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The Post-Ultimate Mega Smash Poll -The 1,010 Vote Result Bonanza!

LiveStudioAudience

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So, what were some characters that did better than you expected?

What were some characters who did worse than you expected?
I've always advocated for Impa, BWD, and especially Dixie but was never sure if the support for them existed beyond token appreciation. This poll has been a pleasant surprise in seeing that there is a strong sense by people that they belong in Smash. Especially for Dixie who's been short changed for so many appearances in stuff like Mario Kart and not been granted the quantity of games she warrants, seeing her get that number one slot is both lovely and vindicating.
 

EarlTamm

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So, what were some characters that did better than you expected?

What were some characters who did worse than you expected?
While I put my vote to most of them, Raven Beak, members of the Kid Icarus cast, and Funkey Kong doing so well were big surprises to me initially(Though there were certainly more beyond that). But I just came to understand that the basis of the polls allows for such characters to get the spotlight.

Geno is a character I expected to do a bit better, but it's not like he did bad(I would hardly scoff at placing 5th in the Mario section and 31st overall given how many characters are here). Maybe the poll just never reached places where support of him is dense, but I would not be shocked if its just the natural result given the basis of the poll.
 

Louie G.

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I do have to wonder if the idols may have done better if paired up instead. Nevertheless, I’m a bit disappointed but unsurprised with these results. I believe Octoling is a moderate want by most people, the obvious next step for a growing series so it’s an easy blank to fill. Splatoon getting a second character is palatable enough, especially since many probably have the impression of it being a simple echo fighter.

But I’m convinced that many Smash fans are not that concerned with Splatoon’s cast, lack the vision to support them conceptually or a mix of the two. This doesn’t necessarily discourage me about their chances or anything, because I’ve always felt an idol group or Octavio is the kind of thing that would need to be seen to be fully understood and loved. Still believe a non-Octoling unique Splatoon newcomer may be the single most slept on prospect.

I wonder about the overlap between Karate Joe and Chorus Kids (and other Rhythm
Heaven characters). I personally didn’t vote for Karate Joe, but did vote for Chorus Kids, so I wonder if the Rhythm Heaven series has an even greater potential than is visible now.
I voted for Chorus Kids (my MW) and not Karate Joe as well. In reality I would be happy with anything, but my endorsement goes behind the wackier oddball picks to represent the wacky oddball series over the martial artist. I also voted for Barista, Yuka and Wrestler at the very least.

Swamp mentioned during the 500 vote check-in that votes between these two frontrunners often did not overlap. Would be hard to come to an accurate conclusion about this but I’m convinced if interest was pooled behind a single character RH would be minimally Top 3 among the unrepresented series. Dare I say this is probably the series that is hurt the very most from a lack of community consensus, and it makes me very sad that we will never be able to rally the way Golden Sun’s persisting support has for a series that has just as many adoring fans.
 
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SharkLord

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So, what were some characters that did better than you expected?

What were some characters who did worse than you expected?
In general, it seems like the most popular characters were older characters who were already fairly popular before Ultimate. I suppose it's because of Ultimate's differing priorities; Most Smash games are a mix of popular requests and whoever's relevant to the current console, but Ultimate prioritized veterans above all else, and ballot picks second, leaving us with only 11 newcomers (Including five clones) and four stages in the base game. Then the DLC shifted to primarily third-parties, and the few Nintendo characters were from Switch games specifically. To me, the poll confirms that there's a fair bit of characters who did decently well on the ballot but got screwed over by the limited roster space. Of course, this also doesn't include third-parties, but it still shows there's a fair few first-parties that would be met with applause.

In my ideal world BWD would still keep top vote, but ah well. A very close second is still really good. Actually I'm surprised Dixie managed to take first place, though the setup being a casual "Who'd you be chill with?" rather than a "What's your absolute MOST WANTED???" probably benefited her a lot. I was personally expecting Waluigi to be on top, or perhaps Bandana Dee keeping his momentum.

It's cool how Ashley and especially Krystal managed to stay on popular despite fizzling out during Ultimate's cycle due to being trophied. Krystal especially, since Star Fox has been dormant on the Switch and Krystal herself has been MIA for even longer.

Octoling and Raven Beak are the only Switch newcomers to crack the top ten. Octoling is to be expected, but Raven Beak's a bit of a surprise. The biggest surprise is multiple Kid Icarus characters maintaining modest popularity, even without a game in over a decade. There's also Chibi-Robo being the second most popular new series pick; He doesn't have the same push as Isaac and he doesn't have any recent games either, so I expected Andy or Ayumi to beat him.

Zelda's divided requests have been discussed a lot already. Fire Emblem is also somewhat divided. I think FE in particular is hampered by both the stigma of endless swordbois and Engage just not hitting it as big as Three Houses, with a hypothetical moveset for Alear being assumed to be too derivative. This leaves us without a major recent frontrunner, especially since we'll most likely have a new FE for the Switch 2 by the time we get to the next Smash. Though, I kinda assumed the Three Houses cast might do a bit better; Instead, the top three FE characters are the three Assist Trophies.
 

fogbadge

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In general, it seems like the most popular characters were older characters who were already fairly popular before Ultimate. I suppose it's because of Ultimate's differing priorities; Most Smash games are a mix of popular requests and whoever's relevant to the current console, but Ultimate prioritized veterans above all else, and ballot picks second, leaving us with only 11 newcomers (Including five clones) and four stages in the base game. Then the DLC shifted to primarily third-parties, and the few Nintendo characters were from Switch games specifically. To me, the poll confirms that there's a fair bit of characters who did decently well on the ballot but got screwed over by the limited roster space. Of course, this also doesn't include third-parties, but it still shows there's a fair few first-parties that would be met with applause.

In my ideal world BWD would still keep top vote, but ah well. A very close second is still really good. Actually I'm surprised Dixie managed to take first place, though the setup being a casual "Who'd you be chill with?" rather than a "What's your absolute MOST WANTED???" probably benefited her a lot. I was personally expecting Waluigi to be on top, or perhaps Bandana Dee keeping his momentum.

It's cool how Ashley and especially Krystal managed to stay on popular despite fizzling out during Ultimate's cycle due to being trophied. Krystal especially, since Star Fox has been dormant on the Switch and Krystal herself has been MIA for even longer.

Octoling and Raven Beak are the only Switch newcomers to crack the top ten. Octoling is to be expected, but Raven Beak's a bit of a surprise. The biggest surprise is multiple Kid Icarus characters maintaining modest popularity, even without a game in over a decade. There's also Chibi-Robo being the second most popular new series pick; He doesn't have the same push as Isaac and he doesn't have any recent games either, so I expected Andy or Ayumi to beat him.

Zelda's divided requests have been discussed a lot already. Fire Emblem is also somewhat divided. I think FE in particular is hampered by both the stigma of endless swordbois and Engage just not hitting it as big as Three Houses, with a hypothetical moveset for Alear being assumed to be too derivative. This leaves us without a major recent frontrunner, especially since we'll most likely have a new FE for the Switch 2 by the time we get to the next Smash. Though, I kinda assumed the Three Houses cast might do a bit better; Instead, the top three FE characters are the three Assist Trophies.
Octoling debuted on the Wii U
 

Super Flygon

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Thanks for sharing the results, and for doing this poll Swamp Sensei Swamp Sensei !

Some really nice results and I'd love to see a lot of these characters playable in the next game (with Everyone is Here again!). Nice to see Dixie at the top with others like Bandana Dee, Raven Beak and Skull Kid performing well. My personal most wanted is actually Paper Mario (along with more representation from TTYD).
 

Gorgonzales

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So, what were some characters that did better than you expected?

What were some characters who did worse than you expected?
Chibi-Robo lives on in the hearts of fans and I'm surprised he cracked top 20. I love seeing the littler guys get some love, so good for him honestly.

Ashley getting 6th overall was the biggest surprise to me. Like, wow. She's right up against the top 5, I would've never guessed she'd make it that far.

Not a Star Fox fan but I'm glad Krystal is still in the running, performing very well to boot. Smash could use more cryomancy.

I'm not sure any of the people who voted for Black Shadow have actually played F-Zero. Or at least, saw the guy in action. He's such a nothingburger character and I genuinely can't tell if people unironically want him in or just see him as a Falcondorf dumping ground.

Doc Louis getting into the top 50 is a pleasant surprise. You love to see more Punch Out rep.
 
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Swamp Sensei

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I'm not sure any of the people who voted for Black Shadow have actually played F-Zero. Or at least, saw the guy in action. He's such a nothingburger character and I genuinely can't tell if people unironically want him in or just see him as a Falcondorf dumping ground.
I do think Black Shadow would have done pretty well regardless. Just by his own merits, he's a really popular F-Zero character. He's plot important, unlike most of the cast and had a big appearance in the anime.

I know there's a strong (deserved) distaste for the idea of Black Shadow taking Ganondorf's moveset and calling it a day, but we still need to consider his actual strengths.
 

SharkLord

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I do think Black Shadow would have done pretty well regardless. Just by his own merits, he's a really popular F-Zero character. He's plot important, unlike most of the cast and had a big appearance in the anime.

I know there's a strong (deserved) distaste for the idea of Black Shadow taking Ganondorf's moveset and calling it a day, but we still need to consider his actual strengths.
Yeah, he's the main villain for most of the games, right? He was the victim of the anime's big galaxy-scale Falcon Punch and all that.

There's also his iconic Black Shadow Dance
(At 0:32)
 
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ninjahmos

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I wouldn't really want Black Shadow to take Falcondorf's moveset, but I can kinda see him at least being either an Echo or a semi-clone of Falcon.
 
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WeirdChillFever

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In general, it seems like the most popular characters were older characters who were already fairly popular before Ultimate. I suppose it's because of Ultimate's differing priorities; Most Smash games are a mix of popular requests and whoever's relevant to the current console, but Ultimate prioritized veterans above all else, and ballot picks second, leaving us with only 11 newcomers (Including five clones) and four stages in the base game. Then the DLC shifted to primarily third-parties, and the few Nintendo characters were from Switch games specifically. To me, the poll confirms that there's a fair bit of characters who did decently well on the ballot but got screwed over by the limited roster space. Of course, this also doesn't include third-parties, but it still shows there's a fair few first-parties that would be met with applause.

In my ideal world BWD would still keep top vote, but ah well. A very close second is still really good. Actually I'm surprised Dixie managed to take first place, though the setup being a casual "Who'd you be chill with?" rather than a "What's your absolute MOST WANTED???" probably benefited her a lot. I was personally expecting Waluigi to be on top, or perhaps Bandana Dee keeping his momentum.

It's cool how Ashley and especially Krystal managed to stay on popular despite fizzling out during Ultimate's cycle due to being trophied. Krystal especially, since Star Fox has been dormant on the Switch and Krystal herself has been MIA for even longer.

Octoling and Raven Beak are the only Switch newcomers to crack the top ten. Octoling is to be expected, but Raven Beak's a bit of a surprise. The biggest surprise is multiple Kid Icarus characters maintaining modest popularity, even without a game in over a decade. There's also Chibi-Robo being the second most popular new series pick; He doesn't have the same push as Isaac and he doesn't have any recent games either, so I expected Andy or Ayumi to beat him.

Zelda's divided requests have been discussed a lot already. Fire Emblem is also somewhat divided. I think FE in particular is hampered by both the stigma of endless swordbois and Engage just not hitting it as big as Three Houses, with a hypothetical moveset for Alear being assumed to be too derivative. This leaves us without a major recent frontrunner, especially since we'll most likely have a new FE for the Switch 2 by the time we get to the next Smash. Though, I kinda assumed the Three Houses cast might do a bit better; Instead, the top three FE characters are the three Assist Trophies.
I think it’s worth noting that third parties aren’t part of this poll. Ultimate Speculation mostly moved the needle on third party speculation with new trends like Crash, Dante and Master Chief/Doom Guy. The first party selection might feel like a time capsule from the ballot times because Ultimate DLC discussion didn’t have its biggest developments or trends aimed at first parties.

especially since many probably have the impression of it being a simple echo fighter.
To be honest I take no offense at the idea of Octoling being a pure-clone Echo, they’re two sides of the same coin in Splatoon and while more weapon rep would be nice, they could also just take that in the form of Dark Pit-like reskins from the Inkling‘s weapons.

But I’m convinced that many Smash fans are not that concerned with Splatoon’s cast, lack the vision to support them conceptually or a mix of the two. This doesn’t necessarily discourage me about their chances or anything, because I’ve always felt an idol group or Octavio is the kind of thing that would need to be seen to be fully understood and loved. Still believe a non-Octoling unique Splatoon newcomer may be the single most slept on prospect.
Splatoon, Pikmin and Animal Crossing made a huge splash in the Switch era and grew into mascot series for Nintendo and I think they’re worth exploring even beyond their most obvious frontrunner picks. Pikmin could maybe get away with Echo Alph, Shepherd & Oatchi and maybe even Louie & Moss as an Oatchi echo.

I voted for Chorus Kids (my MW) and not Karate Joe as well. In reality I would be happy with anything, but my endorsement goes behind the wackier oddball picks to represent the wacky oddball series over the martial artist. I also voted for Barista, Yuka and Wrestler at the very least.

Swamp mentioned during the 500 vote check-in that votes between these two frontrunners often did not overlap. Would be hard to come to an accurate conclusion about this but I’m convinced if interest was pooled behind a single character RH would be minimally Top 3 among the unrepresented series. Dare I say this is probably the series that is hurt the very most from a lack of community consensus, and it makes me very sad that we will never be able to rally the way Golden Sun’s persisting support has for a series that has just as many adoring fans.
Would be interesting to see! I voted for Chorus Kids and Wrestler for both being characters that can show the call-and-response gameplay of Rhythm Heaven.
 

SharkLord

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I think it’s worth noting that third parties aren’t part of this poll. Ultimate Speculation mostly moved the needle on third party speculation with new trends like Crash, Dante and Master Chief/Doom Guy. The first party selection might feel like a time capsule from the ballot times because Ultimate DLC discussion didn’t have its biggest developments or trends aimed at first parties.
That's very true, but the poll is also very freeform and lets you pick as many fighters as you want. If nothing else, it still shows there's a decent few first-parties that would be met with solid applause, especially if Smash 6 reverts to a more traditional newcomer setup.

But yeah, you're right. The third-party focus probably did push out any first-party who didn't have a strong following already. And like I mentioned, the tight squeeze in the base game likely left some characters who had a solid support base but no payoff, which preserves their following even further.
 

smashkirby

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So, what were some characters that did better than you expected?
Funky Kong and Chibi-Robo stood out to me especially. I mean, despite EVERYTHING the latter in particular has had to suffer through, it does my heart good to see HIM in the top 20 (21).
Ayumi Tachibana was also a surprise too, though I can't help but feel like Detective Club getting a new game miiiiight have helped her just a bit...

BTW...while I expected Dixie Kong to do well, I never thought SHE'D be #1. Not that I'm bothered. Heck, I'm THRILLED. As I've said in the past, she and B.W.D. are my most-wanted first-parties for Smash (that have a legitimate shot), so to see them as #1 and #2 respectively excites me a lot.

Speaking of B.W.D., a normal Waddle Dee being in the HIGH double-digits is also a sight for me, and a great sight at that!

Personal bias speaking here, but to see Lark (from Pilotwings) get double-digit votes was also a great sight for me. Hey, take a 'W' where you can get it, you know?

What were some characters who did worse than you expected?
Anna from Fire Emblem being bumped out of the top 5 for Fire Emblem was... something. Same goes for Waluigi NOT being #1 and Yuka NOT being about... let's say 10-15 places higher from where she currently is was a bit of a bummer.
 

Laniv

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So, what were some characters that did better than you expected?

What were some characters who did worse than you expected?
Better than I expected?

Every Kid Icarus character, by dint of being characters from a 12-year-old game that hasn't gotten much attention recently. Chibi-Robo, by dint of being in the same boat as the Kid Icarus characters, but with far worse prospects ahead. And Starfy is always a treat to see

Worse than I thought? ... It's really just Geno, isn't it? Losing out to three other Mario characters and barely getting kicked out of top 30 by Sylux and K.K. Slider* is tougher than I thought. Even after the remake?


*This is not a jab against K.K. Slider. His musical talents are unparalleled and I hold nothing but the highest esteem for him
 

Louie G.

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To be honest I take no offense at the idea of Octoling being a pure-clone Echo, they’re two sides of the same coin in Splatoon and while more weapon rep would be nice, they could also just take that in the form of Dark Pit-like reskins from the Inkling‘s weapons.
This is how I feel too, and I’ve even toyed with the prospect of them being an alternate skin (I think this is more likely than people think, although a clone is still the most likely). This makes Octoling such a weirdly compelling character. Their presence in the next game is a 100% certainty, but how fleshed out they will be is entirely up in the air. You could have them take up four of Inkling’s alt colors, you could make them a fully unique newcomer with a new weapon loadout. I can’t think of any other fighter with this many viable outlets toward representation.

I wouldn’t fault you for predicting any one of them, but if I had to personally guess I believe they will make Octoling a derivative fighter and put more time toward a fully unique character concept.
 
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Swamp Sensei

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I wonder if Geno was hurt by the poll itself. From the start I tried to include third party owned characters as members of their franchises. Geno, Mallow, the Hyrule and Fire Emblem Warriors crew and the Mario Rabbid crew were always meant to be intended. And they were classified like Ultimate largely classifies them. Geno is a Mario character. Terrako is a Zelda character, etc.

But I'm wondering if Geno's identity as a third party character muddied the waters. It wouldn't shock if people didn't go looking for him because they'd incorrectly assume he wouldn't be there. I never got Geno as a write in vote, and I assumed it was because people who wanted him, found him. But maybe I'm wrong.

Did the format of my poll hurt third party characters like Geno?
 
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0007

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I'm not sure any of the people who voted for Black Shadow have actually played F-Zero. Or at least, saw the guy in action. He's such a nothingburger character and I genuinely can't tell if people unironically want him in or just see him as a Falcondorf dumping ground.
I literally don't understand this. He has that famous scene in the anime where he gets Falcon Punched into an exploding galaxy, his superhero villain design is unique, and Captain Falcon had literally ZERO moveset before Sakurai invented it for him. They could easily give Black Shadow a crazy martial artist bruiser moveset, he looks like a very physically powerful character.

I wonder if Geno was hurt by the poll itself. From the start I tried to include third party owned characters as members of their franchises. Geno, Mallow, the Hyrule and Fire Emblem Warriors crew and the Mario Rabbit crew were always meant to be intended. And they were classified like Ultimate largely classifies them. Geno is a Mario character. Terrako is a Zelda character, etc.

But I'm wondering if Geno's identity as a third party character muddied the waters. It wouldn't shock if people didn't go looking for him because they'd incorrectly assume he wouldn't be there. I never got Geno as a write in vote, and I assumed it was because people who wanted him, found him. But maybe I'm wrong.

Did the format of my poll hurt third party characters like Geno?
I think Geno's copyright status is very muddled, I don't think people clearly know he's a Square Enix created character (and still owned by them IIRC)
 

Schnee117

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Geno performed as expected given the parameters of the polling
If voting were restricted to only being able to pick a few choices per category then he'd jump up (or at least, remain where he is in terms of vote count whilst the Toads and Paper Mario tumble below him) because Geno fans are nothing if not very, very dedicated, definitely moreso than the majority of fanbases. But in a scenario where the only restriction was who was listed and you aren't otherwise limited in the number of votes like this poll, it makes sense that he'd take a hit because the reality there is that yeah, a lot of people would probably like to see Toads of some kind be playable, they're just not particularly loud about it. The same holds for Paper Mario when his fans aren't arguing over how he'd be portrayed and then Waluigi was always the number 1 pick for a Mario newcomer in this selection.

There's a lot of silent fans and fans who are only casually into wanting a character and this catches them.
 

EarlTamm

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I wonder if Geno was hurt by the poll itself. From the start I tried to include third party owned characters as members of their franchises. Geno, Mallow, the Hyrule and Fire Emblem Warriors crew and the Mario Rabbit crew were always meant to be intended. And they were classified like Ultimate largely classifies them. Geno is a Mario character. Terrako is a Zelda character, etc.

But I'm wondering if Geno's identity as a third party character muddied the waters. It wouldn't shock if people didn't go looking for him because they'd incorrectly assume he wouldn't be there. I never got Geno as a write in vote, and I assumed it was because people who wanted him, found him. But maybe I'm wrong.

Did the format of my poll hurt third party characters like Geno?
I think Geno's copyright status is very muddled, I don't think people clearly know he's a Square Enix created character (and still owned by them IIRC)
This is certainly an explanation for why maybe some people might miss him, but I am sure many just outright assume he is a normal Mario character as well, so its hard to determine if this is a major factor in why Geno is surprisingly low. If this was a flaw in the system, I don't think its a major one since it really only notably effected a handful of characters at most, with Geno being the only one that seems obvious, but its still something to consider.

Would be kinda funny if he shows up in a potential third party poll and actually does better though.
 

Gorgonzales

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I wonder if Geno was hurt by the poll itself. From the start I tried to include third party owned characters as members of their franchises. Geno, Mallow, the Hyrule and Fire Emblem Warriors crew and the Mario Rabbid crew were always meant to be intended. And they were classified like Ultimate largely classifies them. Geno is a Mario character. Terrako is a Zelda character, etc.

But I'm wondering if Geno's identity as a third party character muddied the waters. It wouldn't shock if people didn't go looking for him because they'd incorrectly assume he wouldn't be there. I never got Geno as a write in vote, and I assumed it was because people who wanted him, found him. But maybe I'm wrong.

Did the format of my poll hurt third party characters like Geno?
Make it a point that people can use Ctrl + F to check if the character they're looking for is in the poll.

Just make it a tip on the poll opening or maybe put it in parentheses after every series introduction (you can use Ctrl + F to search for the character you want)!
 

Swamp Sensei

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Make it a point that people can use Ctrl + F to check if the character they're looking for is in the poll.

Just make it a tip on the poll opening or maybe put it in parentheses after every series introduction (you can use Ctrl + F to search for the character you want)!
It has been very clear from the suggestions box, that half the people don't read instructions.
 

BritishGuy54

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The results haven’t changed substantially from 500 to 1000 votes, bar the swapping of a few characters, and the fall-off of a few.

Still, it’s interesting to see that Smash fans really love dormant and/or seniority in characters and series in that regard, such as Donkey Kong, F-Zero, Mother, and Star Fox.

I still wonder why Pneuma wasn’t in the poll. Is it just that people don’t consider her as her own character (or moveset)?
 

Diddy Kong

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With the way Pyra and Mythra are implemented, Pneuma is already kinda sort of there, in a way.

Donkey Kong being named in the groups of Star Fox and F Zero hurts tho. 🥲

Don't do this.
 

nirvanafan

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Probably the biggest surprise for me was Raven Beak beating Sylux, thought Sylux would be decently ahead after the Prime 4 trailer.
 

Louie G.

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Probably the biggest surprise for me was Raven Beak beating Sylux, thought Sylux would be decently ahead after the Prime 4 trailer.
This makes sense to me, mostly because we got to see Raven Beak in action and that’s relatively fresh in our minds. Sylux isn’t exactly a brand new face, but I think actually knowing his role in Prime 4 and seeing what he does in that game will make or break him. The trailer just confirms to us what we already assumed, which is that he is in the game.

Personally, I have virtually no interest in Sylux being added until I see this for myself. I forget if I endorsed Raven Beak, but I did vote for EMMI.

Donkey Kong being named in the groups of Star Fox and F Zero hurts tho. 🥲
I don’t think it’s particularly fair, although I guess on paper it makes sense if you’re judging off last brand new release.

But personally… I don’t know. A prominent showcase in the billion dollar grossing Mario movie, an area in Universal Studios, an upcoming remaster for DKC Returns. These aren’t really the makings of a series on ice. At the very least, it’s hard to argue the IP as a whole is in a dormant state. The games themselves probably continue to be backed up from Prime 4. Not that I particularly expect a new character myself, but it’s kind of disingenuous to lump it in there.

Hell, even F-Zero is not a dormant series anymore. F-Zero 99 is effectively a new game, regardless of whether or not people see it that way. Clearly a high budget AAA affair would cement this further in people’s minds, but for all intents and purposes F-Zero has been seeing new material in 2024. Easily the best position the series has been in since the Gamecube.

Although in fairness to BritishGuy’s point, these recent moves are likely not inspiring new support. Much of the Dixie Kong train is carried over from Brawl onward, with another spike after Tropical Freeze. Funky Kong feels like a new movement, though.
 
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LiveStudioAudience

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Much of the skepticism and general unsure expectations by some DK fans about the series (as well as curiosity about its presence in future editions of Smash) is all related to its deficit of activity relative to other first party IP's and lack of deeper trust towards Nintendo about the brand. If something like DKC Returns HD had been announced three years ago then you'd probably have a more hopeful feeling as it would have been seen far more as a stopgap release coming pretty reasonably after the Tropical Freeze port while the next new game was being worked on. But an announcement like that coming in 2024 six years after the Switch TF version and for release in early 2025? In this case it just doesn't immediately feel like it makes up for long drought the fandom's already been dealing with nor act as a credible sign that something significant is coming.

Moreover, however much it makes theoretical sense for the next DK game to be worked on, until there's outright confirmation by Nintendo on that, a few are going to doubt it. Video game hype cycles and positive expectations are often fueled by recent releases and the promise of more new titles... and to some the latter is where Donkey Kong in general feels fairly weak. A remake of a spin-off like Mario vs DK is semi-encouraging, the theme park additions are hypothetically promising, and the cameos in SMB movie or Mario Kart 8 are nice.

However, none are outright new games primarily focused on the Donkey Kong sub-brand and all the speculation and common assumption that of course a core team in Nintendo must be working on one is not a replacement of knowledge (let alone actual evidence) of them. Often a deeper optimism for a franchise necessitates a trust that something's going to happen with it and for some there's simply not enough that Nintendo's done on the game front to earn that.
 
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SharkLord

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This makes sense to me, mostly because we got to see Raven Beak in action and that’s relatively fresh in our minds. Sylux isn’t exactly a brand new face, but I think actually knowing his role in Prime 4 and seeing what he does in that game will make or break him. The trailer just confirms to us what we already assumed, which is that he is in the game.

Personally, I have virtually no interest in Sylux being added until I see this for myself. I forget if I endorsed Raven Beak, but I did vote for EMMI.



I don’t think it’s particularly fair, although I guess on paper it makes sense if you’re judging off last brand new release.

But personally… I don’t know. A prominent showcase in the billion dollar grossing Mario movie, an area in Universal Studios, an upcoming remaster for DKC Returns. These aren’t really the makings of a series on ice. At the very least, it’s hard to argue the IP as a whole is in a dormant state. The games themselves probably continue to be backed up from Prime 4. Not that I particularly expect a new character myself, but it’s kind of disingenuous to lump it in there.

Hell, even F-Zero is not a dormant series anymore. F-Zero 99 is effectively a new game, regardless of whether or not people see it that way. Clearly a high budget AAA affair would cement this further in people’s minds, but for all intents and purposes F-Zero has been seeing new material in 2024. Easily the best position the series has been in since the Gamecube.

Although in fairness to BritishGuy’s point, these recent moves are likely not inspiring new support. Much of the Dixie Kong train is carried over from Brawl onward, with another spike after Tropical Freeze. Funky Kong feels like a new movement, though.
Much of the skepticism and general unsure expectations by some DK fans about the series (as well as curiosity about its presence in future editions of Smash) is all related to its deficient of activity relative to other first party IP's and lack of deeper trust towards Nintendo about the brand. If something like DKC Returns HD had been announced three years ago then you'd probably have a more hopeful feeling as it would have been seen far more as a stopgap release coming pretty reasonably after the Tropical Freeze port while the next new game was being worked on. But an announcement like that coming in 2024 six years after the Switch TF version and for release in early 2025? In this case it just doesn't immediately feel like it makes up for long drought the fandom's already been dealing with or act as a credible sign that something significant is coming.

Moreover, however much it makes theoretical sense for the next DK game to be worked on, until there's outright confirmation by Nintendo on that, a few are going to doubt it. Video game hype cycles and positive expectations are often fueled by recent releases and the promise of more new titles... and to some the latter is where Donkey Kong in general feels fairly weak. A remake of a spin-off like Mario vs DK is semi-encouraging, the theme park additions are hypothetically promising, and the cameos in SMB movie or Mario Kart 8 are nice.

However, none are outright new games primarily focused on the Donkey Kong sub-brand and all the speculation and common assumption that of course a core team in Nintendo must be working on one is not a replacement of knowledge (let alone actual evidence) of them. Often a deeper optimism for a franchise necessitates a trust that something's going to happen with it and for some there's simply not enough that Nintendo's done on the game front to earn that.
Yeah, I'd say DK and F-Zero are chilled at the moment, but not entirely on ice. They still haven't seen a new mainline title in ages; In DK's case, his most prominent appearences have been as parts of the Mario universe. The characters are still active, but they're still just supporting roles to the Mario cast. Even so, they're still doing something with the series, so they're clearly not dead in the water, either. It's an odd in-between.
 

LiveStudioAudience

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I've done the comparison before, but DK's place within Nintendo is a bit like Castlevania's status within Konami. Both get plenty of cameos in crossover titles, non-gaming media (DK with the movie, Castlevania with the Netflix show), decent merchandise and generally well-done re-releases of older games. In many respects they're fairly active IPs... but they just can't seem to just get any new releases. Heck DKC and Castlevania have both spawned (admittedly far more with the latter) small cottage industries within the indie gaming sphere based on producing spiritual sequels/tributes to their respective gameplay styles; a context partially fueled by neither franchise getting new titles.

While the conditions are quite different (Nintendo's ability/motivation for getting a permanent DK studio being up in the air and Konami simply having their fingers in so many different pies that older franchises have taken a backseat) it is interesting that both are still very alive in so many ways all without having genuinely new games to call their own for so long, with even the two pseudo exceptions (Mario vs DK & Haunted Castle) both being remakes, albeit lauded ones.
 
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Swamp Sensei

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Hey everyone, just to make a quick correction here.

I did find three suggestions for the Famicom Detective Club protagonist. I'm not familiar with the series so I was looking for what appears to be a default name of Taro Ninten.

I was looking for the wrong name. Every time I looked for Taro, I couldn't find him.

I hope that explains my goof.
 

smashkirby

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Hey everyone, just to make a quick correction here.

I did find three suggestions for the Famicom Detective Club protagonist. I'm not familiar with the series so I was looking for what appears to be a default name of Taro Ninten.

I was looking for the wrong name. Every time I looked for Taro, I couldn't find him.

I hope that explains my goof.
I'll understand if you'd rather not bother looking into this, but I assume my suggestion of Naomi Moriha [Jasmine Callsign] from Jet Impulse [DS Air] was the ONLY suggestion for the character?
 
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Swamp Sensei

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I'll understand if you'd rather not bother looking into this, but I assume my suggestion of Naomi Moriha [Jasmine Callsign] from Jet Impulse [DS Air] was the ONLY suggestion for the character?
They got three votes apparently.
 

smashkirby

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They got three votes apparently.
Wow, she did???

Not trying to make a huge deal out of this, but given how obscure she is (I'm pretty sure her home game HASN'T been acknowledged in Smash Bros. via a Trophy/Sticker/Spirit yet), I certainly can't say that's nothing.

By the way, while her home game was only released in Japan, it WAS planned for a worldwide release, with the title 'DS Air', and she herself was going to be named 'Jasmine Callsign' outside of Japan. Otherwise, she's probably more known as Naomi Moriha.
 
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fogbadge

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Hey everyone, just to make a quick correction here.

I did find three suggestions for the Famicom Detective Club protagonist. I'm not familiar with the series so I was looking for what appears to be a default name of Taro Ninten.

I was looking for the wrong name. Every time I looked for Taro, I couldn't find him.

I hope that explains my goof.
Ninten? I thought it was Yoshino
 

Quillion

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Do you guys really still need to feed into the core problem with Smash speculation and even development and marketing to some extent (over-focus on characters) instead of trying to make things better?
 

ninjahmos

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Do you guys really still need to feed into the core problem with Smash speculation and even development and marketing to some extent (over-focus on characters) instead of trying to make things better?
Unfortunately, I feel like it always delves back into that.
 

Lenidem

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Do you guys really still need to feed into the core problem with Smash speculation and even development and marketing to some extent (over-focus on characters) instead of trying to make things better?
This "core problem" being what, exactly?
 
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