Toon Link Stage Counter Picks/Bans {BOWSER!}

[Sosuke]

Maybe when I feel like it's worth it.

 

[Dalub]

..........................................................................................

 

[Sosuke]

Okay, done. =P

Now I have to make a new invitation thing for when we invite people over to our boards to discuss (I'll try to make this version better so more people come over).


So, yeah. Yay.

 

[Mota]

Nice OP format, just realised this was finished.

Should be stickied or added to the Useful Links Directory.

 

[Sosuke]

Super Bump!

Re-discussion time!

Alright guys, so I want some help/ input with the whole "invitation" thing I make to character boards when asking them to visit this thread to help us discuss.

If you don't know what I'm talking about, here's an example:

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=209912

It'll only take like 2-3 minutes. Just post what you think is a good/ bad stage for Ness (against Toon Link) and why.
It can be like one sentence or something. Just put some amount of an explanation please. ^_^



Ness is the reason I stopped trying to main Ike when this game first came out.
So yeah, thanks for that. <_<

I know we're not allowed to make thread about these anymore, so it's gonna have to be a post in this match-up thread or something.
I'm thinking the this version is sorta bad now. I want to change it. =/


How about:

Toon Links are discussing Ness stage counter picks and bans!​

We'd really appreciate it if you could help us discuss possible stage counters and bans for your character. All we need in the end is a minimum of 2 counter pick stages, and a minimum 2 stages to ban(including a stage to strike before a match) to move on. You don't have to provide all this at once, so if you only know a single stage is good/bad for either character, that's fine. Thanks in advance. =)

Good? Bad?
Suggestions/comments/ etc.??



ALSO!!!:
I've added stage striking to this. Check the top part of the OP for details!

Also, any suggestions on how to make the OP better would be nice. I think I need a little help with wording stuff. (I don't mean the summaries, just the top part of the OP). xD


~ I also think I can add download files to this thread, so idk what I can do with that. ~

 

[WindMajor]

1. The new invitation memo is perfect the way it is. The reader will get the message instantly, and it won't feel like a hassle to them.

2. You should switch hosting sites for the downloadable image. Typing the code is a hassle, and when I just checked, it asked for the code and a password o_O. If you want, you can give me the image and I'll host it. I have an old Geocities account that I still use for photos. If you pass me the photo, I'll give you the link, so you can put it up.

3. Mods can use HTML right? I was thinking that you can make a Table of Contents in the OP, and when you click on a name, it would automatically scroll down to the name, kind of like the "Back to Top" buttons you see on most webpages. Although there's nothing wrong with the system you have now, there are other places that could use it (MK Matchup Thread), and well, if you want, I can give you the code.

 

[Sosuke]

1. The new invitation memo is perfect the way it is. The reader will get the message instantly, and it won't feel like a hassle to them.

^_^

2. You should switch hosting sites for the downloadable image. Typing the code is a hassle, and when I just checked, it asked for the code and a password o_O. If you want, you can give me the image and I'll host it. I have an old Geocities account that I still use for photos. If you pass me the photo, I'll give you the link, so you can put it up.

The second password is for editing it, you only need the first. The picture thing is something I'll consider. I might get started on making one on Gimp if I can.

3. Mods can use HTML right? I was thinking that you can make a Table of Contents in the OP, and when you click on a name, it would automatically scroll down to the name, kind of like the "Back to Top" buttons you see on most webpages. Although there's nothing wrong with the system you have now, there are other places that could use it (MK Matchup Thread), and well, if you want, I can give you the code.

Ohh this is a great idea. Scrolling is kind of a hassle. You have to code for it? o_o
Gimmie

 

[WindMajor]

^_^


The second password is for editing it, you only need the first. The picture thing is something I'll consider. I might get started on making one on Gimp if I can.

Ohh this is a great idea. Scrolling is kind of a hassle. You have to code for it? o_o
Gimmie

I'll give it to you probably tomorrow or the next day. I have too much college work v_v.

EDIT: Okay I'm gonna put the code and explain it. Text in yellow serves as the explanation.

TABLE OF CONTENTS

So what you would write in the table of contents would be this:

<a href="#bowser">Click Here to Scroll Down to Bowser!!!!!!!!</a>

If you want, instead of writing Bowser's name, you can be creative and make a character select screen using the icons that Smashboards provides us with. The code would look like this:

<a href="#bowser">:bow ser2:</a>

Remove the space between bow and ser2 and the icon will appear. Now, when people click on the Bowser icon (), you will scroll downward. However, you haven't defined where to scroll down to. I saw in the OP that you already had icons for each character next to their summaries. What you can do is this. Place this code around the Bowser Icon next to the summary:

<a name="bowser"> (Bowser Icon) </a>

You have defined the Bowser Icon as "bowser". Now when you click on the Bowser Icon in the table of contents, it will automatically scroll to the Bowser icon next to the summary. Hope this helps.

Here's extra help: http://www.w3schools.com/HTML/html_links.asp

 

[Sosuke]

<a href="#bowser"></a>






<a name="bowser"></a>


Like that? @_@


Edit: ok, it works!
*edits the OP*




EDIT:

DONEEEEEEEEEE

 

[WindMajor]

I tested every single one and it works perfectly. Nice job, Sasuke! (of course, I shall pat myself on the back :D)

 

[Sosuke]

Haha, I probably should have told you I already tested all of them. xD
Oh well, never hurts to make sure.

So I was looking up html stuff, and I found this: http://www.web-source.net/html_codes_chart.htm
There's some stuff that seems useful. @_@
<hr width="25%" color="#6699ff" size="6" />
Like the separators.

 

[WindMajor]

I'm assuming you do that with the <hr /> tag, right? Blue isn't the best color for Smashboards, but you could just change the values. There's a whole bunch of good stuff in (X)HTML. I wish the Metaknights could use this (X)HTML technology for their cluttered match ups.

 

[Sosuke]

Yeah, the "hr" one. Blue was just the provided color I saw, so I used it. It can be changed to whatever.
Maybe in the invitation thing I should link to the SBR ruleset? Or maybe in the OP? =/

 

[WindMajor]

What do you mean? The counterpick/ban/stagestrike rules? Don't link it, it's better to just explain it, and explain how it applies to our stage choices.

 

[Sosuke]

I mean for the stage list. So people don't' say Cornaria or anything.

 

[WindMajor]

Oh sure. Do that.

 

[.REMIX.]

I would say ban BF for meta too because its a small stage and he has many gimping oppurtunities

 

[Sosuke]

Bump for Bowser discussion!

 

[TLMSheikant]

Good luck getting ppl to contribute. >_>

 

[Dalub]

..................................

 

[TLMSheikant]

I'd say go for FD, Lylat, Smashville, RC can be a great stage too. Ban Castle Siege, Yoshis or Brinstar.

 

[Sosuke]

Brinstar? It kinda seems like it would be good against Bowser.

 

[TLMSheikant]

>_> Its our worst stage in the matchup. Its not "bad" per se. But bowser has an easier time getting to us since the stage is so small. Yoshis obviously makes it very annoying to camp. And the plat provides great cover against TL's proyectiles. Castle Siege's first trans makes bowser's approach easier. The second one can be good for TL but be careful of grab release chains (walkoff). The third trans is great for TL, acts sort of like a lylat. Its better to ban it though imo. The first trans is gay. Plus, he can time his side b (tho situational) so that when the stage is trans'ing he survives but u dont. gay i know.

 

[WindMajor]

Wouldn't Rainbow Cruise be a good stage for Bowser, considering how easy it is to Side B?

Anyways, we must camp. Final Destination is a good neutral. Actually, all the neutral stages are pretty good against Bowser except for Yoshi's Island. Final Destination is the best stage to play him though. I don't know enough about Bowser to think of a stage that we can ban. I guess Brinstar is bad, and any other small stage would be bad as well. How about Jungle Japes?

 

[TLMSheikant]

...Dont ever take a bowser to JJ...Twink >_> u should know by now JJ is suicide with TL. Good thing its banned now .

Also- bowsers vertical recovery is meh. So he might struggle surviving in RC. Be careful of his upair tho and prepare to tech in case he hits u with it.

 

[Dalub]

....................................

 

[TLMSheikant]

Btw, with good DI a side b wont kill till like 150-160% in most stages. Just sayin'.

 

[B!squick]

I'm gonna tell you right now that Jungle Japes is a MUCH better counter than Frigate Orpheon. And if you want a stage to strike pre-match, Battlefield is our best neutral. Or Yoshi's Island if your MrEh, lol. Frigate is actually a really nice stage for Bowser because of it's size and TL wont be able to camp there.

Here's a vid of what's probably the best TL v Bowser action you'll ever see:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eP7nJGDI89M

 

[TLMSheikant]

Dang, I forgot Frigate completely lol. Frigate is like one of TL's worst stages.

 

[Sosuke]

Haha, dumb me. I should probably start doing this from now on:

Here's the old discussion so you have something to go on.

Bowser

Counter- Lylat Cruise, Delfino Plaza, Frigate Orpheon
Ban- Jungle Japes, Castle Siege​

Synopsis~ On top of being a great camping stage, Lylat Cruise gimps Bowser's recovery pretty bad. Using Dsmash at the edge when the stage is tilted is pretty much a guaranteed kill. Delfino Plaza's water stages prevent Bowsersides, while giving Toon Link an advantageous point to spike Bowser while hes in the water. This stage also gimps Bowser's recovery. Take advantage of all the times the stage shifts to parts with Water. Try to get spikes, because Bowser can't spike you. Be wary of when the stage shifts to walk-off parts, Bowser can chain grab you then. Stay in the air and away from Bowser at those times. When at Frigate Orpheon, just stay on the right side of the stage. Whenever you hit him with a move that will knock him off-stage, make sure its to the right. This will mess up his recovery and give you an advantage. This stage also allows for good camping. Ban Jungle Japes because the kill zones and water give Bowser an advantage in getting kills. Castle Siege has many stage transitions that can lead to chain grab deaths by Bowser. The second stage of the stage also gives a big advantage to Bowser because he can chain grab you to your death, and camping is impossible at that phase.

 

[WindMajor]

Dang, I forgot Frigate completely lol. Frigate is like one of TL's worst stages.

And yet, it's on the counter list.....

So we strike Battlefield, and possibly Yoshi's Island?

Then we counter Final Destination, or Lylat Cruise.....

....and we ban what? Castle Siege? Jungle Japes? RC? Frigate?

May I ask, why is Battlefield a good Bowser stage?

 

[Dalub]

...........................................

 

[TLMSheikant]

I wouldnt ban Frigate IDK...I'd ban Castle Siege or Brinstar. But that's just me. Guess which stage I'd CP a bowser to...u know it :D.

 

[Sosuke]

Okay, I was sorta thinking about Bowser and Brinstar and this is what I came up with:

The stage is pretty small, and has no walls on it's edges, so it's pretty easy to gimp Bowser here. Also, it's an easy spike if he ever tries recovering from under the stage. Since there are a lot of thing on this stage that can make moves last longer (aka the 3 hittable objects), Bowser's attacks last REALLY long if he ever hits any of those. Since his attacks have a large hitbox and are already pretty slow, this just makes it worse for him. It gives you a good amount of time to punish. Since floor of this stage isn't straight, Bowser's Up-B OoS is less effective because the slope in the middle stops him from hitting you if you use a retreating aerial. (Actually, I think TL'S Up-B can get canceled if he uses it on those things in the middle?) The only thing that bothers me is that Bowser's Side-B probably kills earlier here then most stages.

So idk, any thoughts?

 

[A~Kid/ToonethLinkage]

LMAO do we really need to discuss Bowser? It's an autowin for Toon Link. He even makes it easy for us to spike him.

 

[Sosuke]

LMAO do we really need to discuss Bowser? It's an autowin for Toon Link. He even makes it easy for us to spike him.

^
Someone who goes by tier lists and has never played anyone good that doesn't use a top tier character.

 

[A~Kid/ToonethLinkage]

I don't even go by the tier list. Jeez that's why I main Toon Link. -_-

Besides Bowser is easy to beat. Don't go defending him. You know its true.

 

[Sosuke]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7IZSNqfZNI

 

[WindMajor]

Side B can kill us in any stage, but small stages make it easier for him to do it with. So Rainbow Cruise and Brinstar are stages that are not good for a Side B happy Bowser.

Rainbow Cruise will strain Bowser's poor vertical recovery. It will also reduce his grabs.

DELFINO PLAZA has walk off edges, which means poor Sheikant should think twice about this counterpick. Frigate has the invisible edge, which is bad for both of us, but it's a tiny stage, and we can't outcamp him easily there.

 

[Sosuke]

What's wrong with walk off edges? o_o