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Social The Pichu Social & General Discussion Thread
- Thread starter Grim Tuesday
- Start date
Grim Tuesday
Smash Legend
/orgasm
That was beautiful.
That was beautiful.
DerfMidWest
Fresh ******
*starts tilting more*
on a side note, I've gotten better and I don't even know how <_<
all of the sudden I'm not getting 3/4 stocked... I'm getting my opponents down to 1 stock... or even beating them on occasion... I've gotten faster and am less predictable... I combo better... space better... just plain got better at everything... what is this madness and how do i make more of it º—º
on a side note, I've gotten better and I don't even know how <_<
all of the sudden I'm not getting 3/4 stocked... I'm getting my opponents down to 1 stock... or even beating them on occasion... I've gotten faster and am less predictable... I combo better... space better... just plain got better at everything... what is this madness and how do i make more of it º—º
Grim Tuesday
Smash Legend
Same thing happens to me. I don't slowly get better the more I practice, I just suddenly jump in skill.
DerfMidWest
Fresh ******
It confuses my mind.
KingClubber
Smash Ace
Hey Grim, have you ever thought about B-air as an approach for Pichu, lets me know what you think.
Grim Tuesday
Smash Legend
I use it for approaching ALL THE TIME.
IT IS AMAZING.
It's like a better version of Nair against characters like Marth, Peach, Ganondorf and Sheik.
IT IS AMAZING.
It's like a better version of Nair against characters like Marth, Peach, Ganondorf and Sheik.
DerfMidWest
Fresh ******
Yea I use it to approach allot too, Nair is just less punishable imo.
KingClubber
Smash Ace
I'm glad i asked then, i was testing some ideas for a good approach, and i remember you saying something about pichu's B-air against marth f-air.
So i researched it, and did some test and found some interesting things.
B-air has many hit-boxes that last for a very long time, and have good knock-back even after the first hit-box, unlike N-air where you must hit the with the first few frames for good knock-back so its better to start sooner rather then waiting for the last possible second.
D-tilt, and F-smash is pichu's farthest reaching attacks and have about the same reach, f-smash just pushes out very a bit farther as frames passes, but d-tilt is faster. The problem is knock-back, it seem d-tilt is made for a lead up for another attack depending on the % of damage the enemy has but you have to have it stamped onto your brain to use it fast enough or lights-outs for pichu.
D-tilt is pretty much Pichu's most technical ground attack, other then his head butt jab which only cancels into another jab.
Xp
D-smash has some good hit-stun, but the usefulness of this attack depend on a few thing. Weight, Falling Speed, Damage %, and Location. Also a bit of timing helps with invincibility frames that are in the d-smash beginning frames with most of the hit-boxes.
----
Point out any mistakes you find it this
So i researched it, and did some test and found some interesting things.
B-air has many hit-boxes that last for a very long time, and have good knock-back even after the first hit-box, unlike N-air where you must hit the with the first few frames for good knock-back so its better to start sooner rather then waiting for the last possible second.
D-tilt, and F-smash is pichu's farthest reaching attacks and have about the same reach, f-smash just pushes out very a bit farther as frames passes, but d-tilt is faster. The problem is knock-back, it seem d-tilt is made for a lead up for another attack depending on the % of damage the enemy has but you have to have it stamped onto your brain to use it fast enough or lights-outs for pichu.
D-tilt is pretty much Pichu's most technical ground attack, other then his head butt jab which only cancels into another jab.
Xp
D-smash has some good hit-stun, but the usefulness of this attack depend on a few thing. Weight, Falling Speed, Damage %, and Location. Also a bit of timing helps with invincibility frames that are in the d-smash beginning frames with most of the hit-boxes.
----
Point out any mistakes you find it this
Grim Tuesday
Smash Legend
Sounds good to me.
I use Fsmash a lot, not many people DI it properly. Down Smash is pretty cool, good in some matches for punishing landing and cross-ups and shiz.
I use Dtilt to cover the ground in front of me after I land most of the time, tack on a little extra damage. I often follow-up with an Agility dash.
The reason Bair is so good against spacing-oriented characters is because, like you said, it has multiple strong hit-boxes. So you can weave in and out with it or just throw it out as a wall without fear of being punished due to having improper timing.
I use Fsmash a lot, not many people DI it properly. Down Smash is pretty cool, good in some matches for punishing landing and cross-ups and shiz.
I use Dtilt to cover the ground in front of me after I land most of the time, tack on a little extra damage. I often follow-up with an Agility dash.
The reason Bair is so good against spacing-oriented characters is because, like you said, it has multiple strong hit-boxes. So you can weave in and out with it or just throw it out as a wall without fear of being punished due to having improper timing.
DerfMidWest
Fresh ******
Bair is a pretty cool guy.
except when i try to nair off the ledge (while somebody is recovering) and accidently bair... then i get mad.
except when i try to nair off the ledge (while somebody is recovering) and accidently bair... then i get mad.
Grim Tuesday
Smash Legend
Awesome Aesir Edge-guarding 
This may or may not interest you guys, but fakeing approaches with Agility is very legit. ICG made a chart awhile ago, no idea where it is, but it basically had Pichu's options from a full-hop depending on what the opponent does.
I've only just recently remembered it's existence, the basic idea is that if you do a full hop as Pichu you have the following legit options:
• Thunder Jolt > Follow-up pressure (if the opponent is out of your range)
• Fast-fall Nair (or maybe bair) (if the opponent tries to challenge you in the air)
• Agility diagonally backwards (or rarely forwards) (if the opponent goes to punish your landing).
I've been using this strat recently, it's pretty gewd.
EDIT: In case it wasn't obvious, space the Agility so you do the perfect landing.
This may or may not interest you guys, but fakeing approaches with Agility is very legit. ICG made a chart awhile ago, no idea where it is, but it basically had Pichu's options from a full-hop depending on what the opponent does.
I've only just recently remembered it's existence, the basic idea is that if you do a full hop as Pichu you have the following legit options:
• Thunder Jolt > Follow-up pressure (if the opponent is out of your range)
• Fast-fall Nair (or maybe bair) (if the opponent tries to challenge you in the air)
• Agility diagonally backwards (or rarely forwards) (if the opponent goes to punish your landing).
I've been using this strat recently, it's pretty gewd.
EDIT: In case it wasn't obvious, space the Agility so you do the perfect landing.
KingClubber
Smash Ace
i think the idea is just not to get hit.
Think of it this way, if you were boss at melee with Pichu and could avoid getting at all time.
Would using electric attacks effect your game?
I think Pichu is more about defensive aggression, and mind-games.
Always leading but never attacking until
A - The enemy attacks which makes openings
B - Finding a weak point in they're plan/skill
Pichu like Pikachu play very similar to Captain Falcon with they're falling speed, and long distances jumps. The aerial attacks of these characters seem more for positioning your enemy for the kill other then making the kill.
Here in this video - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SGTWI2f6AIE&feature=player_detailpage#t=48s
You see this fight against captain falcon in where pikachu use his N-air to pass through the top of his shield adding a bit of shield pressure, but staying just high enough, and fast enough to pass through the sheild without getting caught.
Each these character have good air momentum capture that lets they're attacks pass through the enemy after a dash jump so that they're aerial attacks aren't as punishable for missing, or hitting.
Look a this video - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Y8rQ_0zNIg&feature=player_detailpage#t=98s
in this combo against jiggy puff when captain falcon misses his sweet spot for his knee, it positioned jiggy puff for another knee which he sweet spots for the kill.
This also works for Pichu's N-air, if you don't sweet spot pichu n-air it can lead into another N-air which you can sweet spot for the kill.
Now if you take all this into account, prefect agility adds for great approaches, mind games, and escapes. Since pichu's jumps aren't very far you have to the reach down between you, and you enemy's attack.
I'm sill trying to figure out more ideas, and uses for pichu other aerial attacks, that does do damage to himself, i'll find them im sure.
Another thing is, though i'm sure most do this already but just an case. Use D-tilt for in place of dash attack, the dash attack reach is very poor, and is only good for stopping large hit boxes like Samus Fully Charged Shot.
But the most important thing is not to get hit, period. I know it sounds impossible but pichu is like the only only that might be able to pull this off, he's small for a reason.
Also another trick that i thought of watching a falco video. Agility Stall.
Agility Stall is just like Falco's Forward-B stall, but a lot more harder to pull off but possible. Which you do is let go the ledge by tapping back away from the stage, and immediately hit up-b, and press forward. It might take a bit to get use to, and i haven't tested it against anyone yet.
I was playing around with pichu, and found that you can agility into a ledge grab as long a your facing the ledge, and that your aren't holding up or down on the control stick. Good to know for escapes say like jump backwards off the ledge, and using Agility straight down at it.
Think of it this way, if you were boss at melee with Pichu and could avoid getting at all time.
Would using electric attacks effect your game?
I think Pichu is more about defensive aggression, and mind-games.
Always leading but never attacking until
A - The enemy attacks which makes openings
B - Finding a weak point in they're plan/skill
Pichu like Pikachu play very similar to Captain Falcon with they're falling speed, and long distances jumps. The aerial attacks of these characters seem more for positioning your enemy for the kill other then making the kill.
Here in this video - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SGTWI2f6AIE&feature=player_detailpage#t=48s
You see this fight against captain falcon in where pikachu use his N-air to pass through the top of his shield adding a bit of shield pressure, but staying just high enough, and fast enough to pass through the sheild without getting caught.
Each these character have good air momentum capture that lets they're attacks pass through the enemy after a dash jump so that they're aerial attacks aren't as punishable for missing, or hitting.
Look a this video - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Y8rQ_0zNIg&feature=player_detailpage#t=98s
in this combo against jiggy puff when captain falcon misses his sweet spot for his knee, it positioned jiggy puff for another knee which he sweet spots for the kill.
This also works for Pichu's N-air, if you don't sweet spot pichu n-air it can lead into another N-air which you can sweet spot for the kill.
Now if you take all this into account, prefect agility adds for great approaches, mind games, and escapes. Since pichu's jumps aren't very far you have to the reach down between you, and you enemy's attack.
I'm sill trying to figure out more ideas, and uses for pichu other aerial attacks, that does do damage to himself, i'll find them im sure.
Another thing is, though i'm sure most do this already but just an case. Use D-tilt for in place of dash attack, the dash attack reach is very poor, and is only good for stopping large hit boxes like Samus Fully Charged Shot.
But the most important thing is not to get hit, period. I know it sounds impossible but pichu is like the only only that might be able to pull this off, he's small for a reason.
Also another trick that i thought of watching a falco video. Agility Stall.
Agility Stall is just like Falco's Forward-B stall, but a lot more harder to pull off but possible. Which you do is let go the ledge by tapping back away from the stage, and immediately hit up-b, and press forward. It might take a bit to get use to, and i haven't tested it against anyone yet.
I was playing around with pichu, and found that you can agility into a ledge grab as long a your facing the ledge, and that your aren't holding up or down on the control stick. Good to know for escapes say like jump backwards off the ledge, and using Agility straight down at it.
Grim Tuesday
Smash Legend
Agility is awesome on the ledge. I do Axe **** all dai lawng.
KingClubber
Smash Ace
using the same idea from before it you follow the step from agility dash, you can agility dash from the ledge itself.
Grim Tuesday
Smash Legend
Yeah, it's pretty legit.
I just wish Agility had invincibility frames...
I just wish Agility had invincibility frames...
KingClubber
Smash Ace
I'm pretty much convened at this point that Pichu's N-air works like Captain Falcon F-air without the extra kick in knock-back, and the electric hit-box.
Depending on the weight, and falling speed.
You can No sweet spot Nair to
- N-air (Sweet Spot) like in the video
- D-air (Works like Falcon Up-air)
- U-air (Don't do this unless your feeling cocky, it's only help them)
I was testing some stuff out, and i think this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bj9UUq8BVqc
is possible to do with sweet spotted N-air but at an higher % of damage.
Tell me what you think Grim. Later might be on again tonight.
Depending on the weight, and falling speed.
You can No sweet spot Nair to
- N-air (Sweet Spot) like in the video
- D-air (Works like Falcon Up-air)
- U-air (Don't do this unless your feeling cocky, it's only help them)
I was testing some stuff out, and i think this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bj9UUq8BVqc
is possible to do with sweet spotted N-air but at an higher % of damage.
Tell me what you think Grim. Later might be on again tonight.
Grim Tuesday
Smash Legend
Definitely looks plausible to me.
You can start off those nair chains with bair as well.
Like, against Peach for example, Bair > Nair > Nair > Nair works.
You can start off those nair chains with bair as well.
Like, against Peach for example, Bair > Nair > Nair > Nair works.
DerfMidWest
Fresh ******
If agility had invincibility frames in the beginning (where you are standing still) that would be great... or if it was invincible the entire time... also if it just came out faster because my friend that is now experienced in Pichu fighting thanks to me looks for me to try and agility and smacks me whenever i'm stuck in the air.
KingClubber
Smash Ace
@Grim
Okay i did some more test on the idea, it doesn't work as well as C.falcon because he has the electric hit-box hit lag which make him recover from the hit faster then the one taking the hit.
Pichu doesn't have that, but it can work none the less but only after a certain damage %, and the character stats. But it does work. I manage to pull it off with three hits on ganon. Could do more but my fingers aren't fast enough, and i still have trouble doing pichu short hop. Im getting there though. I took me nearly a hour to pull it off though.
@Aesir
Don't bother thinking about that, pichu Agility will always be the way it is now, what we must do with it now is exploit it to are advantage.
And if your getting caught doing agility you've become predictable, change it up a bit with new angles. Remember it's good for approaching, escaping, and mind games. Since he already knows where and when, use that and mess with his head. Make him think you going to try the same trick, and do something that we blow his mind.
-
A new idea/theory that may or may not work.
The F-air is pretty useless but, it might be of some use off stage when you enemy is trying to get back on to stage. The idea is to interrupt they're recover by dragging them farther down from reaching the ledge, but far enough for pichu to make a safe recovery.
This is something i can't test as well someone else because of my problems using the short hop, and my instinctive double jump from my old days when i use to main Falco.
Grim, come on man. Teach something new we haven't gotten nothing new in a while from you.
I'm just doing theory work, but you know practicals come on help us out a bit.
- - -
Also we need someone to start going to tournaments to represent pichu, no point in saying pichu is better, if no one is going to prove it.
Okay i did some more test on the idea, it doesn't work as well as C.falcon because he has the electric hit-box hit lag which make him recover from the hit faster then the one taking the hit.
Pichu doesn't have that, but it can work none the less but only after a certain damage %, and the character stats. But it does work. I manage to pull it off with three hits on ganon. Could do more but my fingers aren't fast enough, and i still have trouble doing pichu short hop. Im getting there though. I took me nearly a hour to pull it off though.
@Aesir
Don't bother thinking about that, pichu Agility will always be the way it is now, what we must do with it now is exploit it to are advantage.
And if your getting caught doing agility you've become predictable, change it up a bit with new angles. Remember it's good for approaching, escaping, and mind games. Since he already knows where and when, use that and mess with his head. Make him think you going to try the same trick, and do something that we blow his mind.
-
A new idea/theory that may or may not work.
The F-air is pretty useless but, it might be of some use off stage when you enemy is trying to get back on to stage. The idea is to interrupt they're recover by dragging them farther down from reaching the ledge, but far enough for pichu to make a safe recovery.
This is something i can't test as well someone else because of my problems using the short hop, and my instinctive double jump from my old days when i use to main Falco.
Grim, come on man. Teach something new we haven't gotten nothing new in a while from you.
I'm just doing theory work, but you know practicals come on help us out a bit.
- - -
Also we need someone to start going to tournaments to represent pichu, no point in saying pichu is better, if no one is going to prove it.
Grim Tuesday
Smash Legend
I'm sorrry
Yeah, that fair gimp works.
Let's see, fair has other uses. If the opponent misses a tech below you, you can fast-fall through the platform with a fair.
If you are moving fast enough, it is very difficult to punish and can lead to little hit & run games where it will "combo" into silly things like smashes and grabs just because your opponent screwed up the read.
If you want some more practical stuff... I might make a chain-grabbing guide or something.
Yeah, that fair gimp works.
Let's see, fair has other uses. If the opponent misses a tech below you, you can fast-fall through the platform with a fair.
If you are moving fast enough, it is very difficult to punish and can lead to little hit & run games where it will "combo" into silly things like smashes and grabs just because your opponent screwed up the read.
If you want some more practical stuff... I might make a chain-grabbing guide or something.
DerfMidWest
Fresh ******
Fair gimp works well against spacies.
And I go to tourneys as Pichu :D
but i don't place well... at all...
And I go to tourneys as Pichu :D
but i don't place well... at all...
Grim Tuesday
Smash Legend
I go to tournies as Ice Climbers and Falco and place well, lol.
KingClubber
Smash Ace
Okay good, nice to know the gimp does work. Tell me how do you guys use it, before they try to make a recovery or during they're recovery?
@Aesir
How long have you been playing Pichu?
@ Grim
I do the same with Falco, and maybe Roy some times.
Off-topic: They really need to rethink Roy gameplay, they aren't any points in using his aerials, other then N-air when you can replace them with flare blade, and be better for it. I think they're trying to hard to be flashy with him like marth is. F-air to f-smash, looks flashy but could have just used flare blade for more knock back, and hit stun then prepare an attack or counter attack. The need to stop looking at marth, roy is never going to be able to play like that guy. Roy is just way to slow, Needs less Combo's, and more Killing.
Back on Topic:
@ Grim
A chain grab combo guide, i can use it. The only chain throw i ever use is f-throw to f-throw, I know, i know. But i try to keep moving, i hate stay still for any short amount of time when playing smash, staying still is a mistake to me.
@All
I'm try to make a directional Knock-back Guide for Pichu's attacks, im going to base it of my studies of PSA from brawl. But im going to have to find a program to divide gifs images. I think i might know some who can make it for me though.
@Aesir
How long have you been playing Pichu?
@ Grim
I do the same with Falco, and maybe Roy some times.
Off-topic: They really need to rethink Roy gameplay, they aren't any points in using his aerials, other then N-air when you can replace them with flare blade, and be better for it. I think they're trying to hard to be flashy with him like marth is. F-air to f-smash, looks flashy but could have just used flare blade for more knock back, and hit stun then prepare an attack or counter attack. The need to stop looking at marth, roy is never going to be able to play like that guy. Roy is just way to slow, Needs less Combo's, and more Killing.
Back on Topic:
@ Grim
A chain grab combo guide, i can use it. The only chain throw i ever use is f-throw to f-throw, I know, i know. But i try to keep moving, i hate stay still for any short amount of time when playing smash, staying still is a mistake to me.
@All
I'm try to make a directional Knock-back Guide for Pichu's attacks, im going to base it of my studies of PSA from brawl. But im going to have to find a program to divide gifs images. I think i might know some who can make it for me though.
DerfMidWest
Fresh ******
I've been playing Pichu since... like... I started playing melee again. early 2010 i think... mostly because I couldn't recover with anybody else, then I stopped using him and then i used him again and then I mained him and now he is my main 
Fair is a funny move. I use it usually when they are starting the recovery, but i think it would work while they are doing it too... i think it would intercept it. I know I've stopped falco's side-b with it before.
Fair is a funny move. I use it usually when they are starting the recovery, but i think it would work while they are doing it too... i think it would intercept it. I know I've stopped falco's side-b with it before.
Grim Tuesday
Smash Legend
@Clubber
I generally run off the stage and do a fair to intercept their recovery, if that fails I do a rising fair back on-stage.
Off-topic: Conversely, I think Marth could copy some stuff from Roy's playstyle. Both his Side and Neutral B are REALLY underused.
I generally run off the stage and do a fair to intercept their recovery, if that fails I do a rising fair back on-stage.
Off-topic: Conversely, I think Marth could copy some stuff from Roy's playstyle. Both his Side and Neutral B are REALLY underused.
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
Pichu's lowest Nair gives +1 on block.
What the metagame?
Low Nair > grab is LEGIT?!
Mind = blown
What the metagame?
Low Nair > grab is LEGIT?!
Mind = blown
Grim Tuesday
Smash Legend
The meta-game right now is like... SH nair/bair, FH bair, uair juggling, Agility approaches and Agility mind-games.
DerfMidWest
Fresh ******
I like too dash dance. pichu looks like he has 2 heads.
Nicknyte
Smash Lord
I just like to Shffl Nairs, whenever someone's at high damage and finish off with a dair. The dair properties are really good, because, it has low trajectory and good knock back.
If it's a heavy, i usually do the same, but then I use up air and follow up with a dair. Works pretty well.
If it's a heavy, i usually do the same, but then I use up air and follow up with a dair. Works pretty well.
KingClubber
Smash Ace
Working on that now, i'm hoping to find some solid stuff that will advance this, Pichu specialty at the moment is gimping, and mind games, but we still need someone to represent Pichu in tournaments or all will be for naught.
KingClubber
Smash Ace
Long time no see NITE.
Nicknyte
Smash Lord
Why, hello there. QUEENGRUBBER.
KingClubber
Smash Ace
Cut me some slack. One letter, u ruined my name for one letter?
I might be King, but even gods make mistakes.
I might be King, but even gods make mistakes.
Nicknyte
Smash Lord
That Y is as important your name, sir. :D
I might not be King, but my name is Elvis Thompson.
I might not be King, but my name is Elvis Thompson.
![Эикельманн [РУС]](/data/avatars/l/153/153661.jpg?1415225120){kind=avatar}
Эикельманн [РУС]
Banned via Administration
i'm going to be using a lot of pichu and roy at genesis. look out for me if you're there, king clubber.
DerfMidWest
Fresh ******
I need some help with the IC matchup.
Also with ganon a little bit too... while facing ganon I counterpick FD and Rainbow Cruise and just try to not get grabbed and up-smash allot. Down Smash also seems to be better for gimping his recovery than F-smash. what really annoys me is the D-throw -> U-smash combo, but I'm getting out of it more easily.I also find it better to approach ganon from underneath with a Uair when he tries to do an arial because it stops his dair and his fair doesn't hit underneath him for awhile and my uair just wins. Fair seems to be pretty good too. for comboing i' mostly just juggling with uair or doing to grab combos. d-throw -> upsmash seems to work pretty good.
what else should I try to be doing? (and how do i fight the ICs)
Also with ganon a little bit too... while facing ganon I counterpick FD and Rainbow Cruise and just try to not get grabbed and up-smash allot. Down Smash also seems to be better for gimping his recovery than F-smash. what really annoys me is the D-throw -> U-smash combo, but I'm getting out of it more easily.I also find it better to approach ganon from underneath with a Uair when he tries to do an arial because it stops his dair and his fair doesn't hit underneath him for awhile and my uair just wins. Fair seems to be pretty good too. for comboing i' mostly just juggling with uair or doing to grab combos. d-throw -> upsmash seems to work pretty good.
what else should I try to be doing? (and how do i fight the ICs)
Grim Tuesday
Smash Legend
Ice Climbers: It's hard, very hard. Use jolts and be quick, don't go for anything risky. ICs are at the perfect weight for comboing and have a crap air game though, so you can get lots of damage off of a single Uair. Shield and wave-dash out of shield a lot so as not to get hit by unexpected wave-dash down smashes. Jump over Ice Blocks if they camp with them, and if they try and blizzard camp under a platform try and get behind them as quickly as you can to punish, but watch out for Up Smash and Up Air while doing this. If they try and dair while falling to escape being juggled, you can crouch-cancel > up smash/down smash.
Ganondorf: Take him to Kongo Jungle instead and camp him out Pink Shinobi vs. Rockcrock style. Against Ganon you want to stay cautiously close, wave-dash in when you see an opening and like you said: Uair (Up Tilt also works AND I think it beats his dair). Make sure you don't get baited by a short hop though, cause he can always wave-land or double jump > anything.
Ganondorf: Take him to Kongo Jungle instead and camp him out Pink Shinobi vs. Rockcrock style. Against Ganon you want to stay cautiously close, wave-dash in when you see an opening and like you said: Uair (Up Tilt also works AND I think it beats his dair). Make sure you don't get baited by a short hop though, cause he can always wave-land or double jump > anything.
DerfMidWest
Fresh ******
could upsmash and/or fsmash beat out their dsmash?
Grim Tuesday
Smash Legend
Fsmash might be able to.