Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[The DanMan051]

Thats the Metascore dude, they ask the critics for that, you wanna wait for the audience score. I aint saying youre not allowed to like or dislike the game, i am just saying you want a fair review wait fo rwhat the audience scores say cuz those are the people who pay money for the game.

I cited user scores alongside the critic metascores.

 

[Noipoi]

Until Verg says Cooking Mama is the square rep i'm not believing anything he says.

 

[Ignoritus]

The fact he's saying all that, to me, certainly implies that he isn't exactly taking it seriously either. But I'll admit, it was less explicit than I thought.

I agree that it sounds like Vergeben isn't taking it too seriously, but Vergeben has also not claimed to know the exact character for sure. Probably hurts Geno's chances even further, but I wouldn't call his speculation a deconfirmation.

 

[Luigi The President]

The hype created by Geno as DLC would excite the Smash fanbase.

The reveal of Sora would create internet imploding hype, similar to Cloud or Snake.

I love Geno. I think he’s a great character, and he would be extremely fun. Like, I would love to see him revealed. To compare him and say that he makes more sense, or something to that effect, than Sora? No way.

We’re comparing a character from a one off SNES game, it doesn’t matter if it’s “relevant” because of a collectible item that Nintendo is selling. Geno doesn’t sell that, the mere fact that it’s a collectible that has classic games on it sells that.

While I see where some people are coming from in terms of “KH fans won’t necessarily buy a Switch and the game just to play as Sora”. Great. Then why add Snake? Why add Cloud? Why add Bayonetta? That’s a crap point, and it’s absurd. It means literally nothing.

3rd party characters are beginnings for business relationships and advertisement, as well as making this the greatest gaming crossover in gaming history. Geno wouldn’t contribute to that, but Sora would.

Did you notice how in the September Direct, Final Fantasy VII, X, and IX were announced for Switch? That conveniently happened after Cloud, and after relations between the two companies (Nintendo and SE) greatly improved.

There is little to no reason, if i’m being honest, to believe that Geno would sell more than Sora. Smash fans will mostly buy anything, #1, and I do think some of you underestimate just how much impact adding 3rd parties has.

I actually have a friend who has said if Sora was in Smash, he’d definitely get a Switch. Yes, it’s anecdotal evidence, but let’s not pretend it’s impossible.

What a mouthful. I’m not anti-Geno. I love Geno, and want to see him happen. I also like Sora, and think him happening would be crazy. Let’s not start up some ridiculous debate about the two characters though.

Think of it this way. You have a reveal of Smash DLC at the VGAs. Who would get more of a pop...Sora, the extremely iconic and “recognizable to almost any gaming fan” character, or Geno, a character that is mostly known within the Smash fanbase but is easily not recognized nearly as much as Sora?

Nintendo and Squenix already have a flourishing relationship, is my issue with this. Sora won't do anything, say, the FF ports, already haven't, from what I get.

I apologize for bringing this point up so much, but KH3's existence is a very big looming threat to Sora in Smash due to it being on the consoles of Nintendo's competitors.

Thanks for supporting my boy. And TPC/Nekoo's boy.

 

[The DanMan051]

I agree that it sounds like Vergeben isn't taking it too seriously, but Vergeben has also not claimed to know the exact character for sure. Probably hurts Geno's chances even further, but I wouldn't call his speculation a deconfirmation.

Again, a bit overzealous on my part; the other discussion I'm involved in right now is definitely fanning the emotional flames a bit.

 

[Will]

Until Verg says Cooking Mama is the square rep i'm not believing anything he says.

Nobody understands how much perfect sense Cooking Mama makes, though.
She's quite literally the most Nintendo-oriented Square character.

 

[Grizzexploder]

Sakurai has never deconfirmed the "fan made rule" of Assist Trophies not being playable fighters in the game they appear in.

he hasn't deconfirmed it, but he has said that Assist Trophies are ways for him to include people who he wasn't able to fully develop as playable

“Assist Trophies allow you to enjoy even more characters who couldn’t quite make it as playable fighters. You may even see some that only the most dedicated fans will recognize, so you’ll have to look forward to them.” -SMASH DOJO

there also really isn't any precedent of Assist Trophies being playable fighters, unlike Trophies/Stickers/possibly Spirits (though we only have Mewtwo & Lucas to go off, so that's on shaky ground)

 

[Luigi The President]

Okay. Okay. You know what. Click that pause button. Please gang.

Geno may be in. Sora may be in. 2B may be in. No leaker is gonna know until we know for sure.

All these Squenix reps, have got points going for, and against them. Very valid points have been raised here, both for and against Geno, for and against Sora.

Let's just talk about how damn cute Katalina is again

 

[KingofKoopas]

Again, a bit overzealous on my part; the other discussion I'm involved in right now is definitely fanning the emotional flames a bit.

i know for a fact the audience score aint out yet cuz the game aint out yet. They block it on metacritic til after the games released 12 hours after.

 

[PsySmasher]

Sakurai has never deconfirmed the "fan made rule" of Assist Trophies not being playable fighters in the game they appear in.

That kinda goes against the purpose of Assist Trophies: to have certain characters represented in the game, despite not being playable.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

i know for a fact the audience score aint out yet cuz the game aint out yet. They block it on metacritic til after the games released 12 hours after.

But Fire Emblem Fates has been out for years.

 

[NineS]

Okay. Okay. You know what. Click that pause button. Please gang.

Geno may be in. Sora may be in. 2B may be in. No leaker is gonna know until we know for sure.

All these Squenix reps, have got points going for, and against them. Very valid points have been raised here, both for and against Geno, for and against Sora.

Let's just talk about how damn cute Katalina is again

I don't know what you said, but you had me at 2B.

I'm a sucker for NieR, aren't I?

Either way, we're all just hoping for the best.

Too bad people seem to have different definitions of what "the best" actually is.

 

[Grizzexploder]

Okay. Okay. You know what. Click that pause button. Please gang.

Geno may be in. Sora may be in. 2B may be in. No leaker is gonna know until we know for sure.

All these Squenix reps, have got points going for, and against them. Very valid points have been raised here, both for and against Geno, for and against Sora.

Let's just talk about how damn cute Katalina is again

have i mentioned that i have downloaded every single katalina fanart on pixiv

 

[Deleted member]

Okay. Okay. You know what. Click that pause button. Please gang.

Geno may be in. Sora may be in. 2B may be in. No leaker is gonna know until we know for sure.

All these Squenix reps, have got points going for, and against them. Very valid points have been raised here, both for and against Geno, for and against Sora.

Let's just talk about how damn cute Katalina is again

Sorry, I'm not talking about Katalina until you all admit that Gex is the best Squeenix rep.

 

[TheCJBrine]

Are we sure there would be a Smash reveal at the videogame awards?

I mean, I don't know if Kingdom Hearts is a nominee for anything, but Dragon Quest is, meaning a Smash reveal seems likely to make LeakyPandy correct for once...

There's also Spawn Wave, but recently y'all decided he wasn't actually hinting at anything...

 

[Idon]

As soon as I see a SINGLE Assist trophy be both playable AND a trophy AT THE SAME TIME in the ten years they've existed, fine. I'll eat all of my words.

I'll agree.

"There is no such thing as a deconfirmation."
"Sakurai would be put on the project plan 'port both the assist trophy and develop an entirely unique character' on the project plan."
"Assist trophies aren't just consolation prizes for fighters Sakurai couldn't/wouldn't make."

Until then:

 

[Luigi The President]

I don't know what you said, but you had me at 2B.

I'm a sucker for NieR, aren't I?

Either way, we're all just hoping for the best.

Too bad people seem to have different definitions of what "the best" actually is.

H e h .... seeing as KAINE IS THE BES

Sorry, I'm not talking about Katalina until you all admit that Gex is the best Squeenix rep.

Well yeah.

Gex is the Bexst.

have i mentioned that i have downloaded every single katalina fanart on pixiv

We are now friends

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Are we sure there would be a Smash reveal at the videogame awards?

I mean, I don't know if Kingdom Hearts is a nominee for anything, but Dragon Quest is, meaning a Smash reveal seems likely to make LeakyPandy correct for once...

But remember, this is LeakyPandy... I'm not holding my breath

 

[KingofKoopas]

Okay. Okay. You know what. Click that pause button. Please gang.

Geno may be in. Sora may be in. 2B may be in. No leaker is gonna know until we know for sure.

All these Squenix reps, have got points going for, and against them. Very valid points have been raised here, both for and against Geno, for and against Sora.

Let's just talk about how damn cute Katalina is again

Great idea, More Waifu Knight talk is always welcome. Wheres the guy who posts the pictures!

 

[Yoshisaurus Rex]

What's even the point anymore?
We got footage of preeeeeetty much everyone.

Idk, it’s nice to get the little tidbits of info I guess. *shrugs*

 

[Arymle Roseanne]

Bit more recent than I claimed, but:
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/234547-super-smash-bros-ultimate/77060095?jumpto=136#136
"Geno is someone practically everyone is predicting and expecting. Meaning that they internally probably do not take that one as seriously as names they themselves have been putting out to employees.
That's not to say that he isn't a name on their list of characters they have been telling people it is though. "

Why does Verg goes to GameFAQs anyway? That place is surrounded by idiots who are pessimistic about everything...is there any other place he shares the information?

 

[Grizzexploder]

y'all already know the squeenix character is space invader

 

[KingofKoopas]

Are we sure there would be a Smash reveal at the videogame awards?

I mean, I don't know if Kingdom Hearts is a nominee for anything, but Dragon Quest is, meaning a Smash reveal seems likely to make LeakyPandy correct for once...

There's also Spawn Wave, but recently y'all decided he wasn't actually hinting at anything...

"LeakyPandy correct for once..."

 

[Deleted member]

Well yeah.

Gex is the Bexst.

Oh shoot, I forgot that to use Gex, they'll also need to get in touch with so many different parties, one of which is Disney. Gex is off the table.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

I don't see how we'd get a DLC reveal for Smash the day before game release.

Unless the next DLC fighter is coming around the same time as Piranha Plant. It's far too early.

I'm sure of only one thing when it comes to VGAs and Nintendo now and that's Metroid Prime will be there in some way.

 

[Raxxel]

Why does Verg goes to GameFAQs anyway? That place is surrounded by idiots who are pessimistic about everything...is there any other place he shares the information?

Really good question. He should come to the general thread here, surely he'll feel much more welcome.

 

[TheCJBrine]

But remember, this is LeakyPandy... I'm not holding my breath

Yeah they even got their date for the Smash Direct wrong, saying it would be the week of the 5th. It was a safe guess at the time, too, lol.

And instead of saying Skull Kid would be an AT they said he would be a boss, which would be cool imo since he's not playable anyway, but from what his AT does that seems unlikely.

I just think a Smash reveal at the VGAs would be more-likely to lineup with what LeakyPandy said, but I wouldn't take it as adding to their credibility as they're usually always wrong anyway.

 

[Diem]

4.2/5 average user score on gamefaqs and 7.3/10 on metacritic (places were games with the slightest bit of controversy get negativity bombed-- I recall FEW and Xenoblade 2 both had around a 1.5 user score on gamefaqs right after they opened them up for scoring). Meanwhile, Mass Effect 3 has a 5.9/10 user metascore... but also 4.2/5 user score on gamefaqs.
Evil Within: 3.8/5 on gamefaqs, 7.5/10 user and critic metascore (which really isn't "reviewed well" when most major outlets skew towards the upper part of the scale).

It's almost like the correlation trying to be drawn doesn't really work; vocal minorities can shape the "consensus" on a game after the fact, but critic reviews and commercial sales are infinitely more solid metrics.

Sales, maybe, but critics aren't always reliable. Games that review poorly sometimes sell well, and games that review well sometimes sell poorly. And even then sales aren't always a good metric for a game's quality or reception, either. It's my understanding that before Awakening, Fire Emblem games weren't doing too well commercially. Are those games poorer quality than their successors?

If Fates's detractors are truly a minority, I'd believe that. After all, how many people constantly talk trash about Call of Duty, while the series continues to sell better than most other franchises and receive good review scores? Sometimes negativity is just people being cynical because they find it enjoyable to hate on things. So if the actual majority of people genuinely like the game, I wouldn't be surprised.

Because people like to forget the majority of a game's audience is usually the casual demographic, who purchase the game but don't get heavily invested in it, let alone online discussions. Smash Ultimate is going to sell millions, but only a fraction of that number will keep playing the game beyond the first few months or talk about it online. I mean, there's only about a hundred people viewing this thread right now. That's less than a fraction of a percent of how many people are going to be playing the game in three weeks.

So if 1.5 out of that 1.8 million are content with the game, but the .3 million are just louder about their opinion, sure. But I've seldom heard people speak positively about the game, so I just haven't seen it.

 

[J0eyboi]

I don't see how we'd get a DLC reveal for Smash the day before game release.

Unless the next DLC fighter is coming around the same time as Piranha Plant. It's far too early.

I'm sure of only one thing when it comes to VGAs and Nintendo now and that's Metroid Prime will be there in some way.

I'd imagine the next DLC will be announced right around when Plant is released.

 

[Good Guy Giygas]

As far as the SE rep goes, I think we're gonna get a character from "Metal Gear: Russia" "Left Alive."

 

[PsySmasher]

Are we sure there would be a Smash reveal at the videogame awards?

I mean, I don't know if Kingdom Hearts is a nominee for anything, but Dragon Quest is, meaning a Smash reveal seems likely to make LeakyPandy correct for once...

There's also Spawn Wave, but recently y'all decided he wasn't actually hinting at anything...

Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if we get nothing at the VGAs. They take place the day before Smash Ultimate releases, which seems kind of early to reveal a DLC character, especially based on how/when Sakurai says DLC is developed.

It definitely wouldn't be enough time to put together a full-fledged character trailer.

At most, we'll get a Mewtwo-like reveal.

But there's a good chance we'll get nothing.

 

[Grizzexploder]

SPACE INVADER FOR SMASH

KILLER APP OF THE ATARI 2600

RETRO REP x SQUEENIX REP

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

View attachment 178077

SPACE INVADER FOR SMASH

KILLER APP OF THE 80S

I'd actually be down for that...

 

[Deleted member]

View attachment 178077

SPACE INVADER FOR SMASH

KILLER APP OF THE ATARI 2600

RETRO REP x SQUEENIX REP

E.T. or bust.

 

[Raxxel]

View attachment 178077

SPACE INVADER FOR SMASH

KILLER APP OF THE ATARI 2600

RETRO REP x SQUEENIX REP

... y'know, it wouldn't be the worst thing to come to Smash Bros.

 

[Idon]

View attachment 178077

SPACE INVADER FOR SMASH

KILLER APP OF THE 80S

Pft, what a loser pick.
The real winner here is Galaga

 

[Grizzexploder]

IT'S HIS TIME TO SHINE

 

[Dyamanttine]

When Cloud has been released, alot of PS4 users buyed a Wii U just for him, imagine what that would do with Sora

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

E.T. or bust.

Are you crazy? We need N64 Superman...
His Final Smash would be forcing his opponents to play through the ring levels

 

[Good Guy Giygas]

Are you crazy? We need N64 Superman...
His Final Smash would be forcing his opponents to play through the ring levels

And we need playable Battletoads with a Gamestop stage.