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VaNz Stuff.. about Peach (Tactical Discussion)

Wake

Smash Master
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Sep 27, 2010
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Thank you Based Mimi.
Yeah. I'm sure I'll play a Sheik again and get it recorded. :p I've been taking a look at a lot of Peach/Sheik videos from various players just to see how they do it. Certain styles of Sheik don't seem to be as much of a problem to me. The big problem for me in terms of style would be something similar to the way Amsah plays that MU, at least in NTSC.

IF my set ever gets uploaded, I'll still make sure to show it to ya. Thanks for the advice though. Any advice in that MU helps. :)
 

MacD

Banned via Administration
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Jun 28, 2007
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probably on a platform
He also used more Dair approaches than any other 'modern' Peach ('more' meaning 'greater than singular') but I'm not sure if this is just a stylistic choice, if VaNz likes Dair, or if it's weirdly effective vs Sheik. Maybe he can tell you lol.
omg, i need to get kira in here to tell you about my OP strat of approaching with a low float dair to beat him

those were some silly matches

awwww good times

makes me want to play again

........

or i could just hate my life and solo queue
 

Cia

das kwl
Joined
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Top of the Tier List
Ehh.. I like Dair vs Sheik more than any other character for a few reasons.

1) She's Tall and slightly floaty. So if one of the kicks pierces her shield, It's likely to give you a free Nair. Very rarely is anyone CCing while in shield. Especially when they're planning to Nair OoS.

2) The duration of Dair > Nair/Bair can be used to cross the shield while you land. No Free grabs for sheik is a good thing.

3) I had another reason.. I can't seem to remember it atm..
---

about my lack of dsmash. It's something I've forced myself not to do from fear of becoming habitual. But I often don't even use it in situations where it would have net me a ton of dmg :( I noticed this when we were at apex doing all those peach dittos. lol
 

ShroudedOne

Smash Hero
Premium
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Mar 14, 2011
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5,493
I've actually started thinking that Sheik isn't that bad, mainly because she doesn't keep Peach out as well.

I don't like turnips in doubles. They leave me too vulnerable, and I don't feel like they really help anything (maybe edge guarding?)
 

Wake

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Sep 27, 2010
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Thank you Based Mimi.
I've actually started thinking that Sheik isn't that bad, mainly because she doesn't keep Peach out as well.

I don't like turnips in doubles. They leave me too vulnerable, and I don't feel like they really help anything (maybe edge guarding?)
I'm not actually convinced that Sheik should be that bad. However, I personally just haven't quite figured it out yet.
 

Riddlebox

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Nov 29, 2009
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How far can I ride without turning back?
Has anyone else noticed thatwhen you drop through a platform and try and float right away...you use your double jump? However, if you drop through and go a certain vertical distance (using battlefield's highest and lowest platforms as a gauge) you don't lose your double jump. I thought I was making input errors, but after I got F-smashed while trying to space a F.C. fair, and got a double jump cancel instead I went to training mode to verify. David said it has to do with canceling the fall through animation with double jump?

Are there any other intricate little things like that I don't know XD?
 

Wake

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Sep 27, 2010
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Thank you Based Mimi.
Yeah I noticed that too. I thought I was messing up :p

http://www.twitch.tv/heathmay/b/308937697

I have tons of matches in here. If anyone would, I have a money match starting at about 1:18:00 against a Marth/Sheik/Samus player if you could critique that. I'd appreciate it since I need a lot of help with the Sheik MU.

Also, there're some cool Peach/Zelda matches at about 2:00:00, along with some other characters like Falco and Sheik. I think I'm getting pretty good at PSing Falco's lasers. I get a bunch off at the match at around 2:14:00. Check em ouuuuttt. Or just watch everything. Sometimes it gets a little choppy, but it clears up again. :)

Oh yeah, and I get owned by Sheik again at around 2:27:00. I play Peach the entire time, and I'm the guy in the striped orange shirt, in case anyone was wondering :p. Not sure why the camera had to be right there -______-
 

thesage

Smash Hero
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Dec 26, 2005
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Arlington, Va
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4957-3743-1481
Wake i watched the matches of you in the crew battle. Try to get better at edgeguarding fox, and roll backwards, throw turnips, and use platforms more against zelda.
 

Violence

Smash Lord
Joined
May 31, 2010
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Vancouver, BC
Hey guys, this might be common knowledge, but I recently recommended to my friend, who is learning Peach/all of melee at the moment, to use Z to start his aerial while floating, then release the jump button, fast fall, land, and dsmash with c stick down. Is this this most efficient button description for a float canceled aerial, or is there an even better way?

Thanks in advance.
 

john!

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Nov 19, 2006
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i press "a" with one side of my thumb while holding the jump button with the other side of my thumb. i think this is how most peaches do it, but obviously it's personal preference.

also, there are other good options other than dsmash (like jab or grab)
 

Rosedemon

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Jun 21, 2007
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2,760
Hey guys, this might be common knowledge, but I recently recommended to my friend, who is learning Peach/all of melee at the moment, to use Z to start his aerial while floating, then release the jump button, fast fall, land, and dsmash with c stick down. Is this this most efficient button description for a float canceled aerial, or is there an even better way?

Thanks in advance.
You asked these basic *****es before even AIMING me?

Oh hell no, we are so done!
 

Paju

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Oct 25, 2008
Messages
255
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Lempäälä, Finland
Hey guys, I just got 9th in Gamer Meetup STHLM this weekend. I lost to Calle W and Fuzzyness in bracket. I would really appreciate it if someone could take the time and analyze me vs Fuzzyness (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VeD05AJzicU) as I'm really lost with the Falcon matchup and don't really know what to do against him. I think my biggest flaw in the matchup is the fact that I always die very quickly so if anyone has good advice how to avoid falcon's kill moves, that would be already big help! My set vs Calle W got also recorded (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GjIUzRSSTdc) but I can analyze the set by myself as I know the falco matchup very well (unless someone wants to analyze it ofc). Thanks in advance!
 

ArcNatural

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Right. The other infamous timeout Peach. Whoops rofl.
I don't really blame light for this. Eddy camped just as hard that game, he had the opportunity to fight and just camped even behind in stocks.

lol @ sig shrouded.

My smurf almost 30, taking forever.
 

ShroudedOne

Smash Hero
Premium
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K8UDQIfKdBo

Sorry about the sound. I have no idea why it gets like that when recording melee.

Against sheik what should I do? Any other general tips would be great as well.
I think you need to be faster, and more decisive. You would float really close for a while, but not do anything. And you're too close to Sheik to just float, and then not do anything right out of it. Branching off of that, make sure that your moves hit, or that you can act out of a whiffed move (in order to bait a reaction, or retreat). You seem to get punished for throwing out moves that are too obvious/obviously won't hit.

Edge guarding Sheik is really tricky. If you can, try to go out to them, and bair/fair/nair their second jump (only do this if you are certain you'll hit it, otherwise you've just put yourself in a bad position). If not, you can throw turnips out at them, to eat their second jump, or just wait by the ledge and react. Once you've taken their double jump, GRAB THE LEDGE. I can't stress enough how dead Sheik is when she is forced to up-B. The worst case scenario is that Sheik lands on a platform, or really close to the center of the stage, and you should still be able to roll/getup off the ledge (below 100%, but if you know they'll go for the stage, you can time it when your over 100% fairly easily) and punish them. Downsmash/reverse FC nair are probably the best options for punishing the up-B lag.

Sheik on the ledge: At low percents, you can afford to get closer to the ledge, bait an attack from it, and CC > punish. At higher percents, you should try staying further away from the ledge, in a float height just underneath a platform, from which you can react to most of Shiek's options. If they love jumping from the ledge with or without an attack, a weak dash attack (with the tips of her fingers) works well, too. I noticed that you seem to stand too far away from the ledge to effectively punish Sheik with more than a turnip. I recommend being right underneath the center of a BF/YS/DL platform (1/4 stage length away from the ledge on FD).

Getting under her is very good, which you should try to do as much as possible, with dash attack, down tilt, low FC uairs. Even if you don't get a combo, you've stopped her momentum, which is still really good. Try to look for her jumping habits (Sheik's seem to like jumping), and see when you can get aerials under her.

I think you float too low, because you get dash attacked out of it. But you may just need to float more safely.

Well, this is more or less what I thought of. I hope this helps!

EDIT: Sheik's shield is really, really, really stupid. Unless it's really low, just grab her, and throw her offstage (or downthrow, if you're unsure).
 
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