The Official SBR Brawl Tier List v1.0

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

He's better in the current enviroment, you can thank MK for that.

indeed... poor DDDs counter that MK *****....

honestly... he's RUINING the game with his existance

 

[adumbrodeus]

indeed... poor DDDs counter that MK *****....

honestly... he's RUINING the game with his existance

Well, MK doesn't **** her, the match seems to be even. It's just that both the Zelda and MK have to be incredible for that, anything less and he smashes her into a bloody pulp.


Yeah, but that's pretty much the situation. Without MK, Marth would be top tier, most of my secondaries would be far more viable, yeah. MK is annoying.

 

[Maverick69]

seems reasonable, though i see fox rising for sure in the future

I see him rising AND shining

 

[Emblem Lord]

Marth would not be top tier if MK didn't exist.

Stop perpetuating lies adumbrodeus.

Marth doesn't **** any good people hard enough to be top tier.

 

[LuigiKing]

I agree with Emblem Lord, there is no way marth would be top tier if MK was out of the question. Marth is at least somewhat FAIR to play against. He has bad recovery, thats at least a weakness, sheesh. I honestly have not one issue with marth in brawl, he is above average, but perfectly beatable, even by mid tiers.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Marth's recovery is average, but yes he is much more beatable then MK.

 

[Corigames]

this game is more than blanced enough for you too win with anyone honestly its not like melee where if fox played mewtwo odds are fox would win i still think if i played link agaisnt metanight its still more than possible too win im not even brothering worrying about teirs for brawl the game is blanced unlike melee mvc2 etc

RAGE

I still wish I could hate people to death...

 

[SlickSlicer]

Captain Falcon is the best character. You scrubs just don't know how to play him. Good players use nothing but falcon punch and always win.

 

[Xenesis]

If we wanted you to see it, you already would

and threadS. Plural.

Man, you guys should become climate change scientists. You'd do well there. Results are always worthless without the method of coming to that conclusion available to be scrutinised. And by available, really it should be anyone.

Unfortunately, without the methodology available it's no more intrinsically trustable than Gamefaqs user #23944. The only reason you get away with it is because you're the "Back Room".

 

[Corigames]

Or because if they say, "Lucas is low tier becuse he con't recover as well as other people." 5000 Lucas mains will coming BAAWWWWWING into this thread bithing about how they just don't know how to do it right. Not to mention the same situation for every Yoshi, Sonic, Peach, Samus, etc. low tier players who all think that their character is just as good as every other one if not better. they aren't, at lest not now in this meta.

Stop ragging on the backroom. If you think you can do better, on your own, then go ahead. List every god **** reason too. Then you can feel like **** when everyone and their scrubby friends moan and whine about your crappy reasons. It's pointless.

 

[Xenesis]

Blah

I don't care about the tier list, just as a scientist I disapprove of not reporting methods.

 

[Corigames]

I don't care about the tier list, just as a scientist I disapprove of not reporting methods.

And as a realist, I don't.

 

[SlickSlicer]

You're both right because:

-It would be better if sbr listed reasons for their choices.
-But if they did list reasons, everybody would BAAAAAWWWW anyways, saying stuff like [x reason] is invalid because of [y justification].

The truth is that everybody should just play Brawl the way it's meant to be played:

Captain Falcon
all items on
pictochat.

Anybody who disagrees is a scrub.

 

[Hobobloke]

i dont really care for tiers but im happy with bowsers outcome

 

[Red Arremer]

The truth is that everybody should just play Brawl the way it's meant to be played:

Captain Falcon
all items on
pictochat.

Anybody who disagrees is a scrub.

Tourney***!

 

[SlickSlicer]

Tourney***!

You've found me out, spayed fox!

 

[SwastikaPyle]

Luigi should be higher, Pikachu one or two spots lower. That is all.

 

[Darkwashu]

You're both right because:

-It would be better if sbr listed reasons for their choices.
-But if they did list reasons, everybody would BAAAAAWWWW anyways, saying stuff like [x reason] is invalid because of [y justification].

I just realized.
Reasons WOULD be nice.
Compare Tlinks position to the amount of tournaments he has won.
I'd like to here about that 8 space gap.

And not listing reasons is cauing more BAAAAAAAAAAAWWWWWWING
Like from me

The truth is that everybody should just play Brawl the way it's meant to be played:

Captain Falcon
all items on
pictochat.

Anybody who disagrees is a scrub.

I PLAY ON WARIOWARE I SUCK

 

[GreatFalco]

The gap between MetaKnight and R.O.B. is bigger than the gap between Wolf and ToonLink or Shiek and Lucas.

I see the chars order fine, though I would change something here and there, I'm probably wrong. But the division isn't that well.
At least Falcon should have his own manly tier at bottom. Another solution would be get Lucas, Ness, Mario and PT at middle, because Falcon can't handle them on the same skill level.

 

[Umby]

There's nothing wrong with providing reasons. People complaining and attempting to correct such reasons would provide adequate input for helping influence the next version of the tier list, IMO.

 

[Golem the Stern Father]

There's nothing wrong with providing reasons. People complaining and attempting to correct such reasons would provide adequate input for helping influence the next version of the tier list, IMO.

You're right, as long as one gives valid reasoning to their explaination of a tier placement (though users should stop complaining), all is good. But, you didn't mention users BAAAWing with no explaination to support, throwing opinions as facts, and the hatred.

If you disagree (or even dislike) the Brawl tier list, do what I did (see below), it definatly beats complaining, posting a surprised reaction, or discussing it in here...

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

Well, MK doesn't **** her, the match seems to be even. It's just that both the Zelda and MK have to be incredible for that, anything less and he smashes her into a bloody pulp.


Yeah, but that's pretty much the situation. Without MK, Marth would be top tier, most of my secondaries would be far more viable, yeah. MK is annoying.

well yes... this is true... I meant to make the word plural: "counters"

honestly... a LOT of charcters can beat DDD farily easily.... but with MK's stupid, the roster for tournaments is limited to people that aren't ***** by MK.... and I dunno... DDD gets lucky and a lot of his counters get cleared.... and then DDD returns the favour for MK against DK

 

[Janaye]

Tourney***!

 

[Afro_Chris]

^ lol nice pic janaye

aww man i falcon is low tier TT-TT

 

[German Wolf]

Tires don exit

lol I changed from Falcon to Snake^^

 

[Chis]

TR4Q

Tiers are 4 quitters!

People should just ignore the list. I'll say it AGAIN...Even a blind man can see this is biased, and we all know it deep inside. And it's been released far too early to be substantial. I don't know why they're not telling us the way the conducted this. Probably because it's not done probably...

 

[Grunt]

Anyone who needs reasons on positions hasn't been keeping up with the SBR character discussion, Character specific matchup discussions, or the tourney rankings.
That's what they did, why shouldn't you?

 

[Chis]

I'm not the only one questioning this list, many others who have been keeping more up to date than I have, have ben giving valid points for their concerns. Especially Bowser's placing. And many others. SBR should just post valid reasons for the placings or the complaining will continue.

 

[Browny]

or the tourney rankings.
That's what they did, why shouldn't you?

that only applies for some characters. this list looks as if its 95% tourney rankings, while sonic, bowser, zelda, and luigi are all exempt from this and just thrown in wherever. Sonic is 11 or soplaces higher in the tourney rankings thread than here, while the likes of bowser, luigi and zelda are about 10 lower in actual tourneys compared to this list. every other character seems to fit well though.

 

[Overswarm]

I think you guys are proving why a tiny bit of information is dangerous. You take Ankoku's list as gospel when it is not; while I may be able to say "Oh wow, Kishsquared has gotten top 3 with Bowser and I watched Sliq beat DSF's metaknight on Rainbow cruise in a one stock finale when he was at a percentage disadvantage", it is more important for me to say "Ya know, even though Wolf has X amount of tournament placings... I don't really care if WolfKlaw89 got first, beating out LucarioROX and MetaSnake 37 at a 50 man tournament.

Tournament results aren't the de facto thing when it comes to tier placement; they are great signs, but there are other factors involved. You are asking us to explain our placings to you, and we are telling you that someone is placed where they are because they have shown to be that good, on average, by the SBR. Anything really specific will merely be refuted by someone else, if not the same people, unless we show them the exact same tier list they ALREADY want to see. You're not looking for information or justification for our list, you're looking for justfication as to why it isn't yours.

If you look at Bowser and say "WOW, he's high. Why?", go to the Bowser forums and hang out for a bit. Read the weekly character discussion.

 

[M@v]

I think you guys are proving why a tiny bit of information is dangerous. You take Ankoku's list as gospel when it is not; while I may be able to say "Oh wow, Kishsquared has gotten top 3 with Bowser and I watched Sliq beat DSF's metaknight on Rainbow cruise in a one stock finale when he was at a percentage disadvantage", it is more important for me to say "Ya know, even though Wolf has X amount of tournament placings... I don't really care if WolfKlaw89 got first, beating out LucarioROX and MetaSnake 37 at a 50 man tournament.

Tournament results aren't the de facto thing when it comes to tier placement; they are great signs, but there are other factors involved. You are asking us to explain our placings to you, and we are telling you that someone is placed where they are because they have shown to be that good, on average, by the SBR. Anything really specific will merely be refuted by someone else, if not the same people, unless we show them the exact same tier list they ALREADY want to see. You're not looking for information or justification for our list, you're looking for justfication as to why it isn't yours.

If you look at Bowser and say "WOW, he's high. Why?", go to the Bowser forums and hang out for a bit. Read the weekly character discussion.

^people will never be satisfied sadly enough, but thats human nature. Once again people, this is VERSION 1. The SBR in total has been to more tourneys than pretty much anyone, I think thats sufficient enough. And biased? Your kidding right? Just because your good with a character doesn't mean hes automatically high tier. Its the super smash brothers brawl tier list, not the "Me,myself, and I tier list". Its general rankings. Not only are you guys massively disagreeing with the tier list and calling it completely wrong and biased, but you are also assaulting the sbr, which is completely stupid. There WOULDN'T be a tier list without them. Go to a bunch of high level tourneys, and play every character and examine every little detail, THEN you can argue about the tier and call it bogus list once you know what your talking about. I'm not trying to sound angry here, but its the truth. THATS what SBR does to get tier lists.

 

[Chis]

^people will never be satisfied sadly enough, but thats human nature. Once again people, this is VERSION 1. The SBR in total has been to more tourneys than pretty much anyone, I think thats sufficient enough. And biased? Your kidding right? Just because your good with a character doesn't mean hes automatically high tier. Its the super smash brothers brawl tier list, not the "Me,myself, and I tier list". Its general rankings. Not only are you guys massively disagreeing with the tier list and calling it completely wrong and biased, but you are also assaulting the sbr, which is completely stupid. There WOULDN'T be a tier list without them. Go to a bunch of high level tourneys, and play every character and examine every little detail, THEN you can argue about the tier and call it bogus list once you know what your talking about. I'm not trying to sound angry here, but its the truth. THATS what SBR does to get tier lists. If you dont like the tier list, WORK TO CHANGE IT with your character by ranking in major tourneys!

See how I NEVER talked about my mains once in any of my post? Or that I wanted (put name of my main in here) moved up, down, left or right. I knew It be a matter of time until someone posted something like this. Biased? Let's admit it, alot of people posting here are biased. More so if the agree with the placings. My post a few pages ago should sum it up. And why shouldn't I doubt the SBR? I've got a brain don't I? That part of your post shows your quite biased yourself. That is all.

 

[M@v]

Way to read my post completely wrong.....

See how I NEVER talked about my mains once in any of my post? Or that I wanted (put name of my main in here) moved up, down, left or right.

1st off, im referring to everyone in general, Im not targeting this at just you. I know for a fact many of those calling the tier list complete bull#$@% havent done enough to say a legit opinion as of yet. HECK i havent, thats why I haven't commented on it.I have played a lot of matches and been to a few smaller tournies, but I havent been to the big ones, where a lot of the Tourney results are from. And I haven't rigourously sat down with every single character, played them. I have read a lot of advanced discussions, but its still not enough, since I havent played every character rigiourously myself. I've seen way too many main fanboys in this thread, but likes thats a suprise Once again, this is IN general, not at you. You shouldnt be worried about my post if you know you dont fit into what I said.

I knew It be a matter of time until someone posted something like this. Biased? Let's admit it, alot of people posting here are biased.More so if the agree with the placings. My post a few pages ago should sum it up.

I'm not saying that. Take a good look at the thread. A large number of people directly accused the sbr of making a biased tier list. I'm not saying people are biased.

And why shouldn't I doubt the SBR? I've got a brain don't I?

Never said you didn't have one, or that you can't doubt the SBR. All I'm asking is that people put enough work into analyzing the characters before arguing about the SBR's results. And that just doesn't mean"everyone says MK is god and Falcon is suck, so thats the law of the land."DO research yourself and draw conclusions. Its like a scientific experiment almost.As I said, don't post unless you've done your homework on the characters, and have seen/played your fair share of serious matches.

That part of your post shows your quite biased yourself. That is all.

Do explain how I am biased, even though I never mentioned myself in the thread, and that I'm merely stating fact on how a tier list is formed, and all I say is to conduct that procedure yourself before saying that the SBR is right/wrong. And Ill stress this for the 100th time, this is the verison one tier list...-_-.

 

[Dastrn]

See how I NEVER talked about my mains once in any of my post? Or that I wanted (put name of my main in here) moved up, down, left or right. I knew It be a matter of time until someone posted something like this. Biased? Let's admit it, alot of people posting here are biased. More so if the agree with the placings. My post a few pages ago should sum it up. And why shouldn't I doubt the SBR? I've got a brain don't I? That part of your post shows your quite biased yourself. That is all.

Most people that can't argue to back up their whining bring up some variation of this statement:

"So you are saying I should just believe everything I'm told by (the man) (the government) (the system) (authority) ?!?!?!?!"

It's so funny to me how all of the sudden kids are hating on the SBR because they see it as some governing group that looks down on all of them, not realizing that everyone in there are players, tournament organizers, and just regular dudes trying to help the community.

I hear the word "biased" tossed around a lot, but I don't think you really know what you are saying when you use that word. The word implies that the SBR made a decision not because of honest evaluation but because of some special interest. What, exactly, is the special interest that you are referencing when you call us biased? What is in it for us to inaccurately rank characters? What do we get out of voting inaccurately?

Since everyone is using Bowser as a reason to complain about the list, I'll talk about Bowser. He's one of my secondaries. Everyone around my level that I play has trouble against my Bowser. I still lose to players better than me, and I still beat players worse than me. But when I'm playing people at my level, my Bowser gives them fits. He's vastly underestimated by most people because he looks big and slow. But if you watch players who know how to space well playing with Bowser, he suddenly doesn't seem so slow anymore. You realize how quick his Fair comes out. You realize how good his tilts are. You see that his recovery isn't as bad as you thought. You see that klaw is better than just a gimmick suicide trick. You see how all of his smashes kill. You see that his F-smash kills at retardedly low %s. You realize that he can compete with Metaknight. You see him competing with G&W.

Bowser is not a half bad character at all. Mid-tier is definitely appropriate for a character with his strengths and weaknesses. If Bowser had 30% more range in his recovery, and his Fsmash came out twice as fast, he would be easily top 8.

 

[.Marik]

Tiers r 4 queers.. >_>

 

[adumbrodeus]

Marth would not be top tier if MK didn't exist.

Stop perpetuating lies adumbrodeus.

Marth doesn't **** any good people hard enough to be top tier.

Not lies, not having a real disadvantage (55-45 is still a neutral) against anyone when others have clear disadvantages is overall more effective.

Unless there's another char which can claim the status of "no real counters, hard or soft" minus mk, he's the most logical choice. That's a match-up set-up fitting a top tier, but barely.

So he'd be top, not because he ***** the most, but because he gets ***** the least.

 

[Chis]

Thank you for replying Pgh-M@v-Pgh. Biased? the 'And biased? your kidding right?', or this one 'Not only are you guys massively disagreeing with the tier list and calling it completely wrong and biased, but you are also assaulting (you ment insulting right?) the sbr, which is completely stupid'. Then start praising SBR. You can't blame me if that sounded biased...Oh and statements are ment be be backed up by facts.

I'm accusing the sbr of making a biased tier list, is that bad?

Lol, DastrnMarco thinks i'm a kid. And thinks i'm against sbr. Back it up with facts and not statements please.
Also look up the meaning of whining, 'To complain continuously in an irritating mannor.' I've hardly complained that much >_>

 

[Overswarm]

lawl... Chis needs to work on his reading comprehension skills XD

 

[M@v]

Thank you for replying Pgh-M@v-Pgh. Biased? the 'And biased? your kidding right?', or this one 'Not only are you guys massively disagreeing with the tier list and calling it completely wrong and biased, but you are also assaulting (you ment insulting right?) the sbr, which is completely stupid'. Then start praising SBR. You can't blame me if that sounded biased...Oh and statements are ment be be backed up by facts.

I'm accusing the sbr of making a biased tier list, is that bad?

without facts, yes. WHY are they making a biased tier list, thats my WHOLE point! Post why you think it. Thats when it becomes debate, not mindless argument. And when I said completely stupid, I immediately say what people should do to make an intelligent argument. Theres your facts.

 

[Chis]

lawl... Chis needs to work on his reading comprehension skills XD

Wow, relying on flaming already? Surely you can do better than that. So if I disagree with your opinion you have to insult me? What sort of example is that setting to the others?
By the way, I'm typing with the Wii browser. >_>