The Official Geno Thread

[FlipTroopa]

Calling Geno a valuable part of the plot is like calling Mallow a valuable part of the plot...

And while I admit that Geno on Sakurai's poll DOES help him...

Well, alongside characters like Cpt. Syrup, Link's Uncle, and James friggin' Bond...

THAT doesn't help him...

Again, though, we have different levels of "character" being suggested on the poll. Top "voted" characters seem to be becoming playable while mid-level and bizarre low-level are becoming Assists.

King Dedede, Diddy, and Ike are all top-voted characters. Trainer, Wario, Pit, Meta Knight were all top-voted for Melee. Lucas appears at the mid-to-low level for Brawl but was promised by Sakurai. Sonic is the only character to appear once on the poll and get in.

Stafy, Waluigi, Samurai Goroh, Punch-Out, Saki, etc. all appear on the Brawl poll somewhere, either once or twice.

There is an obvious bias towards characters who were on the poll. The ONLY exception to this rule is Solid Snake and we know the reason he's in has nothing to do with Smash: it was a personal favor from Sakurai to Kojima.

And so if Geno has a high ranking in the Toukoken smack dab between three playable characters, he's got a very, very high chance of appearing. Esp. when he was brought up so many times on the earlier pre- and post-Melee polls.

EDIT: I should also add that almost all the Melee newcomers were mentioned on the Melee poll that came out just after SSB64. Bowser, Peach, Mewtwo, Marth, Ganondorf, Zelda, Sheik, Young Link, and Falco dominated their franchises. Dr. Mario, Pichu, Game and Watch, Roy, and Ice Climbers were the only "SURPRISE" additions Sakurai came up with on his own.

Diddy Kong and Dedede, alongside the ones I mentioned above, also ranked highly on the polls. Geno was in the Top Ten for Mario then (with very little votes, but he was there), and now he dominates the Top Choices for Mario altogether. And, if you bother to read fan input on either poll, Geno is consistently not only requested but marked as a favorite character, Mario RPG as a favorite game, etc. etc. Keep in mind that Japan has completely different tastes from the US. To them, Mario RPG was like the ultimate lovechild of video gaming--Nintendo and Square finally making a game together. It should not be a surprise to anybody if the Japanese fanbase goes crazy over the game not having any representation. It was a big deal.

It sold over a million copies, which is no mean feat for any game. One of the lowest sellers of the Mario series, BUT IT STILL SOLD OVER A MILLION COPIES. That's worthy of praise.

 

[antimatter]

@smashbot
*sighs* did you not read any of the above posts? Geno is more important than Mallow by a large percentage. the game is basically about him. but whatever, you can just go support shy guy. i'd rather have someone in brawl that is unique and actually made for the mario universe, unlike the shy guys.

 

[Cless]

Calling Geno a valuable part of the plot is like calling Mallow a valuable part of the plot...

And while I admit that Geno on Sakurai's poll DOES help him...

Well, alongside characters like Cpt. Syrup, Link's Uncle, and James friggin' Bond...

THAT doesn't help him...

Mallow had very little plot significance. His purpose was to introduce Frogfucius and Nimbus Land. Geno changed the whole objective of the game and unified everyone's motivations.

Captain Syrup shouldn't be anything more than an AT. Wario is representing Wario Ware, not Wario Land; plus, she was only in like 2 games. Link's Uncle wouldn't be any different from Link, so AT. And James Bond? Really?

 

[FlipTroopa]

Mallow had very little plot significance. His purpose was to introduce Frogfucius and Nimbus Land. Geno changed the whole objective of the game and unified everyone's motivations.

Captain Syrup shouldn't be anything more than an AT. Wario is representing Wario Ware, not Wario Land; plus, she was only in like 2 games. Link's Uncle wouldn't be any different from Link, so AT. And James Bond? Really?

For some reason on the Melee poll, Sakurai listed James Bond under "Rare Characters." In Japan, copyrights are a bit different and since Rare held the 007 license at the time they could, I suppose, use the name and original properties from the game--even go so far as to create their own Bond who resembled none of the actors. At least, that's how I understand it.

And Captain Syrup would rock as a playable character. Female pirates are win, and besides: they need some Wario Land love in that game.

 

[Cless]

Yeah, that's Japan. That would never fly here. The game wouldn't get released here.

Fine whatever, Captain Syrup playable. I really don't care either way. Wario has his old outfit and the shoulder tackle.

 

[Mathieu21]

Ignore this message.

 

[Shuma]

Well, alongside characters like Cpt. Syrup, Link's Uncle, and James friggin' Bond...

James Bond better be a PC or a boss in SE.

 

[Storm Eagle]

I WOULD have played it, if it actually would have been released here...come on, Virtual Console!

Edit: And Link's unkle would be a badass Assist Trophy! He would give you a sword an a shield, wich would boost your strenth and defense. ^^

 

[Starphoenix]

Got a quick questiong Geno fans... Why does it always seem like Geno and Megaman are competing to be in Brawl? Why can they not both be in? I mean Megaman still is in the running, I have "passionetly" discussed why the infamous podcast was really nothing. That is besides the point, why does it seem like these 2 are always fighting?

 

[Mathieu21]

Got a quick questiong Geno fans... Why does it always seem like Geno and Megaman are competing to be in Brawl? Why can they not both be in? I mean Megaman still is in the running, I have "passionetly" discussed why the infamous podcast was really nothing. That is besides the point, why does it seem like these 2 are always fighting?

Because they both are 3rd party characters.

Some fan will probably tell me Geno is first party, but he isn't.

 

[Oblivion129]

Got a quick questiong Geno fans... Why does it always seem like Geno and Megaman are competing to be in Brawl? Why can they not both be in? I mean Megaman still is in the running, I have "passionetly" discussed why the infamous podcast was really nothing. That is besides the point, why does it seem like these 2 are always fighting?

I never saw them fighting, and they shouldn't be. Although Geno is owned by Square, he is considered a Mario character and a Mario rep, meaning Geno does not take a third party spot.

 

[Cless]

Because they both are 3rd party characters.

Some fan will probably tell me Geno is first party, but he isn't.

Sakurai lists Geno as a Mario character. The truth of the matter is that he isn't. Sakurai would have to get a contract with Squeenix, but if Sakurai wishes to consider him as a Mario character for his game, it's well within his rights to do so.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

I really wish we could, but the trolls and Geno Haters are making that very hard to do. Everyone's getting obsessed with debating and arguing, instead of spending that time on artwork.

Maybe from now on, we shouldn't respond to ANYTHING Anti-Geno. If we just ignore trolls and Geno haters, they'll eventually leave. Why would they stay if no one is listening to them?

I Agree; But on the same note it's hard to find ANYTHING To talk about related to geno with 15,000 Freaking pages on the puppet, All i can think of is "Make a plot with him and Paper Mario because they both collect stars in there game!" <_<...But yeh, I'm sick of the argueing.

Interesting enough for you?

OMG THAT'S A FREAKING MAZING.

Seriously, Think you can do the full picture? I Definantly want to get a downsized DOJO Pick of that for the roster i'm making (O_O.) Nice job.

Also do you have an avatar sized pic about 100 X 100 or so for that?

 

[Starphoenix]

Because they both are 3rd party characters.

Some fan will probably tell me Geno is first party, but he isn't.

No he is not first party, but technically he is not third party either... He gets his own category because he is just that cool.

Anyways, if that is the ONLY reason than that is the stupidest thing I have ever heard, Geno is a Mario character and Megaman is an actual different franchise. They are different and both popular since one was the most voted for third party character, while Megaman was the most voted for third party franchise. I want them both in and it is still open for both to appear.

 

[Starphoenix]

I admit, before I never really cared for Geno. I always played SMRPG, but could never got past the sewer part with Mario and Mallow, so I never "experienced" Geno. The way you guys have made him sound kind of makes me excited for him, granted I still desire Megaman the most, (he still has a good shot) but you guys have shot Geno up there along with Claus and Ridley. ^_^

 

[error_alt_delete]

I think the reason geno was put in the first party catagory was because of the fact that the series was first party. but not in the same way you guys are putting it, maybe sakurai was stating for every character not weather or not the characters themselfs were first party, but if the series they were from was first party. there is also the possibility that is all he cares about for the matter of third or first party, but he would still have to get the rights from whatever company owns him.(I dont care for trying to remember their new name.)

 

[Starphoenix]

Remember though, in Melee on the front page of the booklet, they had to give a little diclaimer to RARE, saying that the DK Rap, Kongo Jungle and Jungle Japes were property of Rare. Nintendo used them regardless without having to ask them because it was DK-related, that did not mean those stages were 3rd party stages, it just means they could freely use them as they pleased, just had to add the footnote in the booklet. Check it out yourself!

Same thing with Geno. Check and mate to all those Geno whiners.

 

[Cless]

No one ever listens to me...

 

[Bane84]

Cless is a man of few words.

 

[Copperpot]

There are a lot of wreckless assumptions that get spewed about. There's one in particular that urks me, like nails scraping a chalkboard.

Anyone guess what that is?

It's the assumption that, because Geno isn't a staple of Square's video game empire, that they will somehow be able to dictate what character Sakurai puts in his game.

If Square turns to Sakurai and says, "Sure, you can use Geno, but we want you to put in Cloud/Cecil/Sora. Now pony up!", Sakurai's going to say hell no if it isn't what he wants for the game. It's his project, and he probably had the roster finalized months ago. Why would he let another company dictate what he puts in his game, and then charge him to boot. Face the facts people, Square wouldn't just give one of their big names to Nintendo. They'll have to bend over for it.

Seriously, if anyone thinks that Sakurai is going to go out and get someone or something he wasn't even looking for, they're just setting themselves up for disappointment.

 

[Shadowbolt]

Remember though, in Melee on the front page of the booklet, they had to give a little diclaimer to RARE, saying that the DK Rap, Kongo Jungle and Jungle Japes were property of Rare. Nintendo used them regardless without having to ask them because it was DK-related, that did not mean those stages were 3rd party stages, it just means they could freely use them as they pleased, just had to add the footnote in the booklet. Check it out yourself!

Same thing with Geno. Check and mate to all those Geno whiners.

I... I think I love you.

 

[Copperpot]

Rare's situation during the release of Melee was a bit different than it is now. Prior to 2002, Rare was still a second party developer for Nintendo, meaning that Nintendo still had control over their intellectual properties at the time.

Interestingly, we haven't seen any of those Rare-created items announced for Brawl. It's evident that, with Rare now owned by Microsoft, Nintendo is straying from using the things listed above for said reasons.

I don't mean to burst your bubble. I just wanted to clarify a bit.

 

[AmericanGTS]

1) Nintendo is making this game, plain and simple. Sure, Sega and Konami are helping, but this is a first party game developed by a first party company and it would be surprising if there wasn't any bias. Nintendo controls almost every scenario in this game and they certainly reserve the right to decline any business contracts/propositions with any third party company. What does this mean? Capcom and Square Enix might not even get representation in Brawl. It is clearly an assumption with little evidence that another third party character is in Brawl.

2) Geno's rental fees (if there are any) could be paid for by the release of Super Mario RPG. Yes, its a well known and popular Mario game. There is so much "new" content (at the time) for Nintendo that this game certainly deserves recognition in Brawl. The point is Mario, Bowser and Peach don't clearly represent Super Mario RPG. If Nintendo is going to bother Square Enix to obtain rights to legally place Super Mario RPG representation in Brawl, why not drag Geno/Mallow along with them? Perhaps Yoko is evidence of Super Mario RPG representation?

3) There is only a small handful of people that truly know Geno's legal situation. What if there is a contract? What if he really is considered first party for Brawl standards? What if theres a deal? We don't know! How can we argue for/against what we don't even understand? Its all speculation! Maybe we should all argue with evidence instead of "I think I understand copyrights for third party characters created and developed for for first party games and thereofore I will argue for/against Geno!" We're all guilty of assumptions and such, but its getting ridiculous.

4) General arguments against Geno hold very little relevance to Brawl.

"He isn't popular" - Yet almost everyone has an opinion on his inclusion?

"He is third party" - Oh, he is? But aren't there third party characters in Brawl?

"He wasn't in ____" - So Sakurai cares all of a sudden that a character wasn't in a game?

"Not a good investment" - Can't be determined based off of what evidence we have. We don't know much about the business aspect.

"Secondary character" - Hi Falco! Oh, you brought Pichu and Jigglypuff with you?

"Cloud is a better choice" - But even if Cloud is better, he doesn't represent Nintendo's history which is a big "point" in this game.

But above all, why can't it just be "the fans want Geno". I mean, I think its safe to say at this point that Geno is quite a popular character in terms of Brawl characters. Sakurai has acknowledged Geno's existence to say the least, so how about it? Even though Geno doesn't have a ton going for him, at least he has something.

 

[AmericanGTS]

Rare's situation during the release of Melee was a bit different than it is now. Prior to 2002, Rare was still a second party developer for Nintendo, meaning that Nintendo still had control over their intellectual properties at the time.

Interestingly, we haven't seen any of those Rare-created items announced for Brawl. It's evident that, with Rare now owned by Microsoft, Nintendo is straying from using the things listed above for said reasons.

I don't mean to burst your bubble. I just wanted to clarify a bit.

Donkey Kong Country 2 (developed/copyright Rare) music has been confirmed in Brawl.

 

[Cless]

Anyway, I don't understand why they choose the Mushroom Town music from SMRPG for the stage music for Peach's Castle in Itadaki Street DS. I was coming in expecting a Mushroom Town stage after a Super Mario Kart and Yoshi's Island (SMW2 variant) stage. I was severely disappointed, and I liked the hub music in Super Mario 64 too.

Also, Diddy Kong was made by Rare was he not?

 

[Shadowbolt]

Anyway, I don't understand why they choose the Mushroom Town music from SMRPG for the stage music for Peach's Castle in Itadaki Street DS. I was coming in expecting a Mushroom Town stage after a Super Mario Kart and Yoshi's Island (SMW2 variant) stage. I was severely disappointed, and I liked the hub music in Super Mario 64 too.

That, my friend, is because Square is a bunch of *****.

 

[Cless]

Square is, but I don't think Enix as much. Itadaki Street is an Enix original. I'd have to assume that Nintendo didn't care. I'm sure one of the Enix teams worked on the game with Nintendo. And I don't think Square can ****block itself... Man, I wish Squeenix operated as one whole company instead of two separate ones sharing office space and money.

 

[Copperpot]

Donkey Kong Country 2 (developed/copyright Rare) music has been confirmed in Brawl.

Donkey Kong Country 2 was created and released during the time that Rare was still owned by Nintendo. I can't necessarily argue with you there, because I don't really know where the rights lie.

Besides, if that were the case, that would mean that Nintendo had to acquire the rights to a song from a Microsoft-owned company. What is that? Fourth-party?

It's all too complicated, I tell you.

If anything, you pretty much introduced something else in Brawl that falls along the same lines as Geno.

 

[Starphoenix]

Donkey Kong Country 2 was created and released during the time that Rare was still owned by Nintendo. I can't necessarily argue with you there, because I don't really know where the rights lie.

Besides, if that were the case, that would mean that Nintendo had to acquire the rights to a song from a Microsoft-owned company. What is that? Fourth-party?

It's all too complicated, I tell you.

If anything, you pretty much introduced something else in Brawl that falls along the same lines as Geno.

Yes it is called the 2 1/2 party loophole!

 

[Mathieu21]

Besides, if that were the case, that would mean that Nintendo had to acquire the rights to a song from a Microsoft-owned company. What is that? Fourth-party?

That would still be called third-party.

Oh man, I can't wait until Brawl is out so I can have a Smash party and stop talking about what characters are which party.

This terrible pun simply means that I'm tired of speculation.

 

[Machspeed]

That would still be called third-party.

Oh man, I can't wait until Brawl is out so I can have a Smash party and stop talking about what characters are which party.

This terrible pun simply means that I'm tired of speculation.

Just a bit more to go and it's ours, and I guarantee, reguardless of what character makes the final cut we'll still buy it anyways.

But on the note of speculation, what are we discussing?

 

[Copperpot]

We were discussing where the rights lie when Nintendo wants to include elements of Donkey Kong's games when they are technically owned by Rare, now a second-party developer for Microsoft.

Personally, I believe that since Rare was developing the titles while still under ownership of Nintendo, the rights to said games are reserved by the parent company. I could be completely wrong though, and if I am, that is a pretty confusing legal situation.

Basically, this came up because we were comparing the situation to Geno's legal mumbo-jumbo.

 

[IkexMarth]

I wanted to punch my friend soooooooooooo hard.

Me: What do you think of Geno's inclusion?

Friend: Who's Geno?

Me: He's like a possesed puppet/ scarecrow in SMRPG.

Friend: No chance.

Me: Why

Friend: He sounds like pinochio.
me: How?

Friend: When he lies, his nose grows bigged and jabs people with it.

me: **** no.

EPIC FAIL

 

[FlipTroopa]

I can feel for ya Ikex. I mentioned Geno when we were all discussing who should be in the game, and my friends all laughed. A few asked who he was and another told me Mario RPG wasn't even worth buying used at a garage sale. Biased much?

In a similar conversation with separate friends, however, they loved the idea. One of them even said that was going to be his suggestion when it got to be his turn.

The difference between the two groups? Heh... The first group was still largely in high school and played a wider breadth of games. The second group was all 20-something year olds who grew up on Nintendo. Geno definitely has a certain audience, wouldn't you say?

 

[IkexMarth]

I can feel for ya Ikex. I mentioned Geno when we were all discussing who should be in the game, and my friends all laughed. A few asked who he was and another told me Mario RPG wasn't even worth buying used at a garage sale. Biased much?

In a similar conversation with separate friends, however, they loved the idea. One of them even said that was going to be his suggestion when it got to be his turn.

The difference between the two groups? Heh... The first group was still largely in high school and played a wider breadth of games. The second group was all 20-something year olds who grew up on Nintendo. Geno definitely has a certain audience, wouldn't you say?

I think i'm the only one who played SMRPG at my school. We had a Ridley conversation and well...Anyways I hope Geno gets confirmed so then I can rub it in his face. :3

 

[Copperpot]

Pretty much the same reaction I'd get if that scenario was to ever occur. Most of my friends are in their mid to late twenties, and the majority of them (who play games) know who Geno is. They also endorse him being in Brawl.

Anyone I ask who is a non-gamer or generally younger either doesn't know who he is, or they don't like him due to their bias toward Mario's recent installments.

 

[Mathieu21]

What is this I don't even

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I've never asked any of my friends who they want in Brawl...

...I actually never really cared...


We talk about...other stuff

 

["LC"_Lapen]

I've actually only had one video game saavy friend at work who knows who Geno is. Only problem is he can't really see a reason for him to be in. He was actually suprised that there was so much fan support. Other than that, no one else I know knows much about Smash Bros. much less who's included in it.

 

[Wrath`]

how long has this threwad been up? i am just wondering

geno 4 AT