Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Cutie Gwen]

Every time I remember we don't have Telda Tetra I get a little upset.
I know we just got a few pirates of different persuasions but that only makes me want more

Tetra's final smash is her ripping off Guilty Gear and using May's instakill from Xrd

 

[Deleted member]

Every time I remember we don't have Telda Tetra I get a little upset.
I know we just got a few pirates of different persuasions but that only makes me want more

I just want someone from Zelda. TBH my biggest pet peeve with the newcomers in this game is that Zelda still didn't get someone new when there are a bunch of perfectly good options.

 

[Bionichute]

Every time I remember we don't have Telda Tetra I get a little upset.
I know we just got a few pirates of different persuasions but that only makes me want more

we need three of each of the triforce pieces. put in tetra and then put in toon ganondorf and blue pig ganon

 

[Pakky]

I just want someone from Zelda. TBH my biggest pet peeve with the newcomers in this game is that Zelda still didn't get someone new when there are a bunch of perfectly good options.

I would like a combo of all Impas but make her thick with Skyward sword's outfit as a base of the design.

 

[Pyra]

Tetra's final smash is her ripping off Guilty Gear and using May's instakill from Xrd

I would unironically love and expect this

I just want someone from Zelda. TBH my biggest pet peeve with the newcomers in this game is that Zelda still didn't get someone new when there are a bunch of perfectly good options.

I was kinda hoping Yink would have been changed a bit more to at least do SOMETHING MM related and make him feel like a newish character but... nah
Maybe next time fellas
(Or, maybe even DLC Linebeck. Who knows? )

we need three of each of the triforce pieces. put in tetra and then put in toon ganondorf and blue pig ganon

Tanondorf* would be cool. I'd be totally down for either him or HW Ganondorf. (Smaller) Beast Ganon is a given, though.
If we have three of each, then we can make like... three separate triforces...

*: Ganondorf, Toon Ganondorf (Tanondorf), Young Ganondorf (Yanondorf); Zelda, Toon Zelda (Te...tra), Young Zelda (Yellda)

 

[DrCoeloCephalo]

basically every clone character could have something more unique going for them if time allowed, and that doesn't just mean the usual talking points like ganondorf and dark samus, this goes for all the fire emblems, the links, and daisy. i think the only one exempt from this is ken because he's already pretty different from ryu

its okay to be disappointed over how a character is portrayed in smash, its a video game with a lot of flaws, ignoring those flaws isn't a healthy way to view it as art

Remember those postings that have been going around that Daisy factually has all the same features and mechanics to every single one of her moves as Peach? Assuming that that's true, you'd think the Daisy fans that have dedicated their lives to the ideal that Daisy is her own unique character completely different and separate from Peach would be noticably upset that the developers literally made their "unique and different character" a palette and voice swap and advertised it as its own character.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

nah he's a different character but he basically just uses link's moveset with some tweaks to make him play differently. its a personal thing i guess but i never really saw him as a 100% new zelda characters, of which we could have had a number of after 3 games

meanwhile pokemon has gotten 6 100% new characters for three games

You're really under estimating Pokemon's impact

The popularity it has is insane...
Pokemon is the biggest media franchise in the world... Even beating the likes of Star Wars, Harry Potter, Winnie the Pooh, and even Mickey Mouse
If you walk into a store, you are bound to see at least one piece of Pokemon merch
And that Detective Pikachu trailer that dropped last month, had views on pair of that of the Lion King remake, having a good 50 million views...
And that's not even mentioning the insanity that was Pokemon Go
Pokemon is huge and it's massive success deserves all of the newcomers it gets

I'm sorry, Zelda is big and all, but comparing it to Pokemon, is like comparing three big slices of cake, to a whole entire cake...
Also, there are like 800 Pokemon, so there's lot's of moveset potential. Having 10 characters is barely even scratching the surface

 

[Bionichute]

can i just say that toon link (in brawl) felt like sakurai just played the first hour of wind waker and then went "yeah i got it". why do two of his victory animations in that game involve pigs. that's not even a part of the game most people remember

also sakurai is a coward for not putting in pig ganon yet

 

[Pakky]

So just be clear how were Decideye and lycanroc better choices than ?

I keep thinking about the old arguments and I still don't get it.

 

[Iridium]

It would've been cool if had a victory animation where he randomly falls from the sky to stab the ground before jumping back, similarly to a certain scene we all remember.

 

[Saetanigera]

I like the idea of Smash becoming a "Gaming All Stars" type of crossover.

Saber-visual novels
kerrigan-rts
diablo-dungeon crawler
tracer/cheif-fps
Arthas-mmorpg

Can anyone think of better reps for these genres?

 

[Pyra]

So just be clear how were Decideye and lycanroc better choices than ?

I still really want Decidueye but I mean after playing as cat for a little bit I kinda wouldn't replace him with anyone at all
Kinda needed a character like this in the game somehow

A character who's personality is so strong that he taunts for me when I land a Smash attack

 

[Wademan94]

can i just say that toon link (in brawl) felt like sakurai just played the first hour of wind waker and then went "yeah i got it". why do two of his victory animations in that game involve pigs. that's not even a part of the game most people remember

also sakurai is a coward for not putting in pig ganon yet

You know I’ve actually was just thinking about the potential of pig Ganon in Smash

 

[Bionichute]

I'm sorry, Zelda is big and all, but comparing it to Pokemon, is like comparing three big slices of cake, to a whole entire cake...

i didn't say it wasn't, i just like zelda more than pokemon

So just be clear how were Decideye and lycanroc better choices than ?

they weren't, but mimikyu and necrozma were the only two superior choices to incineroar

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Saber-visual novels
kerrigan-rts
diablo-dungeon crawler
tracer/cheif-fps
Arthas-mmorpg

Can anyone think of better reps for these genres?

Pheonix Wright for virtual novels and Doomguy for FPS perhaps?

 

[Pakky]

i didn't say it wasn't, i just like zelda more than pokemon

they weren't, but mimikyu and necrozma were the only two superior choices to incineroar

Now that's a conversation.
Don't mind it as a Pokeball now that the sting has worn off.

However I think that would have a very unique newcomer due to the disguise ability that it has in the games.

 

[Pyra]

they weren't, but mimikyu and necrozma were the only two superior choices to incineroar

Necrozma... eeeeh.

And Mimikyu is probably my favorite Gen 7 Pokemon, but I think (and I thought back then) that he's perfect as a Pokeball.


You know who I'd replace Incineroar with if I could pick anyone?
Buzzwole. Could keep the ****-you-im-awesome personality but also be a jojo mosquito

 

[Bionichute]

Saber-visual novels
kerrigan-rts
diablo-dungeon crawler
tracer/cheif-fps
Arthas-mmorpg

Can anyone think of better reps for these genres?

ayumi tachibana, a rabbid, the guy from nintendoji, samus is already in the game, and a tenno from warframe

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

Saber-visual novels
kerrigan-rts
diablo-dungeon crawler
tracer/cheif-fps
Arthas-mmorpg

Can anyone think of better reps for these genres?

Phoenix Wright would be representing two genres. Adventure and Visual Novel. He'd definitely be the superior pick for multiple reasons.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

they weren't, but mimikyu and necrozma were the only two superior choices to incineroar

I was a huge Mimikyu supporter before he got deconfirmed (Though in retrospect, he did fit better as a Pokeball). Funnily enough, my next choice was Incineroar

 

[DrCoeloCephalo]

So just be clear how were Decideye and lycanroc better choices than ?

I'd personally take a good number of Pokemon over more Starter garbage mons but I know I don't speak for every Pokemon fan.

 

[Saetanigera]

in what way can you incorporate iron boots into a moveset

toggled weight/speed and a nasty meteor spike

 

[ClaTheBae]

Saber-visual novels
kerrigan-rts
diablo-dungeon crawler
tracer/cheif-fps
Arthas-mmorpg

Can anyone think of better reps for these genres?

I know this has been debated countless times, but the sexual orgins of saber would probably prevent her from getting in. That being said, she is the most iconic character from a VN so idk

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

That being said, she is the most iconic character from a VN

Highly debatable. And objectionable at that.

 

[Pakky]

I'd personally take a good number of Pokemon over more Starter garbage mons but I know I don't speak for every Pokemon fan.

Explain, please.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I know this has been debated countless times, but the sexual orgins of saber would probably prevent her from getting in. That being said, she is the most iconic character from a VN so idk

Nintendo paid people in the porn industry to cosplay as Bayonetta to promote Bayonetta 2. I don't think they care

 

[Bionichute]

Explain, please.

starters are the obvious lazy choice for pokemon reps when there are actually just better mascot pokemon from each generation

 

[Wademan94]

they weren't, but mimikyu and necrozma were the only two superior choices to incineroar

I dunno, I kinda think this guy would look a little awkward moving around on a 2D plane.

 

[Pyra]

Pheonix Wright for visual novels and Doomguy for FPS perhaps?

Yeah I think if we were gonna have a FPS rep I'd rather it be Doomguy over Master Chief.
Turns out, for me, chief isn't it, chief.

I will blindly accept Phoenix in any game ever though

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Flaws in the game are subjective. We may want characters that are more “accurate” to their origins, but that doesn’t always lend itself to good game design.

Mario has had F.L.U.D.D for 3 games now. Players have grown accustomed to the playstyle and utility that the move offers. I have seen character speculators argue for replacing the down b with Cappy, but that simply isn’t good game design to do that. What utility does Cappy give Mario aside from, “Wow! Nice Odyssey reference!”

Similarly, Toon Link just bringing in items from Wind Waker shows off more of the origin but...what about the game design? Making him a clone of somebody else (even if it’s not serious, I will entertain it) makes him less like a Link or Hero of Hyrule, and more of a Dedede, completely unfitting for the character.

Ganondorf, while not using “spells”, I believe does fit his origin to a degree, as least far better than he used to. While he isn’t a wizard or mage like Robin, he uses dark magic in his attacks, strength he has shown in other Zelda titles. There’s also the fact that I have yet to see an idea for Dead Man’s Volley that works or works well aside from “give him a projectile”. There’s also the fact that he’s actually a force to be reckoned with if they player is good with him.

Characters should only be heavily changed if their bad game design dictates it. Changing characters because of representation is a bad idea for game design. Fighting games like Mortal Kombat or Street Fighter don’t necessarily change things (it’s not a mascot fighter but it still relates) because then the people who play are then unfamiliar with a playstyle they’ve been used to for years.

As a Mario player, I would be pissed if they removed FLUDD and put Cappy in unless is allowed for similar utility. But even then, how would the Cappy move even stay true to the material? If they give you power over your opponent, like an accurate representation of Cappy would, it would be OP as hell and not good game design.

While I get what some people are talking about to an extent, the representation of characters so far as excellent, and far better than it could have been. Add in the fact that echo fighters were made solely because they required less time, and I don’t really know that the complaints are founded again, because of game design.

It always comes down to game design over representation. It doesn’t mean characters should do things they aren’t known for, but the team has never done that anyway. Characters have largely stayed familiar to their own characteristics in Smash.

 

[osby]

I know this has been debated countless times, but the sexual orgins of saber would probably prevent her from getting in. That being said, she is the most iconic character from a VN so idk

I don't wanna point to Bayonetta, but I think it'd be okay.

I'd personally take a good number of Pokemon over more Starter garbage mons but I know I don't speak for every Pokemon fan.

You speak for nobody except yourself.

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

Nintendo paid people in the porn industry to cosplay as Bayonetta to promote Bayonetta 2. I don't think they care

I dunno. You don't see them pursuing the Bowsette gravy train like people were expecting them to. lol

 

[Bionichute]

I dunno, I kinda think this guy would look a little awkward moving around on a 2D plane.

you

you know he's from one of the 3d pokemon games right

 

[Pyra]

As a Mario player, I would be pissed if they removed FLUDD and put Cappy in unless is allowed for similar utility. But even then, how would the Cappy move even stay true to the material? If they give you power over your opponent, like an accurate representation of Cappy would, it would be OP as hell and not good game design.

Instead of a wet windbox, maybe cappy could be a small windbox while spinning, and give mario some situational movement options (free jump when he touches cappy mid spin, etc).

We should just put Cappy in as his own character. Or a Kirby echo

 

[osby]

Nintendo paid people in the porn industry to cosplay as Bayonetta to promote Bayonetta 2. I don't think they care

I want to ask, but I'm also scared.

starters are the obvious lazy choice for pokemon reps when there are actually just better mascot pokemon from each generation

Yeah, they should have make Psyduck playable, Pikachu was a lazy choice.

 

[DrCoeloCephalo]

Explain, please.

Starter monsters are generally overrated. The only reason they have any place in a story playthrough of Pokemon is because they tend to limit options of other mons of similar or better utility so much in early game and because Pokemon itself is built to be so easy that any low tier trash monster can just solo the game. They just get extra publicity from being your first option.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I dunno. You don't see them pursuing the Bowsette gravy train like people were expecting them to. lol

I mean Nintendo's Bowsette design is very different after all

 

[Wademan94]

you

you know he's from one of the 3d pokemon games right

Yes, I was trying to say I think he’d look awkward moving around in Smash’s 2D plane

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

I mean Nintendo's Bowsette design is very different after all

Yeah, but still, it'll sell. Given the popularity of the trend.

 

[ClaTheBae]

I don't wanna point to Bayonetta, but I think it'd be okay.



You speak for nobody except yourself.

Well bayonetta is sexual, but she never was shown performing actual intercourse in her games to my knowledge.

Nintendo paid people in the porn industry to cosplay as Bayonetta to promote Bayonetta 2. I don't think they care

well I mean if you're choosing realistic bayonetta cosplayers then who are your other options