The Heavenly Scriptures:A Pit Q&A thread!

[MysteriousSilver]

Question: Out of these stages (except Rainbrow Cruise that's a players first ban choice when i fight with him -.-) which would be a recommended pit stage. I'd choose DK place if it was allowed though.. lol!

Delfino Plaza
Battleship Halberd
Castle Siege
Brinstar
Pokemon Stadium 1 (Melee Version)
Frigate Orpheon
Rainbow Cruise

Out of those, I'd suggest Brinstar. Camp on the bottom right corner, where a number characters are forced to jump over the pit to get to you and stop spamming. You can also camp under the stage and throw Uairs through the floor, maybe even break the stage for even more effective camping. Just watch out for the acid, and never take a GnW there.

alsoi never know what to do when snake has me cornered on the edge of the stage. i can always be gay on the ledge but are there other options?

Glide under the stage, or feint a glide, cancel when he runs over there, and WoI back to the ledge.

If that's not an option, ledge games are always good. On Smashville, you can ride the platform. Easiest way -through- him is probably nair, but experiment with otehr things so you don't get predictable.

And of course if he messes up, a good Fsmash, Ftilt or Dsmash will put him on the otehr side, far away from you.

 

[Don Guero]

ok but i still dont uderstand how approaching with nair is good. i thought approaching with any arial was bad. and a snake can spam Ftilts

 

[IrisKong]

ok but i still dont uderstand how approaching with nair is good. i thought approaching with any arial was bad. and a snake can spam Ftilts

Spacing. also, go for the head.

 

[Tetsion]

Spacing. also, go for the head.

Arrow Head show ! (Nair i know)

Thx Silver for your input. I'll get a feeling for Brinstar since they can only ban so many stages (1 in this case)

@ Don, I personally don't approach with Nair myself. If anything I fight away from my enemy usually, I used to be more aggressive with pit. Recently I feel overall he is a defensive char, he's more so the punisher than the "comboer" or anything.

Sadly he's SUPPOSED to be annoying overall, at least imo. I never used to arrow spam, then i started using arrows a lot more they work out a lot better. I mean if I see a wolf spamming back air or grenade spam from snake, or OMG tornado spam. xD you just have to spam..

but yeah, his move's seem a lot better for the defensive stance.. Unlike Snake, Diddy, and Metaknight. Falco I feel is canceled out, otherwise approach with arrows in the air. if he keep's using reflector as you approach it's easier to find an opening (at least for me playing against falco's) just watch out for that grab.. (ranted for a bit x.x)

 

[Don Guero]

haha its ok to rant IMO ur giving out useful info. i like to punish into combos, or what i call read links. cuz with certain attacks in certain situations a good punish minimizes ur opponents options. so if ur in good position, you can get a good read and keep racking up the damage.

but yea Pit is best played defensiveley. which is wierd cuz the best Pits ive played were aggresive

 

[Tetsion]

I found it weird as well, maybe they should be played aggressively. I mean both styles work, i used to win a nice amount playing aggresive too. I just feel approaching certain char's is a bad idea. you can go crazy on diddy kong, don't let up. Same for falco , DDD, and Wario. At least I think you should be aggressive unless someone else has input. For Metaknight, Snake, Marth, and Game and Watch. I feel it's best to play defensively cause they are built to be more aggressive char's. This is just what I think though, not like I have vid's or much tournament cred.

 

[Don Guero]

lol neither do i
im guessing its a mind game cuz people expect pit to be defensive

 

[Nitrix]

Does Pit have any good OoS options and what are they?

 

[Esca]

Full hop dair and Utilt are Pit's best OoS options. And Roll.

 

[Nanaki]

Full hop dair and Utilt are Pit's best OoS options. And Roll.

I'm no regular here, but roll is considered one of his best OoS options? Really?

 

[Razmakazi]

Where's your frame data thread?

And if ya'll can't link me there can you guys at least tell me how fast your ground moves come out and I guess your fastest aerials?

 

[Nanaki]

Where's your frame data thread?

And if ya'll can't link me there can you guys at least tell me how fast your ground moves come out and I guess your fastest aerials?

Click on ME for Frame Data

It's very incomplete, but it has startups and endlag for most moves.

 

[Razmakazi]

ty! hhmmm i thought pit's aerials outside of nair came out quicker than that haha.

 

[Don Guero]

is blowing up snakes mortar with Dair a good option? it happened to me completley by accident but it looks better than airdodging

 

[Nanaki]

is blowing up snakes mortar with Dair a good option? it happened to me completley by accident but it looks better than airdodging

You could always downB it. Or just avoid it altogether.

Dair is slow enough that mis-spacing or mistiming it can probably happen enough for you to regret trying it, imo.

Edit: I have a question. Does anyone know the first frame you can input an attack out of WoI (grounded)?

 

[Katana_koden]

You could always downB it. Or just avoid it altogether.

Dair is slow enough that mis-spacing or mistiming it can probably happen enough for you to regret trying it, imo.

Edit: I have a question. Does anyone know the first frame you can input an attack out of WoI (grounded)?

Okay for the unfinished, frame data for duration only. Till I find some coding for it.
Duration-

A<A<A= 54
A<A<A+ = 71
Dash attack= 41
UP tilt= 34

0-99% ledge
attack= 55
roll= 49
stand= 34
jump= 16 frames till you can WOI from the ledge

100-999% ledge
attack= 69
roll= 79
stand= 59
jump= 19 from before WOI

Misc
5 frames before you are in the air

WIngdash
odd you can't start a WOI till frame 7 (frame 1-5 will do a grounded WOI)
then 17 frames before you can cancel it
3 frames of canceling
Thats the fastest you can do it. So 27 frames total

WOI grounded- 29 frames before canceling
WOI Air- is of course 17

Charging arrow changing direction
7 frames from side to up or visa versa
7 frames from left to right or visa versa

Getups
While face on ground
Roll forward= 35
Roll back= 35
Stand= 29
Attack= 49

While on back
Roll forward= 35
Roll back= 35
Stand= 29
Attack= 49

I need more suggestions.
I need to know what data you are really looking for also.

i'm still working on others data

 

[Nanaki]

Cool, thanks for the response. Didn't realize it took that long to cancel it.

Does the 'push' wind effect hitbox from the WoI startup have any hitstun or shieldstun?

 

[MysteriousSilver]

Nope.

Spoiler

10nopes

 

[Esca]

is blowing up snakes mortar with Dair a good option? it happened to me completley by accident but it looks better than airdodging

Just run up and shield it.

 

[Don Guero]

Just run up and shield it.

im saying if pit is in the air. what would the best option be?

 

[Pitzer]

im saying if pit is in the air. what would the best option be?

Dont air dodge as snakes can get a free uair or uptilt instead jump airdodge at the same time, either that or take the hit.

 

[Nanaki]

I hate to keep pestering with WoI questions, but what frame does the 'windbox' come out on? Is it during the invincibility frames, or after?

 

[Katana_koden]

*looks at note book*

WOI ( ground)
frames 1-5 invincible
wind starts on 6.

Didn't test wind first hitbox in air, but will edit later.

 

[Esca]

I got 5th at hobo today.

Timed out Gnes one round even.

And beat trela.

Also got 1st in doubles with Red Halberd

 

[Katana_koden]

who beat you and with who?

 

[Nanaki]

I got 5th at hobo today.

Timed out Gnes one round even.

And beat trela.

Also got 1st in doubles with Red Halberd

Good **** brah.

Was there a LGL or did you time him out legitly?

 

[Don Guero]

I got 5th at hobo today.

Timed out Gnes one round even.

And beat trela.

Also got 1st in doubles with Red Halberd

nice!!!!!

haha ive experienced timing out someone at hobo lol
its the rage starter

 

[CorruptFate]

Use this thread for asking and answering questions, there is a tourny results thread or Kown's thread for that kind of stuff. Any extra small talk just makes it harder for people to find what info they need.

 

[Nefarious B]

Since you guys don't have a matchup discussion I figured might as well post here that the ZSS boards are discussing the Pit matchup and would love some input. I know you guys just did the matchup somewhat recently so it should be easy

 

[Esca]

who beat you and with who?

I beat Xyro, Trela, RT, Tree and I used all Pit.

Good **** brah.

Was there a LGL or did you time him out legitly?

No LGL. I planked him lol

 

[Lenus Altair]

I know we have this ancient thread:

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=243314

but do we have something more recent/complete? If not, I think its something that needs to be done/compiled.

What are the best methogs to gather frame data?

 

[Katana_koden]

I know we have this ancient thread:

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=243314

but do we have something more recent/complete? If not, I think its something that needs to be done/compiled.

What are the best methogs to gather frame data?

I'm working on it. One thing is, I won't have pics when i'm done with it. It will be a whole new frame data thread. Gotta complete Uair, invincibility, air time, hitbox after charge . I have misc data like:
Pits arrow travels across Battlefield in 20 frames.

Shield stun is a bit of a problem because at first I tested the stun after our latest hitbox, but utilt, surprised me by being able to side step while the hitbox was out.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This might be in the pit combo thread but I just find it weird. Usually lvl 9 cpu's evade immediately after heavy attacks. Oddly enough I tested DK.

Dair > nair, early connect on DK at 7%. actually combo.
On metaknight it can be connected at 3%. actual combo. but evade at like 7%

As said earlier, weird the cpu's don't evade with certain move's + damage.
The longest DK string I pulled off at 7% was Dair> Uair> (Uair/ Dair/ Nair). Doesn't evade after second Uair > ?.

For a clarification, can SH Dair be shield grabbed if not landed but chain to a nair for combo/ punishing/ retreating purposes

 

[Gah777]

What's the purpose of wing refreshes and arrow loops other than just mindgames and mixups? It seems kinda unnessesary. Also I see a lot of Pits use fsmash and bair at low/mid percents. Shouldn't those be saved for KOing?

 

[Afropony]

Arrow lops are kinda useless, wing refreshibng means that we can attack the opponent when they're away from the stage without having to come back to the stage with WoI.
It's usually fairly easy to refresh Pit's kill moves because of arrows and his fairly quick pummel. I don't think it really matters whether you use Bair or Fsmash at lowish percents, especially because they're both good moves for racking up damage.

 

[pulse131]

hey Pit community. so i was playing against a friend at the last tourney and im not sure if its known or not but, ya watch this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YsV9OkcFzjo
at about 2:24 you'll see what im referring too. what the hell happened?

 

[Gah777]

I know wing refreshes are good, but what I meant is when people do WoI on stage, cancel it (by landing), then attack. What's the point of that?

 

[CorruptFate]

hey Pit community. so i was playing against a friend at the last tourney and im not sure if its known or not but, ya watch this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YsV9OkcFzjo
at about 2:24 you'll see what im referring too. what the hell happened?

Their was alot of discussion about how we could recreate this or how usfull it would even be a long time back, we decided to drop it as it was far to hard to recreate and even if you could it didn't add anything useful to what you could really do. But as for how it happens, the arrows travel like - - - - - - - appearing and disappearing rather then what we see as -------------, and if the arrow happens to reappear inside of the platform like you saw, it gets stuck their and its hit box will stay until it hits someone or becomes dislodged.

 

[dualseeker]

Either it was an accident, or I just found another Spike. On Frigate Orpheon, I was playing against a computer, and on the first stage (the one the stage starts with before it flips) I was on the left side, and the platform was above the ledge. Falco was just under the edge and I used Dair. The wierd thing is, Falco went straight down instead of up. I don't know if the left side edge has a little bit of something like FD, or that it was a glitch. But, if there's anything anyone knows, please let me know. Me and Falco were very close to each other, and he was directly below me.

 

[pulse131]

@ CorruptFate- thnx, ill be sure to let Maharba know.

 

[Don Guero]

I know wing refreshes are good, but what I meant is when people do WoI on stage, cancel it (by landing), then attack. What's the point of that?

thats called wing dashing. its good for mindgames, punishing, approaching, reatring, spacing, canceling projectiles, ect. it adds many options to your game. i cant say im the best at wing dashing ive won some matches because of it. if you wantto see it used well maybe you can watch some vids of sagemoon (not trying to kiss any *** here)
think of wing dashing like snakes mortar slide, its not necessary, but its a good weapon to have in ur arsenal

Either it was an accident, or I just found another Spike. On Frigate Orpheon, I was playing against a computer, and on the first stage (the one the stage starts with before it flips) I was on the left side, and the platform was above the ledge. Falco was just under the edge and I used Dair. The wierd thing is, Falco went straight down instead of up. I don't know if the left side edge has a little bit of something like FD, or that it was a glitch. But, if there's anything anyone knows, please let me know. Me and Falco were very close to each other, and he was directly below me.

hmm well if falco was under the ledge, it could have been a stage spike. if he did go straight down then i can tell you that that has happened to me twice already sadly i dont have any evidence to prove it i was told it was bad DI