Smash Ultimate Leak Discussion Thread

[TheCJBrine]

What if Incineroar get's the first trailer in the next direct, we see Ken as an echo, modes including Spirits, and then it ends with...you guessed it...Steve Geno? it could also be Steve.

It's also possible we get more echoes alongside Ken.

 

[NintenZ]

He totally would tho.

Tru, he’s done crazy things in the past... I dunno, I just see him going out with a bigger bang this time, it’s just a gut feeling I have.

 

[Pyra]

Tru, he’s done crazy things in the past... I dunno, I just see him going out with a bigger bang this time, it’s just a gut feeling I have.

I don't think this is necessarily out of the question either.
It's pretty obvious that this cycle is different than other ones.

 

[CosmicQuark]

It's a very plausible and likely scenario.

Plausible, yes. Likely, no. We have no reason to suspect those two are the only ones left. And I personally do not believe placeholder art could give us any indication about the final roster, but others are free to disagree.

 

[Deleted member]

Yep, I know, which is why we discussed it literally every day before the Ken leak.
Why exactly is it back again???

Because while the Box Theory does have holes, there isn't anything outside of speculation that proves or disproves it, and there likely won't be until the final roster is shown, which by then it won't matter anyway. It sucks, but we kinda have to play the waiting game on this one.

 

[Luigi The President]

I dunno man.

I've said it countless times before, but...
You can bust out the "well it's all about the world of Minecraft" argument all you want but I simply refuse to believe Nintendo would work with Microsoft, of all companies...to net a simple assist trophy or stage.
Which is why I really do believe Steve is base roster.

 

[Nekoo]

Everyone's talking about the Box Theory, and Here I'am fully believing the Music theory.

I feel alone.

 

[Majora's Visage]

Evening lads, any new "leaks" today?

 

[NintenZ]

Everyone's talking about the Box Theory, and Here I'am fully believing the Music theory.

I feel alone.

Meanwhile I’m not believing any theories till I see something for myself lol.

 

[Pyra]

Everyone's talking about the Box Theory, and Here I'am fully believing the Music theory.

I feel alone.

Don't worry, I'm a huge fan of the circle of fifths and talking about scales and intervals.

I dunno man.

I've said it countless times before, but...
You can bust out the "well it's all about the world of Minecraft" argument all you want but I simply refuse to believe Nintendo would work with Microsoft, of all companies...to net a simple assist trophy or stage.
Which is why I really do believe Steve is base roster.

Could be. The unique newcomer could end up being Steve instead of a Pokemon.
(Or, better idea, there's more than one unique newcomer left)

 

[CosmicQuark]

I dunno man.

I've said it countless times before, but...
You can bust out the "well it's all about the world of Minecraft" argument all you want but I simply refuse to believe Nintendo would work with Microsoft, of all companies...to net a simple assist trophy or stag.e
Which is why I really do believe Steve is base roster.

Minecraft only being a stage/assist doesn't necessarily mean Microsoft doesn't have a character. I think it's very plausible Minecraft is a Monster Hunter situation--stage/assist, but no character.

 

[TheCJBrine]

I can imagine big characters like Steve and Sora would go on the back of the box.

 

[Luigi The President]

Don't worry, I'm a huge fan of the circle of fifths and talking about scales and intervals.


Could be. The unique newcomer could end up being Steve instead of a Pokemon.

Yep, there's always a chance. I believe personally that Steve will end up breaking the box theory but, you never know.

Minecraft only being a stage/assist doesn't necessarily mean Microsoft doesn't have a character. I think it's very plausible Minecraft is a Monster Hunter situation--stage/assist, but no character.

I mean, you can try to convince me Steve wouldn't get over Banjo-Kazooie. Wouldn't work, but you can try. Look, I like the duo a ton, but not even considering that, why on Earth would Minecraft get the stage if Banjo-Kazooie or Master Chief were in, and not, y'know...Banjo-Kazooie and Master Chief?

 

[Dcas]

Evening lads, any new "leaks" today?

So far no, besides Vergeben stating that if he said which are the candidates to be the SE newcomer to smash, there are jobs at risk.

 

[Pyra]

Yep, there's always a chance. I believe personally that Steve will end up breaking the box theory but, you never know.


I mean, you can try to convince me Steve wouldn't get over Banjo-Kazooie. Wouldn't work, but you can try. Look, I like the duo a ton, but not even considering that, why on Earth would Minecraft get the stage if Banjo-Kazooie or Master Chief were in, and not, y'know...Banjo-Kazooie and Master Chief?

I mean, i'm in the boat that is dying on the "there's more than one unique newcomer left in the base roster" hill so

Edit: why did I combine those two turns of phrases

 

[domriver]

Evening lads, any new "leaks" today?

We need a direct announced. Who knew that this drought over information from 8/8/18 will be like this; :D
we are almost there

12/7/2018!

 

[Shroob]

Honestly, while I've never been 100% sold on the box theory, I still find it a good baseline to taper your expectations to.


It's just like what happened with the last Smash Direct; always go in expecting worst case scenario, that way, if something unexpected happens, you'll be pleasantly surprised.


I realistically 'could' see us in a world where there are indeed 2 reveals left, and I'm not going to sweat it.

If that's it? Cool, I'm already happy with the game.

If there's more? Cool, I'll be surprised when it gets revealed.

 

[Majora's Visage]

Masked Man/Claus would be a pretty cool addition actually.

He has PSI, a Sword that emits electricity, a gun, and wings for flight.

His normals can be sword/gun based while his aerials can be PSI/gun except bair in which he will flap his wings back like Corrin.

To make things more interest, when the smash attack is fully charged, it can emit lighting to stun characters.

His final smash would be PK Love.

I love Mother 3 and Masked Man would be a dream. He have SO MUCH POTENTIAL with his PSI/Gun/Sword/Wings.... But then again it will be unlikely.
Also, his design looks awesome. He look so bad*** and cute that I want to hug him..
View attachment 166349

I never played Mother 3 and I didn't know I needed Claus in Smash until now.

 

[Deleted member]

Everyone's talking about the Box Theory, and Here I'am fully believing the Music theory.

I feel alone.

I'm neutral on the box and believe it has a bunch of holes that are overlooked and facts that are cherry picked. Music Theory is the only one I think that actually has the most solid arguments going for it right now.

You're definitely not alone.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

I wonder how internet reactions would be if Incineroar was the last non-echo newcomer?

 

[Pyra]

I wonder how internet reactions would be if Incineroar was the last non-echo newcomer?

...I think the last several weeks is a preview to that, no?

 

[Shroob]

I wonder how internet reactions would be if Incineroar was the last non-echo newcomer?

Reddit would have a meltdown.

They ****ing despise box theory that they'll literally upvote anything that says "Box theory is dumb"

 

[Potato_]

I wonder how internet reactions would be if Incineroar was the last non-echo newcomer?

Depends, do we get a few hype characters shown as DLC, or even one big name ala Sora or Geno? If so I can see people grumpily accepting it.

If not? Well it won't be pretty for a lot of people.

 

[Mc.Rad]

We need a direct announced. Who knew that this drought over information from 8/8/18 will be like this; :D
we are almost there

12/7/2018!

We just had a Smash reveal like 2 weeks ago, but I'm not saying that to say you're a baby, I'm saying that because I really do need news right now

 

[dezeray112]

So here is what we know so far according to specific leaks:

- An image showing Pichu, Ivysaur and Pac-Man as well as Ken Masters surfaced which could possibly be legit.

- Both Hitagi and Vergeben seemed to have a number of similar claims which include:
- A new playable Gen VII Pokemon which is most likely to be Inceniroar
- Isabelle who was already confirmed
- A Square-Enix character in which the two cannot disclose as of yet
- Even though Vergeben mentioned Minecraft will have some form of content in Ultimate, Hitagi stated that a character from the series (Minecraft) is playable.

- Hitagi also heard that Cy Games and Nintendo are under negotiations to bring Katalina, a character from Granblue Fantasy franchise as potentially and possibly as a DLC character.

 

[Opossum]

Everyone's talking about the Box Theory, and Here I'am fully believing the Music theory.

I feel alone.

Be like me.

Believe the Box Theory AND the Music Theory.

 

[FalconFire93]

I wonder how internet reactions would be if Incineroar was the last non-echo newcomer?

 

[Wyoming]

Everyone's talking about the Box Theory, and Here I'am fully believing the Music theory.

I feel alone.

Music Theory makes a lot sense. It would be interesting to see a second track from a franchise that already got a track showcased on the website but that hasn't happened yet after many weeks so I doubt it.

It also connects fairly well with box theory.

 

[AzureFlame4]

The minds of the box theory people are going to explode when Shadow gets revealed next month. I'm not even a Shadow fan but I give his inclusion a way higher chance than the box theory.

 

[Potato_]

Music Theory makes a lot sense. It would be interesting to see a second track from a franchise that already got a track showcased on the website but that hasn't happened yet after many weeks so I doubt it.

It also connects fairly well with box theory.

Oh God, I can see it now. A Mario Kart track gets put up on the site, and we have people arguing about it for weeks that Music Theory is still viable because Mario has two categories on the song list.

If they actually did that I'd have no doubt in my mind the people behind the blog updates are reading popular theories and using them to screw with us.

 

[Paperchampion23]

Sure is subjective, but if we go accordingly to this "no one liked BUT im a special snowflake that did get hyped due to x thing" then everything is hype. In fact it might be the case, but if we go to a general consensus the vast majority would agree that bjr and shulk were "meh" at best, nothing close to a HUGE or hype reveal.

You just can´t compare the impact of a let´s say "shulk" vs Sora, Sora alone would sell switches to people, on the other hand Shulk wouldn´t.

Well of course, I get that. But we also have to remember that outside of the Smash fanbase, Geno, Isaac, Elma, BWD, and many many others are in the same boat. If we are honest with ourselves, they are on the level of a Shulk reveal in the end, as nobody outside of the Smash or their respective game fanbases will inherently care about those characters. Hell, Ridley and K. Rool are notable for being Smash related requests, not because of their games.

I think we have to remember that, hype IS subjective. Ridley and K. Rool are only as big as they are now because of the 10 years of hype surrounding them, not because they are these immensely popular characters like Cloud or Mega-Man.

This is why I can still expect many of the characters people want, because they are fan-level picks now, not these extremely iconic sets of characters like Mega-man or Snake or Pac-man.

Hopefully people can understand what I mean by that: There is a difference between Inkling or Minecraft representation, games that many people are familiar with, over Ridley or K. Rool, which have decent fanbases, but were popularized primarily due to the prospect of being in Smash.

 

[RC-3197]

I'm sorry but the box theory isn't fact, you are basing everything on a placeholder image on amazon. Judging by how secretive Smash Ultimate has been this time around I highly doubt that the artist who created the box would know the entire roster or even the base roster size. Heck, even the announcer for ultimate has gone on record saying that he had to say tons of false names so he wouldn't know who was in the roster. The whole appearance of the box could have come about because of an artistic reason like it could be because the artist simply didn't want 3 empty spaces on one side. Also Vergeben has missed characters before (Richter, Dark Samus, Chrom, and King K Rool) and I'm sure he's going to miss characters again, specifically, echo fighters. We also shouldn't assume the Square Enix representative is DLC simply because we don't know its identity. Hitagi and Vergeben both stated that Square Enix is extremely anti-leak and it makes it extremely hard to pinpoint the identity of the character.
Vergeben's statement on SE leaks:

Cloud never leaked in smash 4, and I would consider it lucky we know there's a square rep at all.
There's absolutely no denying Ken and Incineroar are coming to smash ultimate, however, I highly doubt they will be the last reveals, heck, Ken and Incineroar could even be put in a single trailer in October. Bottom line, we don't know the base roster or even the base roster size so we really shouldn't act like we do.

 

[Luigifan18]

I can imagine big characters like Steve and Sora would go on the back of the box.

And Ridley and K. Rool didn't?

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

I can imagine big characters like Steve and Sora would go on the back of the box.

That sure does sound familiar...I wonder who'd say something like that?

That's fair. The two are both massively popular, and could very well be interchangeable in my scenario. It'd just make more sense to have Sora on the back of the box really.

I feel that both will be in the game after DLC, and if MasterofHyrule is correct, we'll be possibly be seeing both on or close to the base roster.

It's more spitballing than anything, but it ties together most of what we currently know.

• Incineroar and Ken are locks as far as I am, and everyone else should be, concerned.
• Shadow is not only popular and easy to make, but has had multiple mentions from GameXplain's Jon, who has to have some sort of insider info. I know I said the same thing about Mimique, but this dude called Kirby's Epic Yarn 3DS and every Final Fantasy game coming to Switch. Who does that? Someone with insider info. That's who. Of course, he's also sprinkling in falsities so he can pass off his insider info as "predictions," so this one may not be as likely as we think.
• Steve fits with both Vergeben and our most recent leaker, who was corroborated by Vergeben. This one's somewhat of a tossup, but Steve would be huge. I think we severely underestimate just how big it would be if he were to be in Smash Bros.
• We're definitely getting a Square Enix Rep. We know that much. Who is it? No clue. @「Mega Bidoof」made a good point about there potentially being two Square Enix reps, hence why Vergeben has been so tight lipped, because he's hearing two different names: Sora and Geno.

The only thing that could potentially limit this is box theory, but, all you'd have to do is remove Shadow and place Sora and Steve on the back of the box like they did for Snake and Sonic in Brawl and it fits. Sora and Steve being on the back of the box makes sense because both are massive third party characters, and would bring people into the game solely via their inclusion, so it'd make sense to highlight them.

Geno as DLC makes more sense than Sora because Geno is essentially the Mewtwo of this speculation cycle, a character that didn't truly pick up traction until late in the game. You could swap Geno for Sora, but it'd make more sense for Sora to be base roster to draw people in. Either way, they're both in, and Nintendo, Square Enix, and Disney make a lot of money.

Me. That's who.

I wouldn't be surprised if our last reveal was truly one of the most hype of this cycle. I'd say it's either going to be Steve or our SE character, who I believe is Sora for the sake of Box Theory.

Also yes, Sora is a Square Enix rep.

At this point it's like this:

Is Sora a Disney representative?
No Patrick, Sora is not a Disney representative.
No, he is a Square Enix representative.

I'm sorry but the box theory isn't fact, you are basing everything on a placeholder image on amazon. Judging by how secretive Smash Ultimate has been this time around I highly doubt that the artist who created the box would know the entire roster or even the base roster size. Heck, even the announcer for ultimate has gone on record saying that he had to say tons of false names so he wouldn't know who was in the roster. The whole appearance of the box could have come about because of an artistic reason like it could be because the artist simply didn't want 3 empty spaces on one side. Also Vergeben has missed characters before (Richter, Dark Samus, Chrom, and King K Rool) and I'm sure he's going to miss characters again, specifically, echo fighters. We also shouldn't assume the Square Enix representative is DLC simply because we don't know its identity. Hitagi and Vergeben both stated that Square Enix is extremely anti-leak and it makes it extremely hard to pinpoint the identity of the character.
Vergeben's statement on SE leaks:
View attachment 166500Cloud never leaked in smash 4, and I would consider it lucky we know there's a square rep at all.
There's absolutely no denying Ken and Incineroar are coming to smash ultimate, however, I highly doubt they will be the last reveals, heck, Ken and Incineroar could even be put in a single trailer in October. Bottom line, we don't know the base roster or even the base roster size so we really shouldn't act like we do.

To be fair, no DLC leaked outside of Roy and Ryu who were leaked because of datamining, and nothing else.

And Ridley and K. Rool didn't?

Have you seen the box?

Ridley and K. Rool are on the side lol.

 

[TheCJBrine]

And Ridley and K. Rool didn't?

It seems to be reserved for third-parties, i.e. Snake and Sonic on the back of Brawl's game case.

That sure does sound familiar...I wonder who'd say something like that?

That sure does sound familiar...I wonder who'd say something like that?


That sure does sound familiar...I wonder who'd say something like that?

Me. That's who.

I wouldn't be surprised if our last reveal was truly one of the most hype of this cycle. I'd say it's either going to be Steve or our SE character, who I believe is Sora for the sake of Box Theory.

Ah; forgive me. I just thought about it while thinking of box theory.

 

[Luigi The President]

Well of course, I get that. But we also have to remember that outside of the Smash fanbase, Geno, Isaac, Elma, BWD, and many many others are in the same boat. If we are honest with ourselves, they are on the level of a Shulk reveal in the end, as nobody outside of the Smash or their respective game fanbases will inherently care about those characters. Hell, Ridley and K. Rool are notable for being Smash related requests, not because of their games.

I think we have to remember that, hype IS subjective. Ridley and K. Rool are only as big as they are now because of the 10 years of hype surrounding them, not because they are these immensely popular characters like Cloud or Mega-Man.

This is why I can still expect many of the characters people want, because they are fan-level picks now, not these extremely iconic sets of characters like Mega-man or Snake or Pac-man.

Wouldn't really place Geno there if I were you, as you go on to state Ridley and K. Rool are notable due to their requests. Geno's existence is basically defined by how badly people have wanted him in Smash for a decade. But, I'm biased, so.

 

[dezeray112]

I wonder how internet reactions would be if Incineroar was the last non-echo newcomer?

Probably expect some backlash and salt over Inceniroar's inclusion.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

The minds of the box theory people are going to explode when Shadow gets revealed next month. I'm not even a Shadow fan but I give his inclusion a way higher chance than the box theory.

Seriously, if Shadow isn't in then he's gotta be the character with the most things going for him that still didn't make it in for any Smash game ever. A lot of characters in the past have had dubious proof supporting their inclusion but then didn't make it, but Shadow has like actual things that point heavily towards him being in, it's not Ridley in the clouds stuff we're talking about here.

I'm not saying he's a shoe-in, I only consider Ken as that, but I'd still be shocked if he isn't in.

 

[Shroob]

The minds of the box theory people are going to explode when Shadow gets revealed next month. I'm not even a Shadow fan but I give his inclusion a way higher chance than the box theory.

I still stand by my belief that Shadow isn't getting in.... to the base roster.



I really think they'll save him as sort of a package deal with Tails as a DLC newcomer and Shadow as a DLC Echo.



Like, we have Luigi to Mario, Diddy to Donkey, and now Ken to Ryu, and we're not gonna have Tails to Sonic?

 

[Paperchampion23]

Wouldn't really place Geno there if I were you, as you go on to state Ridley and K. Rool are notable due to their requests. Geno's existence is basically defined by how badly people have wanted him in Smash for a decade. But, I'm biased, so.

Nah you are misunderstanding. I'm saying Geno, Isaac, etc are all still VERY possible as late announcements because they are "fan requested" characters, not "iconic" charcters

Smash tends to reveal "iconic" characters first. Wario, Villager, Mega-Man, Inkling are all huge characters that kids and adults all seem to know. Geno and Isaac have very solid fanbases, but are not nearly as iconic. This I think later reveals could certainly happen for them, even though people talk about how Smash "blows its load" early on.