Twisted Fate Mafia [D3 BEGINS, DEADLINE: 3/8 at 11:59 PM EST]

[#HBC | J]

I don't normally gauge activity by post count but yeah.

Pretty much my answer as well.

 

[Corps phoenix]

I'm sorry? I think I asked you a question ...

I thought you were being facetious. No, I'm not new mafia.

 

[ThatSmasherYouKnow]

I would post, but honestly, it's too early in the game to really put up any evidence. Nothing's really happened other than the "Lynch all Liars" policy, which seems a bit scummy. Only the mafia would know if they were lying or not so all the mafia would try and lynch the liar and they just gave themselves away.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Awesome.

Can we lynch Del then?

Vote: The Man From Delamar

 

[ThatSmasherYouKnow]

Awesome.

Can we lynch Del then?

Vote: The Man From Delamar

Why, because he said that he was gonna be a bit inactive? Assuming that he's lying, and he's actually mafia, you're voting on him to make yourself look less scummy, and you're both in league to make this happen. Of course I'm just speculating and I'm not pointing fingers on anyone, but still seems odd.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

This guy is giving me a headache.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

I have no idea what you're trying to say.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

^ Was obviously not aimed at Ryker.

 

[ThatSmasherYouKnow]

Yeah, I have trouble with wording things

 

[Dastrn]

Lynch all liars is ****ing stupid.
Lynch inactives is correct most of the time.
J is actually playing the game atm more than most of the recent games I've played with him, so Maven is high.
Dastrn not posting town reads is ****ing dumb, but that is an old opinion that used to be prevalent in DGames and Dastrn is like a relic unburied from the ancient past.
Gheb, J, Dastrn, we're all willing to lynch inactive if we have someone at under 10 posts at the end of D1, yeah?

You've got me pegged on being the relic unburied and all that. I'm confident that I'm not current on the state of D-Games meta-game right now, but I'm also confident that not all of the evolution I saw as I came and went over the years was positive or progressive.

I like both J and Maven's play so far. Town-read or not, I like their play, if that makes sense.

I don't know if 10 votes is the cutoff (sounds about right, though), but we currently have 3 players threatening to come in below 10 votes. I'm tracking posts like I usually do. I've got a pretty sexy little spreadsheet. I'll copy/paste post counts from it from time to time (up to the point at which it's a waste of time to keep tracking.)

And the answer is yes, a player being that inactive is easily on my lynchable list. So my lynchable list right now is Spak (my current vote), RR, Kantrip, ThatSmasherYouKnow (I'll get to him in a second), and I'd say SlickWylde if he wasn't confirmed town by the mod already.

LAL isn't stupid. It's just incomplete. Applying the rule blind leads to robotic play by town, we can't afford too many robots. (I'd argue that 1 or 2 robots is actually good for town, though.)

Ryker, if you want me to believe that not posting town reads is dumb (with clarifying swear words for emphasis, no less), then perhaps you're willing to address the arguments I made above related to that idea? If I'm lacking some education you guys learned on the cold, dark streets of D-Games while I was hiding in the broom making **** jokes, you're as good a person to catch me up as anyone.

 

[ThatSmasherYouKnow]

Basically I was saying that if Del was lying about him having to help his family and was actually mafia trying to avoid suspicion, by voting for him, you would be trying to look less scummy yourself under the justification that "He's being inactive so we should just lynch him because he might be lying and might be mafia". Thinking about it, this post made no sense either, but what the heck.

 

[Dastrn]

Why, because he said that he was gonna be a bit inactive? Assuming that he's lying, and he's actually mafia, you're voting on him to make yourself look less scummy, and you're both in league to make this happen. Of course I'm just speculating and I'm not pointing fingers on anyone, but still seems odd.

This is strange thinking. You've jumped to a conclusion that doesn't make sense, and then made an inference from that assumption that makes even less sense, and implied a tenuous purpose to that inference. And then you've chained the two together as scum as a result. You're at least 3 levels away from concrete here, maybe 4.

The most odd thing here is this idea. It sounds like the kind of thing I'd read on a /r/stonerphilosophy or something.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

[...] if Del was lying about him having to help his family and was actually mafia trying to avoid suspicion[...]

... why the heck would anybody assume something like that?

 

[Dastrn]

ThatSmasherYouKnow can you give us a rough estimate of how many forum mafia games you've played? Here and elsewhere?
Perhaps werewolf or mafia games face to face?

 

[ThatSmasherYouKnow]

... why the heck would anybody assume something like that?

I dunno. I'm just stating it in a what if scenario.

 

[ThatSmasherYouKnow]

ThatSmasherYouKnow can you give us a rough estimate of how many forum mafia games you've played? Here and elsewhere?
Perhaps werewolf or mafia games face to face?

This is my second. And on my first one I had to call in a substitute, @Orboknown because I had a lot of school stuff to deal with.

 

[Corps phoenix]

And the answer is yes, a player being that inactive is easily on my lynchable list. So my lynchable list right now is Spak (my current vote), RR, Kantrip, ThatSmasherYouKnow (I'll get to him in a second), and I'd say SlickWylde if he wasn't confirmed town by the mod already.

This only amounts to basically inactives besides RR. What I want to know is how you could possibly consider RR/Spak unless you think that their interaction was partner-esque.

 

[Corps phoenix]

While I wrote and looked back at me asking why you were confirm town-reading RR for voting Spak, it just clicked to me that you including RR as lynch-worthy does not make sense either.

 

[Dastrn]

My "RR is confirmed town" line was a joke. It was because he RV'ed Spak, and I didn't like how Spak responded, so I threw another vote down, and joked that since he caught Spak, it confirmed him as town. Simple as that. They could be partners. They could be TvS. They could be TvT. Dunno. Let's see how things play out a bit and I'll have stronger feelings as we go.

 

[Corps phoenix]

So is RR a choice for lynch only because he falls into the systematic process that is your way of scumhunting or...

 

[Dastrn]

Meant to include this: yes, it was explicitly stated to be a list of inactives and my 1 thus-far scum read on spak. RR has only 5 posts, which is the third lowest in the game, and several of them were in the RVS stage just screwing around. Since I was asked specifically about being ok with lynching people who came in at under 10 posts, and RR was one of the players who could fit that criteria, I included him in the list.

And no, you're trying to boil down my entire approach of scumhunting into this one idea of vote-counting, but that's a mischaracterization. Ask the people who have played with me before (speak up, those of you who have and are interested in chiming in) if this is true. I usually make a big deal out of inactivity during the first 48-60 hours of the game being open, and go about my usual play in the meantime. I'm usually an early target because people see it as tunnel-visioning or something, and once we get through that and get back to the game at hand, my game turns a lot more into gut and reads.

tl;dr I was asked specifically about voting based on post count D1, stated my opinion strictly as it relates to post-counts, and you're focusing too hard on that one idea.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

You've got me pegged on being the relic unburied and all that. I'm confident that I'm not current on the state of D-Games meta-game right now, but I'm also confident that not all of the evolution I saw as I came and went over the years was positive or progressive.

I like both J and Maven's play so far. Town-read or not, I like their play, if that makes sense.

I don't know if 10 votes is the cutoff (sounds about right, though), but we currently have 3 players threatening to come in below 10 votes. I'm tracking posts like I usually do. I've got a pretty sexy little spreadsheet. I'll copy/paste post counts from it from time to time (up to the point at which it's a waste of time to keep tracking.)

And the answer is yes, a player being that inactive is easily on my lynchable list. So my lynchable list right now is Spak (my current vote), RR, Kantrip, ThatSmasherYouKnow (I'll get to him in a second), and I'd say SlickWylde if he wasn't confirmed town by the mod already.

LAL isn't stupid. It's just incomplete. Applying the rule blind leads to robotic play by town, we can't afford too many robots. (I'd argue that 1 or 2 robots is actually good for town, though.)

Ryker, if you want me to believe that not posting town reads is dumb (with clarifying swear words for emphasis, no less), then perhaps you're willing to address the arguments I made above related to that idea? If I'm lacking some education you guys learned on the cold, dark streets of D-Games while I was hiding in the broom making **** jokes, you're as good a person to catch me up as anyone.

Much like LAL (of which your analysis is correct, bit people like absolutes), not posting town reads because they clue in scum as for who to kill is an idea that sounds okay, but applied in practice doesn't function. There are many times where getting your town reads out with solid reasoning is more important than letting them fly under the radar. For example, if SlickWylde up there wasn't confirmed town. We've got nothing of value from him yet. However, if you had a compelling reason he was town that I had missed, then I wouldn't be pining for his lynch because of his lack of content after you get killed for being active. ESPECIALLY on today's Dgames with inactives and a lack of strong town leaders, you can force scum to choose between consensus clears and the players actively threatening them in the thread. That is in addition to the added benefits of making it easier to discern your and the alignments of those you interact with as we expose them to more reads.

However, I'd rather have this discussion in the post game as I hate tainting mechanics discussion with in-game possible biases.

 

[Maven89]

~ Gheb ~ looked through the game, don't see where you think Man from Delmar is being scummy outside of semi-buddying behavior with me early on. Explain and talk about other people too

When I play mafia I hate giving town reads because it traps you. If I say I like player A for example A, and I want to lynch player B, and Player B starts doing example A, now I have to explain why I still want to lynch him when he's doing something I was giving town reads for. Then maybe player A does something that makes me smell blood in the water, but I already defended him earlier by giving him a town read, so now I'd have to explain my flip, when the only reasons for it are scum reasons. If I never had to give town reads, I could push player B and then jump on Player A, and never have to be tied down to "can't lynch this person because I'm supposed to be town reading them", because it's easy enough to justify flipping through a few options if no one knows where your head is at.

From my perspective, forcing scum to town read people limits their options and ability to team up without giving themselves away. Almost every time I've played it comes down to "But you said you were town reading this guy for voting Maven, but now you're listing this other guy's Maven vote as why you're voting him, and you never said you were reading Maven as town", or something along those lines. Catch mafia by forcing them to post and explain their thoughts, because mafia are full of ****. Then you use your bull**** detector and sniff em out. Forcing them to say who they're "town reading" and why helps with that.

Hell, many times you can find scum just because they're the ones refusing to town read anyone even into day 3. Not a rule/guarantee, I've been in that situation as town, but it's still hella suspicious.

 

[Maven89]

Ryker's obviously better now (not surprising), Dastrn is the same, I like Corps a little more

 

[Spak]

Oh? Tell me more. What about my RVS was wonky? What had Infaioed to comment on at the time of my last post? This is an interesting opinion you have.

I'm not sure what Infaioed means, but I'll summarize your play thus far:
· Jokes about lynching Maven
· Likes Dastrn’s joke, votes me
· Maven acknowledges Ryker dodging
· Random Ryker vote without any given reasoning

Out of the 5 pages of RVS, you're my biggest scum lean. You hadn't said or contributed anything signifigant when I posted that, and had said the most nothing out of everyone. Scum lean in RVS doesn't mean much, but thus far I've put you on my watch list.

Spak, have I missed your.read.on Dastrn?

No, because I haven't given one. I think that we don't have enough info on anyone to be making long-lasting reads yet, but I like him thus far. He's been putting his opinions out there for everyone to see, is handling pressure pretty well, and aside from a performing a gigantic gambit, is playing much like he was in Salt Mini Mafia.

I haven't read anything in Page 6 yet (I'm up to #200) so these opinions may not be up to date, but I have to go to dinner now.

 

[Maven89]

This is my second. And on my first one I had to call in a substitute, @Orboknown because I had a lot of school stuff to deal with.

You can't edit in mafia games, instead you should just post again

What do you think about saying who we think is most likely to be town? Dastrn says this gives the mafia great killing targets, some others say it's important that if we all know what the others are thinking. Based just off the idea of the game (cause you have no real experience), which side would you land on?

 

[Maven89]

He's been putting his opinions out there for everyone to see, is handling pressure pretty well, and aside from a performing a gigantic gambit, is playing much like he was in Salt Mini Mafia.

Are you saying he's performing a gambit in this game, or in that one? Because I don't remember a gambit in either

 

[ThatSmasherYouKnow]

You can't edit in mafia games, instead you should just post again

Ya I just edited to fix a spelling mistake sry

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Wow autocorrect. Spak that was supposed to be incited, but autocorrect went ballistic.

Whatever, you responded to it.

 

[Spak]

Are you saying he's performing a gambit in this game, or in that one? Because I don't remember a gambit in either

Was the N0 Role Cop thing a gambit, or am I using the wrong term?

 

[Maven89]

No you're right, that's definitely a gambit, I just forgot he did that

 

[#HBC | J]

TSYK is reading null and if anything new towny just not understanding what is going on in full detail. (Loved the /r/stonerphilosophy thing to describe him because that's what I was thinking in the back of my head)

Dastrn is inflating his posts a tad too much for my tastes and I've had to re-read them a couple time to digest if anything really merits detailing his alignment and the answer is no for me.

Gheb is a little all over the place for how he normally starts. And Maven is odd as well.

Surprisingly, I like Ryker's posts the most. Not wanting to vote Sparky, but I can see why someone like Ryker would vote Sparky over the beginning. I also have good vibes around Corps/RR.

That's pretty much all I'm seeing to really comment on and I'm actually content to leave my vote on Delly until he gives me a reason to unvote him.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

J likes me and I'm not totally convinced he's scum 4 hours in. What sort of negaverse is this?

 

[Corps phoenix]

Meant to include this: yes, it was explicitly stated to be a list of inactives and my 1 thus-far scum read on spak. RR has only 5 posts, which is the third lowest in the game, and several of them were in the RVS stage just screwing around. Since I was asked specifically about being ok with lynching people who came in at under 10 posts, and RR was one of the players who could fit that criteria, I included him in the list.

And no, you're trying to boil down my entire approach of scumhunting into this one idea of vote-counting, but that's a mischaracterization. Ask the people who have played with me before (speak up, those of you who have and are interested in chiming in) if this is true. I usually make a big deal out of inactivity during the first 48-60 hours of the game being open, and go about my usual play in the meantime. I'm usually an early target because people see it as tunnel-visioning or something, and once we get through that and get back to the game at hand, my game turns a lot more into gut and reads.

tl;dr I was asked specifically about voting based on post count D1, stated my opinion strictly as it relates to post-counts, and you're focusing too hard on that one idea.

So again, RR isn't someone who I would really consider to be inactive. Is he gut then? I don't feel like I'm getting the solid "yes or no" answer I'm just looking for. You're complicating pretty simple questions.

 

[Dastrn]

RR isn't someone you would consider to be inactive. That's nice. But that wasn't the question I was asked. The question I was asked was specifically about people who might post under 10 posts. RR fit that description. So he was included.

How is this complicated? I stated my answer in 3 lines, clarifying precisely why I was counting him in the list of "inactives" as it related to that question in particular.

You seem awfully fixated on trying to tie me and RR together somehow. Why is that? What's your read on him?

 

[Corps phoenix]

Not tying you together, just trying to understand you more. I just don't think our ideals mesh and that we're getting nowhere because your idea of scumhunting isn't the same as mine. From my perspective, you have been inconsistent about your read, and moreso with RR, which is why I pressured you about it. It seems you're going to remain the same and I see a lot of people just chalking you up as to how you're playing mostly to meta so I'll back off for now, but as a warning I expect you to follow up on your mechanics instead of always just talking about it.

Unvote

 

[Dastrn]

Here, maybe this will help:

1. #HBC | Ryker 12
2. Corps Phoenix 14
3. The Man from Delamar 9
4. Maven89 17
5. ASC | Red Ryu 5
6. Gheb_01 11
7. Kantrip 0
8. Spak 12
9. #HBC | J 12
10. ThatSmasherYouKnow 7
11. Dastrn 18
12. SlickWylde 2

This is current including this post. I left out only a very few fluff posts like "oops, autocorrect mistake..." and left in everything else.

 

[Corps phoenix]

Gheb is a little all over the place for how he normally starts. And Maven is odd as well.

Earlier you said that you thought Maven was OK though when you chimed in. Is him being odd indicative of alignment or just something you're eyeing him for?

 

[Dastrn]

... but as a warning I expect you to follow up on your mechanics instead of always just talking about it.

Fair enough, on the whole. Can you explain what you mean by this sentence? I'm not sure I understand you precisely, and I don't want to assume anything, since we seem to be crossing paths communication-wise.

 

[Corps phoenix]

Fair enough, on the whole. Can you explain what you mean by this sentence? I'm not sure I understand you precisely, and I don't want to assume anything, since we seem to be crossing paths communication-wise.

I feel like you're making all these mechanics about posts, making all these paragraphs that come off as armchair but nothing is really coming out of them. All I ask is that something does and I'll try to see your perspective about it, even if I'm not one who is mechanical themselves.