Important The Ridley for SSB4 Thread - End of an Era

[darksamus77]

The issue with lava stages is, 2/3 of metroid stages have been rising lava since 64. Zebes? Brinstar? Norfair? Possibly Pyrosphere? All lava. And we could go a step further and complain about how if it's not lava it's rotating, but that's eh.

Honestly I don't think going back to 2D games would be the best idea, and it would instead be better if they just handed it off back to Retro for more 3D games. Though they already have plans for both anyway.

And Yeah, I think that's a huge part of the problem right there. The game has so many games that are 9's or 10's like the Prime Trilogy or Super Metroid or maybe Zero Mission I wouldn't know, that when the series gets a game that's more like a 7 it just looks terrible in comparison when we get something sketchy like Other M or awful like Fusion or Hunters' single player.

The average is pretty good even with those aside though, so I think it's pretty safe to bet on good Metroid games in the future regardless. And Ridley will be a major villain in all of them. And anti-Ridleys and toobigots will still claim he is irrelevant and unimportant. Yep.

Well, to be fair, I also think lava itself is a bigger thing in Metroid than in other series because usually there's at least one area (or two) that's mostly/all lava and those areas usually also have a catchy theme to go with it. Plus, you know, you can also go through it like water in several games, so I think the developers feel that incorporating lava is a major part of it. Come to think of it, the only game without some type of lava area is Echoes. Every other game has one lava area. So there's that.

If Retro gets it back, I'd love to see a revamped 2D style game a-la DKC Tropical Freeze. I love that style and I think they could do wonders with a Metroid game like that.

Hunters was severely crippled due to hardware limitations. If that game was revamped for the 3DS or Wii U it would be a much better game with better controls. I honestly wouldn't mind that at all, but I doubt they'd revisit it. I'm also sure by now they know that Other M was a mistake due to the controversy it spawned. Only game I can compare the response to it is Majora's Mask. It seems most people either love it or can't stand it (and I love Majora's Mask, for the record).

Ridley will continue to be Samus' nemesis. If she kills him 50 times, the Space Pirates will rebuild him 50 times and throw in about 10 Meta Ridleys for free because that's how they work.

 

[VenomSymbiote]

Anyone else just losing hope the longer this drags on? I'm not trying to rain on anyones parade. I love that there's a thread that you can at least discuss Ridleys possibility without it degrading into mostly insults. I signed up just for that reason actually. I dunno it just seems like Ridley would have been the prime candidate to gain massive hype at E3. Tons of fans there for the tourney, constant streams from the teehouse, Sakurai there for the round table. Yet it didn't happen. The tiny little bit of hope I have is that we haven't fully seen him and he hasn't been named dropped. I can't tell if it's some foolish hope I'm clinging to or warranted at this point however.

Maybe I'm just getting jaded over the whole ordeal and getting progressively more and more pessimistic as it continues to not get resolved. It sucks because I had been hyped but this Ridley thing has been going on so long that I'm losing my faith in Sakurai. He may just think boss Ridley is bee knees for all I know. The fact the only other rep Metroid has gotten since SB64 was another Samus doesn't help my mood in the matter either. I just wish they'd show the boss hazard if that's all he is already. I mentally feel like a tired old man sitting on his porch waiting for something interesting to happen. Sometimes farting.

 

[SchAlternate]

The issue with lava stages is, 2/3 of metroid stages have been rising lava since 64. Zebes? Brinstar? Norfair? Possibly Pyrosphere? All lava. And we could go a step further and complain about how if it's not lava it's rotating, but that's eh.

Don't worry, the 3DS Metroid stage will certainly break that tradition...

Spoiler

... by adding Sector 4 with electric water instead of lava.

 

[majora_787]

I'm not really more pessimistic about Ridley's chances because it goes longer. If anything I'm more optimistic. Sakurai has had opportunity after opportunity to reveal Ridley as a stage hazard instead of teasing him as possibly a character, possibly a hazard. And he took none of them. I just wish he wouldn't ride the troll train all the way to the station.

And also I wouldn't even say Other M is "people who love it" or "people who hate it". It's more of "people who have an unnatural disdain for it" or "people who think it's eh". At least, that's what it is in my experience. My issues with Hunters had more to do with how the single player campaign was set up, not with controls. Fighting two bosses four times each and one boss with two palette swaps is less than super.

And yes, he will continue to be Samus' nemesis... to everyone but toobigots, it seems. He could be the main antagonist of yet ANOTHER Metroid game and those people still wouldn't care.

EDIT: And you know I don't really care how prominent lava is. The fact of the matter is they have other things they could be doing but instead only use lava. I just remembered, but even Brinstar Depths was just spinning over lava.

 

[VenomSymbiote]

Well, to be fair, I also think lava itself is a bigger thing in Metroid than in other series because usually there's at least one area (or two) that's mostly/all lava and those areas usually also have a catchy theme to go with it. Plus, you know, you can also go through it like water in several games, so I think the developers feel that incorporating lava is a major part of it. Come to think of it, the only game without some type of lava area is Echoes. Every other game has one lava area. So there's that.

If Retro gets it back, I'd love to see a revamped 2D style game a-la DKC Tropical Freeze. I love that style and I think they could do wonders with a Metroid game like that.

Hunters was severely crippled due to hardware limitations. If that game was revamped for the 3DS or Wii U it would be a much better game with better controls. I honestly wouldn't mind that at all, but I doubt they'd revisit it. I'm also sure by now they know that Other M was a mistake due to the controversy it spawned. Only game I can compare the response to it is Majora's Mask. It seems most people either love it or can't stand it (and I love Majora's Mask, for the record).

Ridley will continue to be Samus' nemesis. If she kills him 50 times, the Space Pirates will rebuild him 50 times and throw in about 10 Meta Ridleys for free because that's how they work.

To be fair the dark areas in echos are sort of like lava. You constantly take damage while in there until suit upgrades. Perhaps they felt lava + evil dark bad energy was a bit much?

 

[shrooby]

And Ridley shoots plasma, not fire.

Don't tell Ridley what he can and can't shoot from his breathing hole.

 

[majora_787]

Don't tell Ridley what he can and can't shoot from his breathing hole.

Ridley can shoot clam chowder if he damn well pleases.

 

[BKupa666]

This has probably been touched on already, but I think, no matter what, Ridley is getting revealed somehow or another in August.

What with how heavily he's been teased, he's not just going to be passively revealed after the Japanese 3DS release makes his fate clear one way or another. There's been way too much build-up for that.

 

[False Sense]

I still maintain that I am waiting for Sakurai to just be all, "I know you Metroid fans are sick of lava stages and spinning stages. So we made Ridley playable and turned Pyrosphere into... A SPINNING LAVA STAGE!"

That's actually kind of a good deal. I mean, so what if this game has an annoying Metroid stage if we get a playable Ridley?

 

[IsmaR]

Don't worry, the 3DS Metroid stage will certainly break that tradition...

Spoiler

... by adding Sector 4 with electric water instead of lava.

More like

Spoiler

An ice stage based on the freezer/containment unit where they kept Ridley's corpse.

Spoiler

With Ice Ridley as a hazard.

 

[darksamus77]

To be fair the dark areas in echos are sort of like lava. You constantly take damage while in there until suit upgrades. Perhaps they felt lava + evil dark bad energy was a bit much?

I enjoyed Echoes' areas as they were. The Dark World really only sucks until you get the Varia, and then it's bearable. Sanctuary Fortress, man.

I said this previously, but I think a Tallon IV stage that cycles through all the areas (and possible a few cameos by some nifty bosses ) kind of like the F-Zero stage in Brawl would be really cool. Granted, Prime already got a stage, so maybe Echoes with its areas instead. Either way, this would be a pretty swell stage, I think.

 

[BlueBubbee]

That's actually kind of a good deal. I mean, so what if this game has an annoying Metroid stage if we get a playable Ridley?

As long as we get Ridley, I'm fine with this spinning lava stage

 

[majora_787]

Still think if they go for an ice area they should make it a little more memorable than Ridley's freezer. Like the Vesper Defense Outpost with a Sylux cameo or something. Throw in some occasional lockjaw bombs or make the Delano 7 a stage boss and everyone's a weiner. ...Er. Winner.

 

[VenomSymbiote]

I've wanted a snowy Phendrana Drifts stage with that glorious music since forever. Have those armored iced back enemies charge in from the background from time to time as stage hazards, maybe with the mom slamming in after you slap enough of them around being a stage boss.

I do wonder if Sakurai knows or cares how much people in the West want playable Ridley, not boss Ridley. I know he discussed it briefly after Brawl saying he'd be impossible (which could have meant anything from time constraints to having been relegated to SSE boss status early on) but then saying they could if they worked hard enough. Doesn't really tell us if he cares about doing that though.

 

[kisamehoshi34]

don't forget that some time people get the game befor the release like 1 day to 1 week earlier so maybe we will get the final roster befor sept 13 and with ridley as character our leader need to be there

 

[BlueBubbee]

An ice stage based on the freezer/containment unit where they kept Ridley's corpse.

And Masahiro Sakurai looked down on Ridley's fanbase with a face only the master troll could have. A face that was .

 

[IsmaR]

Still think if they go for an ice area they should make it a little more memorable than Ridley's freezer. Like the Vesper Defense Outpost with a Sylux cameo or something. Throw in some occasional lockjaw bombs or make the Delano 7 a stage boss and everyone's a weiner. ...Er. Winner.

Well I would think if they'd go that far with "handheld Metroid" representation, they would use the Ice Spawn as a boss. Or maybe even a room full of Guardians.

On that note, I'm surprised how we never discuss the fact that the Meta Ridley boss trophy explicitly stated that he was weak to Ice attacks.

 

[majora_787]

Well I would think if they'd go that far with "handheld Metroid" representation, they would use the Ice Spawn as a boss. Or maybe even a room full of Guardians.

On that note, I'm surprised how we never discuss the fact that the Meta Ridley boss trophy explicitly stated that he was weak to Ice attacks.

Though if I remember right, Meta Ridley was weak to plasma wasn't he?

 

[darksamus77]

Though if I remember right, Meta Ridley was weak to plasma wasn't he?

I always used the plasma beam on him. Ice Beam didn't track too well in Prime, but the Ice Spreader (which is probably where the trophy gets the ice weakness from) is quite effective on both Meta Ridley and Mr. Prime.

 

[False Sense]

This has probably been touched on already, but I think, no matter what, Ridley is getting revealed somehow or another in August.

What with how heavily he's been teased, he's not just going to be passively revealed after the Japanese 3DS release makes his fate clear one way or another. There's been way too much build-up for that.

This is exactly what people were saying about E3. We were certain that, one way or another, we'd find out what Ridley's role in the game is.

Though August is the last chance they have before the game is released to actually show Ridley. So if he's playable, it would be an ideal time to reveal him. Though there still exists the possibility that maybe they will just let Ridley stay hidden until the 3DS release, and let people discover him on their own.

 

[BlueBubbee]

Thought I could just leave this here

 

[Shinru202]

Ridley Mac and Doc. Kraid working out for the upcoming SSB4.

Doc. Kraid: 100 more laps to go, YOU AIN'T DONE YET!

 

[IsmaR]

Though if I remember right, Meta Ridley was weak to plasma wasn't he?

Ice did the most damage since it's the "strongest" beam, but it was so slow and ineffective at hitting highly mobile targets that it felt like trying to hit a bird out of the air with a crossbow, while the Plasma beam was an AK47. I guess if you want to get technical, beam combos/Super Missiles were his biggest "weakness."

 

[BKupa666]

This is exactly what people were saying about E3. We were certain that, one way or another, we'd find out what Ridley's role in the game is.

Though August is the last chance they have before the game is released to actually show Ridley. So if he's playable, it would be an ideal time to reveal him. Though there still exists the possibility that maybe they will just let Ridley stay hidden until the 3DS release, and let people discover him on their own.

Those people were deluded. Not to toot my own horn, but I think I made the better prediction: "We'll find out something Ridley-related at E3, at least that Pyrosphere isn't in the demo for whatever reason, and at most what Ridley's role is."

Turns out, we got the former scenario; the Pyrosphere was left out for some reason. It could be just happenstance, since a handful of the other stages weren't there either, or it could be more significant. It's worth discussion, in any case.

In this scenario, yeah, it's possible that Ridley would just be casually disconfirmed via the 3DS release, but based on the teasing he's received, I think, whatever his role is, it's going to be nipped in the bud early. They're keeping his role ambiguous on their own terms, and are going to unveil his role on their own terms as well.

 

[NintenRob]

So K Rool is actually bigger then Ridley? I thought he was smaller then that on the SNES.

 

[Kenith]

I think the omission of Pyrosphere from the E3 demo of Smash is really peculiar.

They've shown the thing to death, it's in every trailer, half of the screenshots, yet it wasn't at E3.

 

[majora_787]

I think the omission of Pyrosphere from the E3 demo of Smash is really peculiar.

They've shown the thing to death, it's in every trailer, half of the screenshots, yet it wasn't at E3.

Not to mention it's the oldest stage that is more than just a plain stage that was excluded, and is THE only stage that would have ended the Ridley debates.

EDIT: It's easy to figure that K. Rool is probably larger than Ridley. Ridley is twice as tall as a person. K. Rool is twice as tall as a large gorilla.

 

[False Sense]

I think the omission of Pyrosphere from the E3 demo of Smash is really peculiar.

They've shown the thing to death, it's in every trailer, half of the screenshots, yet it wasn't at E3.

And instead we got two stages that were only recently revealed. I suppose I can see why they would do that, though it also makes me think that they could have officially revealed boss Ridley some time before E3 and have the complete Pyrosphere playable. It's absence (along with no word about Ridley aside from what was in the Direct) is rather odd.

 

[IsmaR]

I think the omission of Pyrosphere from the E3 demo of Smash is really peculiar.

They've shown the thing to death, it's in every trailer, half of the screenshots, yet it wasn't at E3.

Not to mention it's the oldest stage that is more than just a plain stage that was excluded, and is THE only stage that would have ended the Ridley debates.

To add onto that, they can't even use the "stage is incomplete" excuse since Mushroom Kingdom U was both playable at the demo and was apparently incomplete/still having things added onto it (Nabbit shown in a later pic of the day).

 

[BlueBubbee]

I think the omission of Pyrosphere from the E3 demo of Smash is really peculiar.

They've shown the thing to death, it's in every trailer, half of the screenshots, yet it wasn't at E3.

Optimistic View:
Ridley is playable and they didn't want people to know that he wasn't a stage hazard (Sakurai trolling from the direct) because he's playable. If they showed off the stage at e3 players would have noticed that he wasn't there.

Pessimistic View:
Ridley is just a stage hazard/boss on PyroSphere and Sakurai wants to keep people waiting before dropping his ultimate troll bomb

Sakurai's View:
lol idk

 

[majora_787]

I'm still convinced that this is WAY too much ambiguity and evasion to just lead up to "SURPRISE, this character is in EXACTLY the same role they're USUALLY in! Except now, they're actually DOWNGRADED! If you played Dead or Alive Dimensions you know EXACTLY WHAT TO EXPECT! Just imagine a MUCH SLOWER AND SMALLER RIDLEY that needs to JUMP!"

 

[Xenorange]

I hunger for a new character announcement, it's almost been a month now :O time sure does fly. On a different topic, if Ridley's role is not revealed within the upcoming months before the release, would this bode well for his playability or would it be a strong indicator of the opposite?

 

[BlueBubbee]

Damn it, Sakurai. "Too Big Tease".



At least we can assume he's in there somehow.

 

[IsmaR]

I hunger for a new character announcement, it's almost been a month now :O time sure does fly. On a different topic, if Ridley's role is not revealed within the upcoming months before the release, would this bode well for his playability or would it be a strong indicator of the opposite?

If he's not revealed for a few months/years after the games have come out, then we should probably start being worried.

 

[WayfaringElf]

Well, to be fair, I also think lava itself is a bigger thing in Metroid than in other series because usually there's at least one area (or two) that's mostly/all lava and those areas usually also have a catchy theme to go with it. Plus, you know, you can also go through it like water in several games, so I think the developers feel that incorporating lava is a major part of it. Come to think of it, the only game without some type of lava area is Echoes. Every other game has one lava area. So there's that.

If Retro gets it back, I'd love to see a revamped 2D style game a-la DKC Tropical Freeze. I love that style and I think they could do wonders with a Metroid game like that.

Hunters was severely crippled due to hardware limitations. If that game was revamped for the 3DS or Wii U it would be a much better game with better controls. I honestly wouldn't mind that at all, but I doubt they'd revisit it. I'm also sure by now they know that Other M was a mistake due to the controversy it spawned. Only game I can compare the response to it is Majora's Mask. It seems most people either love it or can't stand it (and I love Majora's Mask, for the record).

Ridley will continue to be Samus' nemesis. If she kills him 50 times, the Space Pirates will rebuild him 50 times and throw in about 10 Meta Ridleys for free because that's how they work.

Why don't we have lava based Mario stages then? Bowser just loves the stuff.

 

[Xenorange]

If he's not revealed for a few months/years after the games have come out, then we should probably start being worried.

Uhhm, no need for the sarcastic comment man. I was just asking for general opinions. I thought it was a good question. I'll reword it, if Ridley's role is not revealed before release day would you guys immediately assume the best or the worst?

 

[majora_787]

Uhhm, no need for the sarcastic comment man. I was just asking for general opinions. I thought it was a good question. I'll reword it, if Ridley's role is not revealed before release day would you guys immediately assume the best or the worst?

If Ridley's not in the full roster of the 3DS version, then as far as I care, Ridley's a boss, Sakurai's a psychopath, and my disappointment period begins. Probably to subside by the US release.

Though I seriously don't believe that'll be what happens.

 

[False Sense]

I'm still convinced that this is WAY too much ambiguity and evasion to just lead up to "SURPRISE, this character is in EXACTLY the same role they're USUALLY in! Except now, they're actually DOWNGRADED! If you played Dead or Alive Dimensions you know EXACTLY WHAT TO EXPECT! Just imagine a MUCH SLOWER AND SMALLER RIDLEY that needs to JUMP!"

The ambiguity about this is what really stands out to me. I know it's been said before, but Sakurai is usually quite clear when it comes to showing off non-playable characters. His previous de-confirmations makes me think that he prefers to avoid causing confusion regarding the playability of certain characters. I think the best example of this is when he revealed Ashley. The picture just showed her standing in the Boxing Ring, and the accompanying comment just quoted song lyrics. It could have easily been mistaken for a character reveal. Though Sakurai made sure to include a second comment that clarified her role as an Assist Trophy. It seems odd that someone who is usually careful to avoid causing unnecessary confusion about characters would create such controversy about the role of a highly requested character and not provide clarification. At the very least, I would think that he could provide a daily update a few days after the Direct about Ridley being a boss. Now it's been months since the Direct, and Ridley has not been mentioned. Simply put, it's uncharacteristic of Sakurai.

Well, unless Ridley is actually playable, in which case the teasing Ridley has received matches up with the teasing other newcomers have received.

 

[darksamus77]

Why don't we have lava based Mario stages then? Bowser just loves the stuff.

I'm sure it's in the works. Mario has had a moving stage in every game though, and maybe they can be plagued with moving and lava stages moving forward >:D

 

[ultimatekoopa]

I'm actually glad that the pyrosphere wasn't in the demo, considering that nabbit was not on the demo then it could have meant the same for ridley, it would be like a storm in my parade