The British Thread : UK Circuit idea on most recent post !!!!

[Mr P]

I'm just a random kinda guy an innovator some would say, i do random things coz you know it's fly.

my post wasn't directed at smashie directly, just the idiot bit because i found it kinda ironic when he told bullet to read sirlin and he might win, because ive never heard of smashie win a tournament match. But if its some kind of inside joke then sorry.

I think the point i was trying to put across in that little convo was pretty clear though, a lot of lesser players in the UK put some of the top players on pedestals as if they are god like untouchable figures when in reality they are quite human. If thats the kind of mentality you have then you're never going to reach that level of skill or even more unbelieveable PASS THEM. What zeppo was saying was that he finds it very frustrating when a lot of players in the UK think that he was just born with some kind of godly talent and got to the top simply through his own genes because it's not true. He worked his *** off to get to where he is now and he would rather people appreciate that and try to emulate the same kind of work ethic and motivation in getting to the top. It's fine to appreceite the skill of very good players but it's another thing altogether to put them onto some other inhuman level because you dont get those top players full respect and with that attitude you will never become a good player yourself. in short DONT LIMIT YOURSELF i just find it very frustrating when i see a lot of players in the UK doing that.

 

[J03]

must say P, you dug yourself out of the hole there ^_^

in retort i dont think the original post but any player on a 'pedestal' or tried to make the author 'godlike'. through most of it he simply makes refernces to playstyles and pretty much points out what most good players have or do that make them good. like in smash most good players can do most/all of the required technical skill of there character and compliment them with smart play or 'mindgames'. it doesnt say there born with inhuman powers but nor does it imply that they can play smart and technical because of the time spent doing both. like Z for example has blates spent forever amount fo hours working on his tech skill so he can play smart becuase hes comfortable playing at the speed he plays at. so to take your own meaning as you did belittles guides in general, as you did, because you as a person dont find them helpful or you dont find them helpful at your level of play. personally im not a fan of guides but i do think to take a stance upon them such as yours belittles people who do find them helpful.

i realise this post seems rather harsh or un-needed but imo it should be said to defend people who find guides useful. that said, i am sorry it seems harsh but i cba editing it

 

[COEY]

i don't believe Euan was on about guides at all Joe you freaking genius. I think the post was just a random convo describing some thoughts and feelings that he has had for a while. The fact that he quoted Smashie was an unrelated joke wasnt it?

 

[BloodBowler]

He's just saying that it takes time, practice, skill, devotion and dedication to become good, nobody is born good. Becoming a fanboy of the top players, because they're the top players as opposed to being worth knowing will not make anyone a better player.

 

[COEY]

So we are in agreement that Joe was wrong?

 

[Bullet Bill]

Sirlin's book is just ways of looking at competitive gaming which can never really help your game. In fact, the book never really talks about smash, it uses streetfighter for examples.

As for MrP's comment- I agree. When I played Zeppo for example (at edster my 1st tournament) I wasn't like 'oh my go I'm actually goona play cptn Zeppo!!!!' or anything like that, I just knew I was probably going to loose. But I still played to win

 

[BloodBowler]

So we are in agreement that Joe was wrong?

Since when has J03 ever been right?

 

[J03]

will- if i was wrong i was wrong. besides we all know your a ****ing joke! alos just because you have the internet doesnt make it ok to take the piss.

BB- ****ing **** sucking *** bandit!...nj

BB imo your right about the mindset needed to get good (i.e. practice lol) but you and mr.P and zeppo are all wrong about idolising players( well you may be right but this is all my opinion). idolising players is a good way to see the light at the end of the tunnel. to want to be as good as them or to want to beat them makes players buckle down and start practicing to make themselves better. also i know i wouldnt play fox if it wasnt for seeing helios or marth becuase of M2K recent display of marth amazingness. on the topic of playing to win...well to play to win will probably never make you more likely to win, but if it works or youn then go for it, imo although you should have the desire to win you shouldnt let it affect your game. you should always play to learn, to think about what your opponent does that your not catching on to and viseversa on your strengths. i can play to win all i want but i wont win on that day if there alot better then me.

each to there own i guess and yes this is just MY OPINION. if you think its wrong feel free to retort, thats what forums are for XD. if you dont care then go **** yourself. but i aint gonna stay quiet and let people shoot there mouths off about 'what mentality will get them where'.
the irony being the only way i can retort to someone talking is to talk more myself lol

 

[COEY]

will- if i was wrong i was wrong. besides we all know your a ****ing joke! alos just because you have the internet doesnt make it ok to take the piss.

What the hell do you mean i'm a '****ing joke!' you know nicely put there **** head. Where do you get off making a comment like that. Plus if you go back and read Euan's post you'd find out that you had no idea what you were going on about, as he never mentioned once that the guide was a bad idea as far as i can tell it was a completely different subject.

And finally shut the hell up and try and take a joke once in a while, you are well out of order with the way you put that.

 

[J03]

heh the 'your a joke' was actually meant to be 'your a ****ing joker' so back at ya i guess mr.out of order=/

besides i said if i was wrong then im wrong and i dont really see why i cant make a joke on your behalf yet you can make plenty on mine =/. i aint really ***** about it but you have a habit of doing it in almost every post lol. heh you even make posts soley as a joke on my behalf so i guess theres a reason were in STFU ^_^

 

[COEY]

Fair play then man but all i read really was your a ****ing joke and got annoyed as most people would. Yea i don't mind having a laugh at my expense if it's in good humor but you can see why i was worked up can't you?

 

[J03]

yeah dude its all gravy ^_^

i cba with the convo but in all fairness im not sure its cool that you fly off the handle at a typo when you make as many pokes at me that you do. i mean im not bothered that you have fun at my expense, hell expense away.

 

[Reacher]

According to Sirlin I still have the mentality of a scrub. I've had a nightmare.

Just out of interest, has anbody else found one of the styles he describes fits them perfectly? The obsessed is just me tbh.

 

[BloodBowler]

Does that NJ stand for No Johns or Not Joking?

 

[J03]

haha nay jahns san!

 

[BloodBowler]

Let's see you keep that mentality come tournament time.

 

[J03]

lets see more of that mentality in general lol. if more ppl learnt more from there matches the UK scene would be much better then it is. tbh i just wish i could learn faster then i do. heh to learn fast is to adapt is it not?

 

[Cpt.Zeppo]

Im not bothered about people thinking I was born amazing,if you're that dumb then I wont care lol.But yeah P is right.

Joe I do not get how you got anything about Sirlin from his post.Man up
And idolising isnt the same as fanboy-ism.

Sirlins book looks really interesting Imma read it.

And on learning quickly:That is basically the basis of talent.However,it can be learned in itself.

 

[captain smashie01]

the entire last page

it's so hard to tell whos being serious...

oh, and euan, whatever the hell your point was, there was no need for that

 

[DevMBC]

I'm all the styles in perfect unison obv :x

Bullet bill you're wrong.

All I mean to say euan is that what you said seemed to come out of nowhere lol. Spoke to Z about it last night an he heard my views on w/e, gravy gravy gravy.

 

[Mr P]

Dug myself out of a hole ? I dont remember ever being in one, my second post said EXACTLY the same thing my first one did except it was reinterated with less swearing and explained what i meant a lot better (well atleast what i thought was explained a lot better). I dont know how i could have made it any simpler so that you wouldn't have made any mistakes interpreting what i was saying jo3 but anyway whether what i said was to offend anyone, thats your choice to BE offended and i dont really care who is.

Smashie - i already explained what part of my post was directed at you personally, if you dont want to believe me then that's too bad.

Take from what i said in my post how you like, hopefully for some people they will have gained a positive interpretation from what i said. I mean have been around these smash forums for 4 YEARS now you'd think maybe i know a little bit or too about the game.

Oh and be honest with yourself, do you think you exhibit any of the kind of things i am talking about ? Because ive seen a hell of a lot of it at tournies or on the boards, when you start being honest with yourself and stop living in denial then you'll see big improvements in your game, if you cant see that viewing some players as being unattainable (espescially in the UK) as being bad for your game then i seriously question your way of thought.

 

[Bullet Bill]

Wrong about what Jam?

 

[DevMBC]

Sirlin's book is just ways of looking at competitive gaming which can never really help your game. In fact, the book never really talks about smash, it uses streetfighter for examples.

all of that ^_^

 

[Sporkman]

I don't understand where all the arguing came from.. To me, it looked like P and Zeppo were having a casual conversation about whores and blow jobs.

 

[J03]

euan- then why not skip the second post and just say that... i still stand firm on the idea that people dont look at ken,m2k and Z and think omg ill never be that good for if they did then they WILL never be good. i do think that people look at people like PC and think 'i want to be that good' and surely thats not a bad thing?

 

[J03]

my favorite part of this entire thread has been

Bullet bill you're wrong.

man i can just keep saying it and saying it

 

[Mr P]

euan- then why not skip the second post and just say that... i still stand firm on the idea that people dont look at ken,m2k and Z and think omg ill never be that good for if they did then they WILL never be good. i do think that people look at people like PC and think 'i want to be that good' and surely thats not a bad thing?

You still dont get it all do you ? I give up...

jam- why not get them to send the travel funds to you for some extra money ^_^

By the way jo3, this is EXACTLY what im talking about.

 

[J03]

euan- wtf are you on, jam is a mate, if you had a proper sense of humour i guess you would understand that im joking. i would have said the same thing if anyone had posted it

that said i guess we werent on the same page so im sorry for argueing a point that wasnt under scrutiny.

 

[Mr P]

Here is a post i wrote on another board:

My Initial belief was that talent was something natural, raw that was encoded into your genes at birth, something which was predefined with you as a being from the moment of your conception. But recently i have began to question the meaning of what talent really is, talent to me seems to be something which is linked to a lot of other factors like motivation, creativity and the ability to be openminded in how you think about your craft.

Some people can pick something up quickly and be good at it and you would define them as being talented. Maybe if they worked very hard at it they could be become something incredible and set new boundries for whatever it is they are doing, but for me i have seen too many cases where someone who would not necessarily be defined as "talented" achieve great things and it wasn't necessarily JUST because they worked HARD (i dont want to undermine the importance of hard work here, because it IS compulsary). I've seen people who were awful at something but through a lot of drive and determination reach a moment of clarity and suddenly make a lot of important realisations about what it is that they were doing and become great, even the best at what they do.

We as human beings have the ability to think and analyze and change our approach about certain things, i dont think talent is really as important as it's made out to be unless you are simply of some kind of prodigal level. You couldn't say the man who initally sucked at something and became the very best was talented by your standard definition, i believe that if you think about something in the right way then it is possible to achieve great things or even become the best at what it is you do.

The point i am really trying to make is that just because you are not necessarily talented by the standard defintion doesn't mean you cant go on to become THE BEST at what you do if you work hard enough and approach what you are doing in the right way.

 

[DevMBC]

this topic's getting trippy

 

[J03]

euan, i agree with you. =/ i thought you were going on about how good players shouldnt be held in high regards simply becuase they were good. now i realise your talking about peoples initial ability not affecting there true potential and to not be put off by good players or more importantly making personal johns to yourself that there better because there more talented then you where as there as good as they are becuase of the work theyve put in and whether or not your 'talented' is a point of view warped be people who put these people on unreachable pedestals.

bottom line is anyone can be good at smash, as long as they dont hinder themselves thinking they cant be as good as players they consider talented when in reality the 'talented' players may have been exatly like them when they started out.

at least i think thats what your trying to say XD

 

[J03]

i got confused because you posted when we were still chatting about the guide

 

[Cpt.Zeppo]

Joe-dont take this offensively,but I want to ask you have you ever worked really hard at something and achieved something?

Rofl at teh P.

 

[captain smashie01]

jeez, has some mysterious blanket of hatred descended over scotland?

 

[Mr P]

this topic's getting trippy

Nope, anything but trippy.

euan, i agree with you. =/ i thought you were going on about how good players shouldnt be held in high regards simply becuase they were good. now i realise your talking about peoples initial ability not affecting there true potential and to not be put off by good players or more importantly making personal johns to yourself that there better because there more talented then you where as there as good as they are becuase of the work theyve put in and whether or not your 'talented' is a point of view warped be people who put these people on unreachable pedestals.

bottom line is anyone can be good at smash, as long as they dont hinder themselves thinking they cant be as good as players they consider talented when in reality the 'talented' players may have been exatly like them when they started out.

at least i think thats what your trying to say XD

Yes, exactly.

1 jeez, has some mysterious blanket of hatred descended over scotland?

I dont get it ?

 

[Cpt.Zeppo]

jeez, has some mysterious blanket of hatred descended over scotland?

Is this directed at me?I didnt mean any offence to Joe at all.Talking about things like talent and stuff without any basis of experience is just pretentious.Besides,I dont get how people always look at the intent in a question.How can you gather what Im implying from it?

 

[captain smashie01]

never mind. i think its best we ALL let this whole thing drop

 

[DevMBC]

it's all too personal. this hasn't got anyone anywhere lol. oh forums

 

[grayfox]

I agree with Euan on the front of talent. It is all a mind set of motivation, adaption and dedication. I've read up on it quite a lot as i've always dispised the idea of people just being born better.

Remember, Mozart is regarded as one of the greatest genius' with just inborn incredible ability but both his parents were European renowned composers themselves and taught him from the age of 3 and he worked at it for hours and hours a day >_O Didn't become worlds best just like that

 

[captain smashie01]

beethoven > mozart

and he was deaf, thats like playin smash with one hand