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Tiers? (Include an explaination)
- Thread starter Nero
- Start date
Also take into mind that tiers are recognizing who would win at the maximum human skill level. If players could play at the skill level of a perfect computer (or Ant-d) then Yoshi, Ness, and Fox would probably be higher due to invincibility/DJC, djc, and shines.
greenblob
Smash Lord
The "skill>tiers" statement is only half true. The tier list only applies at the highest level of play.
munsif
Smash Cadet
Alot of people are putting their favourite charcters on top. From searching for smash 64 pro videos Kirby is used the most, pikachu is definately second fox is after that. The world champion plays with mario but no-one else uses him. Well here is the tier list i have put toghether
Pro tier-
kirby
pikachu
High tier-
ness
fox
captin falcon
middle tier-
jigglypuff
mario
luigi
lower tier-
link
yoshi
lowest tier
Donkey kong
Samus
this may not be a true reperesentation. The higher tiers i believe are certain although as you get lower ther arent any pro videos with such charcter leaving it to personal opinion.
Pro tier-
kirby
pikachu
High tier-
ness
fox
captin falcon
middle tier-
jigglypuff
mario
luigi
lower tier-
link
yoshi
lowest tier
Donkey kong
Samus
this may not be a true reperesentation. The higher tiers i believe are certain although as you get lower ther arent any pro videos with such charcter leaving it to personal opinion.
Wenbobular
Smash Hero
- Joined
- May 26, 2006
- Messages
- 5,744
This is pretty funnily inaccurate.
First of all, I guess you haven't heard of RedMario/AkaMario (same guy I think) from Japan, who I think is or was the best Japanese SSB player. <-- I heard somewhere
but it shows how there are pro Marios out there, you just don't know them.If the "world champion" you're referring to is Isai, then he mains Pikachu but plays almost all characters with the same fluidity, notably his Link, Mario, Fox, and Falcon.
Popularity of characters is usually based on tiers, not the other way around.
What "pro" videos of Kirbies have you been watching? I see very few Kirbies in relation to the other chracters.
You provide no basis for any of the other tiers.
Tiers are usually based on more than just personal opinion. Each character has their own very distinct pros and cons.
Next time offer some reasons for your placements so we can have an actual debate, thanks.
Zantetsu
Smash Master
Link above yoshi? Yoshi should be in **** high tier or above
Surri-Sama
Smash Hero
dont use spacific players to base a tier, RedMario and AkaMario are oth VERY excelent players, but what about Sossy and Dark Link -X- both of these people main "lower" tier chars and play much better then 98% of the ssb comunityThis is pretty funnily inaccurate.
First of all, I guess you haven't heard of RedMario/AkaMario (same guy I think) from Japan, who I think is or was the best Japanese SSB player. <-- I heard somewhere
If the "world champion" you're referring to is Isai, then he mains Pikachu but plays almost all characters with the same fluidity, notably his Link, Mario, Fox, and Falcon.
Popularity of characters is usually based on tiers, not the other way around.
What "pro" videos of Kirbies have you been watching? I see very few Kirbies in relation to the other chracters.
You provide no basis for any of the other tiers.
Tiers are usually based on more than just personal opinion. Each character has their own very distinct pros and cons.
Next time offer some reasons for your placements so we can have an actual debate, thanks.
all in all, there are extreamly good players for all chars, (Dedrick IS a pro Kirby dont say anythign agesnt him he doesnt suck >_>) so i wouldnt ever try to sue players to make/edit Tiers.
_kSo_
Smash Master
Dark Link -X- and Sossy do not belong in the same category of players
sossy is much much better
besides, i dun think dark link mains link..i think he uses a high tier character
Surri-Sama
Smash Hero
aww man whyd you have to say something like this, it totaly distracts people from my point (and as we know people round here cant focus on anything when they are distracted) Sossy obviously is on a diffrent level then Dark Link -X- but my point was they are BOTH great players, can you argue that? And they BOTH do VERY WELL with chars most people dont consider "Good" thats all, and you maybe right about Dark Link -X- i really dont know, ive only been privlaged enough to play him once, but i do know he beat Met with Link (some time ago now mind you) and that counts for a LOT
Zantetsu
Smash Master
Lawlz, Yoshi is high tier, idc what anyone says.
Zantetsu
Smash Master
Epic Tourny Results
---
1. Pika
2. Pika
3. Pika
4. Pika
5. Pika
6. Pika
7. Pika
8. Pika
Surri-Sama
Smash Hero
lol this will never end, my opinion ABOUT tiers is just that there make a good excuse for people who hate losing
my point was that tiers dont even mean anythign really..to me anyways, i beat Mario with Falcon, i beat Pika with Link...who cares!!!
TerranMasse
Smash Cadet
i was going to say myself.....just look at Isai and how he plays his ness
Wenbobular
Smash Hero
- Joined
- May 26, 2006
- Messages
- 5,744
I think he said himself somewhere that his Ness is actually one of his worst characters...I'm not totally sure where you're going with that anyways.
At Sirhc - I was just giving him an example of how people actually use Mario.
Surri-Sama
Smash Hero
aiy aiy, but you clearly said somethign unclear about marios place o nthe tier, then abotu Aka and Red, so you kinda compaired...whuich i dont see a point too =.=
Wenbobular
Smash Hero
- Joined
- May 26, 2006
- Messages
- 5,744
See the guy's post I quoted, he said that only the "world champion" played Mario, which is quite untrue.
My personal opinion is that Mario should be above 'Puff, but I wasn't really interested in arguing tier placement at the time.
Vex Kasrani
Smash Master
Its obvious fox is teh best, just do reflector 2 times on the ground then shoot laser, it does 100 dmg, do this a few time and simply jabbing the poor victim will finish them.
_kSo_
Smash Master
heh,
m3gav01lt beat dark link last time he played him
falcon ftw
falcon for top tier
for realz
pika
kirby
falcon
fox
...
...
...
i dun care
...
Surri-Sama
Smash Hero
Seriously? O_O i dont really know Megavolt but if he beat Dark Link -X- he must be ok
heh,
m3gav01lt beat dark link last time he played him
falcon ftw
falcon for top tier
for realz
pika
kirby
falcon
fox
...
...
...
i dun care
...
and seriously Ness does belong on top tier his priority and speed make it so
JaimeHR
Smash Ace
Wasn't this tier nonsense sattled already xP?
Thino
Smash Master
thats exactly what i was thinking
Yes, we have a tier list.
But that doesn't mean people can't post their own ideas, and explain why they differ from the official ones.
But that doesn't mean people can't post their own ideas, and explain why they differ from the official ones.
Thino
Smash Master
Wenbobular
Smash Hero
- Joined
- May 26, 2006
- Messages
- 5,744
I think that tier list was the one I found commonly accepted on GameFaqs...if you guys want to do a SWF version, we'd probably need to have like...a panel of judges.
Surri-Sama
Smash Hero
wasnt there an ACTUAL tier done though, where all chars where given like 10 diffrent catagories then ranked acordingly, then vai an avg a tier was made?
Couldnt we just do this ?
Zantetsu
Smash Master
I made a thread about right before you came to swf. It was trying to change the tier list. All I got was a bunch of replies saying "does it matter?"
I would love to see the tier list change and many competitve smashers didn't have much time to make a new tier list due to melee coming in 2 years.
All I want to see is link higher (idc if his recovery sucks, thats one flaw and shouldn't bump him down all the way to bottom) and kirby lower (at high level of play, kirby sucks.)
Zantetsu
Smash Master
Wrong.
I know where this thread is going >_>
http://vidfan.com/media/1294/Family-Guy---The-Stubborn-Mule.html
SuPeRbOoM
Smash Master
ness is lower
exactly; you are the mule.
You think Captain Falcon is better than Ness?! That's absurd; Ness is much better than Falcon. They both have approximately equal combo ability (if anything Ness' is better because of DJC), but Captain Falcon is extremely more vulnerable to combos, and his recovery sucks.
Sensei
Smash Lord
ness's recovery is worse than captain falcons. also falcons combos are easier to preform and harder to DI out of. falcon is also faster and can out beat anybody in dash dance camping. falcon > ness.
Totally wrong. Captain Falcon is a lot easier to edgeguard, which means his recovery is worse. ALSO, Ness is a lot better AT edgeguarding. Also, "ease of combos" should not be considered in a tier list (otherwise Fox would be a lot lower) since it is assumed we are talking about top level play.
okay?
okay?
Sensei
Smash Lord
you don't know what you're talking about.
_kSo_
Smash Master
why are you trying to discuss top level play because based on the way you are talking, it is something you obviously are not a part of.
greenblob
Smash Lord
I think a good starting point is to rank the best player of each character. So you would compare the best Pika (Isai's Pika) to the best Link (Isai's Link) to the best Yoshi (Sossy?) etc. This means that Isai would make up most of the tier list, but well, it's a start.
Zantetsu
Smash Master
I'm not being stubborn and saying "this is the tier list because i said so".
Also I never said falcon was better then ness...
Quoted for truth
FIRST OF ALL, I was obviously (well, obviously not obviously enough) joking when I said "this is the definite tier list and if you disagree you're wrong." I was simply mocking other people who are like that. Clearly this board has no sense of humor.
2. While there are better players than me, I beat well over 95% of the people I play online, and I feel I am qualified to discuss top level play.
3. I am certain that, at top level play, Ness is better than Captain Falcon. Ness has a much larger potential than most people realize, since very few people are extremely good with him, and lots of people main Falcon. Yes Captain's 0 to death combos are easier to perform, but his recovery is one of the worst and least predictable in the game (he is easily killed by Ness' down-smash yo-yo when thrown off the stage at a low percentage), and he is one of the easiest characters in the game to combo (probably the easiest next to DK). If you disagree, you should provide some examples, rather than arrogantly saying "You don't know what you're talking about." I would be happy to challenge anyone's Captain Falcon with my Ness.
<3
2. While there are better players than me, I beat well over 95% of the people I play online, and I feel I am qualified to discuss top level play.
3. I am certain that, at top level play, Ness is better than Captain Falcon. Ness has a much larger potential than most people realize, since very few people are extremely good with him, and lots of people main Falcon. Yes Captain's 0 to death combos are easier to perform, but his recovery is one of the worst and least predictable in the game (he is easily killed by Ness' down-smash yo-yo when thrown off the stage at a low percentage), and he is one of the easiest characters in the game to combo (probably the easiest next to DK). If you disagree, you should provide some examples, rather than arrogantly saying "You don't know what you're talking about." I would be happy to challenge anyone's Captain Falcon with my Ness.
<3
SuPeRbOoM
Smash Master
ill play you on p2p add my aim Superboofman505