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ミスティック Speed

ミスティック Speed

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Spirst said:
lol. Pacman is an annoying character.

Your Mewtwo wasn't bad though. Only reason I did just one game as him is because I hate the ditto a lot. I noticed you can be a bit too aggressive though and that gets shut down by Pac or people who know how to punish well in general. Slow it down a bit and I'm sure you'd do better.
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Offence is the best defence, no? x3
That other player was really good with Mega Man, btw.
 
D

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Guest
Spirst said:
lol. Pacman is an annoying character.

Your Mewtwo wasn't bad though. Only reason I did just one game as him is because I hate the ditto a lot. I noticed you can be a bit too aggressive though and that gets shut down by Pac or people who know how to punish well in general. Slow it down a bit and I'm sure you'd do better.
Click to expand...
He probably wasn't aggressive enough. A true aggressive player would be able to beat a defensive one. Speed's problem probably came more from not being 100% aggressive when he started rushing you down, as opposed to being offensive at all.

U-Throw said:
Hey, @Mario Smith, I thought you said that skill means nothing in Smash 4. How come you say that, but you also say that you win because you have a lot of skill, not because of your character choices? I sense a serious inconsistency here.
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If you play Mewtwo and fight Link, more times than not, prepare to hear some hyrule music. However, it's my skill at the game that gives me a somewhat more valid chance against people. It's also my skill that lets me know that once I have beaten somebody as Mewtwo, to switch into another character, because Link is coming to town.

In the end, the reason skill doesn't mean anything is because not only are there no advanced techniques, which removes the skill cap (perfect pivoting is unreliable), but Sakurai (yes, I am just going to say Sakurai or Nintendo, it saves time) is focusing too much on making characters seem as if they jumped from their game into Smash, as opposed to making them appear as though this is an alternate dimension where they are just Smash Characters. The difference between the two is that with the first one, we wind up getting a severely unbalanced and unfair cast, filled with Fast/Strong characters (of whom invalidate other characters who aren't like them), like Diddy Kong (who's balance philosophy was being "faster and stronger than humans", which is already broken), then we get Sheik, who has the fastest attacks, in a game where everyone is slow, to the point where Sheik doesn't even need to be Strong to win. We have Donkey Kong and Bowser, who are fast/strong characters (regardless of their size), we have R.O.B, who can spam from one side of the universe to the other, then finish you off with a Smash or Uair, Pacman, who's a gimmicky character, and to make it even worst, has a lagless Dash Attack (the only good approach option from the ground).
(list doesn't end there)
Yet with the second one, we would see more balance, because it wouldn't matter who the characters are, it would matter that they're here, and need to be balanced.


The only true skill that exists in Sm4sh is skill of the matchups, anything besides from that has little meaning, unless you are literally a pro going up against a noob, as anyone else who even comes close to being at your level will destroy you if they play you "counter"

Smash 4 is too character-centric for it's own good. Nintendo needs to start viewing the characters as part of the game, as opposed to individual, unique, entities that are joining together to Smash.

NonSpecificHokori said:
Is it that time of the month, again @Mario Smith?
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What the? Anyways, my ranting about how unbalanced the game is and how much Mewtwo needs improvement probably won't change until Nintendo patches up Sm4sh again.

There's no logical reason how a giant can be lighter than a mouse. If anything Mewtwo's "psychic powers" could be used to prevent him from getting launched.
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Either that or give him a gimmick where at first he is the lightest character in the game (since he's using his powers to float into oblivion), but as his % increases, he starts to use less and less of his weightless-powers, so by the time he gets to about 100%, his weight value will be about as high as Ganondorf's (in which his weight-increase could stop there). At least that way, while he can be defeated early on, he can also survive longer than before (due to his real weight).
 
U-Throw

U-Throw

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Mario Smith said:
He probably wasn't aggressive enough. A true aggressive player would be able to beat a defensive one. Speed's problem probably came more from not being 100% aggressive when he started rushing you down, as opposed to being offensive at all.


If you play Mewtwo and fight Link, more times than not, prepare to hear some hyrule music. However, it's my skill at the game that gives me a somewhat more valid chance against people. It's also my skill that lets me know that once I have beaten somebody as Mewtwo, to switch into another character, because Link is coming to town.

In the end, the reason skill doesn't mean anything is because not only are there no advanced techniques, which removes the skill cap (perfect pivoting is unreliable), but Sakurai (yes, I am just going to say Sakurai or Nintendo, it saves time) is focusing too much on making characters seem as if they jumped from their game into Smash, as opposed to making them appear as though this is an alternate dimension where they are just Smash Characters. The difference between the two is that with the first one, we wind up getting a severely unbalanced and unfair cast, filled with Fast/Strong characters (of whom invalidate other characters who aren't like them), like Diddy Kong (who's balance philosophy was being "faster and stronger than humans", which is already broken), then we get Sheik, who has the fastest attacks, in a game where everyone is slow, to the point where Sheik doesn't even need to be Strong to win. We have Donkey Kong and Bowser, who are fast/strong characters (regardless of their size), we have R.O.B, who can spam from one side of the universe to the other, then finish you off with a Smash or Uair, Pacman, who's a gimmicky character, and to make it even worst, has a lagless Dash Attack (the only good approach option from the ground).
(list doesn't end there)
Yet with the second one, we would see more balance, because it wouldn't matter who the characters are, it would matter that they're here, and need to be balanced.


The only true skill that exists in Sm4sh is skill of the matchups, anything besides from that has little meaning, unless you are literally a pro going up against a noob, as anyone else who even comes close to being at your level will destroy you if they play you "counter"

Smash 4 is too character-centric for it's own good. Nintendo needs to start viewing the characters as part of the game, as opposed to individual, unique, entities that are joining together to Smash.


What the? Anyways, my ranting about how unbalanced the game is and how much Mewtwo needs improvement probably won't change until Nintendo patches up Sm4sh again.

There's no logical reason how a giant can be lighter than a mouse. If anything Mewtwo's "psychic powers" could be used to prevent him from getting launched.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Either that or give him a gimmick where at first he is the lightest character in the game (since he's using his powers to float into oblivion), but as his % increases, he starts to use less and less of his weightless-powers, so by the time he gets to about 100%, his weight value will be about as high as Ganondorf's (in which his weight-increase could stop there). At least that way, while he can be defeated early on, he can also survive longer than before (due to his real weight).
Click to expand...
So, what I'm getting out of this is, "My skill lets me know when to switch to characters with advantageous match-ups so I can exploit that character's match-ups in order to win." Therefore, you're basically saying that your skill is almost entirely character-based, rather than skill-based, which is what you accused top-level competitive players of just a few weeks ago. Ergo, you are a hypocrite that, according to your own words, is a n00b-ish coward who has zero actual skill and has to hide behind advantageous characters and abuse their powers in order to win. The bottom line is, I don't even have to respond beyond this because you've already done my job for me by destroying your own argument. A special thanks from me to you, in that regard.
 
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謹賀新年！
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U-Throw said:
So, what I'm getting out of this is, "My skill lets me know when to switch to characters with advantageous match-ups so I can exploit that character's match-ups in order to win." Therefore, you're basically saying that your skill is almost entirely character-based, rather than skill-based, which is what you accused top-level competitive players of just a few weeks ago. Ergo, you are a hypocrite that, according to your own words, is a n00b-ish coward who has zero actual skill and has to hide behind advantageous characters and abuse their powers in order to win. The bottom line is, I don't even have to respond beyond this because you've already done my job for me by destroying your own argument. A special thanks from me to you, in that regard.
Click to expand...
Just joining in in the middle of this, but take this to PMs if you wish to continue this debate, as regardless of who started it/said what first, this is getting a little too heated.

@Mario Smith
 
U-Throw

U-Throw

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--- said:
Just joining in in the middle of this, but take this to PMs if you wish to continue this debate, as regardless of who started it/said what first, this is getting a little too heated.

@Mario Smith
Click to expand...
Understood. I'm through fighting about this. I've no desire to argue any further, even in PMs, @Mario Smith, so please don't message me about it. I'm ready to just drop this whole subject, leave it all behind me, and move on.
Pikachutobal said:
Does anyone else think the Mewtwo's Jab is a very useful move?
Click to expand...
Yes, very much so. It can link into several other moves, and I've also used it to catch recovering opponents in midair and send them offstage again. However, it does have a significant amount of both startup- and end-lag, and I feel like that somewhat limits its usefulness. Regardless, Mewtwo's jab is still very fun to use, and I like to toss it out a couple of times per match. Also, I totally agree with the thing you said about Disable. Few things compare to the satisfaction of KO'ing with a Disable follow-up:

*Tink*

[Smash Attack]

GAME!
 
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Spirst

Spirst

　
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Mario Smith said:
He probably wasn't aggressive enough. A true aggressive player would be able to beat a defensive one. Speed's problem probably came more from not being 100% aggressive when he started rushing you down, as opposed to being offensive at all.
Click to expand...
Lol, no. That's not how it works. It's not as straightforward as "a true aggressive player would be able to beat a defensive one". If the aggressive play isn't working, it doesn't make any sense at all to keep going at it 100% and I know this from personal experience against defensive players. When you take the time and slow it down a bit, you're able to think about what actions you'll take and bait the opponent into doing things that get them punished. A "true aggressive player" will likely lose majority of their games against competent opponents since that gets extremely predictable after 1 or 2 games.

And not going to get into the whole other argument with you about skill, but it's pretty silly to say ATs don't exist in the face of things like MALCC, teleport ledge cancels, glidetossing, perfect pivoting, dance trotting, jab locks, edge sliding, jab canceling, and so on.
 
D

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It's just that when people get too cocky, I have to put them in their place.
 
LIQUID12A

LIQUID12A

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Mario Smith said:
It's just that when people get too cocky, I have to put them in their place.
Click to expand...
Although you're not exactly in a position to do so, what with the censor dodging and not stopping when U-Throw said to drop it there, for instance.

Just stop here and there won't be any additional repercussions, it's for your own good.
 
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ミスティック Speed

ミスティック Speed

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Spirst said:
Lol, no. That's not how it works. It's not as straightforward as "a true aggressive player would be able to beat a defensive one". If the aggressive play isn't working, it doesn't make any sense at all to keep going at it 100% and I know this from personal experience against defensive players. When you take the time and slow it down a bit, you're able to think about what actions you'll take and bait the opponent into doing things that get them punished. A "true aggressive player" will likely lose majority of their games against competent opponents since that gets extremely predictable after 1 or 2 games.

And not going to get into the whole other argument with you about skill, but it's pretty silly to say ATs don't exist in the face of things like MALCC, teleport ledge cancels, glidetossing, perfect pivoting, dance trotting, jab locks, edge sliding, jab canceling, and so on.
Click to expand...
...
Yet, I do use a lot of those techniques...
 
ZephyrZ

ZephyrZ

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Mario Smith said:
He probably wasn't aggressive enough. A true aggressive player would be able to beat a defensive one. Speed's problem probably came more from not being 100% aggressive when he started rushing you down, as opposed to being offensive at all.
Click to expand...
This isn't Melee anymore, you know.

Also, Speeds a girl.
Mario Smith said:
It's just that when people get too cocky, I have to put them in their place.
Click to expand...
That's ironic.
 
U-Throw

U-Throw

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I'm not going to play just to prove something, so I'm not interested.

However, I'm not currently doing anything, so if anyone is interested in playing just for fun, I'd be happy to battle you.
 
DrRiceBoy

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Mario Smith said:
It's just that when people get too cocky, I have to put them in their place.
Click to expand...
You're getting cocky too though... The way you say things is kind of rude and arrogant. We're all buddies (you included) so I don't get why you have to be like this. You actively provoke people and is always starting arguments. You've been doing this since Mewtwo got released... Come on. :/
 
meleebrawler

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U-Throw said:
Understood. I'm through fighting about this. I've no desire to argue any further, even in PMs, @Mario Smith, so please don't message me about it. I'm ready to just drop this whole subject, leave it all behind me, and move on.

Yes, very much so. It can link into several other moves, and I've also used it to catch recovering opponents in midair and send them offstage again. However, it does have a significant amount of both startup- and end-lag, and I feel like that somewhat limits its usefulness. Regardless, Mewtwo's jab is still very fun to use, and I like to toss it out a couple of times per match. Also, I totally agree with the thing you said about Disable. Few things compare to the satisfaction of KO'ing with a Disable follow-up:

*Tink*

[Smash Attack]

GAME!
Click to expand...
How often do you use the jab combo compared to followups?
 
D

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U-Throw said:
I'm not going to play just to prove something, so I'm not interested.

However, I'm not currently doing anything, so if anyone is interested in playing just for fun, I'd be happy to battle you.
Click to expand...
I'll play just 4 fun

DrRiceBoy said:
You're getting cocky too though... The way you say things is kind of rude and arrogant. We're all buddies (you included) so I don't get why you have to be like this. You actively provoke people and is always starting arguments. You've been doing this since Mewtwo got released... Come on. :/
Click to expand...
I actually felt something from this, so I will relent for now
 
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