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I think Mewtwo, Pit, and Samus are all solidly better than Fox.
Actually you could kind of make the argument that Fox's tournament results don't support him being #1 right now. I don't think he's been the winningest character so far, but PM is so new that tournament results alone aren't enough. There's no question that part of why Fox is #1 is theory fighter and his performance in Melee.
Honestly I think there's quite a few good characters you can argue are above Falco. Falco isn't nearly as complete as Fox as a character, he's very strong (and better than Fox) in some ways but he's not nearly as versatile overall, and with such a large cast of viable characters versatility is pretty important.
I'd be very interested to hear the argument for Samus. She can clearly put up a pretty good wall of projectiles if she's got a platform to work with, and some characters have a lot of trouble with that, but characters with reliable reflectors or very good mobility can easily get around it and it doesn't work on some stage layouts.
"They don't know the matchup."
Well, I play with ESAM a lot, so I think Samus is VERY good. I think she loses to M2 and maybe Falco, but goes even with/beats everybody else.
Dash-dancing is a MUCH weaker mechanic in a game with better projectiles. Who cares when he's going to go in when we control all this space in front of us?
I'd definitely also be worried about Fox and Pit, and maybe Lucas and Sonic too, but we'll see how ESAM continues to perform against them.
Fox might not win every matchup, but I don't think he has any that are worse than 45-55. If you look at Fox vs Mewtwo or Fox vs Pit, for example (which I think most people agree are his worst matchups), they're clearly still winnable for Fox, he's just maybe at a tiny bit of a disadvantage. He just has such explosive speed and power than he has the tools to win any match, his only issue is some characters can abuse his falling speed to have even more powerful offense against him.
Samus is superb, as is everyone mid-tier and above in PM. ESAM is clearly good, but it was clear that no one at Xanadu (ignoring M2K) knew what they were doing. For christ's sake, he chain grabbed everyone there with a character who doesn't even have a chain grab. All they had to do was DI away, but ESAM got away with it anyway.
I'd say M2K clearly beats fox, not Mewtwo. Taj got beat by DEHF's Fox at Apex, and he's most likely the second best Mewtwo player. Bowser gets wrecked as long as Fox plays ultra lame and camps him out.
Fox has the best tournament results.
Personally I think that Sheik, MK, Pit, Mario, and Diddy are all solid contenders with Falco for 2nd best in the game. My problem is not that the A tier has several contenders, but that the S tier has exactly 1 contender.
The chaingrab is real. It still works on most characters on away DI. It's only escapable if you DI in, at which point Samus just does whatever she wants.
Thats the dumbest thing ive ever heard strong bad why dont you take the red pill and wake up
Dooooood. I took the blue pill. Get at me.
Red is the color of democracy. I will destroy you using your own characters just like how in the 1960s jesus and america teamed up to steal russian spacecraft and go to the moon
Really? I don't see him played all that often in tournies, but I figured that was because people were just tired of him always being the best and wanted to try out some new characters.
Going off Smashboards rankings (which doesn't include all tournaments, blame under-reporting regions + recent Texas stuff!), Fox is way ahead of everyone. It's actually kind of interesting, since it shows Marth and Link as possibly better represented population wise as they have more top 16-8 placings than characters better than them. It's not til you get to tourney wins, that people like Link and Marth drop off, and others like Mario/Wolf show up stronger.
I dunno specific tourneys, Wolf is pretty well known in a couple of scenes though. Chillin, Rat, Scythe, so on and so forth. I dunno how to check the rankings easier to see which tourneys were won by specific characters (instead of just stating # of wins or placings), but you can check the rankings and maybe find something there. I'm also only talking about tourney wins: I'll see about compiling stats for placings ranging from 2nd to 7th
He's The Enlightenment/Papa+Stone/Greenluigi. You know, the guy that goes to all the local libraries to make new accounts. Guess he got bored of playing Runescape.
Lmao that's weird.
**** u nerd
DO NOT SHOW THEM THE POWER
The chaingrab is not real, on any character. The only character she can even re-grab on DI away is Ness, everyone can jump out on correct DI. Refer to this chart down the page: http://smashboards.com/threads/chain-grabs.345169/page-2
that's the definition of a not-real chaingrab XD
Fine, it isn't a real chaingrab. But getting re-grabbed is arguably the better option in a lot of cases here. It's either that, or DI right above her and become susceptible to upsmash, fsmash, nair, utilt, etc. and whatever may come of that. I realize that doesn't make the chaingrab real, but my original point still stands--getting regrabbed by Samus isn't indicative of a lack of ability to play against her. It just means her dthrow is good since your options are take damage and positional disadvantage from regrabs or take more damage and positional disadvantage from an attack.
Except for 90% of the cast, it's best to DI away. You can't be re-grabbed, and she can't follow up as well unless they're floaty.
