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[SleuthMechanism]

Yeah no.
The 3ds has more than enough games to last it.
2 Fire Emblem games, 5 Pokemon games, 3 Zelda games, DK, Xenoblade, Star Fox, However many Mario titles there are and some good third party support from Square Enix and Capcom for example. If anything the Wii U needs more love if they don't want the U to be a failure in the end. Zelda U got delayed to next year and the Wii U already suffered from having a 3ds counterpart to one of it's games.

That and i seriously doubt with the amount of details they've put into the models in this game(seriously fur textures in a pokemon game!? i never though i'd see the day they'd go past low poly plastic-like models! ;v that they'd make a downgraded version for 3DS considering that they'd practically have to remake all the graphics from scratch.
If mewtwo is in and gets a mega evo super move i really really hope it's x for once since 1. it fits the style of the game more and 2. why does kid buu- i mean mewtwo y have to be in the spotlight in EVERYTHING?(though personally i think both mewtwos as well as mega legendaries as a concept are the dumbest things.)
As for mega charizard i like X better because it looks like a more dramatic super form whilst y IMO looks like charizard with a bunch of extra unecessary accesories pasted to it.(sucg as garchomp's fins and a random head spike replacing the horns)I also dig the flame beard/stache even though the fire effect looks really dumb and awkward in the 3ds pokemon games.

@Smogon: yeah, believe it or not even stuff that seems clearly op often takes a long time to ban unless it's something that is absolutely disgustingly broken to the point where you're wondering wtf the designers were thinking like mega gengar in x&y and mega rayqauza in general. Granted, they did have a phase of going suddenly completely crazy like the very tail end of gen iv.(still convinced it was a conspiracy by people who didn't like dragon types to ban salamence right before b&w just so it would never be suspect tested again =p) and throughout most of gen v with being overtly lenient on bans.

 

[Yoshisaurus Rex]

That and i seriously doubt with the amount of details they've put into the models in this game(seriously fur textures in a pokemon game!? i never though i'd see the day they'd go past low poly plastic-like models! ;v that they'd make a downgraded version for 3DS considering that they'd practically have to remake all the graphics from scratch.
If mewtwo is in and gets a mega evo super move i really really hope it's x for once since 1. it fits the style of the game more and 2. why does kid buu- i mean mewtwo y have to be in the spotlight in EVERYTHING?(though personally i think both mewtwos as well as mega legendaries as a concept are the dumbest things.)
As for mega charizard i like X better because it looks like a more dramatic super form whilst y IMO looks like charizard with a bunch of extra unecessary accesories pasted to it.(sucg as garchomp's fins and a random head spike replacing the horns)I also dig the flame beard/stache even though the fire effect looks really dumb and awkward in the 3ds pokemon games.

I know but I wasn't really directly talking about Pokken. Just the Wii U's game library in general. Sorry if I caused confusion there.

 

[ZephyrZ]

Eh it just seems like anything that disrupts their love of wall and stall and utter reliance on status and hazards it isn't long before they ban something.

Fortunately Druddigon can never be banned because it's Druddigon the best Dragon ever.

Favoring wall and stall? Oh no, it just looks that way because it's so much easier for an offensive pokemon to be broken then a defensive one.

Walls are easily kept in check by type weaknesses. Ferrothorn is great and all, but it's not going to be able to stand up against a Flamethrower or Aura Sphere. Others are just too passive for the current Metagame; Forretress used to be great in earlier gens, but now it's basically just set-up fodder.

Offensive pokemon, however, are not as easily kept in check by weaknesses. Many powerhouses can just tear apart anything that can wall them, and outspeed most anything that can KO them. You can't have your weakness exploited if your opponent is KOed before it can be exploited.

If Smogon was all about perserving stall, then Defog, Gothitelle, Kyurem-B, and so, so many things would of been banned already. Stall is a dying play style; most things have to be capable of dealing damage in order to keep up with the ever-growing list of power houses. This is why dedicated walls like Forretress have fallen out of favor and tanks like Landerous-T are growing in favor.

Let's also not forget Doexys-D and Deoxys-S were banned largely impart because they set up Spikes with too much ease; Smogon will ban hazard-related threats if they get out of hand as well.

 

[MagiusNecros]

I will give smogon props though. I use a lot of their Pokémon builds as a guideline when I breed my own.

 

[SleuthMechanism]

Favoring walls? eh... no, not at all infact thats why pretty much nobody but me likes gen 2 OU XDIt's just that in recent gens you now have a bunch of mons with absurd offensive stats and boosting capabilities making offense an overwhelmingly good option over others playstyles.(which is one of many reasons i cant stand the gen vi meta.) the bans really did nothing to change this.

 

[U-Throw]

Favoring wall and stall? Oh no, it just looks that way because it's so much easier for an offensive pokemon to be broken then a defensive one.

Walls are easily kept in check by type weaknesses. Ferrothorn is great and all, but it's not going to be able to stand up against a Flamethrower or Aura Sphere. Others are just too passive for the current Metagame; Forretress used to be great in earlier gens, but now it's basically just set-up fodder.

Offensive pokemon, however, are not as easily kept in check by weaknesses. Many powerhouses can just tear apart anything that can wall them, and outspeed most anything that can KO them. You can't have your weakness exploited if your opponent is KOed before it can be exploited.

If Smogon was all about perserving stall, then Defog, Gothitelle, Kyurem-B, and so, so many things would of been banned already. Stall is a dying play style; most things have to be capable of dealing damage in order to keep up with the ever-growing list of power houses. This is why dedicated walls like Forretress have fallen out of favor and tanks like Landerous-T are growing in favor.

Let's also not forget Doexys-D and Deoxys-S were banned largely impart because they set up Spikes with too much ease; Smogon will ban hazard-related threats if they get out of hand as well.

I love how much interesting discussion we're having here!
I have absolutely no idea what we're talking about.

 

[BugCatcherWill]

Favoring wall and stall? Oh no, it just looks that way because it's so much easier for an offensive pokemon to be broken then a defensive one.

Walls are easily kept in check by type weaknesses. Ferrothorn is great and all, but it's not going to be able to stand up against a Flamethrower or Aura Sphere. Others are just too passive for the current Metagame; Forretress used to be great in earlier gens, but now it's basically just set-up fodder.

Offensive pokemon, however, are not as easily kept in check by weaknesses. Many powerhouses can just tear apart anything that can wall them, and outspeed most anything that can KO them. You can't have your weakness exploited if your opponent is KOed before it can be exploited.

If Smogon was all about perserving stall, then Defog, Gothitelle, Kyurem-B, and so, so many things would of been banned already. Stall is a dying play style; most things have to be capable of dealing damage in order to keep up with the ever-growing list of power houses. This is why dedicated walls like Forretress have fallen out of favor and tanks like Landerous-T are growing in favor.

Let's also not forget Doexys-D and Deoxys-S were banned largely impart because they set up Spikes with too much ease; Smogon will ban hazard-related threats if they get out of hand as well.

Also, Mega Evolutions basically *****-slap stall teams in higher tiers...

 

[DrRiceBoy]

Haven't touched Showdown in quite a while... but I remember sucking hard. I used janky stuff like Toxic-Stockpile-Rest-Fire Punch Snorlax and Specs Pidgeot in OU. It was fun but needless to say I got wrecked most of the time. huehuehuehue

On the topic of stall, I hear Mega Sableye is really good.

 

[Demon-oni]

This girl gets it! Dr. Mario mains... Team, UNITE UP!

EDIT: Oh, and before I forget, what's that 30% startup combo? I must know it!

I actually like Doc more than Mario. Mario may have more damage potential on specific matchups, but a lot of Doc's stuff is guaranteed across the board, usually rack about 20% each while being valid till around 70%, and his tornado is insane as an edgeguard (can kill bowser offstage at 70%). You just really have to work with his recovery since it's not good at all.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Haven't touched Showdown in quite a while... but I remember sucking hard. I used janky stuff like Toxic-Stockpile-Rest-Fire Punch Snorlax and Specs Pidgeot in OU. It was fun but needless to say I got wrecked most of the time. huehuehuehue

On the topic of stall, I hear Mega Sableye is really good.

Fun fact about Mega Sableye: Priority doesn't change on the turn you mega evolve, meaning you still get to benefit from Prankster

 

[DrRiceBoy]

Fun fact about Mega Sableye: Priority doesn't change on the turn you mega evolve, meaning you still get to benefit from Prankster

Yeah, I hear that's exactly why he's really good... lol...

 

[MagiusNecros]

Sheer Force Feraligatr though.

 

[SleuthMechanism]

Last i played showdown i pretty much only played UU and doubles. speedboosting into lategame megashark sweeps and pretending it's gen v by still using a sun team all day.

 

[MagiusNecros]

I can't use showdown because the ability to generate your team to exact specifications doesn't sit well with me.

 

[BugCatcherWill]

I can't use showdown because the ability to generate your team to exact specifications doesn't sit well with me.

Beats doing it in the game

 

[ZephyrZ]

It's been too long since I touched Showdown.
I used to play it regularly, but I've kind of abandoned it after Smash came out. I'll probably play it again after Pokemon Z or whatever comes out.

I had a balanced Mega Sableye themed team, a full-out Volt Turn team(literally everything on the team new Volt Switch, U-Turn or Baton Pass), and a semi-stall Mega Venusaur team myself. Unfortunately all three of those teams got deleted when I cleared my browser history one time...but I totally intend to make that Volt Turn team again.

I can't use showdown because the ability to generate your team to exact specifications doesn't sit well with me.

I would totally play Wi-Fi more if creating teams didn't take hours upon hours of brainless grinding.

I only really use Wi-Fi for rotation battles.

 

[SleuthMechanism]

^This. pretty much. Especially since said team may become obsolete in a month or two or i'll end up finding glaring flaws later on down the line that i didn't anticipate or see during initial testing. I'd play showdown more if people actually played gen iv ou. ORAS uu was ok but maaan it feels like half the game is determined by team matchups nowadays since there are just way too many mons to account for/keep track of XD;It is the one gen that actually got me into doubles where i can use janky gimmicks(such as hailroom and sun) and still win though so theres that. XD;

 

[SuperNintendoKid]

anyone wanna battle?
Mewtwo dittos allowed

 

[cstonic]

Has anyone seen Tweek's Mewtwo in action?
If not,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_RdLmNxYJSU

 

[DrRiceBoy]

Played a bunch of Mewtwo on Anther's Ladder for the first time today. Pretty nice experience. Everybody was friendly and the matches were a lot better than For Glory. I won 6 sets and lost 3. =)

there was this one guy that camped hard and was pretty rude though... not to mention the match was laggy... there's a bad egg in everything I suppose.

Has anyone seen Tweek's Mewtwo in action?
If not,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_RdLmNxYJSU

Holy Buddha, that last match comeback... ledge trump -> confusion -> fair... sexy as heck.

 

[MagiusNecros]

Beats doing it in the game

That's what you think!

 

[Chiroz]

Played a bunch of Mewtwo on Anther's Ladder for the first time today. Pretty nice experience. Everybody was friendly and the matches were a lot better than For Glory. I won 6 sets and lost 3. =)

there was this one guy that camped hard and was pretty rude though... not to mention the match was laggy... there's a bad egg in everything I suppose.

Holy Buddha, that last match comeback... ledge trump -> confusion -> fair... sexy as heck.

I've been looking for something to do when ledge trumping.

Mewtwo can ledge trump incredibly easy but I always failed to follow up on it because B-Air and Double Jump are both sooo slow (and I didn't know what else to try). I will give Confusion a try, might allow new options for me.

 

[SuperNintendoKid]

i sent you a replay of my ownage as mewtwo
@ミスティック Speed

 

[Karsticles]

How do you "easily" ledge trump with Mewtwo? Run off holding back doesn't seem to work for me like it does with speedy characters.

 

[Gui JP]

Preparing to throw $4.99 at Nintendo for some Mewtwo!
(I don't even have a Wii U yet, just planning ahead for when I do.
The saviiiiings)

 

[ORVO5]

How do you "easily" ledge trump with Mewtwo? Run off holding back doesn't seem to work for me like it does with speedy characters.

Wait.. I was trying out random combinations and it happened.. I just gotta figure out how I did it.

Figured it out. It's with back+jump (not tap jump ofcourse lol.)

Edit 2: Actually it's easier to fo with back+A

Edit 3: Compared to Ganondorf this has to be extra precise. Not sure if I get the mechanics 100% with Mewtwo because it's 50/50, but it's there for sure. I don't think there's an easy way tbh.

 

[Demon-oni]

You could just do it the way sonic does it, considering the fast air speed. Half circle back after you pass the edge.

 

[ORVO5]

You could just do it the way sonic does it, considering the fast air speed. Half circle back after you pass the edge.

Trying that when i wake up lol

 

[pikazz]

that beautiful when I punished a sonic Spin Dash with Mewtwos Disable! I won because of it <3

when I will get my elgato this week, I will record that :3

 

[Demon-oni]

So has anyone else but me been trying to work the mewtwo teleport ledge cancels into their game? It seems fun, but you screw up just a tiny bit on distance and you get an SD. But in return, you become like the coolest person on Battlefield ever.

 

[cstonic]

So has anyone else but me been trying to work the mewtwo teleport ledge cancels into their game? It seems fun, but you screw up just a tiny bit on distance and you get an SD. But in return, you become like the coolest person on Battlefield ever.

Yup! Thats what Im working on this week.

 

[Demon-oni]

I've actually learned quite a bit about it already. Turns out Mewtwo's momentum pre-teleport determines how much distance his teleport will go and can actually screw up the sweet spotting if you don't pay attention to it. Going the opposite direction of the teleport means the distance is shorter, up to one mario in length, and of course going the same direction adds a mario in length of how much distance the teleport covers. Battlefield is a great place to measure out your teleports, and there's a lot of tricks you can try as well.

 

[Chiroz]

I've actually learned quite a bit about it already. Turns out Mewtwo's momentum pre-teleport determines how much distance his teleport will go and can actually screw up the sweet spotting if you don't pay attention to it. Going the opposite direction of the teleport means the distance is shorter, up to one mario in length, and of course going the same direction adds a mario in length of how much distance the teleport covers. Battlefield is a great place to measure out your teleports, and there's a lot of tricks you can try as well.

I don't think this is accurate. I was skeptical and I jumped onto my 3DS and tried it, I got the exact same distance by doing it against my momentum.

If you want to better test it yourself pick a stage with an obvious "center" on Omega, run from the corner and full jump, just as you're reaching the very center Teleport and instantly release the control stick. Whether you TP with the momentum or against it you will reach outside the stage just outside of ledge snapping range (Mewtwo won't grab the edge and he will fall to his death).

I also tested while on the floor and you also get the exact same distance whether you do it with or against the momentum. What I did notice is that aerial Teleport has more range than grounded Teleport (because Mewtwo retains his momentum while doing the flip).



It's good to note that grounded Teleports can be shortened by inputting a diagonal. The closer your control stick is to a downwards position the shorter the Teleport will be. Pressing straight downwards allows you to Teleport in place (This might be what confused you).

 

[Demon-oni]

I don't think this is accurate. I was skeptical and I jumped onto my 3DS and tried it, I got the exact same distance by doing it against my momentum.

If you want to better test it yourself pick a stage with an obvious "center" on Omega, run from the corner and full jump, just as you're reaching the very center Teleport and instantly release the control stick. Whether you TP with the momentum or against it you will reach outside the stage just outside of ledge snapping range (Mewtwo won't grab the edge and he will fall to his death).

I also tested while on the floor and you also get the exact same distance whether you do it with or against the momentum. What I did notice is that aerial Teleport has more range than grounded Teleport (because Mewtwo retains his momentum while doing the flip).



It's good to note that grounded Teleports can be shortened by inputting a diagonal. The closer your control stick is to a downwards position the shorter the Teleport will be. Pressing straight downwards allows you to Teleport in place (This might be what confused you).

1. I don't understand the method in which your doing this but either way it sound like you aren't teleporting to the ledge, right? Mewtwo landing on the ground immediately after teleport and how he lands is pretty crucial to this.

2. I do realize you can shorten grounded teleports. These are tested with various control schemes and after a few hours of testing from what I can say are perfectly horizontal inputs are what I'm using for identifying these distances. Of course there is always the possibility I'm wrong, but before either of us can prove the other wrong we'd need some type of evidence supporting one side.

3. I just tested this on the Wii U and 3DS, both on standard and Omega Battlefield. The distances are still different. If you want I can give you some points on the field in order to test this, and if possible I will find a way to record it and edit a video showing the variants of distances. It's not huge granted, but enough that can turn a possible huge play into an SD.

On Omega Battlefield for the 3DS version, on the right half of the ring, do you notice the third blue block in the middle right before the pattern starts to bottleneck? Thats a reference point for a teleport with no momentum that if you teleport to the ledge, it'll ledge cancel, provided Mewtwo is centered over that square with no previous momentum. Now if you were to start a dash, with Mewtwo's waist being the center of his model, once his waist meets the blue square before the first reference point and you teleport then, he will ledge cancel, where as before with no momentum this square does not give a possibility to ledge cancel at all. Now the last point, the blue cube after the bottleneck. If you do a teleport with no momentum here, you will suicide to your death attempting to ledge cancel. However, if you run from the nearby ledge then teleport from that square, all of a sudden it no longer kills you and you get a perfect ledge cancel.

I'm not saying the distances are that far, but it is enough to screw with the positioning enough that can mean the difference of an early lead or an early SD. The main reason I was testing pre momentum teleport distances in the first place was because in a real match you likely won't be standing still for one reason or another.

 

[MagiusNecros]

Teleport has it's properties depending on the directional input. Current momentum doesn't seem to matter.

 

[Demon-oni]

Hey it's cool. I tried to help. If no one wants to believe me, that's their choice. I know what works is all that matters to me.

 

[MagiusNecros]

Hey it's cool. I tried to help. If no one wants to believe me, that's their choice. I know what works is all that matters to me.

Showing a vid showing any difference would help your claim honestly.

 

[Chiroz]

1. I don't understand the method in which your doing this but either way it sound like you aren't teleporting to the ledge, right? Mewtwo landing on the ground immediately after teleport and how he lands is pretty crucial to this.

2. I do realize you can shorten grounded teleports. These are tested with various control schemes and after a few hours of testing from what I can say are perfectly horizontal inputs are what I'm using for identifying these distances. Of course there is always the possibility I'm wrong, but before either of us can prove the other wrong we'd need some type of evidence supporting one side.

3. I just tested this on the Wii U and 3DS, both on standard and Omega Battlefield. The distances are still different. If you want I can give you some points on the field in order to test this, and if possible I will find a way to record it and edit a video showing the variants of distances. It's not huge granted, but enough that can turn a possible huge play into an SD.

On Omega Battlefield for the 3DS version, on the right half of the ring, do you notice the third blue block in the middle right before the pattern starts to bottleneck? Thats a reference point for a teleport with no momentum that if you teleport to the ledge, it'll ledge cancel, provided Mewtwo is centered over that square with no previous momentum. Now if you were to start a dash, with Mewtwo's waist being the center of his model, once his waist meets the blue square before the first reference point and you teleport then, he will ledge cancel, where as before with no momentum this square does not give a possibility to ledge cancel at all. Now the last point, the blue cube after the bottleneck. If you do a teleport with no momentum here, you will suicide to your death attempting to ledge cancel. However, if you run from the nearby ledge then teleport from that square, all of a sudden it no longer kills you and you get a perfect ledge cancel.

I'm not saying the distances are that far, but it is enough to screw with the positioning enough that can mean the difference of an early lead or an early SD. The main reason I was testing pre momentum teleport distances in the first place was because in a real match you likely won't be standing still for one reason or another.

I wasn't teleporting to the ledge. Your argument was that Teleport has different ranges depending on your momentum, nowhere did you specify anything about the ledge.

The way I tested was by Teleporting from the very center of a "grid" stage in order to correctly measure the distance. The distance of both the aerial and the grounded version of Teleport was exactly the same on the grid whether I did it in the direction of my momentum or against the direction of my momentum (Although the aerial versions have greater range than the grounded ones).

I did not understand you meant with NO momentum and thus didn't test it.

I will test with no momentum, ledgecancelling with/without momentum and the methods you listed above shortly to see what results I get myself.

 

[Demon-oni]

Well If I can find my elgato I'll try to get a video up by the end of week. That's all I can do if that. Need to actually work to make a living, you know.

Edit: Tonicthesquirrel and I were primarily having a conversation about ledge canceling so I thought that's where the assumption would be for the grounds of testing. I do apologize for not specifying so as it might have caused some confusion. I was about to go to bed before talking about all of this then all this happened so forgive me for forgetting to type some details. And on that note, good night everybody. Never work graveyard shifts.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

well tomorrow the vip party is over

but we will always have that vip of getting mewtwo free of charge