Terios the Hedgehog
Smash Hero
And if it proves him all powerful then by all means ban his ***.
And just because people are naturally better with metaknight than say Pokemon Trainer doesn't mean he's TOO good.
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The Official "Should/Will Metaknight be banned?" Thread (LISTEN TO THE SBR PODCAST!)
- Thread starter SamuraiPanda
- Start date
- Status
And just because people are naturally better with metaknight than say Pokemon Trainer doesn't mean he's TOO good.
Terios the Hedgehog
Smash Hero
I said MIGHT. And if the ones that are useful against other characters fall to the side then it's the players fault. If Metaknight is banned then progress against him could stagnate. We could be banning a character that has NO RIGHT to be banned. Individual character communities have tried to step up their game to deal with Metaknight too. That helps the metagame more than anything.
If he's not unstoppable there is no reason to want him banned. And so what if he provides an advantage? If that was a problem all tourney matches would be Falcon dittos.
I don't need any proof. I'm not tryinig to take any definitive action. I didn't say someone will find a counter. I just said we need to wait because it's possible. If he was THAT overpowered he'd control at LEAST a majority. Stop jumping the gun.
Edit: Sorry for the double post. I assumed someone would have posted by now. >.<
Master Raven
Smash Master
It's pretty obvious that players will be better using MK given he's the best character in the game and is easy to use. I don't see why people would be surprised with that at all.
Yuna's kind of sensitive.
Watch out.
It helps the metagame figure out how to deal with someone who has MK's characteristics. That means ... MK. Alternatively, they could be focused on strategies that improve their character against everyone else, as they attempt to win tournaments and weaken their worst matchups against them. But no, they're focused on Meta Knight. At worst the point is neutral about the metagame, but you've done little to prove that MK staying in is helping it.
Wrong. Because anyone except MK you can pick a character and gain an advantage, if your opponent went and announced who they were playing. You can also realistically stage counter them. This just doesn't happen with MK (Except in like, one stage combo -- so if he bans Corneria, Snake can't do it to him anymore).
You need proof if you're going to disagree with my facts. Facts > opinion. Feel free to say you don't feel it's time yet, I can't argue against your opinion on that (Though I can ask why you believe anything will change).
That is a bold-faced lie and you know it.
We're saying "It's too early to tell" because it has yet to be cemented that he's "too good" (or even as good as he is today). We're not speculating that things will get better, we're saying that it's too early to tell whether or not they will.
We're not saying there will be a counter, we're saying not enough time has been given to try to work out counter-strategies (also, not enough people are trying hard enough).
Hehe. I think not Yuna my dear.
I really do think you are, but with rhetoric you're able to portray yourself from a non emotional stand-point. Which is the correct way to debate!
It's like you were indoctrinated to be like that, at birth!
GofG
Smash Champion
I think Sky's actually gay.
>.<
I think he'd be cooler if he were gay.
>.<
I think he'd be cooler if he were gay.
Daimonster
Smash Journeyman
I'm going to have to agree that there hasn't been enough time to tell. However, it is also known to us that there are zero other characters that have a moveset that can combat his. MK has every tool necessary to combat every situation.
Based on how the game currently is, I don't see any advanced techniques coming out that would lessen MK's options and strengthen other characters options.
Based on how the game currently is, I don't see any advanced techniques coming out that would lessen MK's options and strengthen other characters options.
What proof do you have of me being sensitive? I don't care what people say about me as long as they don't break the forum rules in saying it (or if they lie or exaggerate).
If you mean "sensitive" in a gay way, then sure.
Sky plays Peach. Of course, he plays Brawl Peach so he might not fit the Rainbow Peach Brigade theory.
thechunkylover
Smash Apprentice
Not sure if anyone mentioned this but...
I propose a temperary ban. Where other characters can build on their metagame's for a couple of months. After the ban if he still is dominating then permanent ban.
I propose a temperary ban. Where other characters can build on their metagame's for a couple of months. After the ban if he still is dominating then permanent ban.
GofG
Smash Champion
He told me he wasn't a flamboyantly gay black guy when i was talking to him on AIM, but I never really believed him.
Actually, this just in.
In order to counter this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zCFwdQE6uP4&feature=related
I actually went out and had SECKS. With a girl. Girl being the operative word.
Brawl peach is left to the Overweight African americans. Leave it to us to play her.
SOON I WLL TAKE EDREEEEEEEEEEZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ MUHAHAHA.
And brawl peaches are Straight.
stop trying to get into my pants GofG =D
In order to counter this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zCFwdQE6uP4&feature=related
I actually went out and had SECKS. With a girl. Girl being the operative word.
Brawl peach is left to the Overweight African americans. Leave it to us to play her.
SOON I WLL TAKE EDREEEEEEEEEEZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ MUHAHAHA.
And brawl peaches are Straight.
stop trying to get into my pants GofG =D
GofG
Smash Champion
A temporary ban?!
What a brilliant idea! I can't believe no one has thought of th— OH WAIT
Sky, it's not like there's enough room for me in your pants while you're in there LOL JK :D <3
Lol Ur Rite Im Fat H4h4h4h4h4h4
GofG
Smash Champion
<3 Why don't I have your aim, sky?
Straight guys don't want to get into your pants because you don't look like a 17-yearold girl.
I dunno why straight men would want to get into a straight guys pants.
Dayum. Look at this.
Sexuallity in a MK thread. I see where this is going.
ShadowLink84
Smash Hero
And we all know you do.
I am serious.
yuna is so...feminine. Considering he seems so...masculine.
O_O
Did you know?
That when I dream, I dream of you cradling me in your arms, telling me stories of your R.O.B, and then lulling me to sleep?
No homo.
ShadowLink84
Smash Hero
There are those weird people who like it. Is it fine in those instances?
choknater
Smash Obsessed
This thread gets me hot. Kinda like using an academy award as a sex toy.
"Come here, Oscar...~~!"
"Come here, Oscar...~~!"
PeeP
Smash Apprentice
I don't even know why this thread is still open.
We are talking about random sh*t and n00bs keep coming in and presenting overused arguments as their own.
And now two respected (lol) members of our community (OS and Yuna) have pretty much given up on this thread.
Just close it. PLEASE close it.
We are talking about random sh*t and n00bs keep coming in and presenting overused arguments as their own.
And now two respected (lol) members of our community (OS and Yuna) have pretty much given up on this thread.
Just close it. PLEASE close it.
Sesshomuronay
Smash Lord
but it hasta reach 9000!!!
Terios the Hedgehog
Smash Hero
Daimonster
Smash Journeyman
Nobody argues with me.
edit: I'm wrong about that ^^. People do argue with me.
edit: I'm wrong about that ^^. People do argue with me.
ftl
Smash Journeyman
You're wrong about that. People do argue with you.
Maybe what you said has already been said a jillion times and maybe, just maybe, we've already addressed it a jillion times.
OS and ROB broke up a long time ago. Don't let his stories fool you, they are lies. He threw ROB into the gutter and went with MK. He said it was just to prove a point, but ROB won't take him back. This is the real reason OS doesn't want to go to tournaments with MK anymore. MK just abuses him, and he can't take ROB because ROB just won't accept him anymore.
Tragic romance at its finest.
Daimonster
Smash Journeyman
Would you please refer me to the page in which it was addressed? If not, would you bother giving a brief explanation about the matter?
Natch
Smash Ace
HAI GUYS.
Now, to put this whole situation into perspective:
We are currently posting in the second volume of a topic which itself has over 500 pages worth of posts. Very heated and charged debate is going on. All for the sake of a video game. A video game.
It is safe to say that trying to compare SSBB to slavery is inane. Slavery is a complete violation of basic human rights. SSBB is a video game in which you beat the crap out of each other with characters from a large variety of video game "franchises", so to speak.
It is fine that the anti-ban side believes that MK should not banned because he is not Akuma style broken. What I am taking issue with is the fact that the anti-MK side(some of it anyways) whole-heartedly believe that the ONLY CRITERIA FOR BANNING is if a character is Akuma style broken. This contradicts something at the very heart of SSBB.
Fun.
Why did people even start PLAYING this **** game? Because it was fun. Melee was fun. The original SSB was fun. It is safe to assume that people would stop playing this game if it wasn't fun. The only reason one would continue playing this game is because they make money off of it at a reasonable rate. And those people are in the minority. Clearly, the opinions of those who play for fun and those who play money are very different.
-People who play for fun will want MK banned when the game stops becoming fun and/or they think it's going that way.
-People who play for money will want MK banned when the game becomes less profitable and/or they think it's going that way.
If you play for both fun AND money, that means you have to have both those criteria fullfilled to want MK banned. This isn't absolute-some may play for fun, and the money is just a bonus.
It should be noted that if the masses are having a very hard time against MK, and the pros do not, it probably comes down to the abilities of the player, not the character. A pro who can effectively predict what you're going to do is going to say MK is beatable. That's because YOU'RE beatable. It's not because your CHARACTER is beatable. But when the pros are against other pros, suddenly the character starts to matter more.
At anything below the highest levels of player, the character is hindered by the player. It doesn't matter that the Ice Climbers have a zero-death chaingrab if you can't do it. At the highest levels of play, the player is hindered by the player. It doesn't matter how well you can do the Ice Climbers zero-death chaingrab if you're outranged on every count.
Ergo, MK will always be "beatable" because the ungodly skill of the pros who can beat any non-pro MK.
Now, to put this whole situation into perspective:
We are currently posting in the second volume of a topic which itself has over 500 pages worth of posts. Very heated and charged debate is going on. All for the sake of a video game. A video game.
It is safe to say that trying to compare SSBB to slavery is inane. Slavery is a complete violation of basic human rights. SSBB is a video game in which you beat the crap out of each other with characters from a large variety of video game "franchises", so to speak.
It is fine that the anti-ban side believes that MK should not banned because he is not Akuma style broken. What I am taking issue with is the fact that the anti-MK side(some of it anyways) whole-heartedly believe that the ONLY CRITERIA FOR BANNING is if a character is Akuma style broken. This contradicts something at the very heart of SSBB.
Fun.
Why did people even start PLAYING this **** game? Because it was fun. Melee was fun. The original SSB was fun. It is safe to assume that people would stop playing this game if it wasn't fun. The only reason one would continue playing this game is because they make money off of it at a reasonable rate. And those people are in the minority. Clearly, the opinions of those who play for fun and those who play money are very different.
-People who play for fun will want MK banned when the game stops becoming fun and/or they think it's going that way.
-People who play for money will want MK banned when the game becomes less profitable and/or they think it's going that way.
If you play for both fun AND money, that means you have to have both those criteria fullfilled to want MK banned. This isn't absolute-some may play for fun, and the money is just a bonus.
It should be noted that if the masses are having a very hard time against MK, and the pros do not, it probably comes down to the abilities of the player, not the character. A pro who can effectively predict what you're going to do is going to say MK is beatable. That's because YOU'RE beatable. It's not because your CHARACTER is beatable. But when the pros are against other pros, suddenly the character starts to matter more.
At anything below the highest levels of player, the character is hindered by the player. It doesn't matter that the Ice Climbers have a zero-death chaingrab if you can't do it. At the highest levels of play, the player is hindered by the player. It doesn't matter how well you can do the Ice Climbers zero-death chaingrab if you're outranged on every count.
Ergo, MK will always be "beatable" because the ungodly skill of the pros who can beat any non-pro MK.
Terios the Hedgehog
Smash Hero
The Great Leon
Smash Champion
zing
!
!
-Nana-
Smash Journeyman
First of all Yuna let's try not to compare a human going to jail to ****ing Metaknight lol.
Also you aren't paying attention because I said nothing about top players being for the ban I said it's split. "Enlightened players" have nothing to do with this it's the community as a whole, what will benefit it and what does it prefer. You should never base a character ban off of what top players think since they are few and far between. There are countless other bad players out there and yes the point of having fun is everything. It's a video game.
You're also contradicting yourself it does matter what 1000 bad people thing. The majority should rule in this situation.
You also have absolutely no idea what my view is on this subject so please don't attempt to put words in my mouth. I personally understand the ban but am not for it. I think far too many people are complaining about something they can get around.
So you claim MK mains shouldn't have to change characters to play well? Well then it works out the same for all the people that have changed characters because they can't beat MK's or even went MK because they were sick of losing. There are plenty of valid reason for him to be banned, the question isn't that, it's whether or not it's too early or even necessary. Your arguments for 70:30 are ridiculous since that would basically mean he dominates every single character easily which would mean there would be NO tournaments won that weren't by MK. If a ban were to take place it would have to be before he seems to be destroying people that bad.
You say things need to benefit the community and not any one person but you sound pretty one sided for yourself and top players or enlightened as you like to call yourself for some odd reason. There are far more low level players than top players and really, no one should be favored or cattered to but that's the reality. The bulk of the community aren't great players. This ban needs to benefit the community and that can be decided PARTIALLY by majority rules and obviously by a decent margian.
I'll watch and see how things unravel but as of now I'm indifferent. I considered having MK banned at my last tournament but realized I would hate to do that.
Also you aren't paying attention because I said nothing about top players being for the ban I said it's split. "Enlightened players" have nothing to do with this it's the community as a whole, what will benefit it and what does it prefer. You should never base a character ban off of what top players think since they are few and far between. There are countless other bad players out there and yes the point of having fun is everything. It's a video game.
You're also contradicting yourself it does matter what 1000 bad people thing. The majority should rule in this situation.
You also have absolutely no idea what my view is on this subject so please don't attempt to put words in my mouth. I personally understand the ban but am not for it. I think far too many people are complaining about something they can get around.
So you claim MK mains shouldn't have to change characters to play well? Well then it works out the same for all the people that have changed characters because they can't beat MK's or even went MK because they were sick of losing. There are plenty of valid reason for him to be banned, the question isn't that, it's whether or not it's too early or even necessary. Your arguments for 70:30 are ridiculous since that would basically mean he dominates every single character easily which would mean there would be NO tournaments won that weren't by MK. If a ban were to take place it would have to be before he seems to be destroying people that bad.
You say things need to benefit the community and not any one person but you sound pretty one sided for yourself and top players or enlightened as you like to call yourself for some odd reason. There are far more low level players than top players and really, no one should be favored or cattered to but that's the reality. The bulk of the community aren't great players. This ban needs to benefit the community and that can be decided PARTIALLY by majority rules and obviously by a decent margian.
I'll watch and see how things unravel but as of now I'm indifferent. I considered having MK banned at my last tournament but realized I would hate to do that.
I don't disagree with the basic idea, but I think if you play for both fun AND money you'll be willing to consider a ban if either is lost -- if it's no fun or unprofitable, you're more likely to leave for a game that actually meets both your reasons for playing.
The big problem with the anti-ban side is they have yet to justify "MK must be unbeatable to ban" when he is perfectly capable of ruining the tournament scene even if a character or two can go neutral with him.
Explain where this soft ban mentality showed up -- did Sheik start getting soft banned when she was really popular? No, people just kept playing as her and tournaments were almost all Sheik. But MK is getting heavy bias against people using him. Why is this? Could it be something other than "MK must be unbeatable" that's got people noticing he's a big problem and reacting to it? Because people are reacting to MK and how effective he is, and they didn't react similarily to a character just being popular in Melee, so something has to be different here.
I know exactly what you're saying, I don't think he'd appreciate it if people expected him to be reasonable and make well defended points.
I couldn't resist
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