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Swanky's Sideshow: Diddy Kong Video Arkive and Kritique Thread

D-reckless

Smash Rookie
Joined
May 27, 2014
Messages
13
These are some games of me at Versus Gaming Center in south florida.
follow their youtube (www.youtube.com/user/vsgamingcenter) and their twitch (www.twitch.tv/vsgc). The top SFL players all goto it such as nick riddle, master raven, MVD, porkchops, xaltis, bleagelo, cruz control and many more.

These are 2 sets I had against Porkchops a couple weeks ago.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c343CAH-zsk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4YPiomZCDp8

This is a set I had against Mojohnbo 2 weeks ago.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mibY87E9W-E

These are 2 sets I had against MVD last week.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0uy3IJ5Nto&index=28&list=UUNQJBqULtyOg9flR1jYpeaw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JwvT2d8NB9I&list=UUNQJBqULtyOg9flR1jYpeaw
 

Searing_Sorrow

Smash Journeyman
Joined
May 19, 2014
Messages
433
Location
Alma/Statesboro Georgia
These are some games of me at Versus Gaming Center in south florida.
follow their youtube (www.youtube.com/user/vsgamingcenter) and their twitch (www.twitch.tv/vsgc). The top SFL players all goto it such as nick riddle, master raven, MVD, porkchops, xaltis, bleagelo, cruz control and many more.

These are 2 sets I had against Porkchops a couple weeks ago.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c343CAH-zsk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4YPiomZCDp8

This is a set I had against Mojohnbo 2 weeks ago.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mibY87E9W-E

These are 2 sets I had against MVD last week.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0uy3IJ5Nto&index=28&list=UUNQJBqULtyOg9flR1jYpeaw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JwvT2d8NB9I&list=UUNQJBqULtyOg9flR1jYpeaw
Sounds like fun, saw the Florida crew, but only got to play NickRiddle Hungrybox bracket , Darksonic friendlies and (MasterRaven in pools.) Hopefully I will be a lot better before going to Florida, and was the Florida crew going to go against Xanadu crew?
 
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Conti

Smash Ace
Joined
Dec 14, 2008
Messages
839
Location
Philadelphia, PA
Honestly dude thanks for the ideas and analysis from last week, with your help and a little bit of self review and honestly notes of habits and stuff that i actually wrote down. I was able to adapt and apply the new ideas [sloppily imo] and somehow was able to beat Gohan this weekend. Also Boss [who mains mario/diddy and tops/wins alot of big tournys] Came to my tournament all the way from VA even tho it was a crappy turnout tbh [worst turnouts ive ever had ever i feel bad -.- ofc im getting better when people stop coming out] and i got to get wrecked by him in Grand Finals, i tried, but his percision had me shook, im not at that level of gameplay yet, i understand it i just didnt understand how to respond to it, and the pressure and **** was real [i got mad nervous against em tbh], i learned some stuff from the matches tho right off the bat, but maybe looking at these Diddy Dittos can really help us see some new options and how precision on diddy looks.

I got the matches up on my Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/user/ContiBeastMode/videos) ill organize them at the bottom of this post tho. Yeah, it was neat, Gohan beat me in winners i was just SD'ing and being silly tbh they were winnable games but i knew he was going to lose to boss most likely anyways so i was bound to verse em in losers anyways where id have a 3 outta 5 to try new stuff out lol. He won game1 it was close i was like kinda down, Game2 i brought it back last stock and won, he then switched to marth Game3, he was just beating me by Fsmashing cuz i was just playing down on my self and sloppy, i got mad i was letting myself get "scrubstompped" (idk what term to use to suit it) by mindlessly going into Fsmash (i was being stupid and not DI'ing out) and do a crazy comeback on my 2nd last stock and take all of his stocks off right there, from there i had momentum and idk he hates diddy kong it seems, won game 4 for a 3-1 victory, Then got my training session in with boss, just watch the game, i got merked, but there is SOOO much info right there, game3 i wanted him to 4stock me tbh (i just wanted to see a pros punish game first hand [there was no way i was beating him with my current knowledge and tech/mechanics/decisionmaking of P:M Diddy, he is a much better and experianced player]. OP strategys ;D ) , then i did better in the friendly we played real quick cuz i didnt feel pressured still solid 2stock, but its fine, being able to take 2 off makes me happy tbh, its progress. hopefully we can disect this gameplay and advance our diddys.

HyperBolic Time Portal #11 TPL | ContiBeastMode (Diddy) vs Gohan (Peach/Marth) Winners Round2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TNEiHFKbBPI

HyperBolic Time Portal #11 TPL | ContiBeastMode (Diddy) vs Gohan (Peach/Marth) Losers Finals Part 1/2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3M00KUOOqAo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c__CgkD2TEM

HyperBolic Time Portal #11 TPL | ContiBeastMode (Diddy) vs Boss (Diddy) Grand Finals
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B-lDKDNUgNw

also so after watching ur match with Ganon & Roy in GFs, You are definately the polar opposite of me in terms of playstyle, my punish game is so unsure and sloppy, but my banana zoning and timings are pretty decent, you have some really good punishes, but weak item play and zoning. it was meant for us to critique eachother lol. So yeah to start, start going in on training mode and practice wavedash pickups, mixed with dashdancing and GTs [and dribbling is possible in P:M btw the timing is strictish], like really go out of the box with ur movement, also something busted, Side-B with banana in hand to air grab is busted,do the Attack option, [as u pop off: airiel GT tech cashe throw the banana down]. its scary dashdance pressure.
Side-B grab = god setup it seems, watch boss. Uair and nair n doublejump bs there is sooo much.
I need to practice it too. Practice sheild bounce airel GTs too when someone bananas at u.
Oh and i know barrels are op but dont overuse them [especially cuz its a bad habit for when they get nerfed as i predict]
I'll do an in depth analysis tommorrow on ur game but thats basics off the 2 games i saw, im tired tbh :3
 
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Searing_Sorrow

Smash Journeyman
Joined
May 19, 2014
Messages
433
Location
Alma/Statesboro Georgia
K and yea I use up b reactionary every time I feel they will jump, recover, or attack and abuse it too much. And as for combo game, this is weaker punishes than usual, due to him using correct d.I on my d.I traps and avoiding my best combo starters.( we play a lot)

What sucks about my play is my air mobility is still better than my ground mobility ( b reverse cancel movement, agt , footstool, side b, up b etc). something I am trying to work on is making ground game as threatening, I can change dash dance distance and speed, but hadn't really started sh nair at this point, something I started doing at tipped off that really helped complete the giant whole in my neutral game.
 

Searing_Sorrow

Smash Journeyman
Joined
May 19, 2014
Messages
433
Location
Alma/Statesboro Georgia
OK in your battle vs boss, first match you didn't keep nearly enough hit boxes out for the match. Diddy dittos nair up smash and dash attack tend to be really good, derp =good.

On your punish game look closely at your options on early throw usage comparatively to other diddys. Originally boss used to do down throw and hope for poor d.I, so he can hit with fair.
But now he uses mainly up throw at early percent cause it works and is diddy's best throw till around 40 on most of the cast. Comparing them, your using (forward throw) for no followup. boss gets (up throw to dair) with a chance at a powerful followup if bad tech, as well as good position. and then you have (up throw to sh side b), which is a very powerful d.I based throw dependent on a lot of factors I am not going into right now . Difference being Dair can lead to powerful followups if they miss a tech, but when side b grab is available (believe diddy is like up throw him at 18%-28%), it leads to guaranteed followups and platform extensions. Not to mention the second option head jump into falling nair if you have banana placement available leads to good damage as well.

Surprisingly, didn't see much up smash being used, since it is a great juggle with falling nair, but boss was mainly doing well with veteran spacing and textbook fundamentals. This was a good attempt, and a great opportunity to play one of the top diddy mains. In the future though if your diddy and diddy is trying to recover, upb meteor him out of his recovery if he recovers from far, and I believe side b grab also beats out the up b. If you can't get there in time, runaway pivot grab is an option as well. Hope advice helps. Made it to top eight in state power ranking, and still using bananas as landmines or bad peanuts mostly lol I need to hit lab longer
 
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Searing_Sorrow

Smash Journeyman
Joined
May 19, 2014
Messages
433
Location
Alma/Statesboro Georgia
Saw gohan match as well, and will review that later but liked the added movement, takes a while to get used to so you don't get SD'S and raw air dodges, but your spacing was significantly improved vs gohan's peach, and peanuts kept him grounded. saw times to mixup side b inputs and such after connecting, but definitely noticeable improvement and got you to grand finals congrats.

As for dissecting boss's game play, I tried playing similarly, but noticed a large drop in punish game on my part, so am working on carrying punish game into a melee pace. The good of the forum is you can take bits of what everyone does and build your own play style from it, till people are copying you lol. Only time you will see me going serious item play is vs samus, DDD, and if someone wants normal diddy practice. Georgia pm as a whole is very good at counter item play or just (spam)mario, so needing to be good when people get in is necessary for competing here.
 
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MToaste

Smash Rookie
Joined
Feb 25, 2014
Messages
14
Yea that was pretty auto pilot Mario. M2K doesn't deviate until he is forced, assuming this is New Brunswick as in Canada?
Yeah, that's right. It was definitely autopilot as heck, but it worked lol. So many little things I had trouble punishing and getting around, despite knowing the opening.

In any case, I learned how to better fight that sort of thing for next time haha.
 

Conti

Smash Ace
Joined
Dec 14, 2008
Messages
839
Location
Philadelphia, PA
I've been really really busy irl lately my bad, i will critique u once my new house gets internet, [i had to move to a new house and a buncha bs this week outta no where] :3
 

Searing_Sorrow

Smash Journeyman
Joined
May 19, 2014
Messages
433
Location
Alma/Statesboro Georgia
Just posting two videos. I notice the longer a tourney goes on, the worst I tend to play, to the point of just making flat out bad decisions, if you have the time could you take a look and critique away at the videos below.
Vs Sonic
http://m.youtube.com/watch?list=PLaYfkR50MSFYT3_K1ewIVY9SiFLWiuAtx&v=_4MLF8x0G4g
(A 2a.m match on a 14h tourney day, so please excuse our scrubbiness cause we went for so much cheese.) I have no clue "what do" vs sonic's down b, it was acting like it had transcendent priority, not trading with any of my moves, and combos fast fallers like a falco pillar combo gone wrong lol. Only thing I picked up was that side b grab of diddy's will beat it out, but you have to have a banana on the field to force sonic not to do side b instead, which will beat you out. A lot closer of a set than I would like, and all the things like neutral game, dash dance, and that spacing stuff felt meaningless when sonic covers that ground to you in 10f and can react to what you do in mid spin :/ , still a funny set.
Vs cpt falcon , Roy, ganon
http://www.twitch.tv/eaglesmash/c/5265421
(Grand Finals of a local tourney, notice a lot of mistakes personally, but still good to get another point of view on matches.)
Vs Dankey Kang
https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=86MrzTUTyCE
The best dk main in Georgia pm, we ended up playing a few friendlies before the upcoming tournament a while back. Since first match is pure tanking, recommend skipping to match 2 and onward. If a better idea for comboing dk , or for a better approach than suffocate him with projectiles exist, I would like to know lol. Think I got the hang of it by later matches, but still go 50/50, and have to ban PS2, like he bans fd, which is weird since I only do that against samus players and fatality.
Vs falco and yoshi
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yz2fQ3XXh9A&list=PLmOE4XgHqBjqpFBAhwpA02KVal6YOjMpe
Just some hot seat friendlies, a Switerand and attempt at secondaries here or there, but all in all, pleased with the vast improvement of the person in the chair.
 
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Searing_Sorrow

Smash Journeyman
Joined
May 19, 2014
Messages
433
Location
Alma/Statesboro Georgia
http://challonge.com/smashrwmpm1014 small tournament, large competition lol The Reflex Wonder being my 3rd match. With me being so backwards I win vs Wario on fountain of dreams, then lose to his pocket ivysaur on battlefield.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-CYMvimE9A match vs brass monkey, noticed i jumped a lot more than i should have, and didn't do down throw enough to make him respect my d.i trap combo at early percent (Both lead to virtually guaranteed 36-80% depending on the situation if they guess wrong on the throw so dont know why I didnt, dumb moment). Outside of that, with the exception of a few missed movements, I wasn't too disgusted with how I played. Still salty about the banana that bounced off his grounded shield on last stock, but ovrall, he outplayed me.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WD8V1JkpQCo
The match of me playing SS|Soft , did ok vs jigglypuff, but the best match I had was vs the falco offstream, after watching Porkchops play at Tipped Off 10, did a whole lot better this time around with a couple 0 to deaths.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XGtQGjfAlhQ
Salty friendlies to help stall for time until the brawl finals could take place. Unless you want to see the power of my mediocre lolimar, I suggest skipping to 6:56 for an idea to extend combos, aerial side b off up smash lol. Also I didnt rage quit, they told us we could stop when I survived the up air so we were quitting anyway.
 
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Cuccu Maestro

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jun 14, 2006
Messages
59
Location
Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
Could I get some critique on my diddy please? Any little thing that I could improve on would help, I'm trying to fill the holes in my gameplay right now.
I dunno why the video starts halfway through game 2, but here is footage of a set I play.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ev_zl3o6ZY

I will go over my sets vs fox and find one to post as well, the fox matchup is my biggest weakness by far. Do you guys have any advice at all on the fox matchup? Little tidbits even would help, how do you play it and what works?

Thanks in advance, guys.
 

Searing_Sorrow

Smash Journeyman
Joined
May 19, 2014
Messages
433
Location
Alma/Statesboro Georgia
Overall your techskill isn't bad and started to look progressively better in further matches. The major issue arose in decision making at critical points of the match. This could be contributed to not knowing ness the character. Example, ness's fastest throw is forward throw, and all of his throws leave time to change d.i in mid animation. I.e if he does back throw, hold up to live longer. Situations like putting yourself off stage from getting too aggressive setup for an easy yoyo gimp that cost the match. The other problem arose from doing down throw in a few situations where back throw would have killed (ness did this too).

Game 1: If you played each stock with the same spacing discipline of stock 2, this probably would have been an easy 3 stock match. suggestion would be switching up down throw and up throw every so often to get a bigger punish with things like down throw -dash attack - nair- nair. When you know they are using d.i to limit up throw followups, and abuse the explicit out of shff nair on fountain of broken dreams. Will finish watching rest after game 2 later and probably edit this post to include the rest and touch it up some to be more specific.

Game 2: More of the same from game 1, except your option choices on throws became slightly worse. The combo game itself became better, but left you more open to counter play as you over extended more often than necessary. Stage allowed you to better showcase your ability to play with platforms, but would have liked to see you capitalize more on the fact the almost always wake up attacked. (Running shield into fast down or back throw would generally work well.) Overall had nice use of oos options but respect ness’s nair more, and try to bait it first. It is similar to peach’s nair but not instant luigi bad.

Game 3: He continues to wake up attack everytime, so try either a dair punish or empty hop fast fall to bait wake up then side b where he is at after re jumping into the air. Nice use of movement options, and fast turnaround after the bad start. Glad you are utilizing back air and spamming nair more on the small stage. That entire combo at the end should never happen if the right d.i is used, but again requires having knowledge of the character.

Game 4: You are punishing his bad habit of spamming wake up attacks more, but still dying earlier than necessary to back throw d.i up for this throw. The use of drop aerials are nice, but the decision making to go for fair at the ledge and mis-spacing it cost you a stock on stock 2 to spam down air.

All around good games and nice use of the banana to limit the opponent’s options. Unfortunately I won’t be in any serious tournaments till the 28th of this month, so just working on getting other people better till I buy another copy of brawl since it got stolen at the last outing I went to.

Don't have any vids of me in a serious match , but am assisting a friend in making their peach better in this video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ISHEg7ldQh8&feature=youtu.be
For the most part I am just utilizing a lot of movement options, and trying to assist in helping him recognize opportunities to go in. (If you know the character peach, it would be great if you have some tips exceeding basic fundamentals.) I would like it if his punish game could improve before he plays in amateur night this coming Friday. Skip to 1:15:00 for sorrow.
 
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DLA

"Their anguish was my nourishment."
Joined
Jun 28, 2008
Messages
3,533
Location
Chicago, IL
NNID
DLAhhh
So after being discouraged for a long time after 3.5 dropped, I stuck with Diddy and have now been placing as well--maybe even better--than before. I've gotten 3rd at the last two weeklies I went to, netting some pretty swanky wins. Here are some of my best ones:

DLA vs Dart (ranked 2nd on Chicago PR in both Melee and PM):


DLA vs KirkQ (previously ranked 4th on Chicago PR):


DLA vs Kels (ranked 1st on Chicago PR in both Melee and PM):

[will be uploaded soon]
 

Soft Serve

softie
Premium
Joined
Dec 7, 2011
Messages
4,164
Location
AZ
Hypeee

I'll watch these later tonight after I finish some work. I've been watching a lot of Luck recently and taking notes on him so It'll be interesting to compare you two lol.
 

DLA

"Their anguish was my nourishment."
Joined
Jun 28, 2008
Messages
3,533
Location
Chicago, IL
NNID
DLAhhh
I'll post this one too even though I got 3-1'd. I thought I played well minus all of the silly SDs that happened:


edit: this one too:

 
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Bellioes

Smash Lord
Joined
Jan 5, 2009
Messages
1,096
Location
Montreal, QC
Hey guys, just got back into playing since 3.5 dropped and went to my first weekly in a long time not too long ago.

Anyways, lots of Diddy changes Ive been getting used to and heres a pretty recent match from that weekly. Id like critique mostly on game1 since my opponent didnt really know the fox-diddy mu, But feel free to comment on game2 as well. Thanks

http://youtu.be/XjPNlr5B8Fk
 

Soft Serve

softie
Premium
Joined
Dec 7, 2011
Messages
4,164
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AZ
Massive bump, I need help seeing where to improve and how.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpTYF9Qk77E
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDXmIRogTIE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JIQB7vvPH-E

I know my punish game could be expanded a lot, I'm not converting into kill moves or situations that would allow easy traps into dsmash. My reset game is pretty bad in that aspect. The combo game on the ness was okay although I wasn't ending much of them well, I was dropping like everything vs neon but thats mostly me being inconsistent, I dont think I need advice on comboing fast fallers so much as I need to just execute properly.

My neutral was piss poor in the sets vs neon/sonic, just jumping into everything, but still I'd like some good advice as to where to put popguns better and how to preemptively address people approaching me with characters that approach well. I was trying to beat them out with sh instant nairs but it wasn't working well and I just jumped into so many blasters/spins.

Also my item game is really bad now, Idk what happened but I'm so impatient when it comes to using it properly and while I know how to do all the tech it just doesn't come to me and Instead of dash dancing with banana in hand waiting I try to put the banana below people when they jump and it just doesn't work. What should I be doing different to keep the threat of glide toss there but not risk giving up banana/stage control? I know Junebug in a lot of match ups just wavebounces popgun in neutral and does dash forward>Glide toss back throw down when he has the opponent cornered. I don't know if thats to bait them into jumping into it, just threatening them without committing, or just a comfort thing? I want to know when I should be doing it, because I feel like crawl>dtilt>glide toss away feels more threatening.


Yeah I'd like advice lol. Really trying to improve again now that I have a lot more drive. I've been working on my patience with item use and in neutral in general and I think it shows from just one week to the next in the videos, but I still feel like I'm just missing something and when I start doing those few nuances in neutral better and understanding why/when to do things (And clean up my punish game) everything will click better. If anyone gets back to this by tomorrow night I'll try to absorb the info and use it at the weekly tomorrow, but yeah. Thanks in advance, hoping the diddy boards can pick back up because I feel like I'm approaching another big plateau and it'll be much easier to get over if I'm not working all the angles by my self haha
 

Searing_Sorrow

Smash Journeyman
Joined
May 19, 2014
Messages
433
Location
Alma/Statesboro Georgia
Git my drive back too this patch.
Vs Neon: PS2: The most important miss in this match was some very important edgeguard flubs. Some being as simple as just grabbing ledge. For wolf's recovery you want to shoot the peanut early before going to the ledge, it's the opposite of what you do for falco, since you want to mainly take away both their options of side b away. There were a few moments where up throw to up smash would have been a better option, but overall it was still leading to tech chase conversions. The only other thing I noticed was neon using wolf's laser just to see your reaction, (which is about all it is good for). Having more peanuts in general and keeping banana in play longer could of lead to more stray nair and Bair hits to put him out of cc percents, and in the right throw percents for followups. I know side b> up air works on fox and falco, but not sure of the followup on wolf early.

Final Destination : Diddy has in the air b reverse cancel movements, agt with banana and side b. These options can help you stall to find openings or help keep you safe when he has taken over the ground game. There was an early percent choice where you chose to nair wolf at early percent instead of grab (always grab spacies in that scenario.) At best it could have lead to a back throw > cartwheel > side b cheese, and the more likely outcome better stage position and getting your banana out. Cc is really dumb in this game and you always need to be aware of it. Ignoring the recovery flubs as getting used to slightly tweaked recovery.
The biggest thing I saw in this one was that the banana game was extremely linear. Nearly Every throw was straight at wolf. Since you have running crouch down smash down, incorporating running agt up and down with this method should be really easy and allow for burst movement. Aside from that, attempt to incorporate more juggles with nair and upsmash chains. Fair has more knockback, but up air angle is far better than the sak-a-fry angle they put on fair in most situations. Powershielding laser is relatively easy, but in most situations not rewarding, so either getting more peanuts out, or playing through them is probably a better choice. Good set, would definitely recommend trying to get more stray hits on neon before hard committing to aerials on grounded opponents.
 
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Journal

Smash Apprentice
Joined
May 21, 2015
Messages
126
Soft Serve, I'm watching the first video now, and here are my thoughts (sorry if they're a little less organized than Searing_Sorrow's).

With regards to edgeguarding, there are a few things that I think you could do to improve. For example, you can use your banana to cut off options off stage. So if you fire a peanut and throw a banana up as you fall to the ledge, you've cut off a few options. In general, grabbing ledge more would have helped, and I understand that you were afraid of wolf's flash (who isn't lol) but if you want to minimize the time it takes to get to the ledge a little bit, you can do the crawl tech to get there. If you want to stay on stage, know that the downtilt is a little less committal than downsmash at the ledge, and that bair covers half the platform. Downsmash is good, but the spacing might have been a bit off and off the dtilt you probably could have gotten something else to secure the edgeguard. Alternatively, you could place the banana on the platform and position yourself near or on the ledge for better option coverage.

Also just a general thing would be to use the banana in a less predictable way. Try to think of it as a (great source of potassium?) tool for cutting off options, not just to start combos and tech chases by throwing it at them. One way I like to use it against spacies trying to pressure me is to GT down while rolling away so they trip as soon as they land where they were going to land.
 
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Searing_Sorrow

Smash Journeyman
Joined
May 19, 2014
Messages
433
Location
Alma/Statesboro Georgia
www.twitch.tv/eaglesmash
Dont
think this thread is active anymore. Just got back into practicing pm again and need to keep practicing till tipped off 11. Had a few matches Saturday from 1:34:00- 1:46:00 and 2:43:00-3:06:00 that made it pretty obvious to me my edgeguarding and recovery are really off right now. In general I am really bad with dair and keep getting side b a lot when I am going for the buffer motion of peanut gun(edit resetting the controller helped with the latter). Can't get too much out of the games after, cause everyone wanted to leave and we ended up just doing a rock paper scissors 9 times in a row. We even tied on that so just called it even. Harsh criticism is wanted, though descriptions of better alternatives would be greatly appreciated. Otherwise I am just going in blind lol.
 
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Soft Serve

softie
Premium
Joined
Dec 7, 2011
Messages
4,164
Location
AZ
Sometimes? I've been super busy so I've only had time for self critiques, but I know me and Searing sorrow follow the whole board religiously
 

FlamingForce

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 5, 2013
Messages
390
In that case


Pre-Johns: I have a winning record vs Sluggard, but he brought some new tricks and my play was uninspired to say the least, I was somewhat done with singles mentality wise after winning the previous set (Vengeance for our winners set that I lost). I was also not given time to gather myself, had to play LF right away. (Personally I really really like some breaks in between.) I've never had to play as many important sets on a single day in my life (Important being sets that meant either a decent upset or a difference in payout money) and my lack of experience and stamina clearly showed here.

I usually go for a much more campy gameplan vs DDD but I tried going in a little harder this time, some of the main pitfalls that I didn't know my way around were getting grabbed at the edge (he follows it up with a suicide stock at least once) and moving around him when DDD gets closer, I was very scared of his F-air sniping me off platforms.

Another thing is pressure, whenever I get DDD near an edge I'm at a slight loss on how to make the most of my stage advantage, I'm guessing the best option is to just keep a nanner in hand and annoy him with peanuts? I'm hoping for slightly more aggressive options as well though. Aerials on shield (and landing in front of him) seem to always be a bad idea no matter how good your spacing is (Dat lmaoshieldgrab range) does spaced bair work?
 
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Soft Serve

softie
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Dec 7, 2011
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4,164
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Spaced bair always gets shield grabbed unless you're a god, I did a retreating max distance bair and got shield grabbed last monday. Cross him up and shield the bair OoS or don't hit his shield with an aerial unless you have a banana set up going on

I'll watch the set sometime today

Playing aggro vs ddd just doesn't work, you have to lame him out then shark under him when he jumps. If you don't let ddd play neutral then every time you get hit you know you made a mistake and can adjust easier imo
 
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FlamingForce

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Spaced bair always gets shield grabbed unless you're a god, I did a retreating max distance bair and got shield grabbed last monday.
Jesus tapdancing christ.
Pmdt plz rofl.

But yeah, I figured the campy way is the right way, that's how I usually beat him.

Cheers for watching in advance, will keep an eye out for your post.
 

Searing_Sorrow

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To start with, many of the decisions made in this match are reckless for going against an edgeguard character like ddd. Playing more safe and resetting neutral on your terms is overall better in the matchup.

When you don't have a banana in your hand, ddd can safely poke your shield with forward tilt, and throw waddles your way to setup the stage in his favor. It is your goal to get the banana into play, which you were able to do, but you immediately threw it right at him, Giving away your neutral advantage for free.

The two major crimes in this set was that you never utilized diddy's best projectile, the popgun. Popgun with banana in hand allows you to cut out the opponent's options, and punish with the banana when you force the opponent into the air or in sheild.

Ddd is a large character, and with proper setup, can be put from 0-90 really quickly thanks to side b. I mention side b because I don't once remember seeing the command grab utilized as a combo tool, and a stronger punish game would have helped quite a bit in the matchup. At early percent side b pops ddd up for jab jab grab, and at mid percent it pops up for up tilt X2 into up air. This being the minimum followups available regardless of d.i, and more punishing options available as you learn your opponent's habits.

Also noticed that you were not breaking out of hit stun before trying to agt. A good trick for that is using diddy's ability to cancel his popgun to immediately get out of hitstun, and then agt towards wherever you want to go. Outside of that could breakdown each match, but I think the time spent would be better used watching other players for the custom combos. In georgia I end up playing against a lot of the heavies, and with how garbage diddy's kill power is, there is no chance of winning against other pr members without maximizing on the punish game the character has available to him. I have a few matches on twitch that I am putting on YouTube later this week if you want some mobility tricks and combo resets, outside of that, you are probably better off watching Junebug or dla for general neutral game, since I don't post videos that often. Soft Serve probably knows more about ideas for improvement than I can tell you, since I am also coming from a double shift.
 
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Soft Serve

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In that case


Pre-Johns: I have a winning record vs Sluggard, but he brought some new tricks and my play was uninspired to say the least, I was somewhat done with singles mentality wise after winning the previous set (Vengeance for our winners set that I lost). I was also not given time to gather myself, had to play LF right away. (Personally I really really like some breaks in between.) I've never had to play as many important sets on a single day in my life (Important being sets that meant either a decent upset or a difference in payout money) and my lack of experience and stamina clearly showed here.

I usually go for a much more campy gameplan vs DDD but I tried going in a little harder this time, some of the main pitfalls that I didn't know my way around were getting grabbed at the edge (he follows it up with a suicide stock at least once) and moving around him when DDD gets closer, I was very scared of his F-air sniping me off platforms.

Another thing is pressure, whenever I get DDD near an edge I'm at a slight loss on how to make the most of my stage advantage, I'm guessing the best option is to just keep a nanner in hand and annoy him with peanuts? I'm hoping for slightly more aggressive options as well though. Aerials on shield (and landing in front of him) seem to always be a bad idea no matter how good your spacing is (Dat lmaoshieldgrab range) does spaced bair work?
So the biggest things I picked up on from watching is that you weren't getting optimal punishes, weren't controlling neutral as well as you could, and your fairs were so so so telegraphed.

The only thing ddd can do in neutral without getting whiff punished or giving up stage control is throw a waddle. You need to hold onto the banana far more, you were just throwing it out whenever you had it and weren't getting as much as you could off of it. I also think you could be moving much faster and smoother. Zipping around the stage helps you threaten in neutral harder ad well as get the most out of every combo. Try to punish his tech options better, 8/10 times he just did a get up attack and none of them got punished.

When you were going to hit his shield was really telegraphed, be more careful. Like, you were not-fast falling with no double jump right in front of his shield, the fair could be shielded from a mile away. Try to mix up empty sh fast fall grabs, as well as doing side b to punish him shielding in situations where fair would be patently obvious


I've been up for 40 hours so I don't think this is the best advice I could give lol. I'll try to get back to it after I'm a functional human again
 

Searing_Sorrow

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Whelp went to north Carolina bopped and got bopped and ended in 3rd. Against link, I feel fine just adapting to the unique shield pressure and running away a bit more would help. Vs peach however, I am going to just go olimar cause f that matchup sideways, completely neutralizes my air mobility with low commitment instant coverage out of float. (Hindsight forgot I had more than one character). Anyway here is some updated material, true critiques from anyone is welcomed. Have a few adv techs of my own I didn't explain that are in there and used something someone thought of long ago as a tether killer. (Useless when they said it in 3.02 but great edgeguard tool now).


https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL5-Y7vyOjWTvswXFtyqQ1D2ZbN0LBAJFA

A few great matches were not on stream cause they didn't know who I was and had every match I played being an upset, but because of that got to play some good people early. Vs tenuchi#12 and Gato#27
Then for critiquing losses, vs archer #31 and I played stinger's peach. Unless someone has a video of a diddy blowing up Bladewise recently, I am just going olimar in this matchup for now on. Thanks in advance everyone and look forward to your essay server of soft things. Do check out that zelda too, I feel that is how the character was meant to be. Gato vs sorrow was probably best set imo
 

Soft Serve

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Snake set: Snake/diddy is weird, only played it vs Yink once in bracket but both me/you and Yink/Tunechi have really different styles haha. I like to stay grounded, and Yink is far more aggressive/technical/grenade based than tunechi but doesn't have as good of a tranq tech chase game. I know you really enjoy being air-based and it pays off a lot, your combos off of air banana hits and falling nairs are really effective. Halfway through game 1 you stopped rushing in and started controlling the pace of the Match, definetly what you need to do in the MU and it showed in game 2. Snake relies on baiting people into running at him for the most part, so if you stay a short distance away he struggles. I think the biggest thing from this set that you could work on is your ground game and dash dance grabs, there were a lot of opportunities to end stocks/get grabs after you dashed away from him jumping with a dair, and I think like 3/4 times you ran and pulled a banana instead of dashing back in and grabbing him, or catching bad DI on him fast falling the dair and killing with a pivot fsmash.

Edge guarding snake is a choir. Bananas don't do anything to up-b so I normally just leave one on stage incase he has to land there, and just grab ledge. Bair him out of up-b repeatedly and covering his other options is pretty much all you can do. Dair can hit cypher and then him as well if you do it right, which is great. Tunechi was DIing above stage for the C4 recovery, you can just bair or side-b>jump that on reaction. Its when Snake starts DIing into stage and teching>up-b that it gets hard to cover, but generally it just resets the patterns sept he is up-bing really close. You can cover both with a glide toss up>regrab ledge if you want to play it safe.

One other thing, If you're on the ledge and theres a mine right infront of you, EVERY snake player expects the roll and will just kill you for it. refresh ledge invincibility>ledge dash, or shoot a peanut to get rid of it, or neutral get up/attack. the roll is expected because its everyone's first instinct when they think "**** theres pressure right on the ledge, but I can roll through it" and then snake is right there ready to tranq/c4/grab/dsmash/uptilt/ftilt/everything you


vs Gato:
Falcon: Don't do upthrow dash attack, its just really unoptimal, you can get more off of dthrow tech chases until upthrow up-tilt combos. You were controlling neutral really well, but I think you can improve your tech chasing, edge guarding, and general punish game ALOT on falcon. He's tech chase and juggle food and should be off stage from any grab, and you need to keep him out there because if you dont he will live till like 180.

game and Watch: GnW is hard, you have the tools to outplay him at every point in neutral and stagger, but if you mess up once you die. you really need to grab ledge more in general when they are off stage. In situations where he will up-b out of combos but you can trade, go for up-airs. the larger stage counterpick is really good, but you have to dash dance more and then whiff punish things with glide toss>grab. Its such a momentum tool to constantly control what GnW can do, if he is just afraid to put hitboxes out then half of what make Game and Watch scary is gone. Challenging GnW close to him on the side he is putting out a hitbox is complete hell, you got hit by a lot of bad trades because you were just jumping at him/falling on him. If he is coming down, try to put a banana generally where he has to land and then get to the side of him, Falling dair is a really bad habit from GnW mains and if you catch it and fair him from the side you can catch bad DI and take stocks earlier.
Game 4 your edgeguards were a lot better, and good bans. I think Diddy wins on dreamland even though killing him is so hard, you have all the room to just control space.

Vs Stingers:
Vs peach if you plan on going diddy again you really need to pick your fights better. you can challenge her space but you have to do it preemptively or punishing landings precisely, otherwise you'll just get faired or trade poorly or CC dsmashed. Ground movement is so important in this MU because you can't contest her in the air, you have to put bananas where she will land and convert off those slowly. Movement and evasion is our only real tool in the MU, and popgun camping. Honestly I think the only viable strategy for winning it is to take peach to dreamland or other giant stage (what peach main would ban them) and then go for the time out. small stages are a definite no, we need room and platforms. staying away and punishing turnip plucks on reaction with glide toss is really necessary because its one of the few things we can do. Wish I could give other advice but I just play Fox or puff in this MU.


Vs Archer:
Link is weird, you have to stay a certain distance away from him at all times and you win neutral, but the burden of counterplay is on us because link has an infinite supply of boomerangs and bombs, while we get one banana and he can take it away from us. I try to stay just outside of his zair distance.
You HAVE to keep control of the banana at all times because link mains will have good item play and know to just hold it. edgeguards have to be on point to take stocks, and you had good ones but you can have those good edge-guards every time someone is off stage. ledge invincibility bairs are amazing, use them.


In general you're really safe in neutral but you can get sooo much more out of your punish game. Do falcon combos, upthrow(react to DI away) upair upair upair Fair and then edgeguard. Dont upthrow under neath platforms unless you're comfortable wavelanding onto the platform and tech chases, you dropped a lot of chances for big Damage on the falcon/link by upthrowing them to a platform when you could have dthrow tech chases, and then going for nairs on them when you could just grab them again and get a big combo. Your Air game is really good but I think you should work on dash dancing a bit more, Diddy has probably the best dash dance in the game because of how much distance he can control a banana in hand (he can reach 3/4ths of FD with max distance dash>glide toss). I think if you cleaned up your ground movement, was more conservative with when you fish with the banana instead of punishing landings/whiffs, and leveled up your punish game (upthrow combos, tech chases, edgeguarding) you'd see a lot more success. You play really smart, but you can get more out of your ability to pick good engages if you could move faster and punish harder.
 

Searing_Sorrow

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Vs peach don't plan on going diddy, but realized I was pretty much out for the day after fighting g&w. I should have been aiming for going in on her when her float timer is going out. So went and counted in training mode to know max time, if she goes any lower to have more options out of it, only then should I bother using peanut like that. Spaced Bair would have kept me just out of her range, and I could have played the lame game on large stages. In case of small stage pick only then I will switch I think.

Vs snake and falcon, down throw tech chasing instead sounds like a great idea especially when platforms are around, but isnt snake's roll good enough to just di away and roll far enough away? Assumed he had good rolls just cause of his games lol, combining that with that instant up b and i was to afraid to risk it when i could get him above me. As for vs falcon is it better to up throw jab reset, or down throw when no platforms. Seems like early till about 20 down throw would be better then going into up throw where jab regrab starts to occur. Was mostly playing snake match on feel since was not 100% sure where snake's weight put him at till on final destination, and I noticed that gato wasn't getting out of jab resets in the 2 friendlies we played earlier, so just spammed it. Glad to know falcon's tech options are still just as bad, wasn't sure to what extent did they 'normalize' tech rolls so haven't been using down throw much at all.

Vs g&w I pretty much tanked fod since the likelihood of me winning there was low, and used that time to try and find what spots I can di out of, and what spacing options I had. Those hitboxes are really really ... unique if your not prepared for the minimum endlag. The key literally stays out long after he has landed and l canceled lol, no more hard read up b on that.

As for general improvement. I can play hard core ground game, but never seem to do it on the same day I am playing well in the air. It makes sense to go air vs snake/g&w, but should have stopped after doing enough to establish ground control where diddy is so infuriating at. Thanks for the great detail, and yea revisiting a lot of those moments to see where better options were available. Honestly I love diddy's mobility with banana. In the air you have the mobility of wario with reverse cancels, and on the ground you have the suffocating pressure of a marth. Started playing a lot better when I could finally answer why I am throwing the banana if it gives me so many more options, but seems like I gave up my old outrageous punish game for better neutral. Time to hit the lab again since no one plays down here.
 
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Soft Serve

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On falcon, upthrow doesn't knock down until around 15 or so %, so if the falcon knows the di (in) he can jump out of it. Dthrow knocks down at zero and you reaction tech chase till upthrow knocks down, or till upthrow starts comboing. Benefit of dthrow is that if he lands near ledge he has less options and you can get an early smash to send him low off stage where you can gimp him. Falcon has above average tech distance and frame data, it's just diddy is fast enough to cover a of it, and falcon doesn't have a wake up option we have to respect, like a wake up shine or frame 1-3 up b.
 

Searing_Sorrow

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Great to know, I would be lying if I said the 3f up b didn't make me a bit salty since most of my major combos have dair to side b in them. Still have to remind myself that up smash is no longer the great combo tool of the past. There were were times i could have did one more reverse up tilt to a side b grab, but ended a 70+ combo at 44 cause still doing up smash. Meant to ask, am I the only one happy whenever my opponent picks up the banana?

I honestly find peanut gun to be a much better tool in general. Outside of spacies and a few others, opponent having banana only becomes a threat when they throw it up at the edge of the stage , and you allow them that time to box you in at the other edge of the stage instead of going in yourself. Characters like marth and g&w get hurt a lot by holding it, cause that is space they can no longer threaten because the item is not an arcing attack
 
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Soft Serve

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I agree I'm normally okay when people take the banana, but mostly because people don't know how to use it, not necessarily because it doesn't hurt. Shiek/link throwing out projectiles from center stage is scary. So it Marth dash dancing in front of you, over a banana he z dropped there. M2/peach/rob still throwing aerials out while having your banana is scary too. Zss doing dsmash and fsmash while having banana, etc etc.
 
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