Sonic The Hedgehog: Community Matchup thread

[Terios the Hedgehog]

YES NOW I REMEMBER. It's cause i SD'd twice, but you played terrible with Diddy. No bananas on Rainbow Cruise. Now I remember it, pick Rainbow Cruise, no nahnurz for Diddy.

I still won. XD

So you DID play a terrible Diddy. HA!

That was totally worth....ignoring the topic to prove a match of no...real... consequence... happened.....


Huh.

I'm ****ing stupid.

 

[Steeler]

hey guys, sorry i've been away but thanks for discussing the matchup with the pt guys. what was the final consensus?

 

[ROOOOY!]

Pretty much 55:45 against Ivysaur (though some wanted 60:40)

45:55 v Charizard
45:55 v Squirle

Neutral for all, lol.

 

[Tenki]

Though, I'm not sure about the Ivy one. I'm not sure if any Sonics here have played Ivysaurs that are
1) familiar with Sonic and move tendencies
2) can space well and know their own moveset pretty well.

:/ I still think it's 50:50 but it doesn't make a bit of difference guys.

 

[Boxob.]

Though, I'm not sure about the Ivy one. I'm not sure if any Sonics here have played Ivysaurs that are
1) familiar with Sonic and move tendencies
2) can space well and know their own moveset pretty well.

:/ I still think it's 50:50 but it doesn't make a bit of difference guys.

The balls are inert.

Rofl.

Ivy's easy.

 

[JayBee]

The balls are inert.

That had better not be a DBZ reference.

I caught a Haunter! Go! use Hypnosis on Boxob, now!

 

[Steeler]

if you guys don't agree that PT has a 60:40 advantage

then the whole universe is going to DIE

i hope my body can take it...):

 

[ROOOOY!]

I actually voiced that exact thought earlier on.

It all depends on whether Sonic gives you the time to switch. Which thinking about it...he probably wont lol.

Ehh, we need to get back on track with Diddy >_>
Pretty much neutral, yah?

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

PRETTY much. I think Diddy has a small advantage. He's worse for me than PT is that's for sure.

 

[ROOOOY!]

Mmm, 45:55 at worst IMO though.

We could talk about counterpicks, but they're pretty obvious. It's not so much 'what level does Sonic do good in?' it's more 'what level is Diddy bad in?' and it's the usual ones where he can't control the stage.

Rainbow Cruise, Norfair, that kind of dealio.

 

[ShadowLink84]

The problem being Norfair is banned =(
such awesome golden sun music.

BUT I HAVE MUSIC HACKS SO I CAN HEAR IT ANYTIME I WISH HAHAHA!
Including sonic boom

 

[infomon]

This matchup would be neutral, but Sonic Boom pushes it +5 in Sonic's favour.

 

[ShadowLink84]

+10 f00 oh and we must remember open your heart.

 

[Kinzer]

Okay, so I suppose people STILL haven't moved on to the new matchup, which happened to be Diddy Kong... no matter, we all feel like we are informed enoguh of the matchup, and most more or less agree that it is a neutral matchup... why don't we move on to whoever is next on the agenda?

I'll be right back, I need one more person to post so I don't have to worry about getting infracted for triple posting.

14th post.

Edit: Oh look at that, it's Lucas!

 

[da K.I.D.]

just because there wasnt a picture at the top of the page doesnt mean we havent moved on lol...
read the posts scrubmuffin...

i think its 60-40 diddy

good character vs. bad character.

 

[Browny]

15th... D@MN YOU KID POSTING AS I DO

not a single post in the diddy export thread... mass phayle

arent we doing lucas anyway?

 

[da K.I.D.]

you scrub, i posted first.. why dont you refresh before posting.

anyways, just edit your post and putt a pic of diddy in it, you can do that right?
p.s. somehow, i knew that was gonna happen

 

[Kinzer]

Darn you K.I.D., you're so mean... *cough* anyway, we should go make a notice in the OBR to let the Lucas' know that we've gone to their character.

I honestly can't say anything about the matchup since I have absolutely no idea how it works (I've only done silly friendlies).

My internet is being so slow, but I'll get to doing the Diddy write-up (God I still have to do PT... I'm so lazy!), but i need to do it, no schoolwork/whatever johns...

DJ, don't worry about doing Lucas' write-up, I'll take care of that in the end.

 

[ShadowLink84]

sonic vs diddy is 55:45 Diddy or 50:50.
Sonic vs Lucas: 60:40 Sonic.
Grabbing is fun.

 

[ROOOOY!]

I've got a fair bit to contribute here, namely in the form of how the Lucas I played last Smashfest ***** me. It was the first time I'd played a Lucas offline, but still. I feel this is neutral, as it was agreed when discussed on the Lucas boards a short time ago, but I'll wait for the Lucas mains to get here.

 

[MalcolmM]

i think its neutral. ive played many a lucas in my time.

 

[Tenki]

Neutral :<

Ryuka's aerial priority kind of eats Sonic.

 

[infomon]

Lucas' Nair makes me cry.

 

[Tenki]

N-air>U-tilt is kind of annoying.

Zap jump is annoying online, and quite easily chased by Sonic offline lol.

 

[Browny]

shield camp

space bairs/uairs

LEARN THE RANGE OF ZAP JUMP/ MAGNET PULL / PKT2

idk lol. I know quite a few lucas mains and played vs them online (wifi tourney grand final lol he got ***** :D) and offline but they all have never played against a sonic before and dont take brawl as seriously as i do

 

[da K.I.D.]

sounds like lack of matchup knowledge as opposed to the matchup actually being neutral

i tested this like 2 days ago.

hyphen smash eats nair for dinner.

lucas's grab release takes almost as long as ness's right?

that should mean a garanteed f-tilt off of a GR.

all of our attacks cancel out PKT and you can DI out of his PKT2

 

[prOAPC]

the only think i can say is that Lucas has a hard time hitting Sonic with his killing moves, i've played only 3 Sonic, and i won all of those matches because the time ran out

 

[Neon Ness]

vs. ?

...I can't see too much different here than the fight against Ness... 50:50?

With rope snake, zap jump, and PKT2, no Lucas that knows what they're doing is getting gimped. At the same time, though, I find Lucas' usual edgeguarding tactics pretty menaningless against Sonic. PK Freeze is just too slow to be worth anything; same with PKT. Sonic's recovery is too versatile for him to succumb to any of these moves. Lucas has a hard time approaching on the ground... PK Fire should be used sparingly at most to avoid predicatability. Spinshots > PK Fire. Sonic avoids the bolt and is put in a favorable position for an offensive move. PK Fire does, however, effectively fend off Sonic's grab game, to an extent, by either forcing him into the air or, of course, hitting him. Neutral air disrupts Sonic's up air combos, which rack up damage quickly if left unanswered; short hopped nairs punish at close range on the ground and lead into upt tilts. I can't think of anything Lucas can really do out of a teched dthrow... Maybe a shorthopped nair to eat away at Sonic's shield/punish a spotdodge, but that's about it. Lucas should play this one patiently. Sonic's gonna be all over the place, so it's to our advantage to wait for an opening rather than come out with both guns blazing.

Phew... I gotta learn to be more concise.

 

[Browny]

Lucas grab release slides too far away to do anything

 

[aeghrur]

Where's blackbelt...
I have no knowledge of this matchup, except in grab him from his aerials with shieldgrab... hopefully.
Oh, and uh, his upsmash has a very surprising range, but is SOOOOOOOOOOOO punishable if it misses. Doubt Lucas's will use it much though.

 

[Neon Ness]

Oh, and uh, his upsmash has a very surprising range, but is SOOOOOOOOOOOO punishable if it misses. Doubt Lucas's will use it much though.

Up Smash? Against Sonic?

HA!

...Seriously, that would be bad. I save up smash mindgamez for bigger, heavier characters...

You couldn't even really use it to punish a Homing Attack, unless you like saw into the future and saw it coming. If you think to use it after HA's initiation, I doubt Lucas has enough time to pull it off before getting hit.

 

[aeghrur]

Up Smash? Against Sonic?

HA!

...Seriously, that would be bad. I save up smash mindgamez for bigger, heavier characters...

Dude, I got upsmashed so much in FFAs... T_T
IT WAS TERRIBLE.
Seriously, 4 ppl ffa, people would knock me around on these small stages and I'd get upsmashed. T_T

 

[_clinton]

Funny thing about grab release...

Lucas=ground is less annoying
Ness=air is less annoying

A grab at 145% or so from Lucas will equal a dead Sonic depending on the stage (FD in this case)
Lucas' dthrow is as powerful KO wise as Ness' bthrow...just vertical...and DI can make a difference...unlike Ness' throws...

BTW Lucas' throws all can kill as well...compared to just Ness' bthrow...however only the dthrow comes close to Ness' bthrow in power...

A pivot grab can avoid punishment overall for the most part at least compared to the other grabs (Lucas' other grabs have issues)

 

[Neon Ness]

Lul.

Lucas and Ness are beastly in Free for Alls, with their enormous disjointed hitboxes. PK Flash is also deadly.

EDIT at _clint: True. But Lucas will rarely have the opportunity to grab Sonic. His grab is just too slow. Maybe if he tried a mindgamed pivot grab, which is faster, but getting close to Sonic and grabbing him just seems tough to me... Maybe I'm just scrubby.

 

[Kinzer]

Read the Diddy write-up on 230 and tell me if I did it right or not, you n00bzorz.

 

[Tenki]

Sonic cannot D-tilt Lucas out of a grab release :[

The Lucas players that beat me online usually got me into their (high amount of) multi-hit moves and I ran into their smashes (lol orange connections. awesomeeee)

The one Lucas player I played offline (Jewdo) - well, he doesn't really play Brawl much anymore :<

I think you can shield a PK fire (not even P-shield) and then instant dash attack OoS and still hit Lucas.

 

[ROOOOY!]

Kinzer, that's a good write up.


And ehh, Lucas is going to have to work really hard for his kills here. Grabbing Sonic isn't easy.

I think Sonic can get through Lucas' camp game better then most. It's mid range that Sonic is most dangerous at. Right up close, Lucas' nairs -> utilt/jab combo/everything under the sun, even Homing Attack I found really hard to deal with.

 

[lil cj]

I find dash attack very annoying against Lucas
its jus too fast....but spin dashes can be stopped easily with PK fire
Only a ASC has the possibility of hitting Lucas

 

[Jim Morrison]

ASC > Lucas.

SH N-air is indeed annoying.

 

[ROOOOY!]

We really need moar Lucas mains here.
I know they did the match-up on their boards recently and I think had it as neutral.

The main point of this post is to tell everyone that the chart is updated on post 3, with the agreed match-up numbers put in an easy enough way to read.