Stuff About Puff

[Krynxe]

As I said though, it doesn't seem consistent and there are a lot of variables with landing the rest, so it's usually a gamble. (With high risk) If that were to happen though, that'd be a very interesting development in her metagame.

 

[idea]

manatee: i only watched you vs. strain, but...

- grab more
- wavedash for movement more (goes well with the first point)
- generally space yourself farther away from fox
- fsmash less (but not that much less, it's still pretty good; you could just replace a lot of them with safer moves that are more likely to hit)
- you don't have to do this every time: jump, do aerial right after jumping, float back when hitbox fades. he'll get used to it.
- upair is good, especially when fox keeps approaching you from platforms like he did

a few times you used nair when you could have punished with something better. i know why--it's 'cause you weren't expecting them to roll that way or whatever, and wanted to at least hit them with a fast move to be sure you can tack on some damage. but if you're already in a position to punish them if they DO roll that way, then you should be prepared to punish them harder if they actually do, right?

and you do seem to be calling him on a lot of his rolls, then only getting a nair out of it.

in short: focus less on hitting him, and more on killing him. also spacing.

 

[Keblerelf]

Anyone going to ROM 4 this sat?

 

[Mahone]

Ya, ill be tryin to rep puff

 

[Tekk]

Gonna post some sets from last weekend ESA Junior (about 50 entrants).
My doubles sets are already up on http://www.youtube.com/user/LeFrenchMelee.
I also recommend you to subscribe to this channel, that's where all the french tournament matches are uploaded. =)

 

[idea]

i have to post the doubles set from the last toronto tourney when they go up...that was probably the best i've ever played in doubles :D

edit: tekk, who's better, you or this poilon guy?

 

[Tekk]

Lol if I even remotely try to answer this question, it'll star a ruthless flamewar on the french boards. :D

 

[Slhoka]

At least Poilon doesn't lose to me

Thanks for linking me to this thread, Tekk :D

 

[idea]

he looks like one of those old school players who has general knowledge but has kind of moved on from puff and doesn't really specialize in anyone anymore. whereas tekk is new school and only/mostly plays jiggs?

 

[Republican0fHeaven]

I'll be at ROM4.... gotta see if I can get some general advice from you guys..

I still don't have a vid to post of my gameplay

I have a bunch of recorded stuff at my friends place, but he can't figure out how to use vdub to compress it.

 

[-LzR-]

Good stuff Tekk. It's impossible to watch those videos seriously when French Puff sounds so gay xD

 

[Tekk]

he looks like one of those old school players who has general school but has kind of moved on from puff and doesn't really specialize in anyone anymore. whereas tekk is new school and only/mostly plays jiggs?

Poilon is famous in France for playing a really large panel of character, puff included.
I'd say his best char right now is Fox.
And yes I'm pretty new to the scene (I started practicing melee in September '09), I play only Puff in tournament, but this might change in the future, as I love playing other chars, especially Falcon.

 

[Krynxe]

Good stuff Tekk. It's impossible to watch those videos seriously when French Puff sounds so gay xD

lol her sing move in French
ROU-DOU-DOU

 

[Tekk]

so ****ing cute

 

[-LzR-]

Everyone, how is dthrow to rest against Sheik? Managed to land it today sometimes when I tried it, but is it legit and what % does it work at?

 

[KirbyKaze]

I think if they don't DI the throw away it works up to like 40, maybe higher.

 

[Krynxe]

dthrow rest is terrible in general, considering you give your opponent so much time (as you roll over their body) to DI and landing a rest on someone who DIs the dthrow well is extremely difficult if not impossible. On Sheik, it'll works up to a pretty high percent iirc (like above 60-80 or something is where they can always jump out, it's much lower if they DI correctly). Dthrow rest can be really good on a platform stage though, if you're in the middle. You can either land the rest or they'll DI the dthrow, so you can just platform tech chase rest. (They'll almost always tech the same direction the DI'd, it's a matter if you can make it there quick enough)

 

[idea]

yeah dthrow rest ***** sheik. grab sheik in the middle of yoshi's below like 30% and she WILL die unless you make a mistake. at worst, under rare circumstances she gets to the platform really fast and has time to shield, but that could just be me jumping too late after my own throw.

same on any stage with platforms, as long as you grab her in vaguely the right spot at the right percents.

although in my experience everyone DIs away and techs in place.

it'd be good better against fox and falco too if she didn't already have upthrow.

 

[KirbyKaze]

D-throw rest is amazing because it severely limits Sheik & several other characters' options on platform stages.

 

[-LzR-]

So it is something guaranteed if I get to grab Sheik below 20%? That is the big question here, would allow me to easily kill Sheiks at low % if I can manage to get that grab.

 

[Tekk]

I really like Dthrow against spacies at high%, especially near the ledge: If they DI offstage they're 100% dead, if they DI in you can rest them/follow them on a plateform.

 

[idea]

So it is something guaranteed if I get to grab Sheik below 20%? That is the big question here, would allow me to easily kill Sheiks at low % if I can manage to get that grab.

afaik, yes. as long as DIing away puts them on a platform.

pisses them off too so many times i'll start game 1 vs. a sheik, i'll spawn in the middle of battlefield, they spawn on a platform, i'll just sit there, then hold shield as soon as they run off the platform. they usually come down and try to fair me assuming they can get a free hit in...but they misspace it since "game start" or whatever is still on the screen. dthrow, rest. i'm up a stock 3 seconds into the match.

i dunno which port spawns in the middle of battlefield...it's probably #1.

I really like Dthrow against spacies at high%, especially near the ledge: If they DI offstage they're 100% dead, if they DI in you can rest them/follow them on a plateform.

this too but i never remember to try it...my gut always tells me they can DI up and away and recover high. but i guess not?

 

[Massive]

If dthrow>rest at 0% kills the sheik, they do not know how to DI at all.

 

[idea]

lol yeah that's true. i think it might on yoshi's though, even at 0. that doesn't really make sense in my head, but i still think it does at least some of the time.

surprisingly, sheiks almost never DI it in anyway. they always go for the platform, perhaps more afraid of the rest that won't kill them.

if it's a sheik that really knows the matchup, they won't rush in like that anyway. it's just kind of a cheap trick if they don't.

 

[G.L.]

i think this would be a nice option to have. but its hard to do consistently
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dv3wPb8yMNU&feature=channel_video_title

 

[Krynxe]

Very interesting. I'd really like to see that used in a real scenario, I can't really imagine a very good opportunity for it though.

 

[Anand]

i think this would be a nice option to have. but its hard to do consistently
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dv3wPb8yMNU&feature=channel_video_title

I feel like shield drop > DJ > Rest would be a lot more versatile and less situational, since it seems really rare that they will space in a way that drop > rest connects.

Shield drop > DJ > Rest seems strictly better than Rest OoS because drop > DJ is faster than jumpsquat (I think?) and it also feels like it would be possible to move sideways more, so you can punish more stuff with it. (Execution-wise it's obviously much harder though.)

 

[G.L.]

Very interesting. I'd really like to see that used in a real scenario, I can't really imagine a very good opportunity for it though.

yea they have to be pretty close to you for it to hit. I did one vs a peach in some friendlies when she naired my shield.

and about to DJ to rest, that seems like it would be alot better, but i wonder how much harder that would make the exucution/ what the frame difference would be?

 

[Tekk]

Samus FF nairing from above on battlefield.

Powershield => shieldrop => rest.
True Story.

 

[Creepy_Karp]

sorry n00b question:
Can you crouch under falco's forward smash for a rest?

 

[-LzR-]

Possibly at low %. Better just rest OoS.

 

[idea]

no; shield, hope he misspaces it, jump out rest

you can probably CC it sometimes, but not for long

 

[FoxLisk]

sounds like he's saying crouch under as in have falco's hitbox go above you?

which ive seen things like that happen but not reliably and not if you're spaced anywhere you'd generally want to be.

 

[Tekk]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O5XReCgUKkk&feature=feedu

Anyone feel like reviewing some of these matches ? I wanna know the weaknesses I have to work on better.

 

[idea]

i don't think i saw a single uptilt :O shieldpoke uptilt to rest would have made him a lot more scared to wait in shield so much.

you just kind of...move toward him too fast. most of his strategy is to react to you approaching him and put his move out before yours. just look at the first stock of the first match from samus's perspective, it's all "Here he comes, nair" or "Here he comes, uptilt."

it's very familiar to me, you're making the exact same mistake i always do focus more on positioning and less on trying to hit him, imo. you should be trying to stay close enough that he can't missile you but far enough that he can't hit you.

for instance, he tries to attack you from above your head a lot, usually with nair. you shouldn't really be letting him get into position to do that. upair is pretty good when he's coming from a platform, which you did a lot, but if he just shorthops above your head it's often too slow, or could trade, so it's safer to not even let him get that far in on you.

if you're already stuck there, then...you could upair him if he fullhops...bair after he misses if you're far enough away...or you could wait underneath him and shieldgrab after. or even rest.

uhh what else...use more bair. nair and fair didn't seem to be giving you a particular advantage over bair. except for, y'know, being different and less predictable. but still, bair should be more of a default setting.

even more generally...he keeps putting himself in a position where he wants you to jump after him, but it's not in your best interest to do so, but you keep going for it anyway. so yeah, the main thing is, just be a little more patient.

 

[Tekk]

I never managed to uptilt rest a samus lol...
I agree with the being more patient thing, I guess I was just overhyped and wanted to be flashy during this set.
As for nair/fair, I like to use them as a rest setup (especially for fair) or to hit samus from above (for nair). I don't really like going 100%bair all the time, I rather do mixups and use aggressive tactics.
Of course, this applies for samus only.

 

[idea]

uptilt rest even works on jigglypuff at 0, ask hungrybox =/

i agree completely, mixups are good, i just don't think samus is the character to do that stuff with. it's just that samus can CC and tilt through stuff so well. you were both using sex kicks a lot and there was no need to do that when you could have just waited a second and let him miss.

 

[Metà]

I went to a scrub tournament yesterday that had items on. Puff with bunny hood is SO GOOD OH MY GOD you wouldn't believe the combos she can do at high percent, stuff like up-smash triple f-air on fox at over 100% and up-tilt rest on floaties

jigglypuff is god tier

edit: also diakonos was there and i beat his fox/marth in a set w/ items on banned stages lmao. Mute city came on for the last game and it was a 3-stock, what a great ruleset.

 

[Massive]

uptilt rest even works on jigglypuff at 0, ask hungrybox =/

i agree completely, mixups are good, i just don't think samus is the character to do that stuff with. it's just that samus can CC and tilt through stuff so well. you were both using sex kicks a lot and there was no need to do that when you could have just waited a second and let him miss.

Works on jiggs for sure, not on Samus or Luigi though.
They can shake-out and nair before you can jump and rest them.

Samus and Luigi are probably the hardest characters to rest.

 

[Keblerelf]

not samus.

You can jump oos to rest a lot of her moves.