Tier List Speculation

[Kink-Link5]

New Tier List

Top
All characters with animal names

High
All characters named after fruits

Middle
All characters that don't fall into the other categories

Low
All 2D characters

Bottom
All Pokemon

 

[DMG]

Only character that matters is Drunken Fist Luigi

 

[ItalianStallion]

I think you are forgetting someone.

OKAAAAY!?

Why do people keep on forgetting him when they post their lists?? He's too amazing to forget.

 

[trash?]

to add to this, think of it this way:
jigglypuff is often revered as the "gayest" character in super smash bros. melee. now, if we think about this, calling jigglypuff "gay" is (intentionally or not) comparing homosexuals to jigglypuff. would you, personally, want to be compared to jigglypuff?

I'm down for being jiggs. I am absolutely jiggs.

I play homo out of god damn spite, if anyone says you're "too homo", scream "YER DAMN RIGHT I AM" and chuck your controller at their jaw. that's the meta knight way.

pink meta knight: reclaim the homo, pick a top tier™

 

[Kink-Link5]

I'd happily be compared to Jigglypuff over that douchnozzle Falcon.

 

[CyberZixx]

Me too actually. Puff > Falcon.

 

[Ezzee]

Can we discuss Ike? I kinda just picked him up as my new main because he's fun but he feels kinda clunky. He's best when he's jumping around using his great ariels, except his fair is painfully slow now. There's almost no point in using it now because of how slow it is, and it doesn't do much more damage or knockback compared to his other moves. His nair is far better because it's comparible in the damage compartment, comes out much faster and reaches around his body. Quickdraw is still really good for mobility and U-air is great for follow ups, but his throws are really average and he can't do much to combo out of them. I never played 2.5 or earlier, but watching some of the videos, he seemed balanced (not in 2.1.) What do you guys think of Ike?

 

[DMG]

Nair is insanely good. Fair is still really good though, but more for offstage. It's not going to be the "go-to" aerial onstage because the move isn't so damn safe on shields anymore/you need much better spacing. You can't fly at people with Nair offstage... they'll probably live and thank you lol. If you running full hop Fair someone offstage, they probably got messed up.

He's underrated atm and needs players who are more patient with him in neutral.

 

[KayB]

He's underrated atm and needs players who are more patient with him in neutral.

Ike is in fact a low tier. Bottom five actually.

 

[DMG]

Oh yeah good one. Like how Fox and Marth and Lucas are Low tier right? YOU WEREN'T EVEN THERE AT LTC YOU FRAUD YOU CAN'T BE ONE OF US!

If Ike is a low tier, then that tier must be like 12 characters, and he's at the top. Scratch that, if Ike is a low tier, then you must be playing a modded version where he uses the Broccoli Sword/Limp Noodle/Meatless Chicken Leg.

 

[Kink-Link5]

Fair is used for edgeguards, in combos, and from a wide neutral for spacing. Even if the move was -10 on block, it pushes so far away that even the fastest OoS option would have trouble reaching out touching me

Touching Youuuuuuuuuuu

Sweeeeet Caroline

BA BA BAAA

 

[Plum]

Oh yeah good one. Like how Fox and Marth and Lucas are Low tier right? YOU WEREN'T EVEN THERE AT LTC YOU FRAUD YOU CAN'T BE ONE OF US!

If Ike is a low tier, then that tier must be like 12 characters, and he's at the top. Scratch that, if Ike is a low tier, then you must be playing a modded version where he uses the Broccoli Sword/Limp Noodle/Meatless Chicken Leg.

Marth is low tier fact, Lucas is from the Mother series and every Mother character in Smash is bad because it's a rule, and Fox is trash because shine isn't even invincible. So yeah, sounds about right.

 

[DMG]

Yeah those characters are low tier. You can't put Ike down with those amazing bad characters, he's a misfit. He has to be bad to fit in with furryshiners3000, kid who eats glue, and Murtha

 

[Plum]

Fighting for friends is pretty bad though.

 

[DMG]

What do you fight for?

 

[Strong Badam]

Can we discuss Ike? I kinda just picked him up as my new main because he's fun but he feels kinda clunky. He's best when he's jumping around using his great ariels, except his fair is painfully slow now. There's almost no point in using it now because of how slow it is, and it doesn't do much more damage or knockback compared to his other moves. His nair is far better because it's comparible in the damage compartment, comes out much faster and reaches around his body. Quickdraw is still really good for mobility and U-air is great for follow ups, but his throws are really average and he can't do much to combo out of them. I never played 2.5 or earlier, but watching some of the videos, he seemed balanced (not in 2.1.) What do you guys think of Ike?

the first few sentences read as if there was an iteration of ike where his fair was faster :/

"his throws are really average and he can't do much to combo out of them"
what

 

[DMG]

Yeah I dunno what he smokin. Ike's overall throw game is one of the most ludicrous, versatile, and scary out there. With a decent grab range and options like QD -> Grab/Pivot grab.

 

[Ezzee]

Yeah, I've been messing around with throws more and I figured out a f-throw->nair->jab. D-throw isn't bad, but I haven't been able to do much out of it other than dash attack, but I am new to him. What I dislike about fair is that it just doesn't sem worth it. Even off stage I feel like the nair thing can be accoplished with nair, but is more of a quick jab to stall them out instead of just finishing them. Both have ups and downs, but fair seems to be more risk vs reward because somone could attack you during the opening frames. And yeah, my grammar and wording tend to be piss poor, need to work on it.

 

[metroid1117]

FAir has a bit of start-up compared to his other aerials, but it seems like you're starting it too close to your opponent. Ike's aerial speed (not aerial maneuverability) is pretty good, so try short-hop FAir'ing at your opponent and aiming for the tip instead. If you're up close, retreating NAir is a generally a better and safer option.

With regards to Ike's profits from throws, they're very good but heavily dependent on DI and %. For floaties, try playing around with BThrow, FThrow, and QD; you can usually link either throw into a QD attack at low %s, QD -> JC grab or dash attack at mid %s, DACUS at mid-high %s (it depends, but it's somewhere around 70%-80% for no DI), and QD -> RAR BAir or QD -> FAir at high %s. DThrow is also very good on floaties starting a mid %s, at which you can either QD -> JC grab if they DI towards your back or BAir if they DI towards your front. At higher %s, floaties can get DACUS'd or QD -> RAR BAir if they try DI'ing towards your back. Last but not least, UThrow is a pretty good combo starter and positioning throw at low %s, either letting you link into (reverse) BAir or start juggles with NAir. On fastfallers, you can chaingrab them at mid%-high%s, and you can also QD -> JC grab if they try DI'ing away. At higher %s, you can end the chaingrab with QD -> RAR BAir or DACUS, but DACUS isn't really worth it unless you get the hilt sweetspot.

 

[SwordsRbroken]

Ike is top 15 without a doubt. He's got a good neutral, amazing edgeguards, and a great combo game. The only thing he lacks is a good recovery. Oh yeah, and he has a fall speed similar to Marth, so he can get juggled pretty badly by some characters.

He definitely felt awkward to me when I first picked him up as well, but he's pretty strong atm.

I don't think he's as good as Marth or Shiek, but he's Top 10 in my book IMO. That new nair is just godlike.

 

[ELI-mination]

Guys I think DK is top 25 in this game

 

[DMG]

Mind reasonably satisfied

 

[Kink-Link5]

Squirtle is definitely top 34.

 

[jayeldeee]

So this is what I'm understanding:

Spoiler

Yep, this about sums it up.

 

[Archangel]

Tier list

Fox
Sheik
Wario
Metaknight
Snake
Peach
Falco
GW
Wolf

Ivysaur
Marth
DK
DDD

Pit
Mario
Zard
Diddy
ZSS
Zelda
Bowser
Luigi

Link
Ganon
Captain Falcon
Pikachu
Toon Link


Omitting due to inexperience
Lucario
Rob
Squirtle
Puff
Lucas
Ike

Fudged everything from ZSS to Pit

holy crap a list. I forgot what tier lists look like in this thread....

anyway, I'm wondering why the giant gap between fox and Falco? Especially since you have Peach and Sheik above him.

 

[trash?]

man, tier lists are getting WEIRD recently. nobody knows if half the cast are the absolute worst or guaranteed top tiers. if only there were some way to get average opinion...
no wait that was my job wasn't it AAAAGH

 

[DMG]

You do that, and you include the guy who put Pikachu over 2.5 Sonic

 

[KayB]

Is there any decent footage of good Meta Knights showing their supposed top tier placing?

 

[DMG]

I can only go off what I saw at LTC and whoever Wizzrobe's buddy is on their stream (forgot the tag), but he is pretty solid. His ground speed carries the character above mediocrity. If you stay on the ground with MK, you do good. Kind of like not jumping so much with Sheik: you'll do 5x better.

 

[leelue]

holy crap a list. I forgot what tier lists look like in this thread....

anyway, I'm wondering why the giant gap between fox and Falco? Especially since you have Peach and Sheik above him.

A) I haven't seen falco do *quite* as well
B) I have seen the other two you mention do better in my experience, except v a couple characters
C) I personally feel like falco is much more beatable with both of my top characters now, even though that's a biased. In general, i just feel better about fighting falco than fox.

 

[Archangel]

A) I haven't seen falco do *quite* as well
B) I have seen the other two you mention do better in my experience, except v a couple characters
C) I personally feel like falco is much more beatable with both of my top characters now, even though that's a biased. In general, i just feel better about fighting falco than fox.

I can see that. I was just curious as to why you placed him how you did. I'm not sure I agree with the holy melee characters Fox/Falco/Sheik/puff/peach/Marth>everyone. I think that Fox's design overall makes him difficult. I can't say I've found someone who counters him yet. Even though his Shine knocks people farther and messes up some things he is still designed to beat or go even with just about everyone in my experience.

Falco's design remains ******** as well to me. However, The introduction to new things like new spacie/spacie type characters(see lucas who can JC Down-b laser campers). As well as things like Super Armor or light Armor, combined with the severely raised bar of recovery in this game and the fact that he remains a bird who can't fly makes him beatable. It's controversial to say but I can think of some characters who do more than give him trouble but actually feel like they have a winning MU over him now. He still remains to be one of the best. I wouldn't say he's not S-tier level but in melee he's 1-2 with Fox were as in this game it's still undecided who's 1. Fox is still very good and Falco is...less very good when scaled against the complete PM cast.

 

[leelue]

Also, peach could move up 2 spots on my list as well as link down 2 and pit up 1 spot apiece (moving pit into the chunk with ddd).

i wouldn't be surprised if cfalc was better than i say either, i just usually see him lose.

I think you are forgetting someone.

OKAAAAY!?

i did forget Ness in the no clue section. Right.

 

[DMG]

Surely Falcon is better than Luigi and Ganon. Besides that, all I can say is holy cow Wario. I can't put him over Marth or Falco, but I'm biased for Marth so it's whatever.

 

[PMS | LEVEL 100 MAGIKARP]

The day has come where people think GW is top tier and DDD is not the worst in the game

 

[Bryonato]

Been wanting to make my own list for awhile. Guess I'll go for it. Character placement within the tiers doesn't mean a whole lot... Ok it means a little bit. JUST A LITTLE BIT

S:
Fox

A:
Falco
Sheik
Wolf
MK
Peach
Snake
Ivy

B:
Mario
Pit
Link
Marth
Ike
Wario
ZSS
Bowser
DK
Falcon
Zard
Diddy
Lucas

C:
GnW
Ness
D3
Puff
Weegee
ROB
Squirtle
Lucario
Ganon
Sonic

D:
Tink
Zelda
Pika

Yeah "D" Tier sounds ****ty but I really feel most all of the characters in this game are pretty damn good, especially when you compare the "worst" to the "best" in this game to something like Brawl or Melee.

Hope I didn't forget anyone :s
Comments and questions are appreciated. Always willing to learn more about the game if someone thinks this list is whack as fook.

 

[DMG]

Ok sir I'm going to exami-

Oh... I see you have Luigi over Jigglypuff...

Looks like I'm gonna have to sit down for this one, jeez

Ok sir, just off the top of my head here are the things we at the Tier List Institute have "concerns" about:

Snake. I'm going to leave it at that.

Mario over Marth. You *are* aware that Marth has a sword right?

Peach over Sheik is a hard sell. Sheik is always the man in the relationship.



Most importantly, this list you have presented demonstrates you lack the knowledge clearly to formulate a good tier list. You have one flaw that breaks the foundation of your opinions. That flaw is...








Marth clearly isn't low enough. I dunno if you heard the rumors, but it's true. He's low tier.

YOU FAIL WEAKEST LINK GOODBYE

 

[Kink-Link5]

I can only go off what I saw at LTC and whoever Wizzrobe's buddy is on their stream (forgot the tag), but he is pretty solid. His ground speed carries the character above mediocrity. If you stay on the ground with MK, you do good. Kind of like not jumping so much with Sheik: you'll do 5x better.

You do a lot of jumping with near every character that isn't Luigi. MK also has an exeptionally small sh, great fast fall speed, and some of the best options out of an empty hop. MK is good because he's made of extremely solid fundamentals, comparable as mentioned, to Sheik.

 

[Plum]

Marth at least E tier. Other player picks Marth? E is for Easy win.

Sheik likes to wear pants. Oooooh yeah. She doesn't need to live with society's rules with dresses. Dresses are for mid tiers.

 

[DMG]

MK's solid fundamentals stem from ground traits though. Having a good dash/run opens up the game for him. MK is at his best facing most things from the ground, not flailing around in the air with Fairs and Dairs and whatever people are doing.

 

[Plum]

Besides, you have faster access to your aerials from the ground than you have your ground options midair. And his mobility is crazy crazy good on ground, but pretty butts in the air aside from his ground to air transition. Not everybody gets to be oddly mobile in the air like Wario (seriously, how does a man of Wario's girth move like that).