Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[NintenZ]

I am calm.


That makes no sense. We got Cloud into Smash, but it's gonna be hard to keep Cloud in Smash, because it was hard to get Cloud in Smash.

See what I mean with you making assumptions? You're assuming it was hard to get Cloud in Smash and now you're assuming that for some reason Square suddenly doesn't want Cloud in Smash.

I'm not being aggressive, dude. I'm asking you to qualify you're weird assumptions.


That doesn't prove anything. You're proposal is that Square doesn't want Cloud in Super Smash Bros suddenly for no reason.

Like if there's a contract or whatever, I seriously doubt they have to renegotiate just because they are bringing the game to a new console.


He literally said that Rayman is more likely because he's easier to negotiate than other third parties.

That’s really not what I’m saying at all... I’m just saying that it might be hard for Cloud to come back due to legal issues, getting him in as DLC was likely easier due to there being a bit more time to plan out and make a deal like this, but when planning for the main game situations like this become a bit tighter because both sides have to be on board from the beginning. And with the assumption part... Part of speculation is to make educated assumptions, I’m just gathering the evidence I can find. And also with the whole thing with them “having to renegotiate because the game is coming to another console”, we still don’t know if it’s a port or a new game yet so that point isn’t valid yet, if it was a port then I’d say he’s safe, if it’s a new game, I’m uncertain due to licensing and production costs. Also I didn’t mean you were being aggressive, you were just kind of looking a little too deep is all.

 

[Superyoshiom]

I does not surprise me that the number of third parties seems fairly large, at least in terms of newcomers. Newcomers do take up a larger portion of the minds of people, and we got a larger percentage of third party newcomers this time arround.

Brawl has 16 newcomers (being generous here counting Trainer as one person), with 2 third parties. 2/16= 12.5%

Smash for had 21 newcomers (again being generous, counting each MIi as a separate character), with 5 being third party. 5/21 = aprox. 23.8%.

Both of those are the most generous in giving third parties the lowest discrepancy, and shifting either of them would mean the percentage of third parties doubled.

This brings up an interesting point; How many characters do you expect this time around, and out of those, how many of those do you think will be third parties? What do you think a good percentage of newcomer third parties is?

There are only 6 I really want/expect:

1) Inkling (there already)
2) Spring Man (or any arms characer)
3) Bandanna Dee
4) Rex and Pyra
5) Decidueye (or some new Pokemon character)
6) Some Fire Emblem character (because it's gonna happen, and there will be salt)

And if we just get these 6, with heavy moveset tweaks on the veterans, I'd be fine. The lack of newcomers would be a little sad, but if they really focus on changing up movesets and mechanics, and adding good single-player content, I'd be happy.

 

[Polan]

Cloud is in a pretty tough spot though since Sakurai said that he was almost impossible.

Since you didn't even post a source, I decided to go look this up.

Sakurai: This isn’t an exact number, but among the requests for a Final Fantasy character to appear in Smash, around ¼ to ⅓ of the requests we got from fans were for Cloud. I really wanted to answer the desires of those fans, and even though I thought it would be impossible, I reached out anyway, just to try.

He thought it was impossible, he never actually said that getting Cloud was difficult or impossible. In fact reading through that Sakurai/Nomura interview, it seems that Sakurai didn't have that much difficulty getting Squeenix to agree to Cloud in Smash.

 

[Superyoshiom]

That’s really not what I’m saying at all... I’m just saying that it might be hard for Cloud to come back due to legal issues, getting him in as DLC was likely easier due to there being a bit more time to plan out and make a deal like this, but when planning for the main game situations like this become a bit tighter because both sides have to be on board from the beginning. And with the assumption part... Part of speculation is to make educated assumptions, I’m just gathering the evidence I can find. And also with the whole thing with them “having to renegotiate because the game is coming to another console”, we still don’t know if it’s a port or a new game yet so that point isn’t valid yet, if it was a port then I’d say he’s safe, if it’s a new game, I’m uncertain due to licensing and production costs. Also I didn’t mean you were being aggressive, you were just kind of looking a little too deep is all.

I can definitely agree with you to an extent, especially considering Bayonetta, who was the last character added, was given tons of content. I don't think Square Enix is averse to giving Nintendo their characters, and they've shown lots of support to the Switch, so hopefully it'll be a little easier to get cloud back (with more final fantasy content please).

 

[Jak_spoon]

If we got a fire emblem character or better yet two more fire emblem characters this game I’m pretty sure after their reveal I would start every sentence with **** sakurai.

My wife would ask how my day was and I’d be like ****ing sakurai ruined it again.

 

[Superyoshiom]

If we got a fire emblem character or better yet two more fire emblem characters this game I’m pretty sure after their reveal I would start every sentence with **** sakurai.

My wife would ask how my day was and I’d be like ****ing sakurai ruined it again.

I know turning characters into alts is a controversial topic here, but if Lucina, and maybe even Roy (though I think his playstyle is unique enough to warrant a spot), became an alt for marth, we could add a new fe character, or a popular one like Lyn.

On one hand the FE problem is pretty bad, but it's more reasonable to deal with when you see that 1/3 of them are clones.

 

[NintenZ]

There are only 6 I really want/expect:

1) Inkling (there already)
2) Spring Man (or any arms characer)
3) Bandanna Dee
4) Rex and Pyra
5) Decidueye (or some new Pokemon character)
6) Some Fire Emblem character (because it's gonna happen, and there will be salt)

And if we just get these 6, with heavy moveset tweaks on the veterans, I'd be fine. The lack of newcomers would be a little sad, but if they really focus on changing up movesets and mechanics, and adding good single-player content, I'd be happy.

A lot of people are expecting an ARMS character in the base game but I don’t really think that one will get in the base roster due to the project plan likely being decided before the game’s development was mostly finalized, however I believe that a character is a lock for DLC.

 

[Superyoshiom]

A lot of people are expecting an ARMS character in the base game but I don’t really think that one will get in the base roster due to the project plan likely being decided before the game’s development was mostly finalized, however I believe that a character is a lock for DLC.

Are you getting that idea from the Source gaming thing? Because ever since the Japan Time episode which covered it, that seems to be a common argument against a character.

I understand your point, but on the other hand I wouldn't rule it out of the question. Even without knowing how it'd perform, Arms was marketed as a core switch title for its first year. The team behind mario kart was also handling it, so it was likely a big name project even during the development phase. It's not 100% for sure, but it's likely Sakurai could have found the concept unique enough to make a character out of.

 

[NintenZ]

Are you getting that idea from the Source gaming thing? Because ever since the Japan Time episode which covered it, that seems to be a common argument against a character.

I understand your point, but on the other hand I wouldn't rule it out of the question. Even without knowing how it'd perform, Arms was marketed as a core switch title for its first year. The team behind mario kart was also handling it, so it was likely a big name project even during the development phase. It's not 100% for sure, but it's likely Sakurai could have found the concept unique enough to make a character out of.

I think it also has to do with it not exactly having it’s demographic clear at the time as well as them it knowing how the game would perform l, it was still in a very early stage at the time but you know who knows, maybe they did plan ahead.

 

[kylexv]

Since y'all are posting rosters I might as well. Keep in mind this is pretty much 99% predictions and doesn't necessarily reflect my desires:

Newcomers:

Waluigi: Since the Mario series is such a huge series, I feel that one character from it will be added to the new installment. I ended up choosing Waluigi mostly because he could represent the Mario spinoffs, as he came from a Mario spinoff himself, and because we need the Wario brothers to fight the Mario brothers (this is where my 1% wishlist comes in...)

Dixie: Sakurai probably saw the ballot. He knows how popular K. Rool and Dixie are. That is why I feel a DK newcomer is likely. However, whether it is K. Rool or Dixie is totally up to chance. I feel that Dixie is slightly more likely, as she may have been considered for Brawl at some point and Sakurai might want to revisit to the idea.

Impa: The Zelda series hasn't had a notable new character since Melee, which was almost two decades ago. Impa is probably the most likely choice here, as she is one of the only recurring characters in the series (others than the bearers of the Triforce, of course).

Sylux: This one's a weird one. I just don't see Sakurai putting Ridley into the game as a playable character at this point, as he would be pretty off-putting if he were simply resized. I feel a character like Sylux is just a bit more likely, as he seems to be teased to have a pretty prominent role in Metroid Prime 4. This is probably the boldest prediction on my roster, in my opinion.

Bandanna Waddle Dee: HAL has been pushing him very hard lately, so I wouldn't be surprised to see him playable. Also, he would be the first spear user in the game, which helps him chances of standing out.

Mimikyu: Everyone seems to be on the Decidueye boat. However, at least according to some surveys, he's not as popular as a new Pokemon like Mimikyu. In fact, Mimikyu has appeared in a lot of Pokemon merchandise recently, showing that Game Freak wants to push Mimikyu's popularity. Of course, the decision of a Pokemon character is only partially up to Game Freak, so we will never know until a new Pokemon is actually revealed.

Rex and Pyra: These two provide a concept that Smash hasn't really explored yet. Also, this game seems to be more popular than the first game, so I wouldn't be surprised to see these two in the game.

Takamaru: This is a character Sakurai has wanted in the game for a long time. I feel this is finally his chance.

Inklings: Already confirmed, but they were expected by literally everyone.

Spring Man: Extendable arms provide for a unique moveset. Also, Spring Man represents a new Switch IP.

Rayman: After seeing the Rayman trophy in Smash 4 and Mario and Rabbids becoming a thing, it's clear that Nintendo and Ubisoft are quite willing to work with each other.

Steve: I can already hear it now, the stampede of hate comments. But, as much as I hate to admit it, Minecraft (and Steve for that matter) are immensely popular. Plus, this is a great opportunity to represent a modern gaming icon and indie titles at the same time.

 

[Superyoshiom]

Steve: I can already hear it now, the stampede of hate comments. But, as much as I hate to admit it, Minecraft (and Steve for that matter) are immensely popular. Plus, this is a great opportunity to represent a modern gaming icon and indie titles at the same time.

The fact that Steve is actually likely makes me hate the idea even more.

 

[blackghost]

That was not the reason Little Mac got it. Little Mac's model is not even the same as his assist trophy. Just because they have a model doesn't mean they are going to get in.

His model may not be the same but his moves are reused in smash 4. Its just something to consider. Time to develop characters being reduced is a practical reason to add these characters

 

[Jak_spoon]

Since y'all are posting rosters I might as well. Keep in mind this is pretty much 99% predictions and doesn't necessarily reflect my desires:
View attachment 140887

Newcomers:

Takamaru: This is a character Sakurai has wanted in the game for a long time. I feel this is finally his chance.

So I have been thinking a lot about Takamaru and I’ve come to the conclusion that I don’t think he will ever make it in. He’s too Japanese and because of that I believe Sakurai has a genuine fear of his inclusion. And it’s not unfounded. Japan is now in a world where their games don’t sell like they used to. Western sales for Japanese games make only a crazy percent like around 5-10% for their games. That’s why we’re seeing crazy changes in series like final fantasy who are trying to find a way to appeal their western audience. Source gaming translated an article where sakurai talks about this. I feel he doesn’t want Smash to get lost because it is too Japanese which is why he really hesitates to put in characters from Japanese only games.

Edit: I think the next step for Takamaru will be a stage

 

[NintenRob]

I don't Steve will get in because I I think Sakurai would feel he wouldn't be able to capture him well. Smash Bros is complicated game and Steve is not a complicated character. His whole model is made up of just 6 blocks. I think the arms may bend when firing a bow but would you really be able to make a moveset that looks right and also has clear hit boxes. If you look at mods, they just don't look right anymore.

That said, I wouldn't mind a Minecraft stage.

 

[Pakky]

2nd attempt with detailed reasoning

Captain Toad/ Toadette: Have their own game, were in Odyssey and are coming to the Switch.

Pauline: Just like Rosalina it doesn't take a whole lot and she's had WAY more pushes that Rosalina, Mario vs DK anyone?

Dixe: she's Dixie

Cranky: Wishful thinking but he is the original DK and was in TF

Funky: Has been in DKC and is the new push for TF

Rool: That Mii costume tells me they know, otherwise why even put it in?

Impa: Pushed in SWS pushed in HW, she's been around A lot so between her and Tingle I choose her.

Toon Zelda/ Tetra: Either or really both of them can have unique sets really

Ridley: The framework was in the last game it's there. I put him over everyone else Prime 4 could color my mind though

Ashely: Assist Trophy

Captain S: Former villain and most recent character in the Wario Land series whom might come back if that new Wario Land Rumor is real.

BWD: Has been in a ton of games and is the only wielder of the spear ability in Star Allies

Marx: Reoccuring Boss and playable character in Star Allies

Greninja's return and Lucario's absence: I'm a firm believer in this 6 pokemon to a roster thing since it keeps happening either due to happenstance or not. That being said let's talk about Battle Bond the ability Greninja got in gen 7. Now what's so important about it? Well, there's nothing like it, and that's the problem. Mega Evolution gives a pokemon a 100 point boost to their base stat total, however Battle Bond gives Greninja a 110 boost. Not only that but it increases the power of Water Shuriken its signature move, and makes sure that it will hit three times. Nothing else in the game is quite like this, my question is why? Why wasn't Lucario given something special, given all the exposure it's had, heck it doesn't even get a new ability upon mega evolving it gets adaptability which is what Beedrill gets. No unique aura related ability, nothing. So as far as gen 7 is concerned I think Greninja is your 7th gen rep and there will be news one way or another on gen 8.


Porky: the Main bad guy in 2 and 3

Plasma Wraith: Kind of is the main bad guy in the Pikmin series this is just its most powerful form

King Hippo: Fun choice, the most recognizable boxer from Punch Out, unlikely though

Rex & Pyra: Unless I get some proof, they're in.

ARMS characters: Springman and Ribbion girl are assured but here's the thing. ARMS probably needs to be in the next trailer otherwise what was said is most likely pointing towards them being added later. I think they're in because this most likely has been in development for a WHILE so yeah but there's no telling. Also the other two Max Brass and Dr. Cyole are the other two MOST important characters in the game, one being the Commissioner of the ARMS league and the other being the sort of villain figure who's responsible for a lot of things happening in the game as well as some of the equipment (The masks I think) that the fighters wear as well as being the final boss and making the final-final boss and being able to wear said final boss without issue since she made it.

Isabelle: Kind of has her own game with Happy Home designer so, eh?

Deathborn: The SUPER bad guy of F-Zero give him Ganon's set.

FE: Look man I don't know about this series take the most recent ones and shove em in there.

DJ O: Don't know how he would work but he's not very huge or awkward.

Viridi: Costume, has a shot in my eyes

Medusa: Old school villan

Hades: Really good final villan

Slippy: Is the most famous out of the four and has his own side game with Zero.

Travis: Been there since the Wii, charging his sword might be a problem but that's really it.

Labo: I believe in Labo man

Eggman: makes sense if more 3rd parties get second reps

Geno: Costume, has a shot.

Ivy: Just based on that she's popular and i find her most interesting that Nightmare who at this point would just kind of be Cloud or what Ganon turns into hopefully. Yeah, we don't have a whip user so she's cool in my book.

Crash: One of the last two legends from the 90s

Spyro: Where ever one goes the other follows.

Bomber man: Its Bomber man! Was one of the first games on the Switch.

Shovel Knight: Modern classic with a whole lot of pull and Amiibos

Rayman: Popular character that was a trophy and given a lot of traffic thanks to Smashified

Rabbid Mario: Kingdom Battle exists and its good.

Steve: The biggest thing in gaming in the last decade.

 

[JamesDNaux]

Why does anyone even give Minecraft the time of day?

It's on Nintendo consoles? So are thousands of other series.

It sold a lot? Well Steve better get in line, because some rando soldier from CoD, a GTA protagonist, a Sim, a Tetris Block, and a Need for Speed racer all come from series with more sales. And yes, they've all had games on Nintendo consoles before.

Not to mention Minecraft is owned by Microsoft. Why does anyone think Steve is suddenly plausible, let alone likely?

 

[Pakky]

Why does anyone even give Minecraft the time of day?

It's on Nintendo consoles? So are thousands of other series.

It sold a lot? Well Steve better get in line, because some rando soldier from CoD, a GTA protagonist, a Sim, a Tetris Block, and a Need for Speed racer all come from series with more sales. And yes, they've all had games on Nintendo consoles before.

Not to mention Minecraft is owned by Microsoft. Why does anyone think Steve is suddenly plausible, let alone likely?

- On Nintendo consoles

- On sales things get uneven

- Something more recent

 

[JamesDNaux]

- On Nintendo consoles

It's on Nintendo consoles? So are thousands of other series.

And?

- On sales things get uneven

Uneven how?

Besides, the point was that there are other series above Minecraft in sales, and no one ever mentions them for Smash.
Outside of joking about a Tetris block.

 

[Retroend]

as long as sakurai puts my 3 most wanted characters ridley, isaac, and king k rool, i wont care what the final roster will look like.

 

[Pakky]

And?

Uneven how?

Besides, the point was that there are other series above Minecraft in sales, and no one ever mentions them for Smash.
Outside of joking about a Tetris block.

Alright well, we'll see.

 

[Jak_spoon]

as long as sakurai puts my 3 most wanted characters ridley, isaac, and king k rool, i wont care what the final roster will look like.

If those were even the the only characters added I would be fine with the roster.

I want Isaac so bad it hurts

 

[Staarih]

Not to mention Minecraft is owned by Microsoft. Why does anyone think Steve is suddenly plausible, let alone likely?

I dunno how well those other games did on Nintendo platforms (bar Tetris) but Minecraft has apparently been a goldmine (like on every platform I assume lol) with the Wii U version of all things likely being over 1m (with 500k in Japan only) and also supported with Mario content with the Mario pack. The Switch and 3DS versions are probably doing just as well. Minecraft has also become a huge thing, almost an icon in itself in modern gaming, unlike many other games. So with all these combined I see why some think Steve or anything Minecraft could get in Smash. I, personally, am indifferent.

 

[SoccerStar9001]

If Nintendo is actually going to bargain with Microsoft, I'd rather they get Banjo instead of Steve.

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

This brings up an interesting point; How many characters do you expect this time around, and out of those, how many of those do you think will be third parties? What do you think a good percentage of newcomer third parties is?

Number of characters? Including DLC/updates, somewhere in the 70-80 range is my guess.

Third parties? That's a pretty tough call. Smash 4 saw a tripled increase in third parties compared to Brawl, so we don't know what could happen. Even if all of them don't return, I'm betting on getting more third parties in the roster. How many? I think we could get two or three, leading up to a total of nine at most. If we consider a 75-character roster with nine characters as third party, that's around a 12% percentage, give or take a few - about the percentage of Brawl. Weather that's a good or bad thing is up to you - I personally don't think more third parties is an issue but I think I'm in the minority there.

 

[SoccerStar9001]

If we consider a 75-character roster with nine characters as third party, that's around a 24% percentage, give or take a few; nearly a fourth of the roster.

That's 12%.

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

That's 12%.

Seems my calculator was faulty.

 

[SoccerStar9001]

Seems my calculator was faulty.

No offense, but you shouldn't really need a calculator to see that.

 

[Lyndis_]

Why does anyone even give Minecraft the time of day?

It's on Nintendo consoles? So are thousands of other series.

It sold a lot? Well Steve better get in line, because some rando soldier from CoD, a GTA protagonist, a Sim, a Tetris Block, and a Need for Speed racer all come from series with more sales. And yes, they've all had games on Nintendo consoles before.

Not to mention Minecraft is owned by Microsoft. Why does anyone think Steve is suddenly plausible, let alone likely?

Maybe their series overall sold better than MC, but as a single game MC has outsold literally every other game ever made except for Tetris (which considers every single different version of the game as one.)

CoD, GTA, and Need for Speed have had impact but nowhere near to the level of cultural and games industry impact Minecraft has, especially in Japan. Those series may also be on Nintendo platforms, but Minecraft has been on all of them since the 3DS and was the highest selling game for a while on the Switch. Sakurai himself has said he loves the game and it's one of the few he finds himself coming back to. Both SimCity and Tetris are already represented in Smash in some way.

Also, Steve could just be fun. I think he has merits to be a fun character, and while he's definitely not my top pick I wouldn't mind having him in the game. He has more to work with than most any other character I can think of, even the ones that I'd like to have a lot more. There's a lot of ways you could go with his moveset, but I've always liked the idea of a defensive zoner using different types of blocks to control the map the most.

I don't think anyone actually thinks Steve/Alex are likely, but they're definitely not impossible by any means. Honestly the only character(s) I think to be somewhat likely is probably someone from Xenoblade X, since it fits the time frame pretty perfectly. Maybe someone from Tropical Freeze or just DKC in general.

 

[N3ON]

If Nintendo is actually going to bargain with Microsoft, I'd rather they get Banjo instead of Steve.

I'm sure most adults would agree and most children would disagree.

And that's not meant to be pejorative, I think that'd be the objective breakdown.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Banjo would be the most iconic to Nintendo.

Steve would be iconic to gaming as a whole.

One is old school, one is new school.

 

[Lyndis_]

I think if we got both Banjo-Kazooie and Steve, the internet would most likely collectively explode.

It hits that perfect demographic of those nostalgic for N64 games and the younger generation that grew up with Minecraft. Not to mention just those within either/neither that like both of the games, as they are very popular.

 

[Icedragonadam]

Huh zah!

Made an Roster Maker version of my predicted roster! With bit of an update.

Spoiler: Prediction Roster 1

So Zelda, Pokemon and Rhythm Newcomer became Skull Kid, Decidueye, and Chorus Kids respectively.

 

[SoccerStar9001]

I'm sure most adults would agree and most children would disagree.

And that's not meant to be pejorative, I think that'd be the objective breakdown.

True, Banjo is really only remember by the more older Rare fans. But I don't think that should really block a character's chances considering we had more wackier characters in Smash already (but the fact that Banjo is owned by MS is still a large problem).

I wouldn't take children's opinions too seriously, some of them have pretty wild request. Not bashing anyone asking for Steve and Sans, mind you.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

People can dislike Steve all they want.

He's legitimately one of the most popular characters in gaming and I'm willing to bet he did well on the ballot.

 

[SuperMii3D]

True, Banjo is really only remember by the more older Rare fans. But I don't think that should really block a character's chances considering we had more wackier characters in Smash already (but the fact that Banjo is owned by MS is still a large problem).

I wouldn't take children's opinions too seriously, some of them have pretty wild request. Not bashing anyone asking for Steve and Sans, mind you.

I'm pretty sure that Microsoft would.allow Banjo into Smash, seeing how Phil Spence has now twice said that it'd be okay.

 

[KingBroly]

If they put Banjo in, I guarantee Microsoft would demand Minecraft guy to be put in as well. I just don't think there's any way out of that.

You have 2 Capcom and 2 Sega characters already. Time for another Square and 2 Microsoft characters I guess if you're gonna do that.

 

[Danpal65]

The problem I see with putting Banjo or Steve into Smash is, regardless of whether Phil Spencer is okay with it (of course he would be their characters get into freakin Smash), is that there is much more gained by Microsoft in terms of advertising their properties than Nintendo would likely see for Smash by including them.

Yes both those characters are significant, and for different reasons, but from a value position it probably is not worth it from Nintendo's point of view.

 

[Antimatter042]

Long reply incoming:

2nd attempt with detailed reasoning

Captain Toad/ Toadette: Have their own game, were in Odyssey and are coming to the Switch.

Pauline: Just like Rosalina it doesn't take a whole lot and she's had WAY more pushes that Rosalina, Mario vs DK anyone?

Dixe: she's Dixie

Cranky: Wishful thinking but he is the original DK and was in TF

Funky: Has been in DKC and is the new push for TF

Rool: That Mii costume tells me they know, otherwise why even put it in?

Impa: Pushed in SWS pushed in HW, she's been around A lot so between her and Tingle I choose her.

Toon Zelda/ Tetra: Either or really both of them can have unique sets really

Ridley: The framework was in the last game it's there. I put him over everyone else Prime 4 could color my mind though

Ashely: Assist Trophy

Captain S: Former villain and most recent character in the Wario Land series whom might come back if that new Wario Land Rumor is real.

BWD: Has been in a ton of games and is the only wielder of the spear ability in Star Allies

Marx: Reoccuring Boss and playable character in Star Allies

Greninja's return and Lucario's absence: I'm a firm believer in this 6 pokemon to a roster thing since it keeps happening either due to happenstance or not. That being said let's talk about Battle Bond the ability Greninja got in gen 7. Now what's so important about it? Well, there's nothing like it, and that's the problem. Mega Evolution gives a pokemon a 100 point boost to their base stat total, however Battle Bond gives Greninja a 110 boost. Not only that but it increases the power of Water Shuriken its signature move, and makes sure that it will hit three times. Nothing else in the game is quite like this, my question is why? Why wasn't Lucario given something special, given all the exposure it's had, heck it doesn't even get a new ability upon mega evolving it gets adaptability which is what Beedrill gets. No unique aura related ability, nothing. So as far as gen 7 is concerned I think Greninja is your 7th gen rep and there will be news one way or another on gen 8.


Porky: the Main bad guy in 2 and 3

Plasma Wraith: Kind of is the main bad guy in the Pikmin series this is just its most powerful form

King Hippo: Fun choice, the most recognizable boxer from Punch Out, unlikely though

Rex & Pyra: Unless I get some proof, they're in.

ARMS characters: Springman and Ribbion girl are assured but here's the thing. ARMS probably needs to be in the next trailer otherwise what was said is most likely pointing towards them being added later. I think they're in because this most likely has been in development for a WHILE so yeah but there's no telling. Also the other two Max Brass and Dr. Cyole are the other two MOST important characters in the game, one being the Commissioner of the ARMS league and the other being the sort of villain figure who's responsible for a lot of things happening in the game as well as some of the equipment (The masks I think) that the fighters wear as well as being the final boss and making the final-final boss and being able to wear said final boss without issue since she made it.

Isabelle: Kind of has her own game with Happy Home designer so, eh?

Deathborn: The SUPER bad guy of F-Zero give him Ganon's set.

FE: Look man I don't know about this series take the most recent ones and shove em in there.

DJ O: Don't know how he would work but he's not very huge or awkward.

Viridi: Costume, has a shot in my eyes

Medusa: Old school villan

Hades: Really good final villan

Slippy: Is the most famous out of the four and has his own side game with Zero.

Travis: Been there since the Wii, charging his sword might be a problem but that's really it.

Labo: I believe in Labo man

Eggman: makes sense if more 3rd parties get second reps

Geno: Costume, has a shot.

Ivy: Just based on that she's popular and i find her most interesting that Nightmare who at this point would just kind of be Cloud or what Ganon turns into hopefully. Yeah, we don't have a whip user so she's cool in my book.

Crash: One of the last two legends from the 90s

Spyro: Where ever one goes the other follows.

Bomber man: Its Bomber man! Was one of the first games on the Switch.

Shovel Knight: Modern classic with a whole lot of pull and Amiibos

Rayman: Popular character that was a trophy and given a lot of traffic thanks to Smashified

Rabbid Mario: Kingdom Battle exists and its good.

Steve: The biggest thing in gaming in the last decade.

First, probably pretty trivial, but this roster would look a lot better if it was symmetrical. The current structure can make things difficult to read.

Both Captain Toad and Pauline is something I find quite unlikely. Maybe one of the two, but personally I'm more of a Waluigi guy. Though either of your picks could certainly work.

I know everyone agrees DK is underrepresented, but 4 newcomers is far too many. I get Fire Emblem and technically Pokémon with the Pokémon Trainer have done it before, but Fire Emblem did it with 2 clones and a huge FE renaissance right before Smash 4, and PT was a badly designed wreck that Charizard is far better outwith. 1 or maybe 2 newcomers is all I could see here.

Impa is a respectable choice, and I'd be interested in her moveset if she joined the roster. However I feel like Tetra's ship has sailed, and TZ's train has left the station, aside from WW HD for Tetra, neither has got anything since Smash 4.

I know nothing about Wario Land or WarioWare, but I highly doubt 2 new characters when Ware had a silence between pre-Smash 4 and the post-cutoff WarioWare Gold, and Land has had a silence even longer, to the point where I'd consider it F-Zero territory.

I think Ridley should be in the game as well. No comments there, he's one of the biggest all-stars not in the roster and there's so little left with all-stars that scrapping a handful of characters to spend time making him work is actually a reasonable idea if necessary.

No issues with Bandana Waddle Dee or Marx, both may be unlikely (I think Marx is a possible DLC candidate given his Star Allies comeback seems too late for the initial roster) but I'd enjoy them both.

I think your Pokémon reasoning, as a longtime fan of the series, is extremely flawed. Sticking rigidly to 6 reps because of 6 Pokémon on a team seems off when several other, less important series (looking at Kid Icarus especially) can hit that number, and Mario and Zelda, which deserve the same as Pokémon, are way ahead. Additionally, cutting Lucario is ludicrous, as a Brawl vet and the effective 2nd mascot of the series, his popularity is still high and Game Freak like having him around at any opportunity they get, Greninja has a unique Battle Bond, but Lucario spearheaded a core gameplay mechanic with Mega Evolution. Though Greninja is a stupidly popular Pokémon, especially in Japan, as well. Both should stay. It's really too early for a Gen 8 Pokémon, especially when 7 was the 20th anniversary and had a lot of standout Pokémon. I absolutely expect a Gen 8 Pokémon to be a DLC fighter once Pokémon Switch is released, though.

Porky is in a series that's declared dead and done and hasn't changed since pre-Brawl. I think he's basically impossible at this point.

Don't know anything about Pikmin, can't comment of Plasma Wraith. But hey, more villains is a good idea.

King Hippo has a similar issue to Porky and Captain Syrup with relevancy, and another boxer (1 of 5 boxing newcomers here no less) seems like a struggle to stand out moveset-wise.

Rex and Pyra are my most wanted newcomers. If they're somehow not in because they missed the project plan, early in line for DLC. I think Sakurai would have asked Monolith about future projects anyway and there was completed XC2 concept art around the time of the project plan too.

4 ARMS characters is ridiculous. 1 is possible, maybe even likely if Sakurai got word from higher-ups about the game, but 4 fighters with the same core gimmick is way too much, especially when it leapfrogs Splatoon: Nintendo's newest golden goose.

Isabelle is a good choice, a Falcondorf inheritor is welcome in my book, not sure if you're implying 3 FE cuts or just any combination of vets and newcomers there, but unless we get Celica, I see FE staying the same or going down 1 rep, with FE Switch as DLC.

DJ Octavio seems weird, having an awkward body shape, only attacking through an enormous sound system and being a boss of a story mode that's not the focus of the games at all. I think 2 Splatoon characters is decently likely, but with Octoling in the style of the Smash 4 clones.

I love Kid Icarus Uprising, but 6 characters is again way too many. Not much else to be said other than Hades being a pipe dream character of mine, he'd be so awesome.

A character as hated as Slippy is a no go for Smash, just bring Wolf back and Star Fox is fine.

Toy-Con Robot strikes me as too late for Smash, but it's honestly a big want of mine. Better than another stick figure with a Joy-Con request anyway.

That's way too many 3rd parties, I'd expect 2 more at launch at the most, but the current number isn't even worth considering.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Since y'all are posting rosters I might as well. Keep in mind this is pretty much 99% predictions and doesn't necessarily reflect my desires:
View attachment 140887

Newcomers:

Waluigi: Since the Mario series is such a huge series, I feel that one character from it will be added to the new installment. I ended up choosing Waluigi mostly because he could represent the Mario spinoffs, as he came from a Mario spinoff himself, and because we need the Wario brothers to fight the Mario brothers (this is where my 1% wishlist comes in...)

Dixie: Sakurai probably saw the ballot. He knows how popular K. Rool and Dixie are. That is why I feel a DK newcomer is likely. However, whether it is K. Rool or Dixie is totally up to chance. I feel that Dixie is slightly more likely, as she may have been considered for Brawl at some point and Sakurai might want to revisit to the idea.

Impa: The Zelda series hasn't had a notable new character since Melee, which was almost two decades ago. Impa is probably the most likely choice here, as she is one of the only recurring characters in the series (others than the bearers of the Triforce, of course).

Sylux: This one's a weird one. I just don't see Sakurai putting Ridley into the game as a playable character at this point, as he would be pretty off-putting if he were simply resized. I feel a character like Sylux is just a bit more likely, as he seems to be teased to have a pretty prominent role in Metroid Prime 4. This is probably the boldest prediction on my roster, in my opinion.

Bandanna Waddle Dee: HAL has been pushing him very hard lately, so I wouldn't be surprised to see him playable. Also, he would be the first spear user in the game, which helps him chances of standing out.

Mimikyu: Everyone seems to be on the Decidueye boat. However, at least according to some surveys, he's not as popular as a new Pokemon like Mimikyu. In fact, Mimikyu has appeared in a lot of Pokemon merchandise recently, showing that Game Freak wants to push Mimikyu's popularity. Of course, the decision of a Pokemon character is only partially up to Game Freak, so we will never know until a new Pokemon is actually revealed.

Rex and Pyra: These two provide a concept that Smash hasn't really explored yet. Also, this game seems to be more popular than the first game, so I wouldn't be surprised to see these two in the game.

Takamaru: This is a character Sakurai has wanted in the game for a long time. I feel this is finally his chance.

Inklings: Already confirmed, but they were expected by literally everyone.

Spring Man: Extendable arms provide for a unique moveset. Also, Spring Man represents a new Switch IP.

Rayman: After seeing the Rayman trophy in Smash 4 and Mario and Rabbids becoming a thing, it's clear that Nintendo and Ubisoft are quite willing to work with each other.

Steve: I can already hear it now, the stampede of hate comments. But, as much as I hate to admit it, Minecraft (and Steve for that matter) are immensely popular. Plus, this is a great opportunity to represent a modern gaming icon and indie titles at the same time.

I feel all your choices badly except for Steve and Rayman, and am mostly just in dire disagreement with Steve cause I do think Rayman would be a good adition as far as 3rd party characters go. But, great job!

Especially like Impa and Dixie Kong, but choosing Mimikyu, Bandana Dee and Sylux also earns you points here! Sad to see Lucina cut however, but it's understandable. King K.Rool also would be a good choice, but as long as I see ONE DKC newcomer am Kongtent.

8.6/10

 

[Kirby Dragons]

I also don't understand why people hate Steve. I do think he's got a chance. Keep in mind Minecraft is the second bestselling game ever, and one of only two games that sold over 100 million. Microsoft would be a way for him to be kept off the roster, though.