• Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!

    You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!

The Lucas General Discussion

Jamwa

Smash Champion
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
2,045
Location
cave plantation
Fae those doubles matches were up (unfortunately the ones you lose in haha) but they were really cool, imo u played better against chibo and yoshq than pika + snake. the thunderslide on frigate was very cool gotta say.

unfortunately theres no singles vids of you :(

+ lol at M2FAE
 

FightAdamantEevee

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 14, 2009
Messages
1,059
Location
St. Louis, Missouri
Yeah we played really bad vs esam and mvd, we were still getting used to teaming because we were having like in-game problems with like teamwork. We got used to teaming the more bracket matches we played though, i honestly dont think we should've lost to chibo and yosh tough.
 

#HBC | J

Prince of DGamesia
Joined
Feb 14, 2010
Messages
7,591
Location
Colorado
Yes you should haha, and here is semi-active. ;P

Edit: I remember someone talking about Japan in here and while exploring, I found this:

The Official Tier List as of 12/16/11
- Offline

S+  Metaknight

S   Ice Climbers

A+  Olimar Diddy Falco Snake Fox

A   Pit Wario Marth Dedede Zero Suit Samus

B   Toon Link Robot Lucario Zelda and Sheik Game and Watch

C   Donkey Kong Peach Wolf Kirby Pikachu Ike

D   Lucas Mario Sonic

E   Luigi Bowser Yoshi Ness

F   Ganondorf Pokemon Trainer

G   Captain Falcon Link Samus

H   Jigglypuff


Stagelist

Final Destination
SmashVille
Battlefield
 

#HBC | J

Prince of DGamesia
Joined
Feb 14, 2010
Messages
7,591
Location
Colorado
We are not hearing anything at all. We are just feeling based on in the Tier list thread, people are in support of it, Lucas has good tournament results that justify moving up, and his MUs are skewed but we are fixing those as well.

There is little reason for Lucas to be a LT character at this point.
 

Jamwa

Smash Champion
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
2,045
Location
cave plantation
yeah yoshq and chibo were definately winnable. made lucas + zss look so fun to play.
too bad no1 teams with me here in aus cos i play lucas, despite me arguing hes super amazing in dubs.
last major i teamed with a melee player who went squirtle and water gunner me across the map as i upsmashed/dsmashed. very troll

someone come to aus sep 30 to feature at out humble major. there gun be like a 1.5k pot because theres this rich dude who likes to donate
 

Mekos

Smash Master
Joined
Apr 4, 2007
Messages
3,132
Location
killing the evils of this world
NNID
Mekos123
Yea let's not be selfish guys. It's about creating the legacy for lucas. When smash 4 comes out it will be a shame if lucas is known as a low tier for brawl(history).

That means from the outside looking in he is a character that just gets out right bodied by everyone and has no potential.

As lucas mains It's our destiny to upgrade him!!
 

FightAdamantEevee

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 14, 2009
Messages
1,059
Location
St. Louis, Missouri
Guys I need a Lucas practice partner. I suck with the character I've been maining for 3 years and I need someone to practice with me a lot. I give you technical help, you give me beingabetterplayer help.

Nameen?

Edit: I'm 100% srs btw, either this or I'm dropping Lucas for zss for singles
 

#HBC | J

Prince of DGamesia
Joined
Feb 14, 2010
Messages
7,591
Location
Colorado
FAE, totally hit me up and I'll practice with you and that way we can help each other out more.

And you don't suck lmao, you are good. Also if you go to ZSS that would be a totally sad day.

@Mekos: Totally bro. Haha you are good at being inspirational.
 

Chuee

Smash Hero
Joined
Jul 20, 2008
Messages
6,002
Location
Kentucky
Guys I need a Lucas practice partner. I suck with the character I've been maining for 3 years and I need someone to practice with me a lot. I give you technical help, you give me beingabetterplayer help.
Wat
There's no way you suck FAE.

@PF: Nobody does LT tournies anymore. MT where it's at, so even if Lucas moves to MT we'll still be able to play him.
 

Jrugs

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 24, 2010
Messages
624
Location
140.96
FAE I reckon u come back down to Texas, I didnt get to see you mm MVD.



(btw we don't really say reckon)
 

KassandraNova

Smash Master
Joined
May 24, 2009
Messages
4,167
Location
Cincinnati, Ohio
3DS FC
4167-5079-1850
You can only take a character so far. Your enthusiasm is wonderful, and I really wish we could bump Lucas up to mid tier. But it's not going to happen. He has too many awful match ups. And I mean ****ing awful match ups.

At this point of the game, I'm playing Lucas for fun, and I'll be playing him this weekend as well, I don't expect to do awesome because I know my characters limitations, I also know my chances of running into a marth or some bull **** is really high. Some of you do so many amazing things with Lucas that I thought weren't even possible, and sometimes you guys make me regret dropping him 3 years ago and switching to mk. But the fact is, this character isn't mid tier material. Don't tell me I don't love this character because I do, I love all of the mother games and the idea of Lucas being liable makes me more giddy than a school girl. I just don't think this is a mid tier character. He's low tier, that doesn't mean we still can't win, and perform well, that just means we all have our limits as a low tier hero. Man it's really late, and idk why I'm ranting about this. I'm sorry, I'm not trying to be a pessimist, it's just my opinion. I love all Lucas mains and I think you guys are awesome and I feel your pain with the **** you have to go through playing as this character. <3

:phone:
 

#HBC | J

Prince of DGamesia
Joined
Feb 14, 2010
Messages
7,591
Location
Colorado
I understand your pain Kassandra. There was a time where I felt Lucas would be doomed to forever being a LT but the fact is with more research, more results, and a more booming meta-game with our players, there is much more of a chance for Lucas to be a mid-tier. Plus the fact is our MU chat is completely skewed.

I'd be willing to share what my MU chart looks for Lucas based over the years and researching the MUs but I don't want to start debates/arguments at this time since it may appear a bit controversial without explanations behind each MUs and than I would just go into explaining the entire MU haha.

I, personally, respect your opinion Kassandra and still find you fantastic. <3 People have different opinions on things and that is more than alright to have that and express it.
 

Jrugs

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 24, 2010
Messages
624
Location
140.96
Mid
E: :rob: (+1) :kirby2: (-1) :sheilda: (+3) :sonic: (±0) :dk2: (-5) :ike: (-1) :sheik: (+1)
F: :yoshi2: (+2) :ness2: (±0) :pt: (+1) :luigi2: (-4)

Low
G: :lucas: (±0) :mario2: (±0) :samus2: (+1) :bowser2: (-1) :falcon: (±0)
H: :jigglypuff: (+1) :link2: (-1) :zelda: (±0) :ganondorf: (±0)

just give him the spot he's like literary only one spot down.
 

#HBC | J

Prince of DGamesia
Joined
Feb 14, 2010
Messages
7,591
Location
Colorado
Imo, he's better than weegee especially with results and Luigi deserves his bottom position on the MT tier list. xD

But yeah +1/+2 results for what has gone on lately would be great.
 

KassandraNova

Smash Master
Joined
May 24, 2009
Messages
4,167
Location
Cincinnati, Ohio
3DS FC
4167-5079-1850
Luigi is not going to go below Lucas. IMO
This is what I believe. Ugh I don't want to talk about tiers. -_-
If we take away infinites, then yes Lucas can be mid tier.

Aw thanks! You're all fabulous as well. XD
:phone:
 

Jamwa

Smash Champion
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
2,045
Location
cave plantation
you guys all limit possibilities to the difficulty of the respective character, which I think is sad.

this game is about reads, and surviving. none of us play at TAS level so you cant not get better.
DIing and reading is what this game is pretty much about, other elements are frame traps, unpunishable moves and gimmicks(to an extent).

Mekos proved you can win with Lucas; he plays such a calm game and gets HARD READS into usmash (as an example of a high reward:high risk) the rest of his game is polished.
if you see 9B vs M2K, all he does is go for grab reads (yes i know the risk : reward ratio is high) but it just goes to show how prediction and reaction is the heart of this game.

since lucas doesnt have many tools to punish with, not many safe moves and a light weight, many people are content with giving up on him. LEARN to use the good moves, LEARN to predict and punish, LEARN to DI.
you can only get better

its 9:24 and i just got back form work so this may be mumbo jumbo but im sure the point is clear; aspire (and in turn, inspire).
 

Mekos

Smash Master
Joined
Apr 4, 2007
Messages
3,132
Location
killing the evils of this world
NNID
Mekos123
^ True. I'm not trying to hurt anyone's feelings but this is the truth. 80% of the community hasn't mastered the basics of the game like DI'ing correctly.

Smash is simple. There are very very few real combos in brawl singles. With that said after you attempt an approach you should reset to a neutral stand point. Most people go for a follow up. It's the same after you have been hit. If the punish is not 100% safe then you should reset instead of going for a revenge(attacking immediately after u have been hit) attack.

The most important factor of smash and any fighting game is having the skill to "read" your opponent. All competition has a mental element. Most people just ignore that and play with their currently mastered skills and experience. During a match you should be watching your opponent and learning their habits. Very few people have this skill. I didn't always have this skill. It clicked after Genesis 2 and I mastered the ability to "read" after Ktar 6.


So I agree with Jamwa. It's not necessarily about mastering Lucas' AT's. That is a small part of his game. It's about mastering the game of smash! After you have done that master lucas' AT's, spacing, and create your own unique playstyle(so it throws your opponent off guard).

SN: It's funny how when I win in tourney alot of times people say "good job but the person probably lacked matchup knowledge". Whenever someone says that they are being extremely ignorant. The key to competition is bringing something fresh to the table that your opponent doesn't expect. They shouldn't know every tool in your tool box, and if they do that is your fault. This community is full of johners. Don't be like the norm. Believe in yourself and advance your skills. Who cares about a tier list.

Another SN: The reason I beat marths is because I have downloaded marth's grab setups and situations where he can grab. I then read the way the marths like to approach. I then try different ways to get inside by using the basics of the game which every character can do.(run and sidestep, run and shield, run and short hop, and mix these up). I then mix it up and bait my opponent based on their habits.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vMgJRmyhRZA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8tqdB2K_69I

Watch the matches and see how I am learning my opponent as the set goes on and adapting. I am not just auto piloting my current skill set (which is what alot of players do).
 

Mekos

Smash Master
Joined
Apr 4, 2007
Messages
3,132
Location
killing the evils of this world
NNID
Mekos123
Yall seen me vs Gluttony right? Don't listen to the commentators. They are talking about how lucas' backair is not good/i used it incorrectly. They are wrong. Smash is situational. In certain situations lucas bair does great shield pressure. It is safe.

They keep saying I am putting myself against the wall. I did that so if I get grabbed I can grab release off the stage and not get fsmashed. Also, I like my mixups while on the ledge.

The last game second stock they were saying I should have went more aggro. That is the worst thing u can do and the mistake alot of us make. Stay calm. The kill will come and it did. If i would have went too aggro and he killed me, I would have lost the match. Wario vs lucas is a match where whoever has the lead wins. Alot of matches are like that but wario vs lucas is the perfect example. They both have a hard to time "catching up".

People johned for Gluttony and said he didn't know the lucas matchup. It's not that. It's that he didn't know the "Mekos" matchup. But I didn't know the "Gluttony" matchup either. I had to learn during the set. The aggro way he used the bike was so nice and unique. I was ignorant to that. But by the end of the set I adapted and learned how to get around it. That is just one example. There are many more mental things going on during the match (His aggro playstyle in general was unique. The first match I had to get used to his reaction time and adapt accordingly)

Basically don't listen to people and let them control your destiny. Just work hard, set your goals, and achieve them. People will always john and make excuses. Don't listen to negativity.
I don't even know what he means when he says "text book lucas". lol I just ignore it. That sounds real terrible. Like it means "generic". I think he is trying to say I pick safe options but that phrase seems terrible lolol.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2QzjgcBXX0
 

Mekos

Smash Master
Joined
Apr 4, 2007
Messages
3,132
Location
killing the evils of this world
NNID
Mekos123
Mekos, what do you feel the Wario MU is? Is it -2 or more -1?

:phone:
Man it is either 0 or -1. Again this match is purely about who has the lead. We can have a negative 1 because of the grab release. Watch this match. This is where I learned how to fight wario at top level play. It is against Malcom one of the best warios in the USA. During the second match I finally learned how to space correctly against Wario. There are small things that help out. (unfortunately, they took the match off of youtube. I don't know why)

A few examples
1. If the wario is above you just run under him and away lol. Run to the side. He might chase you and attack. If so, power shield and down air. This is a bait situation.

2. You can side step(dodge) wario's neutral air. U have to side step twice. I thought it was so cool when I learned that. The move hits twice and learn how to dodge it accordingly. For example, you can throw power shield mixups in with side stepping.

3. If a wario gets grabs to fsmashes on you when you are at low%, they are weakening their fsmash. Gluttony was smart and didn't fsmash everytime.

There are many more small small things that turn the tide! Knowledge and utilizing that knowledge correctly is key to playing matchups correctly.


@Jrugs and Kassandra - lol thanks guys

lucas vs lucas mm? Sure. I'll warn you that I have never lost a lucas mm ;)
 

Jrugs

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 24, 2010
Messages
624
Location
140.96
woah bro Im a snake. I know its a super gay MU for lucas but Ive seen you almost take down MVD so Im hyped.
 

#HBC | J

Prince of DGamesia
Joined
Feb 14, 2010
Messages
7,591
Location
Colorado
I honestly feel Snake is a gay MU but it's more -2 than -3.

And wow Mekos, near 0? I could believe it with the tools we have but I feel it's more -1.

When I get to a computer, I am going to be sending you a PM about something.

:phone:
 

Mekos

Smash Master
Joined
Apr 4, 2007
Messages
3,132
Location
killing the evils of this world
NNID
Mekos123
@Jrugs - That was a long long time ago. My power level has increased a whole lot. Just a fair warning.
Only snake I'm scared of is Fatal, Razer, and Ally.

@J- okay. And I said 0 or -1 lolol
Snake is pretty gay. What you have to do is play extremely gay back. Get the lead and then camp the WHOLE game. Unless you are confident you will win.
 

~Pink Fresh~

Smash Master
Joined
Jun 21, 2008
Messages
4,180
Location
Maryland
I'm pretty much content on timing out snake at this point.

Which is funny because I did it two years ago but forgot zzz.

I don't think I have a mental block against the character anymore. ^_^
 

Jrugs

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 24, 2010
Messages
624
Location
140.96
@Jrugs - That was a long long time ago. My power level has increased a whole lot. Just a fair warning.
Only snake I'm scared of is Fatal, Razer, and Ally.
:D HELLLLLLLL YEAAHHHHH LETS BATTLE!!!!!
But if I win you have to play mother 3
 

Jamwa

Smash Champion
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
2,045
Location
cave plantation
MEKOS HASNT PLAYED MOTHER 3?
lol thanks mekos for summing up my abomination of text, and i sincerely feel the MU is 0, even though i may not be good at it I can see why it would be. we have like the exact same moves, except he doesnt have PsiF and we dont have a grab (well, a situational grab).

out pivot tether wrecks DACUS happy snakes, and dair can punish ftilts really well. -2 for sure, maybe -1 if we find out some hidden gameplay technique
 

Jrugs

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 24, 2010
Messages
624
Location
140.96
Soooooooooooo.....who wants to go to New York?
Opening up a carpool for Impact in New York Tell your friends

(disclaimer one way trip)
 
Top Bottom