example, you often tried to get KBs with decayed side-b, which just isn't going to happen. This is probably at least partially responsible for your incorrect assertion that you are overusing side-b; quite the contrary, you just aren't using your other moves enough. You had all kinds of fresh finishers and many opportunities to use them and didn't. ZSS has a very strong air game, and you can take advantage of it with a well timed aerial.

4. Finally, good competitors are great psychologists. Oftentimes people ask me: "How do good players always seem to know what I'm going to do?" The answer is the greatest players are aware of things that common players do and are able to quickly capitalize on them. But they are also able to say "Maybe they're expecting my reaction to their spammed <attack> and are planning to counter my counter." You can't ever, ever commit to a single attack or answer. Every attack in Smash Brothers is a question. How are you going to answer it? The answer should be "by asking them another question."

When I watch this video I see a player who is answering questions instead of asking them, and not only that, but often giving the wrong answer and allowing themselves to be punished. There's a great basis here because I think you have a decent handle on the spacing of your attacks.

5. You need to move around more. ZSS shouldn't stand still for long except to mind game. You get punished for this frequently.

Hope this helped!

PS: Paralyzer Shot into Dash Attack = no.

 

[kuenzel]

PS: Paralyzer Shot into Dash Attack = no.

What? Why not? The dash attack isn't that bad, and besides a grab, you don't really have much time to follow up with anything else (especially an uncharged one).
Then you can always try the ol' dash attack to up-tilt.

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

What? Why not? The dash attack isn't that bad, and besides a grab, you don't really have much time to follow up with anything else (especially an uncharged one).
Then you can always try the ol' dash attack to up-tilt.

Well, he did it every single time.

Dash Attack should really only be used when they're at 50-60% so it's safe to follow up with utilt. Otherwise, just grab and dthrow, or dtilt to set them up for a Uair, Up+B or Usmash.

 

[canthandletheSpeculosity]

You know how to recover pretty with ZSS which is a good thing.

That Marth did not know the Matchup. Anyone who does would not get hit by side b as often as that. I guess one tip I can give is that you can uair OOS marth's fair if timed right. He used it a lot enough to make it look really predictable.

I see that you use fair a lot when desending from a SH in an attempt to attack. it has noticable lag when landed so I wouldnt recommend using it. use nair in those situations instead if you need to. A nair is better to punish a move then a first hit fair.

Dont use fair to edgeguard or to punish a move OOS unless it's REALLY laggy which will most likely not happen.

You need to learn to be less predictable when on the ledge. remember that you can down b footstool as a ledge recovery.

Your MAIN mode of attack was basically, you guessed it, side b. Like I was watching the 3rd match and I was like "...wow, WTF is wrong with you?" That was directed at the marth player, not you, for not being able to counter it's predictability. ZSS has OTHER moves to hurt an opponent with...

DONT USE SIDE B when you are right next to someone or are GONNA be next to someone (from a SH) even if SHed. the idea is that you are trying to hit them at the tip while keeping you safe on the other side, otherwise known as SPACING. -_- And know that all a GOOD player has to do is run in there at the gap in between your 1st and 2nd side b and you're done.



Here are a lot of bad habits most ZSS players do that they need to work on, see if these apply to you. Off the top of my head:

1. They are very predictable about what they do after a laser (either dash or grab).

2. They spam side b TO A POINT that all a person has to do is run up to them and shield (which apparently most people don't know is possible...) don't just LUNGE at someone with SH side b if you're gonna end up landing right beside them -_-

3. They attempt dsmash on a charging opponent and get countered.

4. They would always use dsmash twice even if the opponent blocks.

5. they always follow up an attack with the same move. people, dash attack after jab isnt gonna work everytime.

6. They use dair to DI when knocked vertically.

7. They use down b on-stage...

8. They use the full jab attack all the time. People can shield the 3rd hit and grab you.

9. The use of Fsmash...

 

[sasook]

Here are a lot of bad habits most ZSS players do that they need to work on, see if these apply to you. Off the top of my head:

1. They are very predictable about what they do after a laser (either dash or grab).

2. They spam side b TO A POINT that all a person has to do is run up to them and shield (which apparently most people don't know is possible...) don't just LUNGE at someone with SH side b if you're gonna end up landing right beside them -_-

3. They attempt dsmash on a charging opponent and get countered.

4. They would always use dsmash twice even if the opponent blocks.

5. they always follow up an attack with the same move. people, dash attack after jab isnt gonna work everytime.

6. They use dair to DI when knocked vertically.

7. They use down b on-stage...

8. They use the full jab attack all the time. People can shield the 3rd hit and grab you.

Sadly, those apply to me.

 

[Kaitou Ace]

I actually feel that you don't use Side-B enough. You were gaining a lot more damage than you needed to, something that's seriously fatal with Marth, once he lands a tipper, of course. You need to make sure you're in range to punish Marth but he isn't able to do the same to you. Once you did start using the Side-B, you got his damage way up which is good. However, it was way too decayed to kill with, as other people said. Use some mindgames and sneak in a Bair, the results will be beautiful.

Also, you overuse Usmash. While Hyphen smashing is good, Usmash does have a bit of lag at the end and Martth did punish you out of it. Usmash is best hyphened out of a dthrow or after a dsmash chain at low %s. Speaking of which, where were all the Dsmashes? You overused dtilt which got them in the air but you didn't follow up. If they're at low %s, get them in the air with dtilt and fair them, it's the fastest way to rack up damage with ZSS as a fresh fair can get you 17%. That is VERY impressive.

Also, try to use the sex kick out of the Down B as little as often. Marth didn't punish you too much from it but a good Marth definitely would have. If anything, you should switch up your game and footstool them out of the DownB and gain some distance. Then, knowing that you have just increased the space between you two with the footstool, your opponent will definitely try to decrease the distance and thats when you slap them with a Side-B.

Also, don't be predictable with your dash attack. Don't use the full jab combo. The third hit can be shielded very easily and it's not worth the 3 extra damage. The first jab is the only worthwhile one. Frame 1 jabs = <3. Interrupts a lot of their play.

Also, Dsmash leads into your best kills. You should've Dsmashed at points where you Dtilt'd. Know where they will go and make them eat your Dsmash and then Hyphen Usmash them to high %s or if they're there already, BAIR THEM TO DETHHHH!!~~~

Also, if you're going to SH aerials, try not to use Bair too much. I know it has smexy KB but you don't want to decay it because you'll be needing it to take their stocks. If anything, try to SH FF uair because it's quick anyway and is even quicker when you cancel it and it's easy to follow up from it. You also need to has more Dthrows.

EDIT: Just some personal advice, try to throw out your suit pieces but one and make sure you always have that one piece. I feel that's the best thing because we all know how good your armor pieces are and can rack up damage like no other but it's HORRIBLE when they're being thrown back at you. I almost cried when that Marth stage spiked you by down throwing the suit piece. Don't worry about it's lifespan, you can just throw it down on the floor to make sure it stays in the game longer but know when to part ways with your little baby suit piece and get serious and use your smexy ZSS legs to keel.

 

[FK1]

Needs more mindgames...but seriously...if that marth wasn't so aggressive/knew what he was doing, you would have been 3 stocked.

 

[Shaya]

I knew what I was doing enough to afford being aggressive. Countering side b is something I stupidly never thought of in my barrage of tipper fairs to love.

 

[DarkThundah]

Work on spacing please. When you use over B try to space it (either SH retreating sideB or SH approaching side B) so that no matter what happends he cant hit you. Also, another reliable way to kill w/zss is dsmash into bair. When they are @ high percentages I start to use dsmash more activily (as opposed to spamming dsmash throughout the game) so I can get in a bair. ummm...Dsmash^upB repeat is somewhat hard to enitiate but the reward is fantastic.

Try to recover high as opposed to recovering from beneth the stage. Like when you were killed @ like 25% from a suit part that Marth threw, which ended in a stage KO. Use upB when you want to recover high, which should be almost everytime. Saw you use it sometimes but more plz Cant think of anything else.

 

[ph00tbag]

Never fsmash.

Never use Flip Jump as an approach.

Use less dair.

Use more other aerials.

If you have no idea what to do next, it's best to jump around doing aerials like bair, nair and uair, especially bair if your opponent is at high percent. Plasma Whip is only good for spamming against people who have never played against a ZSS before.

Don't spam dtilt. Use it wisely.

Shield all of Marth's forward b if you can. You can usually punish the fourth hit, so don't spotdodge.

 

[noradseven]

You can only stun once per time in the air, I see you trying to stun them multiple times well it doesn't work.

Also you don't know marth very well, you can out range him with a few moves, in the air, he is especially weak below him slightly to the front.

I don't see anything too fundamentally wrong with your game, just need to work on spacing and not using the ground over B at really bad times. No but seriously your spacing is pretty bad on both normals and specials.

4. Finally, good competitors are great psychologists. Oftentimes people ask me: "How do good players always seem to know what I'm going to do?" The answer is the greatest players are aware of things that common players do and are able to quickly capitalize on them. But they are also able to say "Maybe they're expecting my reaction to their spammed <attack> and are planning to counter my counter." You can't ever, ever commit to a single attack or answer. Every attack in Smash Brothers is a question. How are you going to answer it? The answer should be "by asking them another question."

Most people predict this way, but if you practice at it there is a better way, which is logically assembling all the moves they COULD do, in the order of what they will do/hurt you the most, and prepare a counter in your head for each one, you can normally get though the 5-6 most commonly used moves every time, and for some characters like MK, you can just always put up B, d-smash at the top, this is how you can reaction dodge/block both of those moves every time.

Also if you want to improve your mind games play any of the Street Fighters no joke.

I don't find that much of a problem with blaster dash attack, assuming the dash hits. I would still suggest grab though.

 

[Zero]

get serious and use your smexy ZSS legs to keel.

Such ameliorating advice~

But thanks for your input everyone, I've written up notes and will focus on your advice. Next videos you'll see from me will hopefully be up to your standard. I'll bring your quality ZSS to the land down under, no doubt.

Also if you want to improve your mind games play any of the Street Fighters no joke.

It won't work, my friends can't even defend against air strong kick to low strong kick pseudo loop with Ken. They suck.

ALSO NEW VIDEO:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_YWVywT3wGc

The recorder was pretty slack and so we've got cuts of 2 matches added to the end. It doesn't miss out on too much, so it's worth taking a look, I guess.

 

[noradseven]

Such ameliorating advice~

But thanks for your input everyone, I've written up notes and will focus on your advice. Next videos you'll see from me will hopefully be up to your standard. I'll bring your quality ZSS to the land down under, no doubt.



It won't work, my friends can't even defend against air strong kick to low strong kick pseudo loop with Ken. They suck.

ALSO NEW VIDEO:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_YWVywT3wGc

The recorder was pretty slack and so we've got cuts of 2 matches added to the end. It doesn't miss out on too much, so it's worth taking a look, I guess.

Another Gimmick you need to get good at is ZSS's shorthop fastfall back air(use C stick), outside of over B its one of her primary pressure tools.

 

[ph00tbag]

Another Gimmick you need to get good at is ZSS's shorthop fastfall back air(use C stick), outside of over B its one of her primary pressure tools.

It's really sad that both of her pressure tools are her highest knockback moves.

If she had a dair that made any kind of sense and had decent range, I think it'd be better for her.

 

[TheRockSays]

It's really sad that both of her pressure tools are her highest knockback moves.

If she had a dair that made any kind of sense and had decent range, I think it'd be better for her.

Slash that if they would of gave her a move to scare your opponent close range(Fox upsmash *cough*)

topic starter im going to give u a couple tips.

1-Forget Fsmash Exist.
2-Don't use side b in close range under any circumstances.
3-Don't Spam Side b your not Snakeee(unless you got lessons from Snakeee do not over use)
4-Try playing without Side B in friendlys and come up with better tactics.(To reduce reliability)

Number 4 its what i did i reduce reliability on Side b and Down Smash and i got better Tilts are the way to go.

Final Tip:

If you lose to characters like Diddy Kong and Sonic don't feel bad it happens to even the best ZSS players. MK is a threat to every character so chin up and try your best.

I like that you used Dair once it helped u push away Marth, Its a decent move a certain point of the match people say its bad but its good something when people don't see it coming.

Well Good Luck hope it helps.

 

[canthandletheSpeculosity]

If you lose to characters like Diddy Kong and Sonic don't feel bad it happens to even the best ZSS players.

lol what?

 

[Mr.Ious]

ALSO NEW VIDEO:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_YWVywT3wGc

7:57 made me cry...Why no double dsmash -> bair -> win? =/

 

[TheRockSays]

lol what?

well when i went to polytek animefest w/e it was i played NinjaLink and his Diddy like 3 stocked my ZSS and 2 stocked my Kirby. Not trying to make an example but snakeee lost to ADHD Diddy main in singles i believe he picked shiek twice, and lost 1 with ZSS(3 or 2 stocked). No joke Diddy is a tough Monkey.

Oh and i lost to some guy name Wes who i can only get him down to 1 life with ZSS and he 2 stocked my kirby barely he was using a pretty awsome sonic.

 

[Snakeee]

well when i went to polytek animefest w/e it was i played NinjaLink and his Diddy like 3 stocked my ZSS and 2 stocked my Kirby. Not trying to make an example but snakeee lost to ADHD Diddy main in singles i believe he picked shiek twice, and lost 1 with ZSS(3 or 2 stocked). No joke Diddy is a tough Monkey.

Oh and i lost to some guy name Wes who i can only get him down to 1 life with ZSS and he 2 stocked my kirby barely he was using a pretty awsome sonic.

I did not get beaten THAT badly, but whatever lol. At least one of the games were close, and he never 3 stocked me. I have new strategies for him now though

 

[canthandletheSpeculosity]

How do you know that the player himself ***** you and not Diddy?

 

[TheRockSays]

Well thats my first time i have play a diddy main i need to go to tourney more often.

 

[The Filth]

The main thing I took away from that first video was that he read your U-air attempts like a book; if you would have landed even one of about 5-6 attempts on that last stock I think I saw, you would have had him. =]

Just try mixing up the timing a little, that should fix your problem. Predictability seems to be your main downfall right now.

 

[Zero]

Back from my tournament on the weekend, with maybe one of the two videos I managed to salvage. Recording equipment is hard to come by.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdXggy04H9g

Ignore the commentary, it's definitely undeserved. >.< Also, I don't know what I was thinking with Castle Siege. The second match has a little bit cut out of it as well, as you will see, but it all ends badly anyway.

 

[noradseven]

Haha I love the Diddy versus fight however it took me like 40-50 times of doing it to have a shot of winning, its all about controlling the nanners.

I never found sonic to be that bad of a match myself, slightly in ZSS favor but then again I am the one with the sonic around here so its more theory based.

Back from my tournament on the weekend, with maybe one of the two videos I managed to salvage. Recording equipment is hard to come by.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdXggy04H9g

Ignore the commentary, it's definitely undeserved. >.< Also, I don't know what I was thinking with Castle Siege. The second match has a little bit cut out of it as well, as you will see, but it all ends badly anyway.

Wow that is like exactly how I played at the smashboards tourney like 3-4 months ago.
Try experimenting with fast falling back air, it kicks ***.

 

[Zero]

Some new videos from the recent tournamanets!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZnaPRf8H368 (Zerodesu vs. Shaya [Marth])
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fd9NLXNDDA0 (vs. Tedeth [Wolf])

from 2 weeks ago, I've got plenty of replays to process from yesterday, so there will be more.

I'd like to think I've gotten better than before, but I'm still losing to the same people. It's quite irritating.

 

[James Sparrow]

you barely shoot your b gun

 

[Nefarious B]

Zero the things I noticed about your match with Shaya:

You spotdodge on reflex, and he was punishing that badly with dancing blades. Marth is one of those characters that eats spotdodges for breakfast.

You have a really hard time getting back on the stage after getting knocked back. I'm not sure how you could fix this because it's also a problem of mine, but just be aware of it.

In all honesty Shaya's a good player and I think he mostly just outplayed you, but you did well regardless.

 

[Bouse]

Uair->Down+B for better momentum canceling. Also, spam dtilt a lil' less.

 

[Nixernator]

Ok, I don't frequent the Zamus character boards (Read: Rarely come here), I've played Zero Suit for about half my brawl life, and 90% of it is what I've picked up so I might be wrong, but whatever take my advice or leave it.
You don't rely on Side-B as much as you think, the only problem I found was misspacing it at times, you should always hit with the explosive tip, no questions. I know it might be hard but its absolutely vital. You can dtilt out of your first hit of jab, or you can grab or you can do whatever the hell you want really, just stop using all the jabs, lol people can and will DI it down and grab you. The jab is sex, but IMO must always be cancelled.
Also work on combos out of Dsmash, I'm not talk Dsmash>Fair, I'm talking damage racking specific combos (My fav Dsmashx2>Dtilt>Uair>Aerial fun), and kill combos (which you seem to know but used at inappropriate moments), I find that I can and often do get all my kills in a match with just simple Dsmash>Sh Bair, or even sicker looking Dsmashx2> Chase pop-up Bair. As another point where was Dsmash? It's punishable if used incorrectly but overall can pressure an opponent and leads to damage and kills.
Another one was your use of Down-B, it was good use while recovering (I liked a lot of it), the only problem was a slight predictability but hey if it works why stop. The problem, was mainly your use of Down-B while on stage. Seriously Just Don't. Lol
Use paralyzer shot more at safe distances while on the ground, you used it good in the air (way better than me), but I'm a great believer that Zamus can keep many opponents at bay, but keeping up a good barrage of Side-B, Neutral B, and Dsmash. I may sound really scrubby, but trust me until your opponent learns how to PS pretty much all of those I guarantee they will struggle to get close. Also once they do start PS then you can start throwing in mix ups. One of my practice buddy's plays GnW, and yet I can still use neutral b/Dsmash as excellent baits.

Overall you impressed me with some things, and some others made me not so impressed.
Edit: Oops that was a bit long lol, correct me on anything I'm wrong Zamus boards, it will probably help me too =P.

 

[ph00tbag]

you barely shoot your b gun

you barely shoot your b gun

 

[noradseven]

You just need alot of work on your spacing, first of all I hate yoshi's island but that is not the point.

Basically get good at spacing d-tilt, b-air, u-air, and don't forget on the marth match, you can jab marth out of alot of his bull, also I agree down B is quite important in escaping pressure in this match, especially during dancing blade, however use with caution.

Marth matchups are normally not to bad for me because EVERY MARTH, plays p. much the same way, especially in the air, which is f-air, f-air, f-air, f-air, f-air, f-air, n-air, f-air,f-air. I swear I am the only marth that mixes up he does this because it works so well, however it can be punished, just get good at slipping in between his f-air, and setting up your momentum so that you are in a good position to punish him. This is harder than it sounds and it sounds p. hard, but its well worth it, often u-air is your main weapon, b-air, and u-tilt, u-smash and f(up)tilt can be good as well.

Looks to me like you just need to play with ZSS more.

wall o text

Okay first separate your thoughts into separate lines makes it alot easier to read.

I agree relying on the over B too much is really bad, same with the d-smash, however I do recommend the usage of close over B in many situations, just remember its offensive not defensive move.

He used down B in some situations where I wouldn't but down B on stage is surprisingly safe and its 12 frames of invulnerability on startup make it great for escaping pressure, and you don't have to launch the kick, and head special headtap just adds to the crazy.

Doing a paralyze shot on the ground aka not land canceling it or, ledge grabbing immediately after is like saying please kill me now, in most matchups characters can see it coming and punish the living **** out of it.

Yeah your strategy works until people get good at PSing and some characters don't even need this if they have a fast dash attack or dacus, or a dumb fast roll.

 

[sasook]

Marth matchups are normally not to bad for me because EVERY MARTH, plays p. much the same way, especially in the air, which is f-air, f-air, f-air, f-air, f-air, f-air, n-air, f-air,f-air.

Mike HAZE says hi.

 

[ThreeSided]

I'm seeing a lack of both air dodging, and as previously mentioned, neutral b. I'm also hardly seeing any grabbing. =\

Air dodging doesn't take much advice other than "do it", but neutral b is great for stopping charging opponents, which is something that seems to **** you ever now and again. Also, her grab is slow and punishable for sure, but there are some decent ways to get it to work. Try the classic paralyzer gun > grab trap. It works surprisingly well even on better players. At lower percentages, try neutral combo > grab (assuming you don't get blocked). Grabs are important, because they are great for setups. Also keep in mind that the Fthrow chain grab works on wolf, but it's one of the "weird" ones that doesn't start at zero and ends well before 60%. It's more like 40% or something. Still good though.

 

[noradseven]

Grab rocks marth he likes to use both of his jumps alot, and you can grab him on landing, pivot grabs work the best so you don't get counter hit by his pimp stick.

Mike HAZE says hi.

I know some marths don't play that way, but that doesn't stop the other 90%.

 

[FadedImage]

Mike HAZE says hi.

mike is more like, f-air u-air f-air u-air f-air u-air DANCING BLADE!

Spoiler

just kidding, he ***** sauce, and takes my monies ):

I think grabbing landings (after they dbl jump) is one of the safest ways to use ZSS's grab, basically nothing outranges it, so you should never be hit out of your grab. There really is no answer for your opponent, he HAS to be grabbed.

*jots notes to start implementing landing grabs better*

 

[Nefarious B]

Yeah, so they're either in a position where they won't want to use their double jump offensively, which hurts their game, or they will have to retreat onto the ledge to avoid landing on the stage, which gives you stage control anyways.

Good **** I need to start using this more.

Also, something stupidly easy that I've found works decently when opponents are coming in for aerial approaches is just to walk away from them, instead of say shielding the attack or trying to counter it with your own aerial, and then pivot grab the land. Olimars use this a lot, and it really makes an aerial approacher plan their advances better.

 

[noradseven]

Yeah, so they're either in a position where they won't want to use their double jump offensively, which hurts their game, or they will have to retreat onto the ledge to avoid landing on the stage, which gives you stage control anyways.

Good **** I need to start using this more.

Also, something stupidly easy that I've found works decently when opponents are coming in for aerial approaches is just to walk away from them, instead of say shielding the attack or trying to counter it with your own aerial, and then pivot grab the land. Olimars use this a lot, and it really makes an aerial approacher plan their advances better.

I play alot of other fighters so my default reaction to alot of stuff is run away, not even roll, so I can turn around quick.