The "Metaknight should/will be banned" thread.

[The Real Inferno]

I'm an MK main. I am by far not the best with him, but MK is definitely beatable.

He dies from getting hit by a ****ing pillow. Spaced projectile spam also helps. Big, Heavy characters that have hard to interecpt recovery <b>(Dedede</b>, R.O.B.) also give him a bit of a challenge.

LOL Shuttle Loop

 

[napZzz]

I'm an MK main. I am by far not the best with him, but MK is definitely beatable.

He dies from getting hit by a ****ing pillow. Spaced projectile spam also helps. Big, Heavy characters that have hard to interecpt recovery (Dedede, R.O.B.) also give him a bit of a challenge.

This is all from personal experianc though, so there are definately some holes in this.

ROB and DDD have a hard time against meta knight though...he's a big counter to them.

And someone said something about banning him for having attacks that kill at 30%, meta knight can take some characters from 0% and gimp their recovery with like, 1 Dair off stage, like ike. That move is so cheap and spammy, the angle that it sends people and range/knockback it has is ridiculous. It basically gives meta knight a huge advantage over anything with bad recovery.

Current top ranking characters
1.Meta knight
2..Snake -neutral or counter in snakes favor depending on stage
3.Game and watch-Meta knight counters
4.King DDD-Meta knight counters
...and the list goes up of meta knight countering almost all characters that are good in the game

He comes across bumps at a few neutrals, and his maybe only counter, DK.

He's a nightmare match up for most characters, and at a high enough level meta knight is pretty un beatable.

If he keeps winning tourneys for the next 6 months of brawl over others hopefully they will ban him =_=

 

[Foxtrotter]

And someone said something about banning him for having attacks that kill at 30%, meta knight can take some characters from 0% and gimp their recovery with like, 1 Dair off stage, like ike. That move is so cheap and spammy, the angle that it sends people and range/knockback it has is ridiculous. It basically gives meta knight a huge advantage over anything with bad recovery.

1) Don't get grabbed.
2) Don't get hit.
3) No johns.

... Okay, back to seriousness.

Fox can do nearly the same thing Meta Knight's dair can do with his shine, and Lucario can almost do it with his dair.

Meta Knight's recovery can be gimped, somehow, someway, just like all the other character's can.

EDIT:

Current top ranking characters
1.Meta knight
2..Snake -neutral or counter in snakes favor depending on stage
3.Game and watch-Meta knight counters
4.King DDD-Meta knight counters
...and the list goes up of meta knight countering almost all characters that are good in the game

I say wait a few more months as Brawlers search harder for ATs and find techniques to counter Meta Knight. First impressions aren't always right.

 

[maelstrom218]

The issue of banning, as SamuraiPanda already pointed out, is pretty simple: if you're going to ban a character, the only situation that would warrant it is if the said character is so broken, that no other character has a fair chance.

Meaning that, when it comes down to tourney championships, every player from Ken to Chillen to whoever else is pro nowadays, is going to inevitably choose MK. All the time. And since that hasn't happened yet--nor does it seem likely to happen--then MK isn't ban-worthy.

MK is not as broken as Akuma from SF. You can actually APPROACH MK without getting ***** and locked down. MK, as far as I can see, just has overwhelming priority, edgeguarding options, recovery, and combos (in a game that has seldom). He's not broken. He's blatantly overpowered.

And Marth was blatantly overpowered in Melee. As was Sheik. And Fox. And Falco. And Ice Climbers. Yet (assuming you guys played Melee competitively) we still found a way around it--and we should do the same thing with MK. Banning is too extreme a measure to employ, when smarter playing/tactics will (mostly) suffice.

 

[-Jumpman-]

Meta Knight should not be banned. The fact that other characters win tournaments alone is an argument. I main Meta Knight, but get beaten pretty often. This may be because of my lack of Brawl experience, but I get beaten.

Meta Knight is known for getting kills at very low percentages because of his ability to gimp very well, but characters like R.O.B. can do the same.

Meta Knight is annoying and can be called cheap, but an advantage over a lot of characters doesn't mean a guaranteed win. Meta Knight can be beaten and some characters do have an advantage if played well. So there's no reason to ban Meta Knight.

 

[ShadowLink84]

Fox can do nearly the same thing Meta Knight's dair can do with his shine, and Lucario can almost do it with his dair.

With nowhere near the speed or versatility. Lucario can't exactly go after his opponent with Dairs like MK can.
So I don't think its an accurate comparison.

Meta Knight's recovery can be gimped, somehow, someway, just like all the other character's can.[/quote
Basically relying on player error =(

EDIT:

I say wait a few more months as Brawlers search harder for ATs and find techniques to counter Meta Knight. First impressions aren't always right.

Agreed

 

[Zankoku]

lol advanced techniques to beat Meta Knight.

Here's a better idea: Learn to play smarter.

 

[Snail]

lol advanced techniques to beat Meta Knight.

Here's a better idea: Learn to play smarter.

Yeah! MK isn't overpowered, he's really easy to counter! All you've gotta do is be much better than your opponent!

Come on...

 

[ShadowLink84]

lol advanced techniques to beat Meta Knight.

Here's a better idea: Learn to play smarter.

And if our opponent is capable of the same thing?
O_O

Granted it can be winnable for a neutral matchup but what about the ones where MK has an advantage?

Banning him now or anytime is unlikely.
He isn't as broken as many people believe.

 

[Zankoku]

What's a neutral matchup? The ditto?

 

[Tim_The_Enchanter]

Is DK still a neutral/advantaged match for MK?

 

[Snail]

DK, Snake and Lucario are neutrals for MK I suppose. Everything else is advantageous for MK...

 

[GreenKirby]

This topic has only been created like four hours ago and already it got 7 pages. O_o

 

[KoJ]

Some notes of mine.

First of all, Metaknight does not justify a ban in the "broken" sense. He IS beatable, despite his immense power and lack of learning curve.

However, I really wish he was banned.

Metaknight is easy to use and is very, very, very good=A

Lots of n00bs or people wanting to win will use him because of A, meaning there are loads of Meta Knights=B

Most characters have a disadvantage against him=C

B+C=Most characters become much harder to win tournaments with=D

D+The want to win=Those characters are not used.

Understand? Meta isn't overpowered, he just drastically narrows the Meta game, unlike other high-powered characters like Snake and GandW.

 

[Doggalina]

... People are considering Pit's arrows to be broken... ?

Oo

No, they aren't. He pulled that out of his ***.

 

[Crizthakidd]

banning MK would just mean snake and ddd + rob maybe falco winning all the tournies. but mostly snake xD

having mk in just means him and snake win... and thats just it.

 

[ShadowLink84]

What's a neutral matchup? The ditto?

Thats pretty much the only one I can think of and be sure.

 

[Snail]

banning MK would just mean snake and ddd + rob maybe falco winning all the tournies. but mostly snake xD

having mk in just means him and snake win... and thats just it.

Snake, DDD, ROB and Falco actually have weaknesses and bad matchups. And a hell of a lot steeper learning curve than MK does.

It would really help the diversity in character usage if we banned MK.

 

[Amide]

MK isn't really broken enough to merit a ban, but the competitive scene would be so much better without. A good MK will always beat a great DDD. And that's the difference between #1 and #3. I think a good compromise is giving MK additional handicap. (Maybe 30 starting damage) But MK has to go in some way, he's clouding tourneys and is too easy to win with.

 

[Turbo Ether]

Metaknight reminds me so much of Sheik from Melee. Just like MK, Sheik is incredibly easy to pick up, had basically no bad matchups, and she made a good amount of the cast completely unplayable in tournaments because they could NEVER beat her.

In the early melee tier lists, Sheik was unquestionably the best character in the game. Sound familiar?

No doubt that MK is Melee Sheik 2.0. No reason to ban him though.

 

[Dynamism?]

lol don't ban MK he's my favorite to fight cause he's so high pressure


And wtf would you ban him for?! MK is a whimp. >_> I don't get why anyone would want him gone.

Plus he's so cool. Why else do you think this thread just exploded? COOLNESS!
Like seriously...

Oh, and needs more spam at this joke idea. Thanks for making a thread for people to talk about this in and clean the place up SP. :D

 

[Morrigan]

or make him a counterpick only, will that ever work?

 

[JJR.O.B.]

Understand? Meta isn't overpowered, he just drastically narrows the Meta game,

The meta game will soon be the metaknight

 

[-Jumpman-]

or make him a counterpick only, will that ever work?

It won't. It just means the player losing the first game will most likely win the second, unless your opponent is using Snake.

 

[BBQ°]

I don't think it'll be up to the BRoomers to give the official word for Metaknight getting banned. Before long, the tournament hosts will make the rule saying MK is banned in their own tournament. Soon other tournament organizers will catch on and it'll eventually make it to the point where it's a standard that Metaknight is banned.

 

[Uffe]

*wanders in*

Took a shower. Let's get back to the flaming, now, shall we? ;P



... People are considering Pit's arrows to be broken... ?

Oo

If you can't get through Pit's arrows, then you fail at the game and should probably just stop playing it. I'm not directing this at you, I'm just saying whoever says Pit's arrows are broken is probably someone who loses to Pit all the time because of his arrows.

 

[TLMarth]

The kind of people who think that you should play to win, using the best character in the game, who you don't necessarily like, and whose gameplay style is not yours,

are the sort of people, to me, who would believe in survival and only survival. They would eat the bare minimum to get along, work all day, have no "fun" activities, because they are a waste of money. The schedule would be:
Wake up
Work
Work

eat

Work
eat
exercise
bed
They would try to save all their money only to be used as a back up for emergencies, which happens only in a thousand years, and besides the saved up money is over enough.

Does that make sense?
In short, a person who has no fun, but just tries to maximize the chance of living. That's the sort of mentality I see. Though human nature succumbs to luxury.

 

[RDK]

Is DK still a neutral/advantaged match for MK?

I think you mean Snake. DK doesn't have the overall advantage over Snake--he just does better than most other characters.

Against MK, I'm not so sure.

The kind of people who think that you should play to win, using the best character in the game, who you don't necessarily like, and whose gameplay style is not yours,

are the sort of people, to me, who would believe in survival and only survival. They would eat the bare minimum to get along, work all day, have no "fun" activities, because they are a waste of money. The schedule would be:
Wake up
Work
Work

eat

Work
eat
exercise
bed
They would try to save all their money only to be used as a back up for emergencies, which happens only in a thousand years, and besides the saved up money is over enough.

Does that make sense?
In short, a person who has no fun, but just tries to maximize the chance of living. That's the sort of mentality I see. Though human nature succumbs to luxury.

When you get to the semifinals of a large tournament and everyone else is playing either MK or Snake, I think you'll understand.

It's not that people who use them only care about playing to win (and even if they do, what do you care? That's "fun" to them), it's just that they're trying to maximize their chances of winning. That's what competition is all about.

 

[acv]

its not the fact that mk is good that bothers me.its the facte that some idiots think that they instantly win when they pick him so he gets boring to play against so much,at least i have so much experience against meta knight that he now seems easy to beat.

 

[RawrBoom]

People keep saying it's too early to decide about the banning of MK. Maybe it's true, but what the hell is going to come from waiting? A new form of L-canceling or Wavedashing? Plus, in Melee, you could combo with every other character than Sheik. If Metaknight really is the only one who could continuously combo in Brawl, then he's just too overpowered. Not to mention, his ridiculous recovery options.

 

[Espy Rose]

MK isn't really broken enough to merit a ban, but the competitive scene would be so much better without. A good MK will always beat a great DDD. And that's the difference between #1 and #3. I think a good compromise is giving MK additional handicap. (Maybe 30 starting damage) But MK has to go in some way, he's clouding tourneys and is too easy to win with.

If that's the case, then why continue dragging this on and waiting for enough MKs to win tournaments?

I'm just curious as to why people believe that a ban on MK should be pending. Why not run a tournament with MK banned, and see how it flows?

Even the stronger characters like Snake, DDD, and Falco have some weaknesses. Does MK have any weakness that are glaringly obvious, besides his light weight?

People keep saying it's too early to decide about the banning of MK. Maybe it's true, but what the hell is going to come from waiting?

^^^This^^^

 

[popsofctown]

You don't actually have to ban him, if you think about it.

A tier list will come out soon enough. It's clear to almost everyone that MK is a full tier above any other character in the game.

So, once we have an offical tier list, we can just declare that we want to have some "high tier and below" tournaments.

We won't get a decree from god from the SBR to ban MK, but it can underhandedly happen by way of high tier and below tournaments.

 

[SamuraiPanda]

When you get to the semifinals of a large tournament and everyone else is playing either MK or Snake, I think you'll understand.

1) You don't exist.
2) What the hell are you talking about? There is still plenty of diversity in top 8s and what not. Just a lack of diversity for those who actually win.

Don't make up facts.

 

[Espy Rose]

1) You don't exist.
2) What the hell are you talking about? There is still plenty of diversity in top 8s and what not. Just a lack of diversity for those who actually win.

Don't make up facts.

Hypothetically, what would happen if EVERYONE just decided, "to hell with this, I want to win"?

 

[Mmac]

This is from a Matchup thread I found in the MetaKnight Forums:

60/40 (small advantage)
Olimar
Marth
Mr. Game & Watch
Zamus
R.O.B.
Kirby
Pikachu

50/50 (even matchup)
Wario
Falco
Diddy Kong
Yoshi (ZOMGWTFROFLBBQ!)
Lucario
Donkey Kong
King Dedede

40/60 (slight disadvantage)
Snake

this means that about 15 of the 36 Characters Can stand at least a good chance against MetaKnight. I'm not sure on how accurate it is, but he doesn't seem to be as immortal as people say he is.

 

[SamuraiPanda]

Hypothetically, what would happen if EVERYONE just decided, "to hell with this, I want to win"?

There is no reason in discussing that hypothetical because it'll never actually happen.

And FYI, at the tournaments I attend, MK/Snake rarely ever win. Pikachu (Anther) is almost always first.

 

[KoJ]

This is from a Matchup thread I found in the MetaKnight Forums:

60/40 (small advantage)
Olimar
Marth
Mr. Game & Watch
Zamus
R.O.B.
Kirby
Pikachu

50/50 (even matchup)
Wario
Falco
Diddy Kong
Yoshi (ZOMGWTFROFLBBQ!)
Lucario
Donkey Kong
King Dedede

40/60 (slight disadvantage)
Snake

this means that about 15 of the 36 Characters Can stand at least a good chance against MetaKnight. I'm not sure on how accurate it is, but he doesn't seem to be as immortal as people say he is.

ROB has a much larger disadvantage than that. Just go to the ROB boards, and you'll see what I mean. Same with Dedede. I'm not too sure about the rest of the list. I personally think Snake's about equal with MK.

 

[Kami-V]

As much as I hate metaknight, I don't feel any reason to ban him at this point in time. I think its too soon to try and ban a character, unless it were clearly obvious that they were just too powerful, but that is not the case with MK or any character in this game.

I think its safe to say that he's the best character though, and that he might even deserve his own tier...

 

[KoJ]

There is no reason in discussing that hypothetical because it'll never actually happen.

And FYI, at the tournaments I attend, MK/Snake rarely ever win. Pikachu (Anther) is almost always first.

Anther is a very, very, very good player. If he goes to tournaments in your area, of course he'll win a lot.

 

[SamuraiPanda]

Anther is a very, very, very good player. If he goes to tournaments in your area, of course he'll win a lot.

Really? I had no idea Anther was a very good player. Him winning nearly every tournament never tipped me off. I thought he was just some squirrel-loving weirdo (I know you're gonna read this :D).