Important The Ridley for SSB4 Thread - End of an Era

[AbioFlesh]

I'm not. I really do think the chances of Ridley being playable are astronomically low to the point where you can only merely discuss whether it's technically possible or not.

Then why are you ignoring my question? WHY. DO. YOU. EVEN. BOTHER?

NOBODY but the development team knows what's going on. Not you, not me, nobody! No harm in speculating for us consumers.

 

[SchAlternate]

Yeah but those also weren't playable stages.

So? It's still the same principle. They are bosses. They appear to attack the players and have a certain amount of health, just like the SSE bosses; the only difference is that they are now glorified stage hazards.

 

[TitanTeaTime]

Ok, not even a cat gif can save this thread right now. I'm just gonna abandon this thread until like, tomorrow or something.

 

[Deleted member 245254]

Then why are you ignoring my question? WHY. DO. YOU. EVEN. BOTHER?

NOBODY but the development team knows what's going on. Not you, not me, nobody! No harm in speculating for us consumers.

I never said there was harm in speculating?

Seriously, some of you have defensive issues. Simply stating an opinion that's opposite to yours does not mean I'm trying to stifle your discussion or infer that harm will come of hoping he'll be in.

 

[aldelaro5]

Ok, not even a cat gif can save this thread right now. I'm just gonna abandon this thread until like, tomorrow or something.

Well I decided to wait until last Sunday to tell my full opinion on ridley because of how much controversy there was for not very good reason. That's a full month.

So, do what you want it may turn out better.

 

[Bravetriforcer]

I'm hoping you eventually realize that doing nothing but debunking detractors' arguments doesn't make Ridley's chances better.

What are the arguments that he will be in?

Debunked reasons for him not being playable inherently makes them arguments he will be in. Especially when you debunk things Sakurai himself has said that are being presented as reasons he won't be playable.

 

[ultimatekoopa]

It's completely unreasonable to suggest that maybe he just wants to create excitement for Ridley being a boss at the at the same level of presence as the yellow devil?

Honestly that'd be pretty cool if while fighting each other you are dealing with the constant attacks of Ridley. Maybe that's what he intended to tease? I mean it's more rooted in fact that's what he meant to tease than it is to assume something entirely presumptuous...

Because A) The Yellow devil wasn't well received, he was considered annoying or they didn't care about him at all and B) Ridley is basically a purple pinata, he is slow, small in a big stage, considering that YD can be taken out in 6 seconds then that wouldn't make ridley exciting

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

Ooh, someone's here!

I'll repost my information as to why I believe Ridley's playable too.

Here's a list of things we derived from the Direct:

• Ridley appears to shift modes several times during the Direct, resulting in some choppy motion, as seen here: http://gfycat.com/SentimentalBronzeIndianrhinoceros .This is in direct contradiction with the smoothly-animated movements and attacks of his boss battle.
• Ridley's size, based on Pikachu's shadow, seen here, would be this range of sizes.

• Here's a series of comparisons of Ridley's largest size with some other characters.

• And how big is this tiny-sized Ridley on the Pyrosphere?

• But let's assume that Sakurai DOES always say things that we should take at face value, like that Phosphora is just a trophy after all.

Okay, maybe Phosphora is an Assist TROPHY. Much like how Ridley is a Boss CHARACTER.

• Finally, we know next to nothing about Pyrosphere itself. What's so special about it that it cannot be demo'd while three brand new stages can be playtested immediately like several weeks after unveiling? Pyrosphere has been shown for MONTHS with nothing to show for it.

 

[darksamus77]

I'm not. I really do think the chances of Ridley being playable are astronomically low to the point where you can only merely discuss whether it's technically possible or not.

And that's your opinion, which is fine. This is Ridley's support thread, and if you wanna shoot us down for trying to discern what Sakurai really did with Ridley in this one, that's fine. Just don't expect to walk in here and act like we're a bunch of fools without getting some pushback. I actually think at this point, most people are skeptical about his chances of playability. However, Sakurai has been quite ambiguous about the whole thing and we have a right to have reasonable doubt that Ridley is strictly a boss hazard because he wasn't outright shown.

 

[FreeFallUp]

Are you saying that I should create a "Ridley anti-support" thread to voice my opinion? It seems you're trying to imply that debate on the subject is off-topic but you're wrong.

At this point, you've made your opinion very apparent. You can debunk whatever evidence you want, it won't change the fact that this argument will continue until the truth comes out. In other words, there's no real reason for you to continue to do so. Once you leave, another just as vocal about the same or similar opinion will replace you at some point along the line. Good day Sir/Madame!

 

[AbioFlesh]

I never said there was harm in speculating?

Seriously, some of you have defensive issues. Simply stating an opinion that's opposite to yours does not mean I'm trying to stifle your discussion or infer that harm will come of hoping he'll be in.

You still didn't answer the question.

Speaking of which why would you post an opinion like (see down below) if you didn't want to start something? You know it will rile people up and it already has. Like I said, I see this as a thread to share info and to communicate and I hate it when it turns into an argument with a non-supporter.

also:

If he his, color me surprised but I just see a big thread of denial at this point.

 

[Deleted member 245254]

Well, whether I wanted to "start something" is a different matter altogether.

I don't think Ridley will be playable. You do. I think it's kind of silly to think he will be.

Bam. We have a discussion. Where's the harm in discussion?

 

[FreeFallUp]

Well, whether I wanted to "start something" is a different matter altogether.

I don't think Ridley will be playable. You do. I think it's kind of silly to think he will be.

Bam. We have a discussion. Where's the harm in discussion?

Maybe it has to do with how you act as though Ridley supporters are complete idiots and that they are "delusional." You've already stated that you view this thread as being full of delusion.

 

[Khoru]

The thing, I don't really think it's 50/50. In fact, a huge part of the "evidence" you guys put stock in, is assuming that Sakurai is purposefully being misleading over the boss hazard tease in the direct, and there's literally nothing to suggest that he's being misleading in the sense that he'll be playable.

and sakurai wasn't misleading for the rest of the direct
he didn't give apparent disconfirmations for ZSS or palutena or specifically remove aspects from greninja's silhouette to make people draw conclusions

edit: oh god what are timestamps

 

[AbioFlesh]

Well, whether I wanted to "start something" is a different matter altogether.

I don't think Ridley will be playable. You do. I think it's kind of silly to think he will be.

Bam. We have a discussion. Where's the harm in discussion?

This is stuff that annoys me. I don't want this to become another gamefaqs discussion. It has been done to death. You know we won't change each other's opinion. Now answer my question: Why bother?

Here's how this should work: When something that can give us potential info on Ridley's fate pops up, someone shares it and we speculate upon it. Understand?

 

[aldelaro5]

Well, whether I wanted to "start something" is a different matter altogether.

I don't think Ridley will be playable. You do. I think it's kind of silly to think he will be.

Bam. We have a discussion. Where's the harm in discussion?

Then just still continue to think he won't be?

Seriously it's simple. I just don't know why you're here if you got enough information to support your opinion. I know debates can be enjoyable but if there's no purpose, then no they are not. If you think he's playable and are fine with it, good. You can go and be proud of thinking so but if you want to keep it this way, why are you there?

 

[Deleted member 245254]

Maybe it has to do with how you act as though Ridley supporters are complete idiots and that they are "delusional." You've already stated that you view this thread as being full of delusion.

I don't recall calling anyone an idiot, or using any language of the sort for that matter.

I already stated why I accused many in this thread of sounding like they're in denial; they argue against detractors like its only logical to believe he will be playable based on has been given to us, and that makes it easy to feel like a reality check is needed occasionally for Ridley supporters.

The chances are not good. I think accepting this is important.

I just think a little more humility on both sides would do the discussion well, overall.

 

[majora_787]

I don't recall calling anyone an idiot, or using any language of the sort for that matter.

I already stated why I accused many in this thread of sounding like they're in denial; they argue against detractors like its only logical to believe he will be playable based on has been given to us, and that makes it easy to feel like a reality check is needed occasionally for Ridley supporters.

The chances are not good. I think accepting this is important.

I just think a little more humility on both sides would do the discussion well, overall.

Looking at the evidence we have is exactly what has made people feel he IS likely. And you're really not doing a good job of displaying any humility coming in here to call other people looking at what we have past face value and minimal observation as "foolish" or "delusional".

Unless of course you want to conveniently change how humility works, in which case you will do it anyway and we really can't stop you from doing so until after you've shown yourself out to do something more productive with your time than this.

 

[ultimatekoopa]

I don't recall calling anyone an idiot, or using any language of the sort for that matter.

I already stated why I accused many in this thread of sounding like they're in denial; they argue against detractors like its only logical to believe he will be playable based on has been given to us, and that makes it easy to feel like a reality check is needed occasionally for Ridley supporters.

The chances are not good. I think accepting this is important.

I just think a little more humility on both sides would do the discussion well, overall.

We just say that ridley is not confirmed to be a boss

 

[Drclaw411]

I really hope that if any of the Hype Three aren't included...there is at least a reason given. I'm gonna have the urge to know why.

 

[Megadoomer]

I don't think we'd get a reason if they aren't included. We never got a reason for Mewtwo being cut from Brawl, after all.

 

[WayfaringElf]

Can someone exmplain to me how his chances are not good?

 

[majora_787]

I don't think we'd get a reason if they aren't included. We never got a reason for Mewtwo being cut from Brawl, after all.

Though when he was unfinished in Brawl we were able to extrapolate that it was time constraints. I seriously doubt time constraints would be the issue here.

EDIT: @ WayfaringElf

Don't you remember that time Sakurai explicitly showed Ridley that one time and said "This is Ridley, he is a boss on Pyrosphere just like Yellow Devil is a boss on Wily's Castle"?

...You don't remember that? Huh. Uncanny.

 

[AbioFlesh]

I don't think we'd get a reason if they aren't included. We never got a reason for Mewtwo being cut from Brawl, after all.

I think it was because Mewtwo wasn't relevant at the time. I have no clue.

 

[Deleted member 245254]

Looking at the evidence we have is exactly what has made people feel he IS likely. And you're really not doing a good job of displaying any humility coming in here to call other people looking at what we have past face value and minimal observation as "foolish" or "delusional".

Unless of course you want to conveniently change how humility works, in which case you will do it anyway and we really can't stop you from doing so until after you've shown yourself out to do something more productive with your time than this.

Right, so if I don't show myself out and would prefer to continue maintaining why I think Ridley will not be playable and why I think certain justifications for his inclusion are flawed, are you just going to continue whinging about it?

...or maybe you'll just man up and actually commit to a credible point aside from "Ridley is in cuz this is the Ridley thread"?

 

[OblivionWolf]

I'm gonna use some pictures you guys been posting to maybe help with the shadow size thing.

Look above at Ridley's shadow hand in the center heptagon then look below at Kirby's shadow in the same center heptagon very close to the same spot. Kirby's shadow is clearly longer then Ridley's hand.

Donkey Kongs hands are comparable to Ridley's.

Other M Ridley is known for having big hands so Ridley is clearly smaller.

Here are 2 random pics that could help picture how small Ridley is too. Remember Kirby is bigger/longer then Ridley's hand.

 

[WayfaringElf]

Though when he was unfinished in Brawl we were able to extrapolate that it was time constraints. I seriously doubt time constraints would be the issue here.

EDIT: @ WayfaringElf

Don't you remember that time Sakurai explicitly showed Ridley that one time and said "This is Ridley, he is a boss on Pyrosphere just like Yellow Devil is a boss on Wily's Castle"?

...You don't remember that? Huh. Uncanny.

I remember the whole shadow deal, but Sakurai only showed his shadow, he dind't say nothing bout Ridley.
EDIT: Oohhh, I'm slow.

 

[majora_787]

Right, so if I don't show myself out and would prefer to continue maintaining why I think Ridley will not be playable and why I think certain justifications for his inclusion are flawed, are you just going to continue whinging about it?

...or maybe you'll just man up and actually commit to a credible point aside from "Ridley is in cuz this is the Ridley thread"?

If you don't show yourself out, you will be that one person walking into a character support thread accusing the supporters of being foolish and delusional for not agreeing with you, a non-supporter in a support thread. You won't really have anything to do other than say things people will *very clearly* not agree with or care about, and make a complete ass of yourself.

And really, "man up and commit to a credible point"? People have provided credible evidence. You don't want to acknowledge it, because you have shafted yourself to your train of thought hard enough you have decided to be "man enough" to walk into a support thread and go "You're all foolish and delusional for not agreeing with me and liking characters I don't like". Just because you do not want to *SEE* the evidence that is there does not mean it doesn't exist and is suddenly not valid.

But hey, you're dead set on coming in here, being disagreeable, and when people wonder why you're passive-aggressively in the Ridley support thread insulting people for supporting Ridley, you will continue to be "WOAH man, it's just my OPINION!" Even though hopefully, you understand on at least a basic level that what you're doing is fishing for "a problem".

Note, this really isn't trying to convince you of anything. This is making even someone like you aware, we can see REALLY clearly what you're doing, don't want to listen to you be this way here, and if you are going to spew aggressive ignorant crap here then I dunno what to tell you. People will ignore you, and watch in a sort of morbid curiosity and shake their heads while you talk to yourself.

That's basically that's going to happen. That's not really even a debate point, before you try to make it into one. It's what you walked in here to accomplish, and very clearly succeeded at: Making yourself impossible to take seriously and worthwhile to just ignore entirely.

 

[AbioFlesh]

Right, so if I don't show myself out and would prefer to continue maintaining why I think Ridley will not be playable and why I think certain justifications for his inclusion are flawed, are you just going to continue whinging about it?

...or maybe you'll just man up and actually commit to a credible point aside from "Ridley is in cuz this is the Ridley thread"?

Ahem

This is stuff that annoys me. I don't want this to become another gamefaqs discussion. It has been done to death. You know we won't change each other's opinion. Now answer my question: Why bother?

Here's how this should work: When something that can give us potential info on Ridley's fate pops up, someone shares it and we speculate upon it. Understand?

Meaning not an argument whether we think he's playable or not... Like every other Ridley related thread out there.

Edit: Or like any other argument out there that goes on because somebody wants the opposition to agree with them or give up.

 

[majora_787]

Seriously though guys. This is literally going to be the same thing as always. We may as well just all put them on ignore. We don't have to listen to them troll here for responses, we don't have to keep doing the cycle shenanigans we end up having to do, and if they keep insisting on hanging around here and talking to themselves as if we care at this point, then it adds to our page count.

So really it's win/win. By which I mean, we win twice.

 

[Megadoomer]

Aside from the fact that Metroid's pretty poorly represented in the SSB roster, only having a single person representing the series despite the fact that it's tripled in size since the N64 days, I feel like Ridley's playable because, based on what we've seen, it's either that or he's a slow-moving boss that is roughly the size of a larger playable character like Bowser or Rosalina.

I feel like Sakurai would have to be intentionally oblivious to not be aware of the character's fanbase. Not including him in Melee was understandable, since Super Metroid was still the latest game at the time, and his absence from Brawl was at least made up for by giving him two boss battles.

However, if he's not playable in this game, and instead, he's a glorified stage hazard, there isn't any particular justification for it, or anything that makes up for it. Sakurai would basically be giving Metroid the shaft despite knowing that there are a fairly significant amount of people who have wanted to see Ridley playable in Smash Bros. since Melee, in addition to the people who wanted to see Dark Samus playable (or the hunters from the various Prime games, but with the exception of Sylux, they were one-offs, so they've never seemed particularly likely).

Admittedly, I don't feel particularly sure about his chances; I know that Metroid isn't exactly popular in Japan. However, with the information that we've been given to go off of, I feel that it's more likely for him to be a playable character with Sakurai trolling about the boss thing (which isn't exactly unusual; he trolled the viewers multiple times in that Direct alone) than it is for him to be the smallest boss that we've seen who doesn't seem to do much once he shows up.

 

[Luigi#1]

Right, so if I don't show myself out and would prefer to continue maintaining why I think Ridley will not be playable and why I think certain justifications for his inclusion are flawed, are you just going to continue whinging about it?

...or maybe you'll just man up and actually commit to a credible point aside from "Ridley is in cuz this is the Ridley thread"?

Many have came up with evidence for him on this thread. Please show your evidence against him.
Also I really dislike your hatred for Zero because your reasoning is bad there to but that I will save for another time.

 

[Deleted member 245254]

Honestly, I don't think it's impossible for Ridley as a character, to be a playable character, so size comparisons and what not are irrelevant to me, though interesting

The reason I believe he isn't playable is because I think fan desire has driven this thread more than Sakurai created any lead.

If you don't show yourself out, you will be that one person walking into a character support thread accusing the supporters of being foolish and delusional for not agreeing with you, a non-supporter in a support thread. You won't really have anything to do other than say things people will *very clearly* not agree with or care about, and make a complete *** of yourself.

And really, "man up and commit to a credible point"? People have provided credible evidence. You don't want to acknowledge it, because you have shafted yourself to your train of thought hard enough you have decided to be "man enough" to walk into a support thread and go "You're all foolish and delusional for not agreeing with me and liking characters I don't like". Just because you do not want to *SEE* the evidence that is there does not mean it doesn't exist and is suddenly not valid.

But hey, you're dead set on coming in here, being disagreeable, and when people wonder why you're passive-aggressively in the Ridley support thread insulting people for supporting Ridley, you will continue to be "WOAH man, it's just my OPINION!" Even though hopefully, you understand on at least a basic level that what you're doing is fishing for "a problem".

Note, this really isn't trying to convince you of anything. This is making even someone like you aware, we can see REALLY clearly what you're doing, don't want to listen to you be this way here, and if you are going to spew aggressive ignorant crap here then I dunno what to tell you. People will ignore you, and watch in a sort of morbid curiosity and shake their heads while you talk to yourself.

That's basically that's going to happen. That's not really even a debate point, before you try to make it into one. It's what you walked in here to accomplish, and very clearly succeeded at: Making yourself impossible to take seriously and worthwhile to just ignore entirely.

The only arguments I see are for discrediting reasons for why he couldn't be playable.

I see a non-existent amount of arguments pointing to clear evidence of the likelihood of his inclusion.

 

[AbioFlesh]

Admittedly, I don't feel particularly sure about his chances; I know that Metroid isn't exactly popular in Japan. However, with the information that we've been given to go off of, I feel that it's more likely for him to be a playable character with Sakurai trolling about the boss thing (which isn't exactly unusual; he trolled the viewers multiple times in that Direct alone) than it is for him to be the smallest boss that we've seen who doesn't seem to do much once he shows up.

About popularity, I'm pretty sure they listening to non-Japanese fans this time around considering the fact that Little Mac got in.

Honestly, I don't think it's impossible for Ridley as a character, to be a playable character, so size comparisons and what not are irrelevant to me, though interesting

The reason I believe he isn't playable is because I think fan desire has driven this thread more than Sakurai created any lead.



The only arguments I see are for discrediting reasons for why he couldn't be playable.

I see a non-existent amount of arguments pointing to clear evidence of the likelihood of his inclusion.

I gave you an argument that you ignored having to do with the game's influence outside of Japan.

And... you don't believe he's in because of fan expectation? Give us a reason that has to do with Sakurai's lead and not fan desire.

 

[FreeFallUp]

I don't recall calling anyone an idiot, or using any language of the sort for that matter.

I already stated why I accused many in this thread of sounding like they're in denial; they argue against detractors like its only logical to believe he will be playable based on has been given to us, and that makes it easy to feel like a reality check is needed occasionally for Ridley supporters.

The chances are not good. I think accepting this is important.

I just think a little more humility on both sides would do the discussion well, overall.

You're putting words in my mouth. I never once claimed that you called anyone an idiot. I merely stated you act like everyone else here that is a supporter is an idiot.

You also seem to be lacking in the humility department.

You obviously haven't seen my actual opinion on Rid's chances. I haven't even implied it since you've been in this thread.

Professionally, I'm neutral at best. I'm aware of all the factors involved, but I'm not ruling him out, unlike what your posts seem to imply you're doing.

You guys are in-circle jerking and knocking down arguments yet it still is not likely he will be a playable character.

If he his, color me surprised but I just see a big thread of denial at this point.

Emphasis mine.

While I did use the word "delusion" in reference to a past post of yours, I was wrong obviously, that's my bad, but your true wording means the same thing.

Essentially, calling this a "big thread of denial" equates to calling all of the supporters here delusional.

It doesn't help that you are dodging very specific questions, namely, "Why bother to continue in this thread since you've made your point clear and have no intention of saying anything other than reiterating that exact same prospect in as many colorful manners as possible?"

But, these shenanigans have gone on long enough. OK everyone,at this point, given how adamant this individual is, we should just try ignore this person's ramblings unless they prove to hold any logical value and try to move this thread into a more cohesive, less chaotic direction until Sakurai makes his next move.

Edit: Ninja'd a bit by the following:

Seriously though guys. This is literally going to be the same thing as always. We may as well just all put them on ignore. We don't have to listen to them troll here for responses, we don't have to keep doing the cycle shenanigans we end up having to do, and if they keep insisting on hanging around here and talking to themselves as if we care at this point, then it adds to our page count.

So really it's win/win. By which I mean, we win twice.

 

[Deleted member 245254]

I gave you an argument that you ignored having to do with the game's influence outside of Japan.

Okay...but at the same time it's not as though Metroid or Punch Out flounders in Japan. Do you have any statistics pointing at Little Mac or Ridley being completely unwarranted or unwanted from the Japanese perspective?

 

[UltimateWario]

Boy, these arguments are just enriching, aren't they?

"X!"

"NOT X!"

Ah, good stuff. Doesn't anyone ever stand back and say "Wow, this is pointless."? They're opinions. You either think Ridley is in or you don't. "Hints" are mostly subjective -- what one person considers a hint toward a character, others may consider the opposite.

It is not delusional or silly to think Ridley is a playable character. It isn't delusional or silly to think he's not. It's when you start calling the other side delusional or silly that you become the problem.

 

[majora_787]

Boy, these arguments are just enriching, aren't they?

"X!"

"NOT X!"

Ah, good stuff. Doesn't anyone ever stand back and say "Wow, this is pointless."?

I tried to, but I'm not going to sit here and repeat myself.

Over in the Medusa thread, someone had mentioned something about Medusa being a reskin of an assist trophy, and that made me laugh. Is this the part where Andrea draws Roidley trying to be a Nintendog?

 

[FreeFallUp]

Boy, these arguments are just enriching, aren't they?

"X!"

"NOT X!"

Ah, good stuff. Doesn't anyone ever stand back and say "Wow, this is pointless."?

Don't forget that it may or may not incite the feeling of a need for popcorn in the inner sadists in all of us.

 

[Luigi#1]

Honestly, I don't think it's impossible for Ridley as a character, to be a playable character, so size comparisons and what not are irrelevant to me, though interesting

The reason I believe he isn't playable is because I think fan desire has driven this thread more than Sakurai created any lead.



The only arguments I see are for discrediting reasons for why he couldn't be playable.

I see a non-existent amount of arguments pointing to clear evidence of the likelihood of his inclusion.

Your right, Ridley boss is probably Bowser sized slow for a boss [especially for Ridley] on a large stage that stays in the air doing nothing for a couple seconds at a time.