Important The Ridley for SSB4 Thread - End of an Era

[majora_787]

I dunno, I don't find his wings horribly important here since it's kind of hard to tell what is going on there. But what we can see based off the shadows for sure is Ridley moving/stopping, moving slowly, and stopping to pick up Pikachu.

 

[Dark Phazon]

I don't see him "taking off" anywhere.

He's flying, yes, but he doesn't have to be constantly flapping to fly. You can see he is flapping his wings just before and while he is above the stage. He's coming in off from the side.

I honestly don't see what you guys are seeing.

Hmmm it does look like he could have just glided in or began a jump to the middle of the screen and the hover you can see that when he first jumps in his shadow is faint because he is at the highest but he then he drops ever so little to stop and hover in the middle when he drops he is closer to the ground thats why his shadow is more clear and darker also why you see his tail come into view.

Look at this pic a few times based on what i said is happening.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

I'm working on it, but there's been over 70 pages since I last logged on so it'll be a while before I catch up. I'll probably have to skim a bit, as much as I'd hate to miss some art lessons.

And Feliciafan444 made a video on this its worth viewing

 

[SchAlternate]

So I've just watched Shokio's Smash Direct review.

You won't believe how stupid I felt when he revealed he was actually not serious about Ridley, and in fact wanted to troll us due to how overly passionate we were about the whole deal (to be honest, that's quite true).

Seriously, it was so obvious he was joking, and yet...

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

My issue is that Ridley's shadow in that particular instance is the size of half the stage. The Phantom Knight from that picture of Zelda is miniscule compared to that, and it's a pretty big character.

The Ridley in that trailer is NOT playable. If there IS another Ridley in the game (which I still don't believe) it's not that one.

 

[Dark Phazon]

My issue is that Ridley's shadow in that particular instance is the size of half the stage. The Phantom Knight from that picture of Zelda is miniscule compared to that, and it's a pretty big character.

The Ridley in that trailer is NOT playable. If there IS another Ridley in the game (which I still don't believe) it's not that one.

Super mushroom?

Would you put it past Sakurai to do that?

 

[PlasticBag]

If that's honestly his recovery, than it's cheap af.

 

[majora_787]

My issue is that Ridley's shadow in that particular instance is the size of half the stage. The Phantom Knight from that picture of Zelda is miniscule compared to that, and it's a pretty big character.

The Ridley in that trailer is NOT playable. If there IS another Ridley in the game (which I still don't believe) it's not that one.

The shadow of Ridley in the direct is not that large. I did an outline of the shadow, and wings aside, it was slightly skewed and a little bigger than Bowser in terms of "floor area". Not to mention only a few times larger than Pikachu. We don't even half the stage in the direct; we see the middle of the stage.

 

[OblivionWolf]

My issue is that Ridley's shadow in that particular instance is the size of half the stage. The Phantom Knight from that picture of Zelda is miniscule compared to that, and it's a pretty big character.

The Ridley in that trailer is NOT playable. If there IS another Ridley in the game (which I still don't believe) it's not that one.

Its his wings giving you that impression....Pretend the wings arent there for a second....He is like 2 Pikachu's tall. Thats the smallest he has ever been sense NES.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

So I've just watched Shokio's Smash Direct review.

You won't believe how stupid I felt when he revealed he was actually not serious about Ridley, and in fact wanted to troll us due to how overly passionate we were about the whole deal (to be honest, that's quite true).

Seriously, it was so obvious he was joking, and yet...

Wait minute are you saying the whole time hes has ben saying Ridleys too big or from the direct he did a whistle theme that ridley is deconfirmed

He was trolling us he wants ridley to be playable if that's true where's the video

Hmmm it does look like he could have just glided in or began a jump to the middle of the screen and the hover you can see that when he first jumps in his shadow is faint because he is at the highest but he then he drops ever so little to stop and hover in the middle when he drops he is closer to the ground thats why his shadow is more clear and darker also why you see his tail come into view.

Look at this pic a few times based on what i said is happening.

View attachment 12083

I don't see the jump can you pause frame when it happened?

All I got is when the tip of his tail appeared

And ah ha I diden't think of that what if ridley collected a super mushroom before he grabbed pikachu if he really is that big (but so far it looks like he did not grab a mushroom before pikachu judging by the pictures on game FAQ)

 

[majora_787]

Spoiler

I put this together real quick. A LOT of Ridley's shadow is his wings. And while his body is in a way where he appears a little smaller than it probably is in the air, Pikachu seems pretty big next to him. And it's worth noting, Bowser takes up about half of one of the platforms. So I mean Ridley really seems Bowser-ish in size here.

 

[MySmashmains6]

Don't you find Ridley's movement pattern weird?

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

The shadow of Ridley in the direct is not that large. I did an outline of the shadow, and wings aside, it was slightly skewed and a little bigger than Bowser in terms of "floor area". Not to mention only a few times larger than Pikachu. We don't even half the stage in the direct; we see the middle of the stage.

Its his wings giving you that impression....Pretend the wings arent there for a second....He is like 2 Pikachu's tall. Thats the smallest he has ever been sense NES.

Spoiler

Here's my take on it:

1) The circle and arrow I have is the halfway point of Pyrosphere. The silhouette of Ridley and is wings branches itself more than half of the stage. If you look up at the top, you can see his entire shadow isn't even on the stage. It's cut off by both ends of the picture. That's pretty big compared to a lot of other characters from what we've seen. Even if Ridley's body isn't that big, his wings are gigantic.

This doesn't really apply to his size, but other things.

2) The arrow pointing towards his tail is just pointing out that no matter what, the Stage hazard Ridley is Other M Ridley. There is no disputing that.

3) The third arrow in the top left is pointing towards the orange glow of the lava. Leads me to believe that is isn't the Final Destination version of the stage.

EDIT: sorry about the size of the image. It's pretty big.

 

[majora_787]

Spoiler

View attachment 12084

Here's my take on it:

1) The circle and arrow I have is the halfway point of Pyrosphere. The silhouette of Ridley and is wings branches itself more than half of the stage. If you look up at the top, you can see his entire shadow isn't even on the stage. It's cut off by both ends of the picture. That's pretty big compared to a lot of other characters from what we've seen. Even if Ridley's body isn't that big, his wings are gigantic.

This doesn't really apply to his size, but other things.

2) The arrow pointing towards his tail is just pointing out that no matter what, the Stage hazard Ridley is Other M Ridley. There is no disputing that.

3) The third arrow in the top left is pointing towards the orange glow of the lava. Leads me to believe that is isn't the Final Destination version of the stage.

EDIT: sorry about the size of the image. It's pretty big.

Ridley's shadow could be cropped off the stage simply because he is in the air, and shadows are skewed to the back right as opposed to straight down. And his wings ARE large. And the issue with 2 is obvious. You're assuming that the Ridley we saw is a stage hazard. The Ridley we saw is obviously the Other M Ridley, and THAT is indisputable. But we don't know if it is a stage hazard.

And thirdly, it's entirely possible that it isn't. That keeps us from saying "This is FD Pyrosphere, so it's definitely playable Ridley." Which basically just means "He could be playable but he could also still be a boss."

 

[SchAlternate]

He was trolling us he wants ridley to be playable if that's true where's the video

Around 10 minutes into the video.

 

[Snagrio]

Hmmm it does look like he could have just glided in or began a jump to the middle of the screen and the hover you can see that when he first jumps in his shadow is faint because he is at the highest but he then he drops ever so little to stop and hover in the middle when he drops he is closer to the ground thats why his shadow is more clear and darker also why you see his tail come into view.

Look at this pic a few times based on what i said is happening.

View attachment 12083

His shadow seems smaller then grows as he approaches the center, like if he did jump and started falling before hovering.

Maybe I am just seeing things though, who knows.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Ridley's shadow could be cropped off the stage simply because he is in the air, and shadows are skewed to the back right as opposed to straight down. And his wings ARE large. And the issue with 2 is obvious. You're assuming that the Ridley we saw is a stage hazard. The Ridley we saw is obviously the Other M Ridley, and THAT is indisputable. But we don't know if it is a stage hazard.

And thirdly, it's entirely possible that it isn't. That keeps us from saying "This is FD Pyrosphere, so it's definitely playable Ridley." Which basically just means "He could be playable but he could also still be a boss."

Of course his wings are small. But that's quite possibly...dare I say...TOO big for a playable character. At least that's how I see it. No matter what is causing the shadow, it's still Ridley. In his entirety. He's pretty big. If you can show me that Bowser, the biggest character yet, produces a shadow similar to that size, then I won't make as big a deal about the shadow.

I still maintain that he's a Boss Fight character. That's how I feel about everything presented to me, and I'm an advocate for Ridley's inclusion. I still think he's a Boss Fight.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Around 10 minutes into the video.

Wow so he was just Us About ridley being to big the whole time

His feelings are neutral of ridley being playable or not

 

[Oasis_S]

Do people really believe the footage we have is of a playable Ridley meant to fool us?

The comparatively ****ty model (evidenced by his low-poly and low-res tail tip) and animations scream "STAGE ELEMENT." You should really quit fooling yourselves. What we've seen is Ridley as a stage hazard, there is nothing we can take from that footage to indicate any other possible appearance.

 

[majora_787]

Well, I posted an image with Pikachu's shadow as well as Ridley's on Pyrosphere. Bowser's would be a little less than half of one of the stage's platforms. So smaller than Ridley's with the wings clipped off, but not very much smaller at all.

EDIT: I mean of course, this is speculation. Ridley could just be a slow, small boss on a stage that also has a lava hazard. I personally thing that is just a really bizarre thing to even do, but it's possible.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Not that I think Ridley will be playable, but how often does boss characters in traditional fighting games get to be playable once defeated?

 

[Oasis_S]

Not that I think Ridley will be playable, but how often does boss characters in traditional fighting games get to be playable once defeated?

He's not really a "boss" though. He is a stage hazard that happens to present itself in the form of a famous and popular boss character that everyone knows and loves.

 

[majora_787]

Spoiler

I put Bowser in as well. Pikachu's shadow isn't THAT small compared to Ridley's, and taking into account Ridley's weird position, his shadow is probably slightly bigger than Bowser's.

 

[lilt]

One more thing:

That actually supports the theory, that Ridley and Pikachu have to be higher in the air ( jumping from a platform?) (Also, before Ridley grabs Pikachu, you have that clunky animation. Maybe it's caused by a cut in the footage, that Pikachu needed to high enough to be grabbed).
The higher the characters, the nearer they are to the light source. The bigger the shadow gets. Compare the shadows of Zero Suit Samus on Pyrosphere with that of Pikachu's in Ridleys claws (Look for a better footage than here). Pikachu seems even bigger than Zero Suit. Ridley has to be pretty small, but his shadow seems big, because he's high above ground. That's why we only saw his tail for a brief moment.

I noticed that the lightsource may differ stagewise. But here it might be fitting.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I'll play devils advocate with Ridley being a boss.

Look at Yellow Devil. He has an idle stance, and has a few different attacks. If you're going to have bosses, even as Brawl showed us with the Ridley boss that was there, bosses have idle stances to give the players a chance to land a few good hits. That's a common thing. Nothing to freak out about.

He flies over to Pikachu and picks him up. That is likely one of several different attacks. I don't see Ridley as being a slow boss altogether, but a boss with mixed attacks. Some are fast, others slow, and he probably idles with somebody in his claws to give them a chance to escape him. The other characters can probably either smack him around a little bit to free the other player, or can let him dominate them.

One piece of footage of gameplay with a hint of Ridley can't determine whether or not that is how he completely behaves as a boss. From what we have seen, that was the context of the clip; hinting at Ridley being a boss.

Besides a gut feeling people are having that Sakurai was trolling, there isn't anything pointing towards him being playable. To me, it's quite clear that he's a Boss Fight, but to each his own.

 

[majora_787]

I'll play devils advocate with Ridley being a boss.

Look at Yellow Devil. He has an idle stance, and has a few different attacks. If you're going to have bosses, even as Brawl showed us with the Ridley boss that was there, bosses have idle stances to give the players a chance to land a few good hits. That's a common thing. Nothing to freak out about.

He flies over to Pikachu and picks him up. That is likely one of several different attacks. I don't see Ridley as being a slow boss altogether, but a boss with mixed attacks. Some are fast, others slow, and he probably idles with somebody in his claws to give them a chance to escape him. The other characters can probably either smack him around a little bit to free the other player, or can let him dominate them.

One piece of footage of gameplay with a hint of Ridley can't determine whether or not that is how he completely behaves as a boss. From what we have seen, that was the context of the clip; hinting at Ridley being a boss.

Besides a gut feeling people are having that Sakurai was trolling, there isn't anything pointing towards him being playable. To me, it's quite clear that he's a Boss Fight, but to each his own.

But what kind of attack is walking over and grabbing like a player? That is the problem. Ridley is behaving with an absolutely minimal amount of velocity that bosses have in the series. They move quickly, they telegraph their moves, and when they grab they do damage. They don't sit there idly with the opponent in their grasp, because if they do they will do no damage and everyone will always simply escape.

For a boss to move at walking speed, go idle at a weird part of the stage, and to just "grab" in a way that is extremely unlike an actual boss attack, is just strange. There are SEVERAL things hinting at him being playable besides that, including the fact that his small size and really... unaggressive behavior for a boss accumulate to being just plain questionable. And on top of that, if the stage has a lava-based stage hazard, we have made a slow, small boss that attacks in a lazy, unaggressive fashion that people have to deal with while simultaneously avoiding an invasive lava hazard of some kind.

EDIT: To illustrate this more. Master Hand and Crazy Hand both have grabs, as does Tabuu. They telegraph their grabs, they move swiftly so the attack is harder to dodge than literally just moving more quickly than a walk (which people would be doing most of the time anyway), and they then immediately begin doing damage instead of sitting there holding the character in place awkwardky.

Even PLAYER-BASED bosses don't do that. Ones like Giga Bowser or Metal Mario or Giant DK or whatever? They either immediately start doing damage or they immediately throw. It is just extremely bizarre and unproductive boss behavior to slowly amble over, pick people up without telegraphing, and then hold them in a warm embrace.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Spoiler

I put Bowser in as well. Pikachu's shadow isn't THAT small compared to Ridley's, and taking into account Ridley's weird position, his shadow is probably slightly bigger than Bowser's.

So I take it Bowser is the green shape?

So what you're saying is, that Bowser, the largest character in the game we have seen thus far, has a shadow that is not even a third of the size of Ridley's shadow? Ridley is supposed to be playable with a shadow that size?

Even if Ridley was slightly above Bowser like your picture suggests, that shadow is WAY too big for a playable character.

Again, Ridley likely has other attacks as a boss. He's not going to zip around the stage because it doesn't make sense for a boss in Smash Bros to do that. His shadow is pretty large if you ask me. There is nothing pointing towards him being playable.

 

[MagnesD3]

I'll play devils advocate with Ridley being a boss.

Look at Yellow Devil. He has an idle stance, and has a few different attacks. If you're going to have bosses, even as Brawl showed us with the Ridley boss that was there, bosses have idle stances to give the players a chance to land a few good hits. That's a common thing. Nothing to freak out about.

He flies over to Pikachu and picks him up. That is likely one of several different attacks. I don't see Ridley as being a slow boss altogether, but a boss with mixed attacks. Some are fast, others slow, and he probably idles with somebody in his claws to give them a chance to escape him. The other characters can probably either smack him around a little bit to free the other player, or can let him dominate them.

One piece of footage of gameplay with a hint of Ridley can't determine whether or not that is how he completely behaves as a boss. From what we have seen, that was the context of the clip; hinting at Ridley being a boss.

Besides a gut feeling people are having that Sakurai was trolling, there isn't anything pointing towards him being playable. To me, it's quite clear that he's a Boss Fight, but to each his own.

Have you looked at the part that looks like pikachu broke free of the grab like a normal character can

 

[majora_787]

So I take it Bowser is the green shape?

So what you're saying is, that Bowser, the largest character in the game we have seen thus far, has a shadow that is not even a third of the size of Ridley's shadow? Ridley is supposed to be playable with a shadow that size?

Even if Ridley was slightly above Bowser like your picture suggests, that shadow is WAY too big for a playable character.

I don't know why you are looking at the wings. I am comparing Bowser's body shadow to Ridley's body shadow. Ridley's wings are obviously going to make his shadow look significantly larger because they are out due to him flying in the air. Looking at the bodies, Bowser is more than "not even one third" the size of Ridley's shadow.

 

[Steelia]

Have you looked at the part that looks like pikachu broke free of the grab like a normal character can

To be fair, you can escape the grasps of Master Hand and Crazy Hand, too. The fishy thing is how Ridley doesn't appear to be doing anything with Pikachu... He's just kinda hangin around holding the electric mouse.

 

[afrozenaer0]

I'm assuming you guys have heard about the Sal Ramano leak? The one with Shulk, Palutena, and Chrom? Let's just say that ends up being true... What would that mean for Ridley?

 

[majora_787]

I'm assuming you guys have heard about the Sal Ramano leak? The one with Shulk, Palutena, and Chrom? Let's just say that ends up being true... What would that mean for Ridley?

... Nothing? That seems like a really strange question to ask.

 

[MagnesD3]

I'm assuming you guys have heard about the Sal Ramano leak? The one with Shulk, Palutena, and Chrom? Let's just say that ends up being true... What would that mean for Ridley?

Ask rosalina

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

Do people really believe the footage we have is of a playable Ridley meant to fool us?

The comparatively ****ty model (evidenced by his low-poly and low-res tail tip) and animations scream "STAGE ELEMENT." You should really quit fooling yourselves. What we've seen is Ridley as a stage hazard, there is nothing we can take from that footage to indicate any other possible appearance.

Given that Stage Hazard Ridley is a preprogrammed element whose animations/frames will be easily telegraphed to warn players how Stage Hazard Ridley will attack, shouldn't Ridley have SMOOTHER animations?

Also, it's hard to say something is low-poly given that Other M Ridley's tail is pretty angular.

 

[Oracle_Summon]

To be fair, you can escape the grasps of Master Hand and Crazy Hand, too. The fishy thing is how Ridley doesn't appear to be doing anything with Pikachu... He's just kinda hangin around holding the electric mouse.

This would be a big stretch, but I believe Ridley could be waiting for the player to input a command, either pressing a button to hurt Pikachu while holding the mouse or picking a direction to throw the rodent.

The awkward movements look like one of a player trying to be precise with their attack.

If this is playable Ridley, then Ridley will be the only character who can grab characters out of thin air.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Do people really believe the footage we have is of a playable Ridley meant to fool us?

The comparatively ****ty model (evidenced by his low-poly and low-res tail tip) and animations scream "STAGE ELEMENT." You should really quit fooling yourselves. What we've seen is Ridley as a stage hazard, there is nothing we can take from that footage to indicate any other possible appearance.

You know what? Let them continue speculating. I know Ridley's chances took a severe kick to the nards on Tuesday but you have to keep in mind that a lot of people who regularly inhabit this thread have been supporting Ridley to be playable in SSB4 since he was revealed to be a boss in Brawl back in 2008. That's six years of dedication so if they want to hold on until there's undeniable proof that Ridley's in or out, let them. Maybe they will be wrong in the end and they're just spinning their tires but you have to admit that the Direct had A TON of trolling, half reveals, and deliberately ambiguous info. I honestly don't buy the "letting Ridley fans down easy" theory that some people have because, quite frankly, Sakurai has never been the delicate type for disconfirmations and every major assist trophy reveal has had a "they're not playable, deal with it" vibe to them. I'm giving it until E3 before calling it but, on the same note, I'm not going to entertain a number of the borderline neurotic conspiracy theories that are currently floating around about it.

 

[Phaazoid]

Let me just say guys, the argument 'AI doesn't act like that' is moot, regardless of what Ridley is actually doing in the clip.

It's AI. It acts like however they programmed it to act. That can include jumping, gliding, grabbing, or even getting broken free from grabbing. Master hand did pretty much all that. It's nothing new.

I'm not saying I'm subscribing to the Ridley is definitely a boss way of thinking just yet. Just trying to set some points right.

 

[Oasis_S]

You know what? Let them continue speculating. I know Ridley's chances took a severe kick to the nards on Tuesday but you have to keep in mind that a lot of people who regularly inhabit this thread have been supporting Ridley to be playable in SSB4 since he was revealed to be a boss in Brawl back in 2008. That's six years of dedication so if they want to hold on until there's undeniable proof that Ridley's in or out, let them. Maybe they will be wrong in the end and they're just spinning their tires but you have to admit that the Direct had A TON of trolling, half reveals, and deliberately ambiguous info. I honestly don't buy the "letting Ridley fans down easy" theory that some people have because, quite frankly, Sakurai has never been the delicate type for disconfirmations and every major assist trophy reveal has had a "they're not playable, deal with it" vibe to them. I'm giving it until E3 before calling it but, on the same note, I'm not going to entertain a number of the borderline neurotic conspiracy theories that are currently floating around about it.

I AM THOSE PEOPLE AND WHY ARE THEY NOT LIKE ME BRB STARTING A WAR OR SOMETHING.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Do people really believe the footage we have is of a playable Ridley meant to fool us?

The comparatively ****ty model (evidenced by his low-poly and low-res tail tip) and animations scream "STAGE ELEMENT." You should really quit fooling yourselves. What we've seen is Ridley as a stage hazard, there is nothing we can take from that footage to indicate any other possible appearance.

It looks low-res because it's zoomed in. You can see how crudy details are when zoomed in so much on graphics
Because from a distance you can't even detect low-res graphics. On some hd games until you zoom in enough you see not as good details

For example if you can zoom in on a shadow colossus game would it still look HD like zoomed in

 

[majora_787]

This would be a big stretch, but I believe Ridley could be waiting for the player to input a command, either pressing a button to hurt Pikachu while holding the mouse or picking a direction to throw the rodent.

The awkward movements look like one of a player trying to be precise with their attack.

If this is playable Ridley, then Ridley will be the only character who can grab characters out of thin air.

If he is a character meant to be the opposite of Little Mac, why would that be surprising that he has an air grab?

Also Master Hand did not behave the way Ridley did. If you compare how other bosses did grabs, they telegraphed, and then moved at a speed to grab the opponent, and then they do damage.

What you are saying is "there is nothing weird at all about a boss being slightly larger than Bowser, moving slightly faster than Pikachu half-walking, not telegraphing, picking people up like a player would, and then not doing damage because he was probably just programmed that way." Which is some ridiculous-tier self-fulfilling logic, but okay.