TLMSheikant
Smash Master
Definetely ban smashville. And CP lylat cruise.
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Toon Link Stage Counter Picks/Bans {BOWSER!}
- Thread starter Sosuke
- Start date
Shadow Moth
Up in the clouds
I agree with Sasuke, Ban SV.
Rainbow might be a good CP because of Wolf's recovery but IDK.
Rainbow might be a good CP because of Wolf's recovery but IDK.
chaos11011
Smash Lord
Just about what i was thinging viet.What sucks is we cant take them to FD ad Camp him out due to his reflector.
demonictoonlink
Smash Master
Smashville has insane scarring...
Megapants
Smash Apprentice
DTL beat me to the punch. It's really easy to scar on SV. Definitely makes it worth banning. And Lylat is a good counterpick because the shifting stage can potentially mess up his recovery.
Shadow Moth
Up in the clouds
LOL, what's scarring?
Anyway I just said ban it because I usually lose there
Anyway I just said ban it because I usually lose there
I know this I played Wolf before...and scarring is a threat...why?
I'm keeping this vague and dumb on purpose, just answer plz.
Sosuke
Smash Obsessed
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Wolf isn't that good at getting back onstage and if you sweetspot the scar it isn't really punishable unless the power shield it.
And if they don't know about it (lolnubs), then the scar can hit hem and damage them pretty bad.
Anyway, it's helpful to him because Wolf's options for getting back onstage are sucky, and this makes it so you don't have to use them.
But again, this isn't what bothers me since I see it coming. haha
And if they don't know about it (lolnubs), then the scar can hit hem and damage them pretty bad.
Anyway, it's helpful to him because Wolf's options for getting back onstage are sucky, and this makes it so you don't have to use them.
But again, this isn't what bothers me since I see it coming. haha
Power of Slash
Smash Ace
I'm actually thinking the same thing Vietgeek's thinking right now.
Scarring isn't really that big of a deal that it deserves a stage ban on smahsville. He can do it easily on Battlefield and Yoshi's Island as well.
The way I see it a ban on Yoshi's Island would benefit us much better than Smashville ever would.
The wall on the side actually 'does' aid Wolf's recovery. He can now recover from angles he couldn't recover normally because his UpB can glide on the wall to the ledge. There's always Eyebrows for the lucky save, Wolf can still scar there + Illusion at the very side of the ledge for a very similar scar effect, and overall Wolf does much better than Toon Link on Yoshi's Island.
On Smashville there isn't a platform covering over 3/4ths of the stage either.
Banning Yoshi's Island gives you everything from banning SV, and more. In my opinion atleast.
Knowing Wolves they'd probably ban RC right off the bat. If they don't punish them for it with a CP there. If they do go to Lylat. simple =o
Scarring isn't really that big of a deal that it deserves a stage ban on smahsville. He can do it easily on Battlefield and Yoshi's Island as well.
The way I see it a ban on Yoshi's Island would benefit us much better than Smashville ever would.
The wall on the side actually 'does' aid Wolf's recovery. He can now recover from angles he couldn't recover normally because his UpB can glide on the wall to the ledge. There's always Eyebrows for the lucky save, Wolf can still scar there + Illusion at the very side of the ledge for a very similar scar effect, and overall Wolf does much better than Toon Link on Yoshi's Island.
On Smashville there isn't a platform covering over 3/4ths of the stage either.
Banning Yoshi's Island gives you everything from banning SV, and more. In my opinion atleast.
Knowing Wolves they'd probably ban RC right off the bat. If they don't punish them for it with a CP there. If they do go to Lylat. simple =o
SV is good for wolf, but not because of the scarring (IMO). Just the fact that it's a small stage makes it great, wolf can cover the stage very nicely and can also bother anyone who runs away to the platform easily.
I don't know much about counterpicks... Lylat isn't too bad for wolf, but it sounds like a decent idea. If Norfair is a CP in your area, you might want to ban that as well, wolf's great horizontal airspeed helps a lot there. I'd just say go with your favorite stage as a CP, wolf is fairly solid on most stages.
Tl;dr version: Ban SV and Norfair, CP Lylat.
I don't know much about counterpicks... Lylat isn't too bad for wolf, but it sounds like a decent idea. If Norfair is a CP in your area, you might want to ban that as well, wolf's great horizontal airspeed helps a lot there. I'd just say go with your favorite stage as a CP, wolf is fairly solid on most stages.
Tl;dr version: Ban SV and Norfair, CP Lylat.
Just wondering, what makes you say this? I thought TL was good at BF.
Sosuke
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It's like, the stage is such a good size for him.
He spaces sooo well there.
His Bair kills freaking early and its not all that hard to land. It's just the stage dynamics. its perfect for him in this match up. @_@
I can't explain it that well. I'd rather play some random Wolf that I'd be able to 2 stock on any other stage consistently and then lose on this stage to show you what I mean. >_>
He spaces sooo well there.
His Bair kills freaking early and its not all that hard to land. It's just the stage dynamics. its perfect for him in this match up. @_@
I can't explain it that well. I'd rather play some random Wolf that I'd be able to 2 stock on any other stage consistently and then lose on this stage to show you what I mean. >_>
TLMSheikant
Smash Master
WTH sasuke...the best wolf here...he goes even with me on FD (1 stock i win) and other stages but on battlefield i 2 stock him all the time...maybe u just dont know the stage.
Sesshomuronay
Smash Lord
Wolf likes neutral stages, pick something awkward like lylat to screw with his recovery. And ban smashville cuz its like wolfs best stage.
Power of Slash
Smash Ace
On paper Yoshi's Island looks more dangerous than Smashville.
Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't Yoshi's have closer horizontal blastzones and a higher ceiling than Smashville?
among all the other stuff I listed in my other post.
It's not a big difference because they're both neutrals, but I'm wanting to know why Smashville over Yoshi's for a ban?
Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't Yoshi's have closer horizontal blastzones and a higher ceiling than Smashville?
among all the other stuff I listed in my other post.
It's not a big difference because they're both neutrals, but I'm wanting to know why Smashville over Yoshi's for a ban?
tekkie
Smash Master
Smashville is awesome. The ledge has a nice diagonal beneath it to make recovery easier, it is easily scarred, and the wall's closeness makes dsmash a good kill move. It's the same thing as Battlefield.
Yoshi's island is nice because you can't recover underneath the stage on accident, but IIRC the walls are farther.
That's my two cents, anyways.
Shadow Moth
Up in the clouds
Power of Slash
Smash Ace
Then that definately reinforces my argument that banning Yoshi's > banning SV.
Well. ban either one, just don't ban battlefield instead of the two.
Shadow Moth
Up in the clouds
Well at least we agree that Lylat is a CP. =P
BTW I'm pretty sure Yoshi's ceiling=SV's ceiling approximately.
BTW I'm pretty sure Yoshi's ceiling=SV's ceiling approximately.
Power of Slash
Smash Ace
Just tested it
It is =o, but it definately is easier to KO horizontally on yoshi's than SV. just because the stage is bigger, thus making it closer to the blast zones. The only bad part about this is that Wolf mainly KO's horizontally.
It is =o, but it definately is easier to KO horizontally on yoshi's than SV. just because the stage is bigger, thus making it closer to the blast zones. The only bad part about this is that Wolf mainly KO's horizontally.
tekkie
Smash Master
The qualities I mentioned about Smashville are the same for Battlefield. I don't even know where you got ceiling from.
And I don't get your second statement.
You realize this is from Wolf's perspective, right?
Shadow Moth
Up in the clouds
tekkie
Smash Master
Someone asked for Wolf users' opinions. You have mine up there.
Shadow Moth
Up in the clouds
/meaningless argument
YAY!
YAY!
tekkie
Smash Master
Well, anyways, stage doesn't seem to be a significant handicap for Wolf unless it's Lylat. Of course, any Wolf user would ban that ASAP.
Shadow Moth
Up in the clouds
A valid argument. I think Rainbow is a bigger threat to Wolf than Lylat.
Like PoS said, if you guys don't ban RC we're going to punish you for it.
Power of Slash
Smash Ace
I mean. RC's not a heavenly stage for us, but atleast we can bare with it. Wolf's royally screwed there, you guys just can't win there.
Like seriously it's worse than Lylat, I'd be paranoid if I was a Wolf main(was at one point, but I converted to TL <3)
Now then I'd really like to discuss the stages to ban vs. Yoshi and such. Get an interesting discussion going on.
Like seriously it's worse than Lylat, I'd be paranoid if I was a Wolf main(was at one point, but I converted to TL <3)
Now then I'd really like to discuss the stages to ban vs. Yoshi and such. Get an interesting discussion going on.
ChocoNaner
Smash Journeyman
Vs. Yoshi, Castle Siege is a MUST ban. Not only do most Yoshis CP it, but the statues in the second tier, as well as the abnormal stage layout make projectile use difficult, also it makes it easier to avoid TL's Fsmash. I'd also recommend Delfino, FD, and/or Japes.
Yoshi can camp on those stages. He also doesn't have to worry about being gimped on Delfino and Japes for the most part. Although klaptraps and the close blast zones on the sides of the stages could be used to TL's advantage. FD is a bad place to fight Yoshi because of all of the free air space and it being a completely flat stage overall.
Yoshi can camp on those stages. He also doesn't have to worry about being gimped on Delfino and Japes for the most part. Although klaptraps and the close blast zones on the sides of the stages could be used to TL's advantage. FD is a bad place to fight Yoshi because of all of the free air space and it being a completely flat stage overall.
Sosuke
Smash Obsessed
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Okay, Wolfs done!
Thank you to all the Wolf/ Toon Link mains who contributed!! ^_^
<3
I meant Smashville. >___>
Yoshis up next!
FINAL 3 WOOT!!!!
Thank you to all the Wolf/ Toon Link mains who contributed!! ^_^
<3
Wow, fail.
I meant Smashville. >___>
Yoshis up next!
FINAL 3 WOOT!!!!
ChocoNaner
Smash Journeyman
Yoshi's nothing to be excited about. :<
Some way or another it's always a pain to go through a match or set with one.
Some way or another it's always a pain to go through a match or set with one.
Dont face Yoshi on Final Destination banned it. Its useless to spam against this freaky dinosaur, because he can avoid it with Bair except the bomb. We have one of the best Yoshi here in germany, and it is very difficult to win against this prick xD.
So bann BF or FD. FD is one of the best Map for Yoshi and he have more advantage as we got.
On BF Yoshi can be very gay at all. The platforms can be very annoy because bair which can us punish if we try to spam with boomerang or arrows and the plattforms are lead to combos for yoshi.
I can beat him on YI, easier than all other stages, even he have an advantage on it.
Sp BAnn:
BF or FD both he is extremly strong
So bann BF or FD. FD is one of the best Map for Yoshi and he have more advantage as we got.
On BF Yoshi can be very gay at all. The platforms can be very annoy because bair which can us punish if we try to spam with boomerang or arrows and the plattforms are lead to combos for yoshi.
I can beat him on YI, easier than all other stages, even he have an advantage on it.
Sp BAnn:
BF or FD both he is extremly strong
Depster
Smash Champion
When talking about neutrals, you probably don't want to start with FD, but I know I have a hard time against TL at Smashville. I'd probably try to pick a course that just benefited me more, like Norfair, Halberd, RC, or Lylat maybe.
Shadow Moth
Up in the clouds
Definitely ban BF or Yoshi's because the platforms give Yoshi the advantage with him under you. He can spam egg throw and there's not much we can do about it. Plus his u-air kills us pretty well.
For a CP I'd say RC because Yoshi doesn't have a third jump to stall his recovery to wait for a platform.
For a CP I'd say RC because Yoshi doesn't have a third jump to stall his recovery to wait for a platform.
We can stall with eggs lol, then double jump...so RC is definitely not a good idea. Since our DJ amounts almost to your 3 jumps.
On FD, you can out camp us. Our projectile is easily beaten by your arsenal.
@ChocoNaner: That's dependent on the character really. FD can be amazing for us, or very trashy.
@Dep: Are you talking about choosing those against us? Or us choosing them? Because I happen to like Norfair, Halberd, Lylat, and RC.
It's all opinion though, cause my Yosh is balls on BF.
On FD, you can out camp us. Our projectile is easily beaten by your arsenal.
@ChocoNaner: That's dependent on the character really. FD can be amazing for us, or very trashy.
@Dep: Are you talking about choosing those against us? Or us choosing them? Because I happen to like Norfair, Halberd, Lylat, and RC.
It's all opinion though, cause my Yosh is balls on BF.
Paranormalsin
Smash Ace
as a dedicated person to both olimar and toon link (main/second respectively). lylat may not be the best choice to counter olimar. reason being he gains more yellows and purples there. thus making it more difficult to camp him and easier for him to camp you. i do agree with japes, it really messes with olimar unless the olimar is very very very very safe (which is more than likely not going to make a diff if he gets put into the water).
Lobos
Smash Master
CP ranbow cruise for lulz and ban......I think all of yoshi's CP are also good stages for TL LOL
QUIVO
Smash Master
Sorry, my opinions are late..
Diddy Bans: This is just an AZ stage I think, but uthrow to up b does way too much damage... It's also really hard to approach a diddy head on, on the first story of the house. If the stage breaks down, it's like FD. Killing can be a problem for both characters, but since he builds up damage quickly with up b, he can kill faster. Also, yoshi's (pipes stage) from Melee is pretty decent. He can do uthrow up b on that stage, but he has to be a bit more precise otherwise he'll go into falling animation. It's also pretty hard to kill him on this stage. Middle blocks/platform thing can hurt your zair if they're flipping.
I just thought of this, but I think you might be able to tech the uthrow before the up b.
DK Bans: Another stage to ban on him would be Brinstar. He kills really early on this stage. It was kinda hard to camp them iirc, and just those early kills on mesucked.. His range is like half the stage.
Ice Climbers Ban: Luigi's Mansion is a pretty good stage for them. Again, if they're on the first story floor, it's kinda hard to get projectiles in (if they down b). You can break the stage, but it regenerates anyway. Their uair is pretty good on thie stage too. I just remember losing to an ice climbers at a circuit event on this stage : / I think if i practiced it more it wouldnt be so bad..
MK ban: Again.. Luigi's mansion.. Tech chase tornado is really good on this stage. He can hide behind pillars from projectiles. Trying to break down the stage can lead to punishment.
Snake: Halberd?? Utilt kill is earlier, also as far as I could tell.. snake controls the stage better with his grenade game. Instead of playing mid range, you'd have to fight long range here.
Bans based off of wifi experience (i don't know if this will be credible):
Kirby: Jungle japes. Killing him can be troublesome, he has better killing options on this stage when I played on it.
Yoshi: I think Halberd is supposed to be pretty good for them? Helps their recovery from as far as I could tell. They also seemed to control the stage better
Diddy Bans: This is just an AZ stage I think, but uthrow to up b does way too much damage... It's also really hard to approach a diddy head on, on the first story of the house. If the stage breaks down, it's like FD. Killing can be a problem for both characters, but since he builds up damage quickly with up b, he can kill faster. Also, yoshi's (pipes stage) from Melee is pretty decent. He can do uthrow up b on that stage, but he has to be a bit more precise otherwise he'll go into falling animation. It's also pretty hard to kill him on this stage. Middle blocks/platform thing can hurt your zair if they're flipping.
I just thought of this, but I think you might be able to tech the uthrow before the up b.
DK Bans: Another stage to ban on him would be Brinstar. He kills really early on this stage. It was kinda hard to camp them iirc, and just those early kills on mesucked.. His range is like half the stage.
Ice Climbers Ban: Luigi's Mansion is a pretty good stage for them. Again, if they're on the first story floor, it's kinda hard to get projectiles in (if they down b). You can break the stage, but it regenerates anyway. Their uair is pretty good on thie stage too. I just remember losing to an ice climbers at a circuit event on this stage : / I think if i practiced it more it wouldnt be so bad..
MK ban: Again.. Luigi's mansion.. Tech chase tornado is really good on this stage. He can hide behind pillars from projectiles. Trying to break down the stage can lead to punishment.
Snake: Halberd?? Utilt kill is earlier, also as far as I could tell.. snake controls the stage better with his grenade game. Instead of playing mid range, you'd have to fight long range here.
Bans based off of wifi experience (i don't know if this will be credible):
Kirby: Jungle japes. Killing him can be troublesome, he has better killing options on this stage when I played on it.
Yoshi: I think Halberd is supposed to be pretty good for them? Helps their recovery from as far as I could tell. They also seemed to control the stage better
Shadow Moth
Up in the clouds
Ah, but Halberd helps us get back on stage as much as it does Yoshi.