Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[SnakeFighter64]

I regret bringing this up. We always degenerate into the Steve debate and no one ever brings any new points. The most laughable part is the person who says Steve has “limitless potential”. Which to me says that he has nothing. I get that Minecraft is iconic, and I’ll never argue that. But there are a billion other better characters to use other then Steve. I mean, Terrain manipulation? Seriously? How would that NOT break the balance in half?

 

[Untouch]

I hope Sakurai knows that being able to build a wall or ceiling anywhere on the stage would destroy how the game functions.

 

[osby]

I regret bringing this up. We always degenerate into the Steve debate and no one ever brings any new points. The most laughable part is the person who says Steve has “limitless potential”. Which to me says that he has nothing. I get that Minecraft is iconic, and I’ll never argue that. But there are a billion other better characters to use other then Steve. I mean, Terrain manipulation? Seriously? How would that NOT break the balance in half?

How does Timber or Hydrant don't? Also, I'm tempted to ask you for those billion characters.

 

[Pyra]

I hope Sakurai knows that being able to build a wall or ceiling anywhere on the stage would destroy how the game functions.

i can't wait for a fortnight character

 

[SnakeFighter64]

How does Timber or Hydrant don't?

Timber and Hydrant create one relatively small temporary new element. And you can’t block off areas of the stage with them or erect new walls.

 

[Deleted member]

i can't wait for a fortnight character

I can’t wait for the Dragon Quest Builders rep.

 

[Pyra]

I can’t wait for the Dragon Quest Builders rep.

I think the next 4 characters should just be people from voxel build/craft games tbh

Tbh they should make one starring Joker and then replace the one they're putting in with the voxel one

 

[Untouch]

How does Timber or Hydrant don't?

Both of those attacks can't be placed over the edge of a stage to block recoveries, or be set up in a way to make caves of life.
I think they could make a moveset without the block placing (or just have 1 TNT block or something), but that's it.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

I regret bringing this up. We always degenerate into the Steve debate and no one ever brings any new points. The most laughable part is the person who says Steve has “limitless potential”. Which to me says that he has nothing. I get that Minecraft is iconic, and I’ll never argue that. But there are a billion other better characters to use other then Steve. I mean, Terrain manipulation? Seriously? How would that NOT break the balance in half?

I could easily see the blocks disappear pretty quickly, and maybe even limit the amount of blocks Steve can place at once...
Not too big of a deal...

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Question? How different is Yuri Lowenthal’s performance as Lloyd Irving compared to his performance as Marth? I worry that they might be similar enough to sound weird in Smash together



Timber and Hydrant create one relatively small temporary new element. And you can’t block off areas of the stage with them or erect new walls.

Its bad that it wont matter what voice Yuri does, Ill only be able to hear Yosuke Hanamura from Persona 4

 

[Dee Dude]

Steve discussion huh?

Yeah no I still don’t want him in but I’ll be prepared if he does.

It’s nice to recognize his moveset potential but I just hate this idea of having him in for the sake of appealing to the younger demographic or just because Minecraft is a gaming icon, it’s somehow a free pass for Smash when it’s more then that.

He lacks an appealing design even compared to &and would extremely awkward with janky movements, and even if he was animated normally and fluidly, it would look even weirder.

 

[Pyra]

tbh charizard should be demoted to pokeball and replaced with alolan exeggutor

 

[osby]

Timber and Hydrant create one relatively small temporary new element. And you can’t block off areas of the stage with them or erect new walls.

We are just speculating here. Steve's blocks can easily be temporary like them.

 

[Deleted member]

tbh charizard should be demoted to pokeball and replaced with alolan exeggutor

What do we do to get Darkrai and Gengar playable?

 

[MBRedboy31]

I regret bringing this up. We always degenerate into the Steve debate and no one ever brings any new points. The most laughable part is the person who says Steve has “limitless potential”. Which to me says that he has nothing. I get that Minecraft is iconic, and I’ll never argue that. But there are a billion other better characters to use other then Steve. I mean, Terrain manipulation? Seriously? How would that NOT break the balance in half?

To setup his fortress of blocks and traps, he’d first need to make a bit of space, which would be a bit tough since his mobility is poor so he’d have a bit of a disadvantage in neutral even despite his disjointed attacks. Then, he has to navigate his own created terrain, don’t forget (I’d imagine he’d be able to walk over blocks without jumping to give him a bit of an advantage though,) plus, all of the terrain is destructible, so the opponent can whittle it away with their own projectiles if Steve doesn’t provide enough ranged pressure in return, or they can just fly in with attacks although hitting the blocks does slow them down. I’d imagine the terrain would also break if players are launched into it with enough force, so that it doesn’t prolong stocks for too long.

 

[Just a penguin]

I suppose Steve could manipulate the terrain, but it takes like 5 seconds to destroy one block. Maybe Steve would have to craft a pick axe before he could change the terrain efficiently. Also, Snake’s explosives have him controlling part of the stage. Double also, Piranha Plant can’t move canonically. Therefore, the terrain manipulation can be controlled. Or Sakurai could just ignore this part of Minecraft for the fighter. It may seem drastic, but plenty of Ness’s move can’t be performed by Ness, and Captain Falcon doesn’t even use his vehicle besides his Final Smash.

 

[osby]

Its bad that it wont matter what voice Yuri does, Ill only be able to hear Yosuke Hanamura from Persona 4

Same. Yuri Lowenthal is a good voice actor but he only has one bishie voice.

tbh charizard should be demoted to pokeball and replaced with alolan exeggutor

You said it like a hot take but it's the obvious and objective truth.

 

[Pyra]

We are just speculating here. Steve's blocks can easily be temporary like them.

In fact, I would expect his recovery to be an incredibly temporary noob tower and nothing else
Like, less than a second on screen and every block breaks , and they're all one tapable anyway

What do we do to get Darkrai and Gengar playable?

Darkrai + Jigglypuff best team

 

[Iridium]

Steve would just look weird, but that should not stop him from getting in anyway. He has plenty of moveset potential that would easily make him unique, as I've seen explained here.

And I can make him my personal training punching bag, so that's a plus.

 

[osby]

I suppose Steve could manipulate the terrain, but it takes like 5 seconds to destroy one block. Maybe Steve would have to craft a pick axe before he could change the terrain efficiently. Also, Snake’s explosives have him controlling part of the stage. Double also, Piranha Plant can’t move canonically. Therefore, the terrain manipulation can be controlled. Or Sakurai could just ignore this part of Minecraft for the fighter. It may seem drastic, but plenty of Ness’s move can’t be performed by Ness, and Captain Falcon doesn’t even use his vehicle besides his Final Smash.

Smash 64 obviously had a different design approach to fighters compared to later games, but yeah, "Captain Toad can't jump" kind of arguments are still very weak.

 

[Pyra]

Rabbid Steve Salts the Fandom

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Same. Yuri Lowenthal is a good voice actor but he only has one bishie voice.

I aint complaining really, I love Yosukea voice

 

[Deleted member]

I get tired of the "Game and Watch can work but Steve can't because reasons" thing because I can guarantee 100% no one would ever think an amalgamation of all Game and Watch games would ever work if he had never been in Smash in the first place.
In fact, I get tired of any argument where someone points out how there's a set precedent to make a newcomer work but people just dismiss it with a "no u" type of deal.
"Isabelle can't fight, she's a pacifist! No Villager doesn't count, he has no personality!"

I hope Sakurai knows that being able to build a wall or ceiling anywhere on the stage would destroy how the game functions.

You have never played Rivals of Aether, have you?

 

[Pyra]

I get tired of the "Game and Watch can work but Steve can't because reasons" thing because I can guarantee 100% no one would ever think an amalgamation of all Game and Watch games would ever work if he had never been in Smash in the first place.
In fact, I get tired of any argument where someone points out how there's a set precedent to make a newcomer work but people just dismiss it with a "no u" type of deal.
"Isabelle can't fight, she's a pacifist! No Villager doesn't count, he has no personality!"

You have never played Rivals of Aether, have you?

r i d l e y
i s
t o o
b i g

 

[osby]

r i d l e y
i s
t o o
b i g

He really is, though.

That's why his identical twin brothers RIDLEY is playable, and not him.

 

[Deleted member]

I get tired of the "Game and Watch can work but Steve can't because reasons" thing because I can guarantee 100% no one would ever think an amalgamation of all Game and Watch games would ever work if he had never been in Smash in the first place.
In fact, I get tired of any argument where someone points out how there's a set precedent to make a newcomer work but people just dismiss it with a "no u" type of deal.
"Isabelle can't fight, she's a pacifist! No Villager doesn't count, he has no personality!"

You have never played Rivals of Aether, have you?

Sorry for the off-topic, but this thing has been on my mind the whole day and i need to stop it:

Is your avatar from Zombieland Saga? Should i watch that anime?

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

on the topic of Yuri Lowenthall, here is his best work

 

[Deleted member]

r i d l e y
i s
t o o
b i g

k . r o o l
i s
f o r g o t t e n

on the topic of Yuri Lowenthall, here is his best work

That isn’t Spider-Man PS4.

Don’t kill me.

 

[Untouch]

I get tired of the "Game and Watch can work but Steve can't because reasons" thing because I can guarantee 100% no one would ever think an amalgamation of all Game and Watch games would ever work if he had never been in Smash in the first place.
In fact, I get tired of any argument where someone points out how there's a set precedent to make a newcomer work but people just dismiss it with a "no u" type of deal.
"Isabelle can't fight, she's a pacifist! No Villager doesn't count, he has no personality!"

You have never played Rivals of Aether, have you?

What RoA can build a ceiling of life on the stage anywhere?
I know about the character that can make the wall, but it isn't really the same thing.

(I mean this is ignoring the fact that these two games don't have the same mechanics and can't be compared.)

 

[SnakeFighter64]

I get tired of the "Game and Watch can work but Steve can't because reasons" thing because I can guarantee 100% no one would ever think an amalgamation of all Game and Watch games would ever work if he had never been in Smash in the first place.
In fact, I get tired of any argument where someone points out how there's a set precedent to make a newcomer work but people just dismiss it with a "no u" type of deal.
"Isabelle can't fight, she's a pacifist! No Villager doesn't count, he has no personality!"

You have never played Rivals of Aether, have you?

Fine. I obviously can’t say anything to convince you of my opinion. So f**k it. I’m gonna stop being reasonable and just be frank. Minecraft is BORING. You have no goal or objective you just run around and build stuff for no reason. There is nothing I can get from Minecraft that I can’t do with a pencil and paper and not get a result that’s a billion times better. Steve isn’t a character. He’s ugly and has no design appeal or personality. It’s almost like Mojang designed him as a joke thinking noone would ever see him. I don’t have any idea why that game got popular and an even smaller understanding of why people actually want Steve in Smash. He’s a boring non-character from a boring non-game and I cannot wait for Minecraft to die.

 

[osby]

on the topic of Yuri Lowenthall, here is his best work

Don't let him misinform you, guys. THIS is his best work:

Spoiler: Big P3 spoilers

 

[MSmariosonic]

Fine. I obviously can’t say anything to convince you of my opinion. So f**k it. I’m gonna stop being reasonable and just be frank. Minecraft is BORING. You have no goal or objective you just run around and build stuff for no reason. There is nothing I can get from Minecraft that I can’t do with a pencil and paper and not get a result that’s a billion times better. Steve isn’t a character. He’s ugly and has no design appeal or personality. It’s almost like Mojang designed him as a joke thinking noone would ever see him. I don’t have any idea why that game got popular and an even smaller understanding of why people actually want Steve in Smash. He’s a boring non-character from a boring non-game and I cannot wait for Minecraft to die.

I see a lack of constructive criticism

 

[Idon]

If Yuri Lowenthal wasn't already in the game, I'd nominate Phil Lamarr for being the dainty prince voice:

 

[Deleted member]

He really is, though.

That's why his identical twin brothers RIDLEY is playable, and not him.

I'm pretty sure RIDLEY is just Ridley with a Stand who has forgotten all of his draconic powers which is why he's not so big anymore.

Sorry for the off-topic, but this thing has been on my mind the whole day and i need to stop it:

Is your avatar from Zombieland Saga? Should i watch that anime?

Yes and yes.

What RoA can build a ceiling of life on the stage anywhere?
I know about the character that can make the wall, but it isn't really the same thing.

(I mean this is ignoring the fact that these two games don't have the same mechanics and can't be compared.)

You say that as if Steve HAS to be able to build a ceiling anywhere.
Also, Kragg can pick up a rock that acts as a solid wall(which can also be destroyed to release some projectiles). If put on top of a platform, you'll create a small ceiling.
And unlike his big wall recovery, it can't be destroyed by launching someone with enough force into it so you can indeed creat an infinite wall or ceiling as long as you don't hit it.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Minecraft is BORING. You have no goal or objective

But you do. You mine and craft enough stuff in order to ultimately take on the Ender Dargon...
It even has an ending and credits

 

[Deleted member]

Fine. I obviously can’t say anything to convince you of my opinion. So f**k it. I’m gonna stop being reasonable and just be frank. Minecraft is BORING. You have no goal or objective you just run around and build stuff for no reason. There is nothing I can get from Minecraft that I can’t do with a pencil and paper and not get a result that’s a billion times better. Steve isn’t a character. He’s ugly and has no design appeal or personality. It’s almost like Mojang designed him as a joke thinking noone would ever see him. I don’t have any idea why that game got popular and an even smaller understanding of why people actually want Steve in Smash. He’s a boring non-character from a boring non-game and I cannot wait for Minecraft to die.

So you admit the reason you don't want Steve in is purely personal and without reason simply because you hate a game SO much and any attempts to argue him out were you pretending to be reasonable so now you decided to take the sheep's clothing and just ne a ***** about it? Asking for a friend.

 

[osby]

Fine. I obviously can’t say anything to convince you of my opinion. So f**k it. I’m gonna stop being reasonable and just be frank. Minecraft is BORING. You have no goal or objective you just run around and build stuff for no reason. There is nothing I can get from Minecraft that I can’t do with a pencil and paper and not get a result that’s a billion times better. Steve isn’t a character. He’s ugly and has no design appeal or personality. It’s almost like Mojang designed him as a joke thinking noone would ever see him. I don’t have any idea why that game got popular and an even smaller understanding of why people actually want Steve in Smash. He’s a boring non-character from a boring non-game

Spoiler

I cannot wait for Minecraft to die.

Good luck with that.

 

[Idon]

Fine. I obviously can’t say anything to convince you of my opinion. So f**k it. I’m gonna stop being reasonable and just be frank. Minecraft is BORING. You have no goal or objective you just run around and build stuff for no reason. There is nothing I can get from Minecraft that I can’t do with a pencil and paper and not get a result that’s a billion times better. Steve isn’t a character. He’s ugly and has no design appeal or personality. It’s almost like Mojang designed him as a joke thinking noone would ever see him. I don’t have any idea why that game got popular and an even smaller understanding of why people actually want Steve in Smash. He’s a boring non-character from a boring non-game and I cannot wait for Minecraft to die.

It's just legos.
The same reason people like legoes is the same reason people like Minecraft.
Benefit is, you can see explore what you built and you don't have to buy every single brick.

 

[Dee Dude]

The scariest thing about Steve that he is such a character Sakurai would absolutely pick out of personal preference when it comes to newcomers.

He’s a Minecraft fan and would want to get creative with his moveset potential.

 

[Deleted member]

It's just legos.
The same reason people like legoes is the same reason people like Minecraft.
Benefit is, you can see explore what you built and you don't have to buy every single brick.

Tbf, LEGO Worlds is literally more LEGO than Minecraft.