SQUAT V: Confirmed 12th of December - Scratch that, LanSmash Ho!

[Jupz]

Ehhh I'd rather just have it for smash :\

 

[l3oOkeR]

have they moved the lansmash venue? because if its the same one they had pre Genesis it was ****in tiny and we could only have 90people max for ALL games


Didnt read all the posts. just saw they have moved it back to ANZ.

**** yes antho do this hold it at Santasmash it will be godly.

 

[luke_atyeo]

And how much *****ing did I do about...

fixed.

although I agree, I mean there really was nothing wrong with the old system but we've grown as a community and its time to take off, those of us who've been to America all really want to see us step it up more to their level.

 

[Bsrk_]

Yeah i agree with Ateyo on this also_ Although i haven't yet been able to make it to a major, i always believe that the way is forward is always to increase and promote community growth and interaction_ If having a bigger venue and more days becomes a viability then perhaps it should be taken as a serious consideration_

 

[Aussierob123]

Yeah i agree with Ateyo on this also_ Although i haven't yet been able to make it to a major, i always believe that the way is forward is always to increase and promote community growth and interaction_ If having a bigger venue and more days becomes a viability then perhaps it should be taken as a serious consideration_

Shaya and Ateyo were kind of arguing against the idea of using the lansmash venue (bigger / more days) because of the price of entry / lack of pot, especially if it's to be regarded a major.

I support whatever decision anthony makes, I can imagine it's really hard being a TO and trying to suit everybody in the community. I also think that there would be a very decent turnout if it is held there instead of the brisbane lan smash venue, seems brisbanes players are alot more dedicated / able to travel than alot of gold coasts younger / lazier players are haha.

Seems like both melee and brawl are growing as competitive games in australia. Maybe soon majors can be organised on their own / have decent pots and competitive natures. Personally it doesn't seem like lansmash does a whole deal for smash besides let us use some tables and still charge a huge entry fee. =/

I'd be able to make any date ever the 7th I think, (im gone for 9 days from the 28th) but otherwise enjoy the tournament everyone .

 

[luke_atyeo]

Maybe soon majors can be organised on their own / have decent pots and competitive natures. Personally it doesn't seem like lansmash does a whole deal for smash besides let us use some tables and still charge a huge entry fee. =/

first off its atyeo, not ateyo

anyway dude you said it yourself, shaya doesnt like how we just tag along to things like this, only for them to take our money and put us into the corner as this little side tourney that no-one cares about, while our money is all really going to the other stuff that we didnt come for/arnt intrested in.


if smash were on equal footing with other games it would be fine but we are seen as this stupid small kiddy scene that plays a **** game that isnt deep in any way (play melee instead omg!)

what shaya is basically saying is, why give them all our money for **** support when we could just go get our own venue and be independant, and have a huge pot (not gonna happen though, sorry shaya but this isnt america, your not going to win $4000 from a major national tourney here) and move and grown as a community.

its never gonna happen if others are holding our hand.


this may seem idealistic but I've been thinking for a while now that we really need to make a move in this direction and make these things bigger and more offical, not just underground, and I'm pretty sure shaya has been having similar ideas.

problem is, as pwn as it would be for me and shaya to try to create something like this, we are really only a student and a security guard, with no funding, no reputation, and no good ideas, even if we are backed by a communitiy.

 

[Jupz]

Yeah I agree with luke

 

[Vyse]

In an email I just sent to Blade (organiser of LanSmash) I made the following proposal:

Saturday: Brawl @ Helensvale Community Centre
Sunday: Melee @ LanSmash

BUT, I don't think it's realistic.
Mostly because of the massive venue change we have to make between days.

I am at rather a cross roads with this, and I'm not sure what to do. I'm hoping Blade can help me shed some light on the best course of action.

I really don't want to delay this until early January, but to win all around, that might be the best bet
Argh! SantaSmash is really on at the worst time >.< and I don't wanna skip it. There might not be much we can do about it though

So confusing, but I guess I need to talk to Blade first. After that I can make a decision. After all is said and done, I might have to stick to my original plan of the 28th (Since I can't get the 5th)

EDIT: My reasoning behind all this is that I just don't wanna turn my back on LanSmash, it's hard y'know?

Thinking about it for a little while, doing Brawl at the Community Center Saturday, QSAC for Melee Sunday might be a good option.

But the bad thing about that is that all the people wanting to play Melee are the ones that get the short end of the stick. I have to rely on the fact that they're dedicated enough to travel all the way to QSAC for the Melee tournament.

There's also the 'ZOMG YOU CANT CHANGE FROM ONE VENUE TO THE OTHER OVER ONE WEEKEND' factor.

I really need opinions.

 

[Pantsmann]

doesn't matter to me, i'm only going to turn up to melee anyway. if that's what you have to do, then do it.

 

[Jupz]

Well all the people serious about brawl will obviously come to your tournament and more new people will be attracted by the lower venue fee.

 

[Hotdog]

i was talking to Vyse:

Helensvale + Lansmash:
Hvale (Brawl): $10 entry fee + $10 pot fee = $20
Lansmash (Melee): $15 Entry fee + $10 pot fee = $25
Total weekend = $45 dollars

Lansmash only
Sat (Brawl): $15 Entry fee + $10 pot fee = $25
Sun (Melee) $15 Entry fee + $10 pot fee = $25
Total = $50
Buuuuuut 2 day Entry fee = $25
So it cost's the same if you're entering both really.

anyway dude you said it yourself, shaya doesnt like how we just tag along to things like this, only for them to take our money and put us into the corner as this little side tourney that no-one cares about, while our money is all really going to the other stuff that we didnt come for/arnt intrested in.

What about BAM? It's pretty much the same thing as we're trying to do here, being part of a big company that just takes our money, but still alot of people go regardless cause they're going for the game.

Sure we can try and become more independent, but it's hard to do that when no one knows that a Smash community like this exist. We just had a couple of guys who came to our Smash tourney today who happen to have tournaments in their own homes of 12ish people cause they didn't we were around, now they know they'll be coming more regularly. I think Australia needs to stick around with the big groups for a little while longer, till we get a big enough community before we can part off and become our own independent group.

 

[Vyse]

No matter how large we become, it's still a good idea to run regularly through these events. It's not so much a matter of parting off, but doing more stuff away from these backers.

 

[CAOTIC]

i was talking to Vyse:

Helensvale + Lansmash:
Hvale (Brawl): $10 entry fee + $10 pot fee = $20
Lansmash (Melee): $15 Entry fee + $10 pot fee = $25
Total weekend = $45 dollars

Lansmash only
Sat (Brawl): $15 Entry fee + $10 pot fee = $25
Sun (Melee) $15 Entry fee + $10 pot fee = $25
Total = $50
Buuuuuut 2 day Entry fee = $25
So it cost's the same if you're entering both really.



What about BAM? It's pretty much the same thing as we're trying to do here, being part of a big company that just takes our money, but still alot of people go regardless cause they're going for the game.

Sure we can try and become more independent, but it's hard to do that when no one knows that a Smash community like this exist. We just had a couple of guys who came to our Smash tourney today who happen to have tournaments in their own homes of 12ish people cause they didn't we were around, now they know they'll be coming more regularly. I think Australia needs to stick around with the big groups for a little while longer, till we get a big enough community before we can part off and become our own independent group.

Not quite, re: BAM/CW. They formed together with the Melbourne Smash Community back in 2007 and the Smash community has roughly a 50% stake in the non-profit organization, which reflects the turnout over the years. CW is Smash, and not something that owns it or tries to exploit it in any way.

 

[luke_atyeo]

yeah I went to a couchwarriors tourney once and I didnt feel like smash was side event at all, it was good.

 

[Aussierob123]

i was talking to Vyse:

We just had a couple of guys who came to our Smash tourney today who happen to have tournaments in their own homes of 12ish people cause they didn't we were around, now they know they'll be coming more regularly.

This doesn't support sticking with lansmash at all, didn't you organise this tournament on your own?

If so on your own advertising efforts, you successfully found an additional 12 players or so to bring to tournaments. I just honestly don't see how lansmash has helped the smash community at all besides providing decently large venues, they still put as at the back with a few tables and nothing more. Has holding lansmash events attracted a considerable amount of unheard players? most of the past events look like those already involved with the community.

 

[swordsaint]

I didn't enjoy the venue when I went to Lansmash. Back few tables, angry pc gamers yelling profanity, distracting us. It was a little squashed as well considering the numbers.

 

[Jupz]

Plus, all of us here in WA have a much greater chance of making it if its on the 12th. I won't be able to come if its the 28th.

 

[D.J Cat]

EDIT: DELETE THIS POST KK...

 

[xXArrowXx]

if its at anz.. like i think it is its not same venue as springwood one.. much more space.. better aircon... posistion is about brisbane 2:3 goldcoast distance wise
i was thinking about hosting a tournament near gardencity somewhere because of its good spacing but if people are that against it.

as for moneies.. ill fork out abit more for a big tourny.

CTF dodgeball on the beach. red v blue, shirts v skins, brawl vs melee. demmand it

 

[Jupz]

IDC about the venue, but some of us won't be able to come on the 28th and the 12th would give all of us a better chance of coming.

 

[Hotdog]

I didn't enjoy the venue when I went to Lansmash. Back few tables, angry pc gamers yelling profanity, distracting us. It was a little squashed as well considering the numbers.

Yea that was a small Venue they had to use for a one of thing cause of some reason, could only hold like 90 people max, they moved back to their old Venue at ANZ which is much bigger and better.

This doesn't support sticking with lansmash at all, didn't you organise this tournament on your own?

If so on your own advertising efforts, you successfully found an additional 12 players or so to bring to tournaments. I just honestly don't see how lansmash has helped the smash community at all besides providing decently large venues, they still put as at the back with a few tables and nothing more. Has holding lansmash events attracted a considerable amount of unheard players? most of the past events look like those already involved with the community.

We've only just recently start to advertise with posters at Unis/any kind of message board etc. At Lansmash we had like couple guys from the place interested in Smash as well. But there's also just a lot of people who come to once to a tourney, then never come again, like at QBB, I dunno but I don't really care if we're part of a big group or not, as long as I can advertise to expand the Smash scene then I'll do it.

 

[Vyse]

I didn't enjoy the venue when I went to Lansmash. Back few tables, angry pc gamers yelling profanity, distracting us. It was a little squashed as well considering the numbers.

That was never supposed to be the venue.

The actual venue used for LanSmash events is ANZ Stadium which is over 9000 times bigger.

 

[Sirias]

Smash is a minor game compared to others, wtf is with all this: "Smash doesn't feel like a main game." Seriously, argh, so many people, get over yourselves.
And ok, the date will more than likely be changed to the 12th considering more and more people are voting for the 12th. So stfu about that.
I agree with Bobsy (DJ CAT), $25 is a lot? Grow up. Don't know how to get there? If you could post on here, then you have access to a computer and the internet, learn to friggin' use it.
I just feel like flaming everyone and their stupidity and crying.
QQ somewhere else, sssiiirrriiiaaassslllyyy.

If you wanna come, then come, it'll be fun, it'll be good, lots of Smash, maybe other activities as well, can go do something in between / before / afterwards / at night, so what is your problem?
You can't expect everything to go your way.

And Shaya.
Go away, seriously.
Cry somewhere else.
You're not helping, you're not from QLD, you're not Zac.
If you don't wanna come, don't come, we'll just kick your anal hole another time, ok?

 

[Kaydash]

Either works for me, just need a definite as soon as possible (not hyper urgent yet) re:work & plane tickets.

Also what Sirias said.

I need to move to Brisbane...

 

[Bsrk_]

angry pc gamers yelling profanity

You've gotta love those guys_

CTF dodgeball on the beach. red v blue, shirts v skins, brawl vs melee. DEMAND IT

 

[Scrubs]

MMM

Lansmash:

Pros:

- Better venue
- 2 days

Cons

- More expensive (well same cost but reduced pot)
- Although the overall costs would be similar a $25 entry fee vs. $10 entry fee will deter people
- People wandering off and playing tf2...sf4 etc... (****ing annoying when you are trying to TO)
- Lansmash staff on power trips
- Little to no support as far as equipment...prizes etc... from lansmash

Helensvale

Pros

- Larger pot
- Entirely dedicated to smash
- Better transport
- Closer to the GC
- BBQ

Cons

- Smaller venue

I think we would be better of running this independantly. For 3 major reasons.....

1. A venue entirely devoted to Smash would increase the attendance and for those new people who are attending it would be a better first experience of the smash scene

2. Increased pot-reduced entry fee.... Although as Hotdogs pointed out the overall cost would be the same about $50 where that $50 goes is what matters...

$25 entry fee (even though it is for 2 days) seems like a lot of money to some people....

3. I see having the tournament on 1 day rather than 2 a postive.... attendance would be boosted for both games.... Brawl players are more likely to enter Melee and visa versa if they are on the same day..

 

[Jupz]

Scrubs summed it up pretty nicely

I would also prefer it to be on just one day as if I'm staying with my cousins it will be easier on them...

 

[Sirias]

Go organise the tournament.
Find the venue.
K.

 

[Aussierob123]

dont take it personally kas.

were all pretty much in agreement that being TO is tough and whatever anthony does is his decision and he does a good job. This is just food for thought about the tournament oganisation with SQUAT, seeing as it's a major. if it could be pushed back to the 12th then some people would benefit but its no big deal and whatever's easiest is what anthony should pursue.

ive never had a problem with lansmash events. besides being futher away haha, that cant really be helped because i live in the southernmost part of GC.

 

[Hotdog]

3. I see having the tournament on 1 day rather than 2 a postive.... attendance would be boosted for both games.... Brawl players are more likely to enter Melee and visa versa if they are on the same day..

I just realized that's pretty much a huge factor of it, we're aiming for at least 65 people, having both Brawl + Melee on the same day could achieve that easy as. Even though we had 69 people for Just Brawl at QBB? I doubt we'll get that much one timers again.

 

[xXArrowXx]

food for thought?

we better have a lunch break.. or ill break everyones face in =D

we might get that many people.. ill bring some maybe if they not busy

 

[Vyse]

Confirmed for the 12th of December.
Helensvale Community Centre is the venue, and both games will run on the same day.

I'll deal with LanSmash/apologise for our disappearance from SantaSmash.
But I will ask them to hold Street Fighter IV on the Sunday so we can go to that the day after.

@Sirias: I disagree with a majority of what you said. The most important thing for me with this tournament is to make it as accessible as humanly possible to the largest audience of people I can. The venue will cost me $650 for the maximum amount of hours on the day (7:30am - 11:30pm), so I need 65 people to make it to this for me to break even.

 

[Sieg]

Smash is a minor game compared to others, wtf is with all this: "Smash doesn't feel like a main game." Seriously, argh, so many people, get over yourselves.
And ok, the date will more than likely be changed to the 12th considering more and more people are voting for the 12th. So stfu about that.
I agree with Bobsy (DJ CAT), $25 is a lot? Grow up. Don't know how to get there? If you could post on here, then you have access to a computer and the internet, learn to friggin' use it.
I just feel like flaming everyone and their stupidity and crying.
QQ somewhere else, sssiiirrriiiaaassslllyyy.

If you wanna come, then come, it'll be fun, it'll be good, lots of Smash, maybe other activities as well, can go do something in between / before / afterwards / at night, so what is your problem?
You can't expect everything to go your way.

And Shaya.
Go away, seriously.
Cry somewhere else.
You're not helping, you're not from QLD, you're not Zac.
If you don't wanna come, don't come, we'll just kick your anal hole another time, ok?

Did I ever tell you I love you?

Because I do.

 

[Bsrk_]

11.30pm_? Sounds sexy_ Thanks for the changes Vyse_ This should hopefully allow W.A to gather itself a small crew for SQUAT_ It's been a little overdue

 

[Sirias]

Ok, Antho, basically my point was for everyone to stop crying.
Obviously it's nigh impossible to please everyone and get as many attendees as possible, but the point is you're trying and you're doing more and still people are QQing about how it's not up to their standards or not easily accessible or too expensive.
OOSers (or even people from Sunny Coast / Brisbane) have the money to come down, so an extra $25 isn't exactly a whole lot, admittedly it's still quite a bit, but nothing in this world is cheap, so why are you giving us a venue that's going to be so incredibly cheap with no incentive to win? And also the location is fine - people without knowledge of how to get there should learn how to get there, not cry here, no?

I remember a conversation sometime back about how pot is the incentive to win and to even attend. If you have nothing more to win than respect or prestige or that, then there's less likely a competitive atmosphere? Money is important, as Ben just said, $25 is a lot, etc, but if someone somehow has the chance to win his money back and more, then wouldn't you agree that he/she would play a lot more intensely? Not saying that this tournament is about the intensity (as you just said it was only about attendees), but I think that money is still an issue when it comes to tournaments, as Shaya said. Cao also said that it's not really only about pot, and true, it isn't 'only' about the winnings, but the money won is still a big incentive, at least to the people that think or know that they have a chance to potentially win.

I think I trailed off there, repeating what I said about 10 times - nonetheless, my point now is; you're getting a venue worth $650 and need at least 65 people to bring $10 each. It's good for people who've never played before, I wouldn't want to pay more than $20 to play Smash (but look at Lansmash?), I still find it to be a ridiculous competitive game, but that's beside the point. Do we have an estimate or total of how many people are going to attend this so far? I guess we could also consider Matt's friends or such, so that's an extra 10-15 or so? And all of us, which is around 15, I think. Or 20. So that's 30-35, or so, so we need around 30 OOSers? Or rather, 10/15 OOSers and 15/20 randoms?

... Still, the tournament is a while away, so it won't be too hard to get newbies.
Anyway, this post is long and boring.
The venue and date are not set, though, right? So now we have to make do with what we have and if some people are still going to cry and aren't completely pleased with the outcome, then my INITIAL POINT WITH THIS WHOLE THING WAS FOR THEM TO NOT CRY AND GET LOST!
Unless you're going to help or make a valid point, then what are they doing - etc!
GAH.

I just totally trailed off into oblivion.

... I just broke up with my boyfriend, give me a break.

Edit:

I forget, if it's being held at Helensvale is it going to be 1 day or 2 days long. I would imagine 1 day since it's more people-friendly that way - although more crammed with the actual tournament (but it's 16 hours anyway, wtf). Why not make it $15 per entry?

 

[Hotdog]

The date and place is finalized.

Helensvales, 12th December, goes for 1 day.

Aww poor Kas (group hug in the men showers yay!) <3

Erm anyways, I only really play smash for Respect of being a good player, money doesn't really influence me to play any better cause I try play my best every time (That and I'll never come first as long as Amaterasu is here anyways LOL). We gotta start advertising this real soon before and after Gencon/Animania.

 

[Vyse]

**** scratch that.

Just had a lengthy conversation with MasterCyl over lunch about our position with LanSmash and together we've worked out something that I think pleases the points both I and Kas are making in this thread.

Long story short, I'm now fairly certain that we'll be holding the national at SantaSmash with the biggest incentives for which being:

- Lower entry fee for smashers (I'll expand on this later but basically tournament venue fee/pot money would equate to our current plans at Helensvale.)
- Professional commentary support from Gamestah(?) the guys CS and TF2 use. (Of course we'd be the ones commentating, but they have epic recording equipment
- A projector
- Properly allocated space to account for us
- other equipment as well (TV's)

We've had a really long talk, one that extended an hour after he shoulda been back at work. But they've convinced me that they're genuinely concerned and want to help us with SQUAT V in whatever way they can muster.

Kas, after some thinking, I think I agree, but only because before I was more scared about getting people in the door. Now I'm no longer scared (because I have no quota to fill), but it is one of my goals.

 

[Shaya]

Vyse, I'm happy to read that.
If anyone asked what I thought would be adequate from LanSmash, you've given a perfect list.
Pot really doesn't concern me as much as you guys think, smash being respected/considered highly is, and that's hopefully confirmed now and I love it :D

 

[Sieg]

I think you should all be really thanking the LS guys for this.

You guys *****, and they come back with more things that will keep you happy.

I think you should go over and make an appreciation thread.

www.lansmash.com/forum

Look, I even linked the website for you.

 

[Vyse]

Vyse, I'm happy to read that.
If anyone asked what I thought would be adequate from LanSmash, you've given a perfect list.
Pot really doesn't concern me as much as you guys think, smash being respected/considered highly is, and that's hopefully confirmed now and I love it :D

Yeah, the biggest concern Cyl had was this perception that Brawl/Melee at LanSmash was just 'A group of guys in the corner with the round tables'. They definitely do not want smash to be seen as such, and it's something Cyl has been concerned about for a while it seems. I'm glad I made this thread because it's helped highlight a lot of concerns too.

There's big things on the horizon, something I've always known, but hopefully next year we'll have a sponsor in tow and other things too.

Thanks for all the input guys, we all benefited a lot from you guys speaking your opinions and concerns.