Stuff About Puff

[HT F8]

I never would have thought of that >.<
What if you're playing a really campy Zelda? :o

Camping with what... that fireball thing? lol. Shield.

 

[RestInPeace]

Camping isn't always projectiles.

And tech chasing with Puff is so hard for me. All they have to do is tech away, and the fastest way to get there would be Pound. It works sometimes. But the thing is that you have to start jumping that way before they start rolling, or at the same time, or it won't work. They can change directions upon reaction time, I think. (I'm imagining that they can do this on reaction time right now.)

And the PS thing is pretty easy, actually, once you get the hang of it. The hard part is following up with something good. I just grab, because I can't think of anything else to do. There's too little lag time on spaced SHFFL'd aerials.

 

[HT F8]

Yeah I know, but if she's gonna sit on the other side of the stage bairing pointlessly, you can just do the same.

And yeah I have the same problem. Tech roll away = no possible followup most of the time.

 

[dudutsai]

You have to predict where they are going to go. It doesn't count as away if you are already halfway there. Also consider tech chasing with dash attack, as that can work sometimes if they end too far away for other moves.

 

[idea]

yeah, that's pretty much just predicting them. teching away is usually safe unless the jigglypuff calls you on it...so start calling them on it. even if you're wrong, now they know you're considering the option and will have to tech not-away sometimes.

if you jump after them, you can kind of time it so that you could float in either direction and still get them. the counter to this is getup attack, since you're floating in the air right above them. the counter to THAT is either predict that and run up and shield, or stay in the air longer than expected and fall on them with nair/other. or run up right next to them in the first place and make an educated guess from there.

long story short, mindgaems.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Tech rolls are generally forty frames in length, twenty of those invincible. Rollout charges fully at frame forty-five. So if they're in the air long enough to make up that difference, you can tech chase with Rollout =P

 

[CRASHiC]

I have so much trouble resting Dr. Mario. Any tips?

 

[dudutsai]

DO NOT DO IT. It's not worth it at all.

Rollout is really good for punishing those moves that nobody techs, like ledge hop fairs, or nairs at high percents.

 

[RestInPeace]

Cape, Cape, Cape, Cape, Cape, Throw, FAIR. lol. Or, they can just take out the throw to be safe.

Rollout tech chase sounds funny. When will there be an occasion for this...? I can see it. Dthrow -> Rollout on fast fallers lol.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Jigglypuff's dthrow has twenty-two frames of lag between release and when you can act, which means they have to spend twenty-eight frames in the air, plus however long it takes for you to reach them with Rollout.

So maybe thirty frames or so.

 

[Tamoo]

jiggs dthrow to rollout sounds like it has some decent potential, esp on stages like fd but i can only see it being useful gainst chars like ganon and cfalcon who u cant do much to from a grab, unlike fox and falco.

Also, doesnt the amount of frames you have after the throw is released until you act depend on the weight of the character? Which is why fox can uthrow uair jiggs but not samus for example.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Some of them depend on the weight of the character, others don't. Jigglypuff's dthrow is a set frame one.

I seriously proposed Rollout as a joke though =P Thirty frames is a LONG time.

 

[Tamoo]

still worth a test though eh lol, and plus, i take it 30 frames is fully charged, it doesnt have to be fully charged to be useful.

 

[AprilShaw]

jiggs dthrow to rollout sounds like it has some decent potential, esp on stages like fd but i can only see it being useful gainst chars like ganon and cfalcon who u cant do much to from a grab, unlike fox and falco.

Also, doesnt the amount of frames you have after the throw is released until you act depend on the weight of the character? Which is why fox can uthrow uair jiggs but not samus for example.

I don't know about this, but I believe if they're heavier then they have less hit stun in general lol. Which is why ganon can uair out of fox uthrow uair, same thing with samus, she's really heavy so she can get out.

 

[Tamoo]

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=206469

just found the magus thread, turns out that weight does affect the afterlag on throws, rather than the hitstun.

Only jiggs uthrow and bthrow are affected by this

 

[RestInPeace]

DThrow a Marth on FD. They'll DI away, and if not, SH Uair them. If they do, ROLLOUT :D. Sounds funny, because chances are they'll shoot an aerial before they land to keep themselves safe. Hit them after lol.

 

[HawaiianJigglyPuff]

DThrow a Marth on FD. They'll DI away, and if not, SH Uair them. If they do, ROLLOUT :D. Sounds funny, because chances are they'll shoot an aerial before they land to keep themselves safe. Hit them after lol.

hmm...this sounds intriguing.

I'll have to try this some time.

 

[dudutsai]

Rollout isn't that great of a move to use. Pretty much every character can hit puff out of her rollout. The only reason to use it, is because people won't expect it, and many people get the timing wrong.

For serious games, I usually will avoid using rollout (it's my favorite move) because it will only work if your opponent messes up the timing, which most people won't do.

 

[hungrybox]

lol

rollout and rest seem like useless moves

when they dont hit anything

 

[idea]

the best use of rollout is to "edgeguard" someone when they're not gonna make it back anyway and it's their last stock.

 

[KirbyKaze]

Actually it ***** on Mute City.

 

[idea]

yes, yes, we know, because there are no edges.

hm...i've always preferred neutrals over 'gay' counterpicks. the non-flat ground and weirder platforms throw me off. much rather take someone to dreamland than brinstar. or FoD, since so many other characters hate the platforms.

by the way, does anyone know what that big pod is in the background of brinstar? it can't be anything from metroid prime or later games because melee came out before them. that leaves metroid 1 (nes), 2 (gameboy/no one has played it) and 3 (super metroid).

 

[elvenarrow3000]

It's a giant bundle of joy!

 

[Tamoo]

totally agree with ya there idea, one of my fave counterpicks is simply fd, i just feel much more comfortable there than any other stage, i dont work well with platforms at all. Mute's pretty legit tho cos its pretty basic most of the time.

 

[idea]

oh, in that case, we don't agree exactly...i don't like FD very much because there are no platforms. but on brinstar, for instance, i always find the uneven middle part screwing me up one way or another. and mute city keeps changing on you.

 

[Tamoo]

aah right, fair enough, ive never really been able to utilise platforms much, i like to play very low to the ground. Also, i find it a massive nuisance to get back to ground against marths and foxes if there are platforms. But yeah, never like brinstar myself.

 

[RestInPeace]

Actually it ***** on Mute City.

This.

and I was joking about the DThrow to Rollout. Rollout can only be used to edgeguard reliably.

I tried to Bair a Marth at high % -> Rollout. It almost hit, lol. He teched in, so I missed. When you finish rolling, you end it with a slower roll... and that roll will roll you off-stage if you're close to the edge. Bad explaining, I know. But if you got that, rollout can kill you this way, so be careful.

 

[dudutsai]

There's a cool thing you can do where you catch the ledge by turning around at the end of the roll. But the two times I have gotten it, It's been complete luck.

Rollout isn't that bad of a move. It will force most players onto platforms because they don't want to take the risk of intercepting. Once they are on a platform, depending on where you end it, you can get away with a missed rollout unpunished.

Edit: In puff dittos, both Mango and Hungrybox used the rollout.

 

[idea]

aha, i love it when i edgecancel fair and grab the edge at the same time. sooo slick. too bad i couldn't possibly do it on purpose.

that might be 'cause puff dittos are silly, and no one wants to rest if they can help it. i would try to punish rollout with rollout =P there's so much ending lag, that might actually work.

 

[hungrybox]

There's a cool thing you can do where you catch the ledge by turning around at the end of the roll. But the two times I have gotten it, It's been complete luck.

Rollout isn't that bad of a move. It will force most players onto platforms because they don't want to take the risk of intercepting. Once they are on a platform, depending on where you end it, you can get away with a missed rollout unpunished.

Edit: In puff dittos, both Mango and Hungrybox used the rollout.

lol, but mine missed -____-

I hate CPs like Brinstar, Japes, Mute, etc.

they're cheap.

AND **** CORNERIA

 

[RestInPeace]

dudutsai: lol. Rollout isn't that good either.

Idea: Meh. I find edge canceled aerials pretty easy with Jiggs. You just need to FF it at the right time. Its not as much as when you start the jump as when you choose to FF it so that you land at the right time. Bair -> edge cancel grab ledge is too good. So much range.

 

[idea]

yeah, they are pretty easy with jiggs' horizontal air movement, but try specifically fairing at the edge and grabbing the edge immediately after. i understand how that must work...kind of like the pc chris edgehog thing, except after an aerial...but try doing it on purpose.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Errr... what? PC edgehog doesn't seem like it's anything like that?

 

[idea]

heh, okay, i guess i'll elaborate.

pc edgehog: walk to edge, turn around at last second, catch edge by now facing toward it and continuing on with walking momentum.

thing i did accidentally two or three times: edgecancel fair, turn around quickly somehow, catch edge by now facing toward it + horizontal aerial momentum.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Oh... wow, like that? I thought it was just a reverse edgecanceled fair.

...yeah, I dunno then. Have fun with that =P

 

[RestInPeace]

Why not just edge cancel the aerial -> Sing? Much easier, and more reliable once you get it down. I think if you roll your analog stick up while you're still in the lag of the edge cancel, however little it may be, your chances of jumping before the sing decreases. So just do that, and grab the edge that way.

But really, I can't think of a reason why you would want to edge cancel aerial -> grab ledge with Puff. Just hit them again, or grab the edge without using the aerial.

Edit: Omg. I just realized, you can edge guard Marth with this. Hit him as he tries to sweet spot an Up B and take the edge. There's nothing he can do from here.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Or you could just... ledgehog him and then ledgehop Rest =P

 

[RestInPeace]

Well if you can't make it there in time you might as well do this for some flash that Puff doesn't have.

 

[idea]

you could do lots of stuff, or you could do something you're actually going to be able to pull off in a match =P for jigglypuff mains, you guys sure do talk about complicated techniques.

and...what O_O if you could do that weird edgecancel aerial grab edge thing every time, you know how crazy that would be? but i'm sure it's stupidly hard to do. and personally, i'm still working on shine out of shield with spacies =P

 

[dudutsai]

you could do lots of stuff, or you could do something you're actually going to be able to pull off in a match =P for jigglypuff mains, you guys sure do talk about complicated techniques.

LOL fox mains in disguise. Jigglypuff isn't technical