Starcraft 2 (Info on first post!)

[Frown]

You gotta feel sorry for queens

Probably my favorite SC2 unit. She's everyone's zerg mommy. :3

 

[M@v]

I'm pretty sure Protoss still use those builds.

Im still fully expecting 2 gate robo, but I'm curious if 4gates will be any different :/. I liked 4 gates how they were in TvP; but I do agree they needed changed because PvP was just plain stupid because of it.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

also pvz was ******** with the old 4 gate rush. its still a strong move, but its not as unholdable as it was before

 

[Omni]

Question regarding TvZ:

Is it better to use BF Hellions earlier, or delay BFH's to use them to elavotor into the Zerg bases? I go for a BF transition after my 2Rax FE pressure and im looking for the most aggressive way to use my BFH's around the 8-9 minute mark in the game.

 

[Overswarm]

Question regarding TvZ:

Is it better to use BF Hellions earlier, or delay BFH's to use them to elavotor into the Zerg bases? I go for a BF transition after my 2Rax FE pressure and im looking for the most aggressive way to use my BFH's around the 8-9 minute mark in the game.

Bring two hellions to their front, harass only to convince them to make spines / roaches / more lings, then leave. Rally other hellions and your dropship there, then elevator.

You can do both. :B

 

[Tom]

 

[Omni]

Bring two hellions to their front, harass only to convince them to make spines / roaches / more lings, then leave. Rally other hellions and your dropship there, then elevator.

You can do both. :B

Ah, that's a great idea.

I normally just use them to scout for an early 3rd, take map vision, and then try to suicide kamakazi kill +10 drones if I don't see a spine. Just looking for my 2nd harass push after the early marine/bunker aggression. I feel as if making my Hellion presence known is a bad thing?

But I guess forcing him to make spines, more units, and lose map control is in its own way a successful harass and way of making him drone less.

Which means my next step can be making siege tanks... when I do my push, the Hellions could help me advance across the map faster and take out his 3rd if I dropship the Hellions into his main or something of the sort?

My biggest weakness still is not harassing Zerg i.e. not being aggressive enough.

 

[Zankoku]

I still believe that done properly and at a decently early enough timing, Terran should be able to simply muscle its way through Zerg with sheer cost-effectiveness.

 

[Omni]

You mean skipping Hellions and going straight into Marine/Tank?

Maybe, but I find that my initial push always ends in a failure. Especially on big maps like Tal. Creep spread + map control = they know exactly when I'm coming. So when I push forward I have to leap frog very slowly. And it's really hard not being caught out of position.

If Zerg manages to trade then I'm usually screwed as well.

 

[Zankoku]

I don't count "Marine" as part of that, no.

 

[Omni]

? Then I don't understand what you mean.

FYI, when I mean going into Marine/Tank I'm referring to the composition of the push. You should obviously be making marines non-stop from the get go.

 

[Zankoku]

Nah, I probably stop Marine production relatively early, and Marine/Tank is more of an aggressive semi-mobile composition than a pure power/cost-effectiveness one.

But my thoughts are still subject to various experimentation, so I'm not about to poison your builds with that.

 

[Omni]

Nah, I probably stop Marine production relatively early, and Marine/Tank is more of an aggressive semi-mobile composition than a pure power/cost-effectiveness one.

But my thoughts are still subject to various experimentation, so I'm not about to poison your builds with that.

Are you referring to Echoic's Hellion/Thor with 0/3 upgrades mech play? Or some kind of cloaked banshee opening?

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

Ankoku wtf r u talking about? if he stops marine production early, the tank push will be roflstomped by mutas lololol

 

[Zankoku]

Are you referring to Echoic's Hellion/Thor with 0/3 upgrades mech play?

That's actually a really interesting-sounding build and one I'll have to look into while I keep messing around.

 

[Overswarm]

An easy all in is to just one rax marines, then build fac asap and start blue flame, then get one dropship. When that dropship finishes, elevator into their main. They generally have spines for defense because lings can't cut it. You win!

 

[Omni]

OS, refine my build for me and give me tips.

I do a 2 Rax FE Early Aggression. Then transition into 6-7 BFH's as fast as possible to damage Zerg economy while solidifying my natural; if there are a lot of spine crawlers then I just use them for keeping the towers. Then basically from there I try to push out ASAP with a good Marine/Tank comp to their 3rd. And then finally I push again using Medivac drops (usually just 2 full of marines) to let me push out forward more easier and setup a tank line that divides their natural from their 3rd. If I can deny and/or wipe out the 3rd usually that's a win.

Any advice?

 

[Tom]

where can i find a list of good protoss builds? or can you guys name a few different ones (and explain what they mean...) so i can begin to learn what to do? i understand what the units do. i just know really have a grip on what i should be building when. some example builds would be nice... thanxz! :3

playing against other newbies and against bots i just end up massing gateways and then sometimes getting collosi and either i get steamrolled or i end up overpowering

i know theres so much i dont know

 

[F1SHY]

http://williamjudd.com/2011/06/17/popular-protoss-build-orders/
Explains build orders and how to react to opponent's teching

 

[Tom]

wow thanks!

 

[Overswarm]

OS, refine my build for me and give me tips.

I do a 2 Rax FE Early Aggression. Then transition into 6-7 BFH's as fast as possible to damage Zerg economy while solidifying my natural; if there are a lot of spine crawlers then I just use them for keeping the towers. Then basically from there I try to push out ASAP with a good Marine/Tank comp to their 3rd. And then finally I push again using Medivac drops (usually just 2 full of marines) to let me push out forward more easier and setup a tank line that divides their natural from their 3rd. If I can deny and/or wipe out the 3rd usually that's a win.

Any advice?

If you have 6 blue flame hellions, you're well past the time for harassment.

You need to go in with 2-4 or 5 hellions if you have a reactor. If you're going for blue flame, it's impossible to have the right amount of hellions; I'd suggest building a tech lab on your rax and using it for your fac to start blue flame ASAP, then make hellions. You should have 2 hellions and some marines outside his base right as it finishes. Use them both to poke in, but don't try to kill and try to stay off creep with your marines. If he engages with lings, kill them with your marine/hellion. If he doesn't, kill drones and force lings.

Just remember your goal here is to force him to make an army, not drones; any army he makes now will be inefficient and it will slow his economy.

From there you need to decide based on the map and your opponent if you should focus on expanding yourself or pressuring his expansion. Your pressure should always occur BEFORE zerg gets his third. You want to be on equal bases, so you pressure as you expand to your second to keep your bases on an even keel.

If he makes a lot of lings, make more hellions.

If he makes a lot of blings, make more tanks.

If he makes a lot of roaches, say "lol" and expand again with some tanks on defense, knowing he can't really hurt you. Harass with drops of marines or hellions and get a viking to kill his OLs. Roaches are expensive.


The terran vs. zerg matchup is just a series of rules.

Can you expand safely? If so, do so. If not, harass so you can get an army or expand.
Can you harass or put pressure on him? If so, do so. If not, get it to where you can and then do so.
can you kill him? If so, do so. If not, find a way to contain.
Can you contain? If so, do so. If not, play defensive until you can harass or contain and if possible expand.

Just follow those rules from the top down in an infinite loop.

 

[Zankoku]

Roman vs Nasty_Nate hurry up

[collapse=spoilers]

Go DreamHuK![/collapse]

 

[Roman.]

he hasn't responded to my post

 

[Zankoku]

If he doesn't say anything by Wednesday then you play Nashun.

 

[Roman.]

technically "by" wed. is before it but i'd like to give him til the end of wed.

 

[M@v]

I cant wait to be running sc2 on extreme settings


I'm going to be sooooooooooooo bad when I get back though lol.

I hope I don't drop to platinum :3. I'll just have to play a lot of customs first to avoid that I giess.

 

[Overswarm]

I cant wait to be running sc2 on extreme settings


I'm going to be sooooooooooooo bad when I get back though lol.

I hope I don't drop to platinum :3. I'll just have to play a lot of customs first to avoid that I giess.

Extreme only affects the campaign.

 

[M@v]

Extreme only affects the campaign.

Oh well. I'll still be running the highest settings possible on multiplayer :D

 

[_Dice]

The only differences between ultra and extreme are the cutscene improvements pretty much.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

i play on lowest cause the flash gets in my way and i get better frame rates

 

[Zankoku]

Not like >60 matters, for most monitors.

 

[Roman.]

when can you be on nashun?

 

[Kenrawr]

hey, i'm laddering again and was just wondering why i keep going against slightly favored/favored players. i don't think i've gotten an "even" once. isn't MMR supposed to try and keep you at a 50:50 w/l ratio? all the players i'm playing against are top 15 diamonds with at least 1k points to my 20 points/80-90th rank. i remember usually getting a lot of "even" matches the last time i laddered.

it's great practice tho

Edit: my placement match that i won was against a 1.3k rank 6 diamond so maybe that's why?

btw i know that rank doesn't mean much. just thought it was strange that they're almost all top 15 so far.

 

[Zankoku]

Probably because all the weaker players aren't looking for matches at the same time as you are. As far as I know, that's how "stream sniping" works.

 

[Kenrawr]

dat probability. what exactly is stream sniping?

i also keep winning in tvt so maybe that's also part of it.

i'm just afraid that i might get booted down to platinum at this rate and won't get the good exp i am getting now.

 

[Zankoku]

basically if you happen to be a master/grandmaster level player you watch the stream of a pro like IdrA and click "Find Match" right when he does, to be more likely to get matched up against him (and mute your stream if you don't want to be stream CHEATING).

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

Ill be honest, i dont even look at favored stuff before matches. I feel its bad to focus on "who" they are instead of what options are available to them. During the load screen the only thing i look at is the map and the races and do a visualization of how I want the beginning of the match to be.

 

[F1SHY]

I took a leap of faith and finished my placement matches. I'm in platinum right now, and I have no idea how to hold off harass/all-ins/cheeses as protoss. Can anyone help w/ what to do about 3rax, 7rr, and banshees?

 

[Kenrawr]

Ill be honest, i dont even look at favored stuff before matches. I feel its bad to focus on "who" they are instead of what options are available to them. During the load screen the only thing i look at is the map and the races and do a visualization of how I want the beginning of the match to be.

well it's kinda hard to miss! and favored/slightly favored doesn't bother me. i was just wondering why it's ALWAYS favored/slightly favored.

btw right after i posted all that stuff i finally got 40+ ranked people. yay confidence boosters

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

I took a leap of faith and finished my placement matches. I'm in platinum right now, and I have no idea how to hold off harass/all-ins/cheeses as protoss. Can anyone help w/ what to do about 3rax, 7rr, and banshees?

Make a stalker and then a sentry as soon as your cyber finishes. Send the stalker straight to their base and it can scout and harass anything else that is on the field at that time. The sentry will hold your ramp if they do a rush. After that, just make units and abuse the high ground. You could probably (read: untested) hold most of this stuff off with 1 gate and proper micro. If you aren't microing correctly, theres the spot you should work on improving. If you micro perfectly and you still lose, go to 3 gates and you can't die. Also, its fine to cut probes when defending an all-in, though if you have the money laying around you should build them.

well it's kinda hard to miss! and favored/slightly favored doesn't bother me. i was just wondering why it's ALWAYS favored/slightly favored.

btw right after i posted all that stuff i finally got 40+ ranked people. yay confidence boosters

I seriously never look, and im not sure why. Just not one of the things I find important before a match.