The Winning Steak Cinemas: Video Archive & Criticism Thread Updated

[Death Arcana]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V53Cvzr3hkI

i know he's obviously sandbagging but it still was a money match
Chris told me my sonic is starting to become decent, almost tourney viable
what do you guy's think of it?

 

[FRiSKruns]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8Bq0wwR_YU - Zero (Sonic) vs. Turbo (Sonic) 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xDsiFNrn6g&feature=related - Zero (Sonic) vs. Turbo (Sonic) 2


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1Viw4qVyqw&feature=related - Zero (Sonic) vs. Kyro (Ness) 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWu0lHXUR7w&feature=related - Zero (Sonic) vs. Kyro (Ness) 2


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vuZPUmofvD4 - Zero (Sonic) vs. ? (Diddy Kong) 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AoTHZmBsz1g - Zero (Sonic) vs. ? (Diddy Kong) 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0B_7E541lww - Zero (Sonic) vs. ? (Diddy Kong) 3


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mFrn2GockFI - Zero (Sonic) vs. JRUGS (Snake) 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ObHP4lagTwo - Zero (Sonic) vs JRUGS (Snake) 2


All of those are offline friendlies.

On that note, would someone PLEASE give me some advice on how to deal w/ Diddy? XD I feel like I struggled way too hard on those, and like I really wasn't playing the match-up right =/

Edit: Just fixed format.

 

[Tesh]

Some friendlies with Rich Brown from pre-WHOBO 3 smashfest.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LiENHAOLnDg - Tesh (Sonic) vs Rich Brown (Olimar) 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VDDByY44kb8 - Tesh (Sonic) vs Rich Brown (Olimar) 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qz5jZY_eiIg - Tesh (Sonic) vs Rich Brown (Olimar) 3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TIhVzn9cFHc - Tesh (Sonic) vs Rich Brown (Olimar) 4

Finally have some matches vs olimar. Could use some help this matchup big time. Always feels so hard to land after dthrow (worse than metaknight for me) and even when I have him cornered, he can whistle through everything and reverse a juggle. No idea how to approach him either or get decent punishes (landing a bunch of weak dash attacks always gets me hit back).

 

[Life]

To deal with whistle, you have to predict it and hit after the SA is over (I don't recall when this is) and/or grab IIRC.

 

[Digital Limit]

What's whistling? Maybe I should read up on Olimar.

 

[Life]

Whistling is Olimar's down-b. It has two purposes:

1. Calls Pikmin back and reorders them by color.
2. Has ~16 frames of Super Armor (that is, knockback immunity) which is useful for defense.

 

[Tesh]

isnt it like frame 2 super armor? 25 frames total (punishable ofcourse, but not with a kill move). But, if you could give more specifics about how to deal better with the situations I was in, I would love it. I have alot of trouble in that matchup trying to figure out wtf to do.

 

[B.A.M.]

just bait it Tesh; its really not that hard to do. I just attack when he makes the sound, because by then the armor is usually off. multiple hitting moves like fair or utilt which i usually do after uair chasing the opponent in the air, seem to have an effect. I did that on Rich when we played and it owned him for the most part. Especially if the oli loves to whistle like rich, i just bait it and own him for it. like throwing out uairs to a dsmash when he lands.

Attack oli at a 45 degree angle ( its his blind spot) and chill at outside of his grab range then punish him if he throws out something due to your closeness or utilize quick approaches head on. It is definitely punishable by a kill move, u just need to know ur frame data so u know when u can throw out an attack to hit the lag. Land camping Olimar is really simple from my opinion, its getting the initiator thats hard at times. Just use the blind spot and baits to force a reaction, stay where he cant really throw anything without it getting punished by a run in grab dash attack or spin dash. Its pretty effective for me.

EDIT: LOL I just watched the first video. Ill help you with the situations you were in; Oli has a good grab with range. Iono why u dont up b out of situations when you are continually getting followed up. springing out of situations you dont understand is among one of the greatest tactics in this game. Its a get outta jail free card that few characters have with such benefits.

And dash attack is a great initiator; except when you think you have oli's grab range and grab 5ft away from oli after sitting in shield for a decade not doing a thing. I know u are a better player than this man ( at least I hope). Just look at your matches; seriously just watch ur own vid. Theres such absurd decision making by you. Rich didnt even do anything ****; u beat urself.

 

[Tesh]

It feels like most of his moves are over before I can anything about it though. Like his grabs and smashes. So much range, and I can never get in without predicting what will happen next.

 

[B.A.M.]

Tesh seriously watch ur vids my dude. Ur going like oli is the speed of light like sonic. DI away and if hes still close up b. There were soooooooooo many times you would just di into him and AD. U AD like 6 times in a row one time. Thats just fail. Not even Meta can just follow you up like that all day legitimately, as u allowed him to. U would seriously run up to him and shield. thats stupid. Ur playing a character thats know for his grab and grab range. You got to think, ' hey my opponent is a character who likes to throw out crap and pivot grab. If im close i should be able to punish him on reaction when he throws pikmen. oh he could grab me to though because its very good. Maybe i should stay OUTSIDE his grab range but close enough to punish his pikmen throw.' TADA uve just become one step closer to getting better at the oli matchup.

Now U have a character that can bait like crazy. Right? So if he stands there, then you gotta throw those out, get him to flinch or react. Heck do the M2K if u want.

 

[Tesh]

Well...I'll try. Don't you have tips that don't require good spacing or zoning or tech skill? I need some of those.

 

[Death Arcana]

Lol
That's like saying just play better

 

[Espy Rose]

Updated the first post. Also, in case you haven't seen them, I added in my games from earlier in March vs. Poltergust and Megafox. They're in the archives.

If some of your videos that you submitted aren't in the archive, it's only because they were in the wrong format.

Keep them videos comin'.

 

[B.A.M.]

Pro tip for Tesh:


Dont play a pro.





Your welcome.

 

[Tesh]

Yo I tried that, but no one ever lets me make the bracket. I should host my own tournaments.....

rong yore bro

 

[da K.I.D.]

Pro-er tip for tesh

Dont play, ever.



Problems solved for everyone. You can all thank me later.

 

[Tesh]

I think KID is secretly in love with me.

 

[B.A.M.]

i dont really care if its the wrong yore. Unless Im chillin in class and its needed then Ill provide the appropriate wording; this is a damn forum.


Tesh you are too goofy man.

EDIT: Its it fun having a legit setup to jab lock MK? yes it is. Hurray for Nair; the Sonic aerial noone gave a chance.

 

[Tesh]

Its more fun having a legit jab lock setup on everyone that leads into a dtillt froll(love dat word) dtilt 0-death.....

papercuts

 

[B.A.M.]

lol hardly a legit jab setup for MK, and it doesnt hit every1 ( if ur talking about edge slips). Oh and let me know when you can buffer that froll turn around dtilt while accounting for changes in DI Mr. I have no tech skill.

Needles.

 

[MeekSpeedy]

Ally vs Meekspeedy

I would appreciate some constructive criticism, I know I did good, but I'd like to do better. :o

Game 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7MEenKLTxqc
Game 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWCSInMDJ-o

 

[Browny]

3:20 first match was awesome lol, and the HA afterwards :o

 

[Tesh]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlQSfXV-7A8 - Tesh (Sonic) vs Esca (Pit) 1+2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqGKprX181Y - Tesh(Sonic) vs Esca (Pit) 3

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_2hoYarccM - Tesh (Sonic) vs Yosh (Yoshi)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sn_Fk5W6REU -Tesh(Sonic) vs KRDsonic(Wolf) 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1A_-WFABGc - Tesh(Sonic) vs KRDsonic(Wolf) 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vyT8v-WQ4g -Tesh(Sonic) vs KRDsonic(Wolf) 3

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oxbK71h_Ss4 Tesh(Sonic) +Bio(ZSS) vs Ozz(MK) + Panty(GnW)
Won game 2, but could not save it
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xMTHDSGLfqw Tesh(Sonic) +Bio(ZSS) vs Ozz(Marth) + Panty(GnW)

 

[BioDG]

I'm so sad game 2 wasn't saved. It was SOOOOO good. =(

 

[Tesh]

yea, cuz we won.

Next time, you fight Ozz while I camp while you fight Panty. Pretty solid plan methinks.

 

[FRiSKruns]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3wD2u69F2Zk - Zero (Sonic) vs Kyro (Ness) 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7Gb32w9b6o - Zero (Sonic) vs Kyro (Ness) 2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTjv9eShFCY - Zero (Sonic) vs Kyro (ROB)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jeHHkLSjmDI - Zero (Sonic) vs Kyro (Wario)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PcBPh2okddg - Zero (Sonic) vs Jrugs (Snake) 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gq40s0tmADQ - Zero (Sonic) vs Jrugs (Snake) 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azdrPlvUedw - Zero (Sonic) vs Jrugs (Snake) 3

 

[wonf]

new vid,sexy friendlie, dk is very strong..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BueHjNuEgt4

comment and critique

 

[B.A.M.]

Meek; good job we play similar so im definitely lovin the sonic swag. remember we can walk grab a MK if he hits us with the first hit of dsmash on our shield. Also know that we can shield drop ftilt is completely guaranteed as well. Now if they double dsmash that gives us options like ASC ( which u did sometimes good stuff) and fsmash. The latter is good when ur both at high percents. Our uair also outranges dair so id say apply more pressure with that. There we alot of times where u were DDPing around too much and giving up some spacial advantages. If you are near MK u can punish dair on reaction, or get under and use our good hitbox of utilt to punish low dairs.

Ur spindashing was good, id just say learn some more follow up mid to late percents. Things like ftilt or jabs give us some good setups dash attacks to when u are land camping someone. Oh and we do have frame traps out of uair so once they realize they have to DI way becuz our uair will outrange everything else, then u get some more followups going. Id like to see more aimed fsmashes as Ally was Nadoing really low. You start punishing those with fsmashes and theyll usually nado higher in which case u can just shield or duck under and then dsmash the landing. Also if they nado ur shield some like to move away a little after they realize it wont poke. Drop shield fsmash will punish the lag in that scenario.

hahah u did something ive been workin on a bit, when people di our fair or they just fall out easily (like meta) we can footstool dair them which is very hard for them to avoid and not that hard to land imo. we also have first hit uair>utilt. I use that one a ton. Im not sure if u did this on purpose but u did a true pivot i believe to jab. If u have that kinda down i would suggest using it with cross up with a combination of SD pivot grabs. It works out really nice from my exp.

I would definitely like to see better edgeguarding vs MK. holding the shield at the edge is so good for us because we can punish a majority of his option from a shield drop. If ur reaction speed is good then u dont have to do that at all. just watch what he does and punish the recovery. Cape? edgehog. Drill? fair. Nado? FH then ff fair or if they are being foolish and going low; fsmash. Always remember with nado u dont have to move forward when u ff the fair. Why? Because they HAVE to come forward or else theyll die. also for nado you can simply walk ( our top walk speed is good enough to combat nado's avg speed) while keeping nado close and punish the low landing with a grab ( throw them back off) or high landing with dsmash or aerial. We honestly have alot going for us here.
If you can learn to edgeguard MK ull put urself in an awesome position to rack damage (of course).

If he happens to get the ledge space urself about his roll distance (maybe a little closer). fsmash can kill many of his ledge options including up B start of nado and aerials. and its at a distance where we are close enough that if we see a roll we can turn around and grab. Obviously not fullproof but its a very solid position for us.

good stuff Meek!

 

[MeekSpeedy]

Meek; good job we play similar so im definitely lovin the sonic swag. remember we can walk grab a MK if he hits us with the first hit of dsmash on our shield. Also know that we can shield drop ftilt is completely guaranteed as well. Now if they double dsmash that gives us options like ASC ( which u did sometimes good stuff) and fsmash. The latter is good when ur both at high percents. Our uair also outranges dair so id say apply more pressure with that. There we alot of times where u were DDPing around too much and giving up some spacial advantages. If you are near MK u can punish dair on reaction, or get under and use our good hitbox of utilt to punish low dairs.

Ur spindashing was good, id just say learn some more follow up mid to late percents. Things like ftilt or jabs give us some good setups dash attacks to when u are land camping someone. Oh and we do have frame traps out of uair so once they realize they have to DI way becuz our uair will outrange everything else, then u get some more followups going. Id like to see more aimed fsmashes as Ally was Nadoing really low. You start punishing those with fsmashes and theyll usually nado higher in which case u can just shield or duck under and then dsmash the landing. Also if they nado ur shield some like to move away a little after they realize it wont poke. Drop shield fsmash will punish the lag in that scenario.

hahah u did something ive been workin on a bit, when people di our fair or they just fall out easily (like meta) we can footstool dair them which is very hard for them to avoid and not that hard to land imo. we also have first hit uair>utilt. I use that one a ton. Im not sure if u did this on purpose but u did a true pivot i believe to jab. If u have that kinda down i would suggest using it with cross up with a combination of SD pivot grabs. It works out really nice from my exp.

I would definitely like to see better edgeguarding vs MK. holding the shield at the edge is so good for us because we can punish a majority of his option from a shield drop. If ur reaction speed is good then u dont have to do that at all. just watch what he does and punish the recovery. Cape? edgehog. Drill? fair. Nado? FH then ff fair or if they are being foolish and going low; fsmash. Always remember with nado u dont have to move forward when u ff the fair. Why? Because they HAVE to come forward or else theyll die. also for nado you can simply walk ( our top walk speed is good enough to combat nado's avg speed) while keeping nado close and punish the low landing with a grab ( throw them back off) or high landing with dsmash or aerial. We honestly have alot going for us here.
If you can learn to edgeguard MK ull put urself in an awesome position to rack damage (of course).

If he happens to get the ledge space urself about his roll distance (maybe a little closer). fsmash can kill many of his ledge options including up B start of nado and aerials. and its at a distance where we are close enough that if we see a roll we can turn around and grab. Obviously not fullproof but its a very solid position for us.

good stuff Meek!

Thank you for the advice. :o I'll be sure to focus more on out of shield options, and utilize and abuse the opportunities given to me.

 

[FRiSKruns]

anyone who wants to give me some advice is more than welcome! *hint hint*

 

[Tesh]

chaingrab, edgeguard, jab lock, dont charge it so much, should have punished that, why spring when u can ff a bair, don't use fair like that, you can shield drop then punish with dash attack.

 

[FRiSKruns]

why spring when u can ff a bair

because it's much safer, along with guarantee'ing you not getting stage spiked it allows you to dair back onto the stage and have time ledge trap, not to mention Ness' fair outranges our bair, and after playing lots of friendlies with Kyro I realized he was really good at beating my ffbair with his fair. Oh and chaingrabs on Ness were illegal at the time. dash attack for a punish against Ness results in being bair'd :3 Regardless of that, I will heed the advice next time I play a good Ness, which will probably be Neveruary 31st.

 

[RiverDB]

Hello Sonicboards, i've recently started to alt Sonic and i was hoping to get some critiques here. I got a set with a Snake from a smashfest last weekend.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0v2C4mnj_o&feature=feedu RiVer(Sonic) vs Lavlis(Snake) 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AZ1secGGxsM&feature=feedu RiVer(Sonic) vs Lavlis(Snake) 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3-dTo_doZQw&feature=related RiVer(Sonic) vs Lavlis(Snake) 3

Any critiques are welcome.

 

[FRiSKruns]

Hello Sonicboards, i've recently started to alt Sonic and i was hoping to get some critiques here. I got a set with a Snake from a smashfest last weekend.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0v2C4mnj_o&feature=feedu RiVer(Sonic) vs Lavlis(Snake) 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AZ1secGGxsM&feature=feedu RiVer(Sonic) vs Lavlis(Snake) 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3-dTo_doZQw&feature=related RiVer(Sonic) vs Lavlis(Snake) 3

Any critiques are welcome.

learning Sonic while only Alting him will only give you a mediocre Sonic at best.

 

[RiverDB]

Well, i'm not sure yet if i'm going to main/second/alt him. I'mma use him for some time and see what'll happen.

 

[Life]

RiverDB: Only got to watch like a minute (from G3), but don't HA so much when recovering. That just puts you in position to be cyphergrabbed by anyone who knows to spot/air dodge it.

 

[Kinzer]

You Don't seem to have much of an idea of how to control Sonic, and you take so many unnecessary risks. I'm going to assume you haven't used him for long and you just haven't gotten used to it, but if that isn't the case then go ahead and ask around for specifics. Unless you can handle Sonic and not be so greedy you won't be winning against a person how has more awareness.

While you're at it, for God's sake, stop using homing so much.

 

[Tesh]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z8arYVC0KDc Tesh (Sonic) vs Illmatic (Peach) 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cqetdkJoEv8 Tesh (Sonic) vs Illmatic (Peach) 2

Illmatic again. Did not take a game this time. Looking at it now, it should have been super obvious that he was holding a stitchface turnip. I managed to get hit by it twice and it set the pace for a pretty bad match.

 

[WedginatorX]

learning Sonic while only Alting him will only give you a mediocre Sonic at best.

Pretty true. No one has a good secondary sonic. Besides maybe atomsk? I only saw his sonic like twice and it seemed alright to me. Of course once was on yoshi's island lol.

 

[Espy Rose]

Against an ignorant player, might I add.