The Official SBR Brawl Tier List v1.0

[.Marik]

Inb4flamewarz.... >_>

 

[Overswarm]

Wow, relying on flaming already? Surely you can do better than that. So if I disagree with your opinion you have to insult me? What sort of example is that setting to the others?
By the way, I'm typing with the Wii browser. >_>

No, really. You do. You quoted his post, repeated what he said, and then changed words until it meant what you wanted to mean.

Inb4flamewarz.... >_>

no you aren't

 

[.Marik]

[/sarcasm]

Yes I am . >:3

 

[Chis]

No, really. You do. You quoted his post, repeated what he said, and then changed words until it meant what you wanted to mean.

No, not really...>_>

If read it carefully you should how that I change nothing...

 

[M@v]

No, not really...>_>

If read it carefully you should how that I change nothing...

umm what? I can not understand that at all. I know your typing with wii but still...

"If you read it carefully you should see that I changed nothing?" <--Is that what you mean?

 

[Dastrn]

No, not really...>_>

If read it carefully you should how that I change nothing...

example:

I said "kids hate on the SBR"

you replied "lol dastrn thinks i'm a kid and against SBR."

 

[Chis]

example:

I said "kids hate on the SBR"

you replied "lol dastrn thinks i'm a kid and against SBR."

You type an essay like the one in my signature with the Wii browser and see how long it takes, without spelling mistakes. And to the other post, yes that's what ment.

What is that I smell? It smells like flames.

 

[M@v]

You type an essay like the one in my signature with the Wii browser and see how long it takes, without spelling mistakes. And to the other post, yes that's what ment.

What is that I smell? It smells like flames.

How are we flaming? Your the one that downright accused me of being biased. Wait I guess thats not a flame since YOU said it right?

 

[KevinM]

Oh snap the tier list

First post!

 

[Skler]

Posting after kevinM ftw.

 

[Chis]

My apologies if I sounded insulting Pgh-M@v-Pgh.

 

[Dastrn]

Oh snap the tier list

First post!

almost....almost.

 

[Xyro77]

*loves how the placings of xyro/tudor/rohins with samus goes unlooked*

 

[Tien2500]

I think you guys are proving why a tiny bit of information is dangerous. You take Ankoku's list as gospel when it is not; while I may be able to say "Oh wow, Kishsquared has gotten top 3 with Bowser and I watched Sliq beat DSF's metaknight on Rainbow cruise in a one stock finale when he was at a percentage disadvantage", it is more important for me to say "Ya know, even though Wolf has X amount of tournament placings... I don't really care if WolfKlaw89 got first, beating out LucarioROX and MetaSnake 37 at a 50 man tournament.

Tournament results aren't the de facto thing when it comes to tier placement; they are great signs, but there are other factors involved. You are asking us to explain our placings to you, and we are telling you that someone is placed where they are because they have shown to be that good, on average, by the SBR. Anything really specific will merely be refuted by someone else, if not the same people, unless we show them the exact same tier list they ALREADY want to see. You're not looking for information or justification for our list, you're looking for justfication as to why it isn't yours.

If you look at Bowser and say "WOW, he's high. Why?", go to the Bowser forums and hang out for a bit. Read the weekly character discussion.

The tournament results topic is the best source of data that most of us have and the best indication so far of a character's proven results.

Anything specific may be refuted by someone else. I assume by this you mean someone uneducated who is arguing just because their character isn't top tier. Whats the big deal about that? Of course there are always going to be people like that but why deprive intelligent people looking for more information for fear of trolls?

The character forums and weekly character discussions are not really an adequate source of information. First of all the character forums are all obviously biased towards their characters. The PT boards list Ivy as an advantage (or neutral... but I think advantage) against MK and Squirtle as a neutral. Character boards for lower tiered characters tend to overrate their characters while top tier characters tend to underrate theirs. The character discussions are interesting but often a bit vague and typically say nothing of match ups.

The reason we (or I at least) want the reasoning is not because we don't trust the back room (although I'm not going to blindly accept what they say either) but rather because most of us do respect them and take them as a better source of information than the character discussion forums, and feel that their insights as to why certain characters are better than others would be valuable.

Finally to those saying "play the character and find out" that really defeats the purpose of having smash boards at all. The point is to disperse information particularly from high level players (like the Back Room) to benefit the community as a whole.

 

[KevinM]

almost....almost.

Nah I got it.

And aww TGM is mad that still no one uses southern placings unless its Florida LOL

 

[Skler]

Posting after KevinM again ftw.

I think Link could achieve last place. Come on Captain Falcon, step it up.

 

[DanGR]

Of what I remember from about a month ago, the bowser boards were crying because they said he had no good matchups.(of course that's not true, but still) In most people's opinions, he's a bad character that doesn't do well in tourneys, and has bad matchups.

 

[Dastrn]

*loves how the placings of xyro/tudor/rohins with samus goes unlooked*

Overlooked is not the same thing as undervalued.

 

[Dastrn]

Of what I remember from about a month ago, the bowser boards were crying because they said he had no good mathups. He's a bad character that doesn't do well in tourneys, and has bad matchups.

Tell that to Sliq and KishSquared.

 

[DanGR]

I would if they asked what I thought.

 

[infernovia]

Oh snap the tier list

First post!

I think this is the first time I laughed at intentional humor.

The only question I have is with samus. I admit, I know nothing of her character.

Why is everyone hating on bowser. Bowser is awesome.

The character forums and weekly character discussions are not really an adequate source of information. First of all the character forums are all obviously biased towards their characters. The PT boards list Ivy as an advantage (or neutral... but I think advantage) against MK and Squirtle as a neutral. Character boards for lower tiered characters tend to overrate their characters while top tier characters tend to underrate theirs. The character discussions are interesting but often a bit vague and typically say nothing of match ups.

Look at it again.

 

[KevinM]

Of what I remember from about a month ago, the bowser boards were crying because they said he had no good matchups.(of course that's not true, but still) In most people's opinions, he's a bad character that doesn't do well in tourneys, and has bad matchups.

Haven't you realized everyone that plays Bowser johns before we ****.

We just like johning.

 

[DanGR]

If you do it the other way around, it makes you look better. :D

 

[Xyro77]

The character forums and weekly character discussions are not really an adequate source of information.

I agree with this^



If overswarm walk out and said ROB cand do XYZ on character XYZ i would believe him without thinking about it...why? Hes an "expert" on rob, thats obviously clear thru his results and his choice of a main. But, who of you in back room people are experts on yoshi? jigs? Samus(hylian isnt)? mario? Bowser? Olimar? Fox? I dont think there are any( i could be wrong) so why should u get the ultimate say? I would think(and maybe you did do this) you would want to get opinions from actual proven "experts" who know there character from front to back......Neo=marth, Anther=pikachu, DSF=snake.....ect.

And if you did do all of this, would you plz make it known to the masses? If you did, the tier list or weekly match up posts wouldnt be taken so badly....the masses would complain as much.

 

[Chis]

The tournament results topic is the best source of data that most of us have and the best indication so far of a character's proven results.

Anything specific may be refuted by someone else. I assume by this you mean someone uneducated who is arguing just because their character isn't top tier. Whats the big deal about that? Of course there are always going to be people like that but why deprive intelligent people looking for more information for fear of trolls?

Using slander will not make me wrong. I'm not the only one doubting this. I didn't say anything about my mains placement. Tournament placings is why I doubt this list. Someone has already mentioned the reasons few pages ago. So I'm an troll for having the 'Wrong' opinion? Lol...

 

[Tien2500]

Look at it again.

My apologies then. I thought at one point Ivy was listed as a neutral or advantage. In any event I am still doubtful of the claim that Squirtle is even against MK and that Charizard is neutral. (Charizard does have some useful tools against MK but he's a very big combo target and I feel MK would gimp him very easily.)

 

[Xyro77]

Nah I got it.

And aww TGM is mad that still no one uses southern placings unless its Florida LOL

Ill be honest, im a bit upset(not mad) that even though Tx is clearly better than half the **** states out there, we are overlooked. Ever since MOAST3 tx has been overlooked.....

Overlooked is not the same thing as undervalued.

Its the same thing. Either way, do dont count.......and thats ****ed up

 

[Tien2500]

Using slander will not make me wrong. I'm not the only one doubting this. I didn't say anything about my mains placement. Tournament placings is why I doubt this list. Someone has already mentioned the reasons few pages ago. So I'm an troll for having the 'Wrong' opinion? Lol...

Dude I was replying to overswarm's post from earlier. I in no way was replying to you, referring to you, or thinking of you. You're just being over sensitive here.

 

[Dastrn]

I agree with this^



If overswarm walk out and said ROB cand do XYZ on character XYZ i would believe him without thinking about it...why? Hes an "expert" on rob, thats obviously clear thru his results and his choice of a main. But, who of you in back room people are experts on yoshi? jigs? Samus(hylian isnt)? mario? Bowser? Olimar? Fox? I dont think there are any( i could be wrong) so why should u get the ultimate say? I would think(and maybe you did do this) you would want to get opinions from actual proven "experts" who know there character from front to back......Neo=marth, Anther=pikachu, DSF=snake.....ect.

And if you did do all of this, would you plz make it known to the masses? If you did, the tier list or weekly match up posts wouldnt be taken so badly....the masses would complain as much.

we did.

10wedids

 

[Tien2500]

we did.

10wedids

But thats the thing. If you did we had no way (before you posted that) to know that you did. That information makes the tier list more valid. Knowing the methodology behind it is important to us if we're going to evaluate the tier list intelligently.

 

[DanGR]

Olimar is easy peasy gimpage guys. Put him in low tier. He even loses to yoshi! What were you thinking sbr? XD

 

[Xyro77]

All i know you samus must have gotten gimped by hylian. Cause god knows me and tudor/rohins wouldnt have said samus is that bad.

 

[Takumaru]

I don't disagree with this list. Nice job on v1 guys. DK kinda surprised me but that's only because I've NEVER seen anyone use DK. I don't disbelieve it though.

As for the samus players, sorry but she is that bad. So what if you can win? I win all the time with peach and I'm not arguing her placement. You guys are just out playing other people. That doesn't make the character good it just makes you good.

 

[Dastrn]

But thats the thing. If you did we had no way (before you posted that) to know that you did. That information makes the tier list more valid. Knowing the methodology behind it is important to us if we're going to evaluate the tier list intelligently.

you've been here since 2002. You should know that you can assume the SBR is not stupid.

 

[BentoBox]

This list has been photoshopped.

 

[Overswarm]

But thats the thing. If you did we had no way (before you posted that) to know that you did. That information makes the tier list more valid. Knowing the methodology behind it is important to us if we're going to evaluate the tier list intelligently.

We're not really asking for feedback. We're just kinda giving it to you; if you truly believe someone is higher or lower, we aren't going to change your minds.

The reason this tier list is as accurate as it is is because everyone got together and compiled our knowledge and went outside of their normal boundries. In the future, we'll know more about the unknown characters and it'll be even more accurate.

 

[Kenrawr]

I don't disagree with this list. Nice job on v1 guys. DK kinda surprised me but that's only because I've NEVER seen anyone use DK. I don't disbelieve it though.

As for the samus players, sorry but she is that bad. So what if you can win? I win all the time with peach and I'm not arguing her placement. You guys are just out playing other people. That doesn't make the character good it just makes you good.

That kind of defeats the logic of basing a tier list by tourney placements :|
Azen, Chu, Chillin, Neo, Forte, M2k, etc.'s placements shouldn't count because they're "good"?

 

[Dastrn]

And if you did do all of this, would you plz make it known to the masses? If you did, the tier list or weekly match up posts wouldnt be taken so badly....the masses would complain as much.

here's the thing: the masses are always going to complain. that's what they do best. Some of you are really good smashers. But most people on any random internet message board you pick are just going to throw a fit because they don't know what they are talking about. At least 50% of the people who post here have no idea what competitive smash feels like. They just play with the same 5 people in their town over and over and the one kid who plays with Sheik and ZSS beats them every time, so they think it's the character. They don't realize that the differences in character is not nearly as great of a factor in low level smash as it is when you are playing the best.

When M2K and ChuDat play, one can generally assume that the tech skill and mind games will be world class. There's very little technical difference between them. (there is a difference, but it's small.) what matters in that matchup is characters. If ChuDat plays with DeDeDe and M2K plays with squirtle, you can generally assume that the top tier character will win.

But when you put two random kids up against each other, the characters almost don't matter. What matters most is the skill gap between the two players. And that gap, at the local level, is generally quite large.

It's THESE kinds of players that say TR4Q, because they can't see past what their experience is. They don't understand the tier list, and they probably will never need to, since they will never get any better.

That kind of defeats the logic of basing a tier list by tourney placements :|
Azen, Chu, Chillin, Neo, Forte, M2k, etc.'s placements shouldn't count because they're "good"?

We never claimed to be making a tier list based on tourney placements.

 

[Epic Kovumon]

Wolf is lower than I expected, I'm sad.

 

[Chis]

Dude I was replying to overswarm's post from earlier. I in no way was replying to you, referring to you, or thinking of you. You're just being over sensitive here.

Your right. Sorry, maybe I need to eat or something. I hope I caused no offence to you. Again sorry.